Well done Geelong for finally taking a stand

[iameviljez]

Premiership Cup?

According BF rumour (so it must be true) he had a draftee meeting with Freo and was not exactly thrilled.

 

[ChappyUK]

According BF rumour (so it must be true) he had a draftee meeting with Freo and was not exactly thrilled.

I heard Ross Lyon was the reason he wouldn't go to Freo.

 

[southcoast]

the spanner in the works was Andrew Gaff who decided to stay when everyone at the Eagles expected him to be leaving. Without his compo pick they had nothing substantial to offer.

Interesting comment this one.

Assuming Gaff did leave - the compensation pick (by AFL 'rules') would have been immediately after our first round pick which was at the end of the first round. Lycetts compensation pick was there too - so not sure how Gaff's compensation pick would have changed the negotiations in anyway shape or form.

That is unless the AFL changed their compensation rules - which, of course, would never happen.

 

[southcoast]

That is such a stupid notion lol. You do realize what happens then yeah? If everyone wants to work for the same employer - i.e. Eagles, Hawks, Tigers, Pies etc., then you will have a complete imbalance in a professional league. Or would you rather situations like Real Madrid and Barcelona dominating La Liga every year, with only a couple of other teams competing.

I actually think we are very close to this point now.

Too many raids being made on the same clubs with scraps being thrown back. In some respects GWS and GCS are being treated exactly the same way the WAFL and SANFL were treated prior to AFL expansion - feeder leagues for the bigger clubs.

While I accept the principles of free agency - the clubs gaining free agents get a huge free kick as there is no requirement, on their part, to give anything else but $. Eg Gaff was being actively pursued by Norfs - while they had to give up salary cap $, there was no loss of draft position and, by extension, potential trade value.

Without spending time thinking things through - if Gaff did go to Norfs as FA then Gaff gets the $ on offer, WCE get the compo pick and Norfs give up 2nd rounder (or equivalent in points if no second rounder in their draft/trade bag).

 

[iameviljez]

Interesting comment this one.

Assuming Gaff did leave - the compensation pick (by AFL 'rules') would have been immediately after our first round pick which was at the end of the first round. Lycetts compensation pick was there too - so not sure how Gaff's compensation pick would have changed the negotiations in anyway shape or form.

That is unless the AFL changed their compensation rules - which, of course, would never happen.

It would have changed it in terms of the Eagles having increased need for a top midfielder.

 

[Shadow89]

I actually think we are very close to this point now.

Too many raids being made on the same clubs with scraps being thrown back. In some respects GWS and GCS are being treated exactly the same way the WAFL and SANFL were treated prior to AFL expansion - feeder leagues for the bigger clubs.

While I accept the principles of free agency - the clubs gaining free agents get a huge free kick as there is no requirement, on their part, to give anything else but $. Eg Gaff was being actively pursued by Norfs - while they had to give up salary cap $, there was no loss of draft position and, by extension, potential trade value.

Without spending time thinking things through - if Gaff did go to Norfs as FA then Gaff gets the $ on offer, WCE get the compo pick and Norfs give up 2nd rounder (or equivalent in points if no second rounder in their draft/trade bag).

Absolutely agree. This trade period has demonstrated just how close we are to the precipice of the cliff, and what the ramifications are if we go off it. Very close to returning to 16 teams the way we're going.

 

[WestCoast05]

The headlines are a bit of bullshit, her quotes in the article are quite reasonable.

But yeah the Freo question needs to be asked.

Seriously - maybe Kelly just didn't agree with the media's premise that he is the ONLY player seeking a move that can't nominate.
Even every player seeking a move for compassion reasons nominated. He is not responsible for the way player movements are done nowdays.

Also one thing you need to realise from her going to the media is the level of abuse from Geelong supporters she has received. Most of it is deleted but I have read plenty of it, malicious stuff.
I have never seen anything like it in a trade before. She would put up a pic of her kids and then receive abusive comments immediately under it. Go to the Geelong board and read some of the names she gets called such as 'hag' etc.
My point being that it is no wonder she feels the need to tell the media how she feels.

 

[Mad_Hatter]

Seriously - maybe Kelly just didn't agree with the media's premise that he is the ONLY player seeking a move that can't nominate.
Even every player seeking a move for compassion reasons nominated. He is not responsible for the way player movements are done nowdays.

Also one thing you need to realise from her going to the media is the level of abuse from Geelong supporters she has received. Most of it is deleted but I have read plenty of it, malicious stuff.
I have never seen anything like it in a trade before. She would put up a pic of her kids and then receive abusive comments immediately under it. Go to the Geelong board and read some of the names she gets called such as 'hag' etc.
My point being that it is no wonder she feels the need to tell the media how she feels.

