Tim Lane - Time for a Tasmanian Team

huntos

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#76
I don't know why everyone is so particular about making sure they make 25M a year, why can't the AFL prop them up on the 1.4 B that they have obtained over the next 5 years?

Tasmania deserve a team and just because it costs a little more to allow them to have one why should it be an hurdle? Money shouldn't be a problem at all for the AFL, they should be catering for footy fans not the wallets of corperate companies.

The team could be owned by an investor (maybe tim lane?:eek:) and he could offshoot some of the operating costs will the state government.

If they can get 15k to see two teams which didn't even make the 8 I'm sure that crowds for their own home side would improve even more and games could be split from north to south each couple of rounds to cater for fans from major cities.

My only question would be, would the team be called tasmania football club? Branding would be a major issue because of the north/south divide. Maybe some big clubs in the north and south could considered merging into one AFL club then both would be catered for.
 

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#77
Well, we have 9. Geelong gets most of it's support from the Geelong area.

9 teams is not too many, each Melbourne clubs helps to generate a significant amount of income for the other clubs, Collingwood doesn't need 50k members because the interest in games by supporters of both home and away teams means that usually you get a good crowd for Melbourne games.
See, you start off your posts trying to sound intelligent and making the odd good point and then you descend into errant silliness.

10 teams (9 if you prefer) in a market the size of Victoria is waaaaaaaaaaaaaayy overcrowded. In terms of attracting sponsors, corporate support the splintered market makes it less attractive except for those Vic clubs with a "national" presence (and that would be Collingwood, Essendon and maybe Carlton).

Crowd numbers are fine but the net receipts are much less when they come from game day ticket sales rather than members with season tickets. Serach BF and you will find details of how they are split. Memberships are infinitely more important to clubs than fans who role up and buy a ticket on game day.

You can say our membership base is low at around 25k, but in 05 we averaged over 40k attendances for games in Melbourne, a reasonable year on-field.

Interstate teams need a high level of support because little is coming from the away supporters. There is little difference between a club that has 40k members to one that averages 40k for home games.

The main advantage interstate clubs have is the availability of low maintenance stadiums to play games at. AFL recognise that is a major issue in Victoria and one that is mostly responsible for creating a significant difference in profitability.
Interstate teams need what? because of what?

They make more money than you because of increased corporate support, more members and generally more professionally run organisations. They do not need more local fans due to lack of away fans - this is a bizarre justification of your clubs general crapiness.

Low maintenance stadiums? where the hell do you get that from? the WAFC is still paying for the last redevelopment of Subiaco while the next redevelopment is urgently required. The ground is undersized by about 20,000 which is stopping West Coast & Freo becoming even more profitable.

Have you ever thought that the Melbourne based clubs might get a better deal because the fixed costs of the stadium owners are actually defrayed over more games. In Perth there are 22 AFL games a year and Subiaco oval (which is owned by the City of Subiaco) gets its main revenue from AFL. How many AFL games are at the G or Telstra? Surely this would allow smart operators to get a good deal. In addition, 50,000 capacity at Telstra hardly makes it big and Norf got what? about 25,000 to a FINAL there a couple of years back.

What does Sydney or even Brisbane bring to the table that a Melbourne club does not?

Of the $1.4 billion generated by the AFL over the next 5 years you want to take a stab at how much of that revenue is generated in Victoria compared to anywhere else?
Your kidding right?

Umm, they bring the biggest city and state and the third biggest city and state into the AFL. They also massively boost the TV audience for AFL which drives increased TV rights figures. Which equals money. The 3 highest rated AFL grand finals of all time all involved Sydney.

Sydney is also Australias largest corporate market - many of the key decision makers live there. It is vital for AFL as a national code that it have a strong presence in Sydney.

If any of about 6 Melbourne based clubs folded tomorrow, there would be blip and then we would move on. If Brisbane or Sydney folded the league would be in disarray.
 

Eagle87

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#78
I don't know why everyone is so particular about making sure they make 25M a year, why can't the AFL prop them up on the 1.4 B that they have obtained over the next 5 years?

Tasmania deserve a team and just because it costs a little more to allow them to have one why should it be an hurdle? Money shouldn't be a problem at all for the AFL, they should be catering for footy fans not the wallets of corperate companies.

The team could be owned by an investor (maybe tim lane?:eek:) and he could offshoot some of the operating costs will the state government.

If they can get 15k to see two teams which didn't even make the 8 I'm sure that crowds for their own home side would improve even more and games could be split from north to south each couple of rounds to cater for fans from major cities.

.... and the Moon is made of cream cheese......

.... I believe Elvis just walked by .....

..... Lets all hug .....


Mate, seriously, at some point, you have to join the real world, the one with actual people, doing actual things.

