Top 10 Centre Half Backs

[cjwalkley]

1 - Justin Leppitsch - very attacking and zones off his player. Reads the ball well and can get beaten, but hurts the opposition as much when he has the ball as his opponent has hurt the Lions on his bad days.

2 - Glen Jakovich - back near his best form, a man mountain. Turning circle is a concern, but overcomes that with a good football brain.

3 - Simon Beaumont - probably too short to be a genuine CHB, but did so manfully and was rarely towelled up in 2002 unlike a lot of his team mates.

4 - Daryl Wakelin - with Paxman back at FB, Wakelin spent time further away from the goal square late in 2002. Dour defender who rarely puts a foot wrong.

5 - Jason Cloke - need another year before his proper assessment is known. Could rate right at the top or drop out all together. Plays as a loose man quite a lot.

6 - Chris Grant - confidence is very low, but at his top rates alongside Leppitsch. Query to whether he can reach those heights again.

7 - Jade Rawlings - injury plagued season in 2002, and needs to prove 2001 wasn't all we will see of his attacking style of CHB.

8 - Ben Holland - when right a genuine CHB who the Tigers sorely missed in 2002.

9 - Clint Bizzell - another undersized player who has stepped up when required.

10 - Jason Saddington - has taken the mantle as the Swans best tall defender now Dunkley has retired.

Special mentions to:

Matthew Bishop
Mark Bolton
Andrew Schauble

 

[Becker]

I agree with Justin Leppitsch as the best, the rest are open to people's opinions I guess.

 

[knuckles]

I agree with Leppa, but talk about daylight between him and the rest!!
In short, he is the only in the list that could move to CHF and be effective. The rest have either skill, physique or confidence deficiencies.

 

[Stiffy_18]

Originally posted by cjwalkley
4 - Daryl Wakelin - with Paxman back at FB, Wakelin spent time further away from the goal square late in 2002. Dour defender who rarely puts a foot wrong.

If you watch a bit more of Port games last year you would have found out that he was playing as a FB or a 3rd tall. IMHO he is not as comfortable at CHF as he is when playing closer to goal.

5 - Jason Cloke - need another year before his proper assessment is known. Could rate right at the top or drop out all together. Plays as a loose man quite a lot.

Has the potential to be one of the best CHBs around, but personally I would like him to stick to his man more often rather than be a 3rd man up in a contest. Scott Welsh seems to cause him some major concerns.

6 - Chris Grant - confidence is very low, but at his top rates alongside Leppitsch. Query to whether he can reach those heights again.

I always thought he was primarily a forward lately. Is a very good CHB when he plays there which lately doesn't seem too often

BTW on what criteria did you pick your top 10? Is it on 2002 form on just pick a player who is capable of playing CHB but doesn't actually play a lot of footy at CHB?

 

[GOALden Hawk]

Originally posted by cjwalkley

7 - Jade Rawlings - injury plagued season in 2002, and needs to prove 2001 wasn't all we will see of his attacking style of CHB.

Rawlings played every game last year. And he is miles ahead of Jason Cloke at this stage - Cloke is yet to prove himself actually playing a defensive role, he has been more of a loose man.

 

[cjwalkley]

Re: Re: Top 10 Centre Half Backs

Originally posted by Stiffy_18
If you watch a bit more of Port games last year you would have found out that he was playing as a FB or a 3rd tall. IMHO he is not as comfortable at CHF as he is when playing closer to goal.



Has the potential to be one of the best CHBs around, but personally I would like him to stick to his man more often rather than be a 3rd man up in a contest. Scott Welsh seems to cause him some major concerns.



I always thought he was primarily a forward lately. Is a very good CHB when he plays there which lately doesn't seem too often

BTW on what criteria did you pick your top 10? Is it on 2002 form on just pick a player who is capable of playing CHB but doesn't actually play a lot of footy at CHB?