I understand that a study of the current Melbourne football culture could cause one to think that the AFL is one big handout machine, which exists to keep Norf & Doggies fans happy even though their clubs are an unnecessary luxury for the comp as a whole BUT deep down inside the AFL is now a massive business and decisions will be made for business purposes not just because it will make some people feel warm and fuzzy.
 

Tas

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#79
While you are there, are you planning on paying back all the money you've received from the SDF in the past 10 years ?
We have received the money for the last 5 or 6 years from memory. No, we are not required to. We will pay it back the day the AFL goes back over the last 20 years and gives us a fair and equitable draw, ie not going to happen.

Clubs with a lot of free-to-air exposure benefit directly from that, clubs with a lot of pay-tv exposure get nothing out of the massive amount of money that generates.

Distribute the pay-tv income based on who facilitates the games and you can keep your crappy free-to-air games, we would be getting a massive chunk of the pay-tv dollars.
 

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#80
Would love to see a rubbish Vic team relocate to Tassie...you could even split the home games between Hobart and Launceston to maximise the crowds and corporates.

Better idea then moving a team to some QLD ****e hole. Tassie people love their AFL, why not tap into that market?
 

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#81
We have received the money for the last 5 or 6 years from memory. No, we are not required to. We will pay it back the day the AFL goes back over the last 20 years and gives us a fair and equitable draw, ie not going to happen.

Clubs with a lot of free-to-air exposure benefit directly from that, clubs with a lot of pay-tv exposure get nothing out of the massive amount of money that generates.

Distribute the pay-tv income based on who facilitates the games and you can keep your crappy free-to-air games, we would be getting a massive chunk of the pay-tv dollars.
Turn it up Tas.
AFL give North a handout now which most clubs don't get.
Last 20 years a unfair draw, that's just crap.
Blame your board for years of mis-management before you blame the AFL
 

jacko57

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#82
See, you start off your posts trying to sound intelligent and making the odd good point and then you descend into errant silliness.

10 teams (9 if you prefer) in a market the size of Victoria is waaaaaaaaaaaaaayy overcrowded. In terms of attracting sponsors, corporate support the splintered market makes it less attractive except for those Vic clubs with a "national" presence (and that would be Collingwood, Essendon and maybe Carlton).

Crowd numbers are fine but the net receipts are much less when they come from game day ticket sales rather than members with season tickets. Serach BF and you will find details of how they are split. Memberships are infinitely more important to clubs than fans who role up and buy a ticket on game day.



Interstate teams need what? because of what?

They make more money than you because of increased corporate support, more members and generally more professionally run organisations. They do not need more local fans due to lack of away fans - this is a bizarre justification of your clubs general crapiness.

Low maintenance stadiums? where the hell do you get that from? the WAFC is still paying for the last redevelopment of Subiaco while the next redevelopment is urgently required. The ground is undersized by about 20,000 which is stopping West Coast & Freo becoming even more profitable.

Have you ever thought that the Melbourne based clubs might get a better deal because the fixed costs of the stadium owners are actually defrayed over more games. In Perth there are 22 AFL games a year and Subiaco oval (which is owned by the City of Subiaco) gets its main revenue from AFL. How many AFL games are at the G or Telstra? Surely this would allow smart operators to get a good deal. In addition, 50,000 capacity at Telstra hardly makes it big and Norf got what? about 25,000 to a FINAL there a couple of years back.



Your kidding right?

Umm, they bring the biggest city and state and the third biggest city and state into the AFL. They also massively boost the TV audience for AFL which drives increased TV rights figures. Which equals money. The 3 highest rated AFL grand finals of all time all involved Sydney.

Sydney is also Australias largest corporate market - many of the key decision makers live there. It is vital for AFL as a national code that it have a strong presence in Sydney.

If any of about 6 Melbourne based clubs folded tomorrow, there would be blip and then we would move on. If Brisbane or Sydney folded the league would be in disarray.
Great analysis. Let's just cut it back to 2 teams based in Melbourne, that would be SO much better. :rolleyes:
 

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#83
We have received the money for the last 5 or 6 years from memory. No, we are not required to. We will pay it back the day the AFL goes back over the last 20 years and gives us a fair and equitable draw, ie not going to happen.

Clubs with a lot of free-to-air exposure benefit directly from that, clubs with a lot of pay-tv exposure get nothing out of the massive amount of money that generates.

Distribute the pay-tv income based on who facilitates the games and you can keep your crappy free-to-air games, we would be getting a massive chunk of the pay-tv dollars.
you have been shafted on FNF considering you were a part of starting it.
 

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#84
If I was still residing in the North East of Victoria I would be so pieved off if Tasmania got an AFL team before a place like Albury Wodonga. Unlike Tasmania if we relocated a team to this area most of the loyal Victorian supporters could drive 5 or 6 times a year to watch their relocated team play and the number of majow companies based in the area would be sufficient to guarantee a number of corporate sponsors.

For many years now I have been saying that Albury / Wodonga would be a perfect spot for an AFL side to relocate to because of the numerous viable (including financial) factors but wjat do the AFL do - look at Tasmania
 

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#85
If I was still residing in the North East of Victoria I would be so pieved off if Tasmania got an AFL team before a place like Albury Wodonga. Unlike Tasmania if we relocated a team to this area most of the loyal Victorian supporters could drive 5 or 6 times a year to watch their relocated team play and the number of majow companies based in the area would be sufficient to guarantee a number of corporate sponsors.

For many years now I have been saying that Albury / Wodonga would be a perfect spot for an AFL side to relocate to because of the numerous viable (including financial) factors but wjat do the AFL do - look at Tasmania
They should at least play NAB Cup games there.
 

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#86
If I was still residing in the North East of Victoria I would be so pieved off if Tasmania got an AFL team before a place like Albury Wodonga. Unlike Tasmania if we relocated a team to this area most of the loyal Victorian supporters could drive 5 or 6 times a year to watch their relocated team play and the number of majow companies based in the area would be sufficient to guarantee a number of corporate sponsors.

For many years now I have been saying that Albury / Wodonga would be a perfect spot for an AFL side to relocate to because of the numerous viable (including financial) factors but wjat do the AFL do - look at Tasmania
Actually, you're wrong. That's the whole point of this thread. The AFL has been ignoring Tasmania's pleas for an AFL side for a long time now. A recent survey on the AFL website asked where the AFL should look at starting/relocating a side. The possible answers were The Gold Coast, Darwin, Canberra and Japan... The AFL has dollar signs in front of it's eyes, and is being lured by the big money on the Gold Coast. No part of Australia deserves an AFL side as much as Tasmania, but given that most Tasmanians are already bought and sold on AFL, further financial gains for the corporate gluttons appears to be minimal... As a result we will continue to get overlooked.
 

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Thread starter #88
If I was still residing in the North East of Victoria I would be so pieved off if Tasmania got an AFL team before a place like Albury Wodonga. Unlike Tasmania if we relocated a team to this area most of the loyal Victorian supporters could drive 5 or 6 times a year to watch their relocated team play and the number of majow companies based in the area would be sufficient to guarantee a number of corporate sponsors.

For many years now I have been saying that Albury / Wodonga would be a perfect spot for an AFL side to relocate to because of the numerous viable (including financial) factors but wjat do the AFL do - look at Tasmania
Keep dreaming mate - Albury/Wodonga is in no way readier to have an AFL side than Tasmania !!!

Even Cairns or Darwin would be more ready for AFL than Albury.
I agree, it would be great for the national comp to have a team based out of Albury, or at least to have a few home and away games a year played there but and it is a big BUT .... Sure, the O&M Grand Final draws around 15,000 people, but AFL attendances at the last few pre-season matches have been nowhere near what Tasmania gets ... the Lavington Sports Ground has an official capacity of 25,000 but since 2003, the best AFL attendance that Albury/Wodonga has ever managed is 12,204 ... and Carlton vs Western Bulldogs drew a paltry 5,151 just last year
http://www.austadiums.com/stadiums/stadiums_crowds.php?id=63

And I really think that Albury offers better corporate prospects than even Cascades or Boags in the Hume Building Society, Masterfoods and Mars .... :rolleyes:
 

catters05

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#89
A tassie team would work if somebody like Brian Cook was in charge of it and it played in both launceston and hobart. A team for the entire state.

You would be suprised IMO. I think the people would get behind it.

And I think its not how many seats at a stadium you have to fill (eg. MCG 100K), but how much you make out of each seat you fill in a stadium and if Tassie has 20-25K grounds and have close to that many members for both the North and South then it could work. (Over 40K members)

Geelong make a fair bit of money out of Kardinia Park and that aint big. Tassie teams grounds need lots of corporate facilities to target the medium sized businesses as there arent massive multinationals down in tas.

I think it would be cool to see, and it aint far form Melbourne for travelling.
 

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Think before you post son.

The nearest thing to a 'corporate' in Tasmania is Forestry Tas (the only company in the state with more than 500 employees). Plus head office is in Hobart. It's really an SME - not a corporate sized business.

Maybe they may be able to sell one corporate box - that's assuming they have one at Launceston.
Both Cascade and Cadbury are huge companies the equal of any that sponsor current AFL sides.
 
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#91
A tassie team would work if somebody like Brian Cook was in charge of it and it played in both launceston and hobart. A team for the entire state.

You would be suprised IMO. I think the people would get behind it.