My criteria is on where they are now. Hence Wakelin will play away from goal more as Paxman will be the No 1 fullback. Chris Grant will spend the majority of 2003 at CHB as well.

 

[Murray]

Jakovich easily the best.
Cloke will become very good - whey you say he plays loose, it could be construed as being attacking.

 

[Pessimistic]

Re: Re: Re: Top 10 Centre Half Backs

Originally posted by cjwalkley
My criteria is on where they are now. Hence Wakelin will play away from goal more as Paxman will be the No 1 fullback. Chris Grant will spend the majority of 2003 at CHB as well.

Wrong wrong wrong - you are rating on 2002 form only -in all your lists - with the exception of a favoured few (like cloke) who gets in on 'potential'

It is not where they are "now"

The best CHF last weekend was probably Luke Hodge

 

[Stiffy_18]

Re: Re: Re: Top 10 Centre Half Backs

Originally posted by cjwalkley
My criteria is on where they are now. Hence Wakelin will play away from goal more as Paxman will be the No 1 fullback. Chris Grant will spend the majority of 2003 at CHB as well.

I think you will find that D. Wakelin will play closer to goal as either a FB or a BP and Matthew Bishop will play as a CHB.

 

[grayham]

Originally posted by cjwalkley

10 - Jason Saddington - has taken the mantle as the Swans best tall defender now Dunkley has retired.

Special mentions to:

Matthew Bishop
Mark Bolton
Andrew Schauble

I'm so pleased a Sydney player has made it onto one of your lists (really waiting for the FF one to be honest).

But Schauble is No.1 CHB and best tall defender at Sydney, although this year may see him move around a bit.

 

[FIGJAM]

Re: Re: Top 10 Centre Half Backs

Originally posted by Stiffy_18
Has the potential to be one of the best CHBs around, but personally I would like him to stick to his man more often rather than be a 3rd man up in a contest. Scott Welsh seems to cause him some major concerns.

Clokey's #1 attribute is that he leaves his opponent, due to superior reading of the play and provides a contest no matter what. This gives the appearance of "loose man" in defence.

Shane Wakelin is our CHB. He is, at the minute, better than Clokey. Wakes was excellent last year and worthy of a top ten spot. Underrated footballer. Beat many big name forwards.

 

[cjwalkley]

Re: Re: Top 10 Centre Half Backs

Originally posted by grayham
I'm so pleased a Sydney player has made it onto one of your lists (really waiting for the FF one to be honest).

But Schauble is No.1 CHB and best tall defender at Sydney, although this year may see him move around a bit.

I'd suggest Schauble will play FB for most of the year, especially against the Lynch's and Neitz's.

 

[cjwalkley]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Top 10 Centre Half Backs

Originally posted by Stiffy_18
I think you will find that D. Wakelin will play closer to goal as either a FB or a BP and Matthew Bishop will play as a CHB.

I guess it depends on the CHF. On a Whitnall or Brown I'd expect Wakelin to pick them up, but a Riewoldt or Stevens and Bishop would get the job. It all depends on who lines up where.

 

[cjwalkley]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Top 10 Centre Half Backs

Originally posted by Pessimistic
Wrong wrong wrong - you are rating on 2002 form only -in all your lists - with the exception of a favoured few (like cloke) who gets in on 'potential'

It is not where they are "now"

The best CHF last weekend was probably Luke Hodge

Gee I'm glad you can garner that my opinions and criteria are wrong. Perhaps you should be doing those Mind Games shows instead.

The only thing I have taken from the Wizard Cup is some of the new positioning of players. The form from it is a joke. The players 2002 form, as well as there potential for improvement is taken into account. As are the positions that they should play in.

 

[Stiffy_18]

Re: Re: Re: Top 10 Centre Half Backs

Originally posted by FIGJAM
Shane Wakelin is our CHB. He is, at the minute, better than Clokey. Wakes was excellent last year and worthy of a top ten spot. Underrated footballer. Beat many big name forwards.