And I think its not how many seats at a stadium you have to fill (eg. MCG 100K), but how much you make out of each seat you fill in a stadium and if Tassie has 20-25K grounds and have close to that many members for both the North and South then it could work. (Over 40K members)

Geelong make a fair bit of money out of Kardinia Park and that aint big. Tassie teams grounds need lots of corporate facilities to target the medium sized businesses as there arent massive multinationals down in tas.

I think it would be cool to see, and it aint far form Melbourne for travelling.

Here, Here!!! It's not as far fetched as people think!!
 

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Moderator #92
A tassie team would work if somebody like Brian Cook was in charge of it and it played in both launceston and hobart. A team for the entire state.

You would be suprised IMO. I think the people would get behind it.

And I think its not how many seats at a stadium you have to fill (eg. MCG 100K), but how much you make out of each seat you fill in a stadium and if Tassie has 20-25K grounds and have close to that many members for both the North and South then it could work. (Over 40K members)

Geelong make a fair bit of money out of Kardinia Park and that aint big. Tassie teams grounds need lots of corporate facilities to target the medium sized businesses as there arent massive multinationals down in tas.

I think it would be cool to see, and it aint far form Melbourne for travelling.
I agree they play half of their games in launceston and the other half in hobart. Sell 1/2 price memberships for hobart and have memberships for Launceston. People can choose to buy both for the full cost or just one or the other.

I often wonder how the AFL comes to the conclusion that the GC and/or west sydney would be more viable than tasmania.
 

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#93
It would be great if there were 2 less teams in Melbourne replaced by teams in the Gold Coast and Tasmania as it would make the competition truly national.

They might need propping up by the AFL for a while, but then again that has been the status quo for a couple of Melbourne based teams for too long anyway.
Agree with what you have written here.

I'm all for a team in Tassie. As Tim notes, the state is passionate about its footy and is deserving of a team to call its own. I've always felt that the AFL talk Tassie down in an effort to talk the Gold Coast up. They tell us that the numbers simply 'don't stack up', yet they haven't actually shown us any numbers. If a regional city of less that 200,000 people like Geelong can support a club, then why not Tassie?

Of course there are soe hurdles to overcome. Tassie is a divided state. Launceston (North) and Hobart (South) have a Sydney vs Melbourne-like rivalry that doesn't do the state any favours. If a Tasmanian team is based in Launceston (playing at Aurora Stadium) then there is every chance the people in and around Hobart will not support it (and vice versa). The people of Tassie need to overcome these petty rivalries and present a united front to the AFL.

It's looking like a Melbourne based club would have to relocate for Tassie to gain an AFL side. The Kangaroos have got their sights set on the Gold Coast (even if they don't admit to it) so that leaves the controversial issue of which other team to earmark for relocation. Carlton and the Western Bulldogs are unable to turn a profit these days without AFL assistance. If this continues for much longer then the AFL should be giving them an ultimatum: show us that you can stand on your own two feet financially or move (to Tassie). Ultimately I believe Carlton will turn their financial situation around (they have too many wealthy supporters not to) and the Western Bulldogs will probably benefit from the improvements to their HQ at Whitten Oval. So the outlook for a Tassie AFL team looks fairly bleak, that's unless the AFL is willing to admit a 17th club.
 

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Think before you post son.

The nearest thing to a 'corporate' in Tasmania is Forestry Tas (the only company in the state with more than 500 employees). Plus head office is in Hobart. It's really an SME - not a corporate sized business.

Maybe they may be able to sell one corporate box - that's assuming they have one at Launceston.
So who does Cricket Tasmania sell their corporate boxes to ??
http://www.tascricket.com.au/_content/linkdocument/00000071document.pdf

Obviously they have at least one and interestingly it includes access to Clarence Football Club facilities at Bellerive Oval.

And who do you think built Aurora Stadium ??? Not the AFL.
The Launceston City Council employs 500 people and. manages annual expenditures in excess of A$66.5 million.
Metro (Launceston based public transport company) employs 404 people.
I'd imagine that Hobart City Council would employ a similar number of people.

And the best thing about it is that cricket and footy are played at opposite times of year, so I'm sure that Cricket Tasmania and AFL Tasmania could work out a package where any interested corporates who purchased a box would be able to sponsor both in a corporate entertainment package.
 

catters05

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Of course there are soe hurdles to overcome. Tassie is a divided state. Launceston (North) and Hobart (South) have a Sydney vs Melbourne-like rivalry that doesn't do the state any favours. If a Tasmanian team is based in Launceston (playing at Aurora Stadium) then there is every chance the people in and around Hobart will not support it (and vice versa).
This is why you play 1/2 the games in Hobart and 1/2 in Launceston. Purchase an extra home game from a Vic club like Sydney and Brisbane have done in the past to make it to 12. 6 in each city....would do well.

As for home finals, that is a different story all together. Maybe the 2 cities could toss a coin over hosting the final to really build interest in the state.....
 
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