You will get no argument form me on that one. I rate Wakelin twins highly and both are very much underrated. IMHO Daryl was very stiff last year for not getting AA selection.

As for Cloke, as I said he will be very good player but he needs to be more accountable. In last years Preliminary final Scott Welsh gave him a run around because of this. If the Crows were performing at their best then it sould have hurt the Pies pretty badly. I still say he can go and leave his man and help his team mates but he needs to be more aware as to when to do it and when to stick to his many. Overall he is a very good player.

 

[noodle]

No Pavlich CJ? I would have thought that he would be in the top 5.

 

[cjwalkley]

I'm not too sure where to rate Pav position wise. He could end up playing anywhere and Connolly has him earmarked as an onballer!

 

[MarkT]

Cloke is a gun and will be a star. He is a bit difficult to classify though. I wouldn't call him a CHB. He can play there and he can play FB but at present, after 1 season he is neither really. He is not as unaccountable as many think but he ahs been beaten by quicker opponents. Whan that has occurred he has still made good contributions either in 1 on 1 contests or by reading the play and making things happen that other playes let happen. That is the difference between players like Cloke and players like Presti. Personally I would like Cloke to be able to use his football brain and judgement rather than be give more accountable roles. I always think you should use a players best attributes and not have him waist time and energy concentrating on what he doesn't do as well for a lesser return. Cloke will be a very good defender but he won't be a regular CHB for quite some if ever.

 

[Lockyer24]

1. Justin Leppitsch
2. Glen Jakovich
3. Matthew Pavlich
4. Daryl Wakelin
5. Jade Rawlings
6. Chris Grant
7. Shane Wakelin
8. Ben Graham
9. Ben Holland
10. Jason Saddington

 

[FreoRules]

If Cloke is so accountable why does Malthouse play an extra man in defence then?



Cloke is a good young player and is still developing but the spin about him just leaving his man and reading the play well is laughable. Very good as a loose man in defence but won't play as a KPP in my opinion as he lacks height to do that but will be a very good HBF. Lacks the pace to play midfield.

 

[Murray]

MM has used that tatic at every club he has coached at.
His approach has always been - Stop them scoring more than us and we win.

 

[Lockyer24]

Originally posted by FreoRules
If Cloke is so accountable why does Malthouse play an extra man in defence then?



Cloke is a good young player and is still developing but the spin about him just leaving his man and reading the play well is laughable.

You're wrong pal. Watch some of our games will you.

 

[FreoRules]

Actually I did watch most of the Collingwood games last year and in more games than not they played a loose man in defence and Cloke had that role.

Also watching Malthouse coaching for over a decade you will see that he will be Mr Negative and hug the boundary lines and play the loose man.

Name me the games when Collingwood played a whole game without resorting to having an extra man in defence.

Cloke is good at what he does but it is a lot easier with no direct opponent.

 

[MarkT]

Originally posted by FreoRules
If Cloke is so accountable why does Malthouse play an extra man in defence then?

Because he thinks it is a good way to limit the opposition forwards opportunities and launch an attack. He's probably wrong because he only has 2 premierships and a couple of runners up medals.

On top of that Collingwood don't have a ruckman capable of clearing the centre so they start many attacks from defense. Some due to direct opposition ball clearance and some due to rushed Collingwood centre clearance which is chopped off and sent back to half back.

To think that MM, a defensive strategist, plays a loose man because a firsty ear player is not capable of manning up and therefore needs coverage is one of the the most unenlightened things I've read on Big Footy that hasn't involved a defense of Carlton's culture.

 

[superstar]

Re: Re: Re: Top 10 Centre Half Backs

Originally posted by FIGJAM
Clokey's #1 attribute is that he leaves his opponent, due to superior reading of the play and provides a contest no matter what. This gives the appearance of "loose man" in defence.

The fact that he rarely has a direct opponent is what gives me the impression that he is a "loose man" in defence.