Most of that "abuse" as you call it, that I've seen atleast, was in retaliation to her own social media posts ignorantly slamming the club.
Notice how Tim himself hasn't copped any? Because he's been silent and just let it play out outside the media/social media bubble.
Perhaps she should have done the same.

 

[Bradkli]

Feel for the cats here...they had every right to hold firm and not trade Kelly to the eagles..HOWEVER this is now going to hurt them next season...he is going to leave for nothing at the end of 2019 and the club now need to deal with this circus all of next season...he will end up missing games due to “personal reasons” and the media will be all over this story every week...having a partner like he does as well, is going to just make the whole situation worse..the cats aren’t winning the flag next season, so whether or not they had kelly won’t have made a difference...what the eagles were offering was a little unders, but it wasn’t the worst deal of all time and would have allowed this circus to end...this will be one of the times where the club and supporters go with “hindsight is a wonderful thing”


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[dean33]

He wanted to get home soooo badly.

But not badly enough to play at Freo.

Seriously, good on Geelong for taking a stand against rubbish like this.

Like beams needed to come back to Melbourne .. but only to play for Collingwood of course. Lions should have held him to his contract as well.

 

[dean33]

Feel for the cats here...they had every right to hold firm and not trade Kelly to the eagles..HOWEVER this is now going to hurt them next season...he is going to leave for nothing at the end of 2019 and the club now need to deal with this circus all of next season...he will end up missing games due to “personal reasons” and the media will be all over this story every week...having a partner like he does as well, is going to just make the whole situation worse..the cats aren’t winning the flag next season, so whether or not they had kelly won’t have made a difference...what the eagles were offering was a little unders, but it wasn’t the worst deal of all time and would have allowed this circus to end...this will be one of the times where the club and supporters go with “hindsight is a wonderful thing”


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

Why would he leave for nothing next year? Can’t geelong trade him to the eagles next season?

 

[STPer18]

Like beams needed to come back to Melbourne .. but only to play for Collingwood of course. Lions should have held him to his contract as well.

Lions obviously thought the deal they received for Beams was worth breaking a contract for though. Geelong set their terms for trade early on in the piece, WCE seemed to be relying on the 'homesickness' card to allow them to pick him up for cheap with a raft of 2nd round picks.

 

[100action]

I see Tims wife calling Geelong heartless and hasn't given them much support. Using the special needs of one of their children as a emotive play. I'd ask 1 question... Why wasn't Freo an option?

Tim's wife is a severe idiot.

If both parents being together was so important for the children, perhaps you could have told your husband to pursue another career or you could have, you know, relocated to Melbourne with your husbands 200k+ wage.

Equalized sporting competition doesn't revolve around you.

 

[Adz]

Can someone post the article about his partner critisising the club?

 

[Jobe Watson]

A lot of the blame has to fall on Tim and/or his manager here.

Can't say "I'm so desperate to go home" and then only choose to go to 1 club. He's a first-year player - it's a joke he even thinks he has the power to demand a trade to a specific club at this early stage of his career and that his current team will just go for it. And he picks the reigning premiers, who don't even need him and wouldn't bother trying to move heaven and Earth to get him.

Geelong gave him the chance to have an AFL career. They're paying him well and above the average Australian salary. He gets extended periods of time off. He gets help and support from the club that goes beyond what any other employer would provide. I know his family situation might be difficult, but you'd think with all of the benefits that come with being an AFL player (and he has Geelong to thank for this) he could maybe suck it up a bit and play out his contract.

 

[Ghossein]

Now that's a bit unfair. Name the last, contracted first year player to (a) request a return to his home state for family reasons, but (b) declare he would only play for one club?

As you are well aware a player cannot specify which club he wants to be drafted by. The draft is a lottery. On the other hand an uncontracted player can pick a destination.

If the AFL allowed players to break contracts and nominate the club they wanted to play for the AFL might as well do away with contracts and let clubs pay players whatever they felt was right

contracted players do this all the time, i'm not sure the last time a first year player did it

and yes, that seems to be the way footy is going

 

[Ghossein]

Requesting West Coast isn’t the issue. The issue was West Coast couldn’t provide the Goods that Geelong wanted.

Why should they take a deal that they weren’t happy with just because a contracted player wants to go home?

and why should we pay overs?

the logic used in this thread only seems to go one way, Geelong are allowed to demand whatever they want because they're looking after themselves, but if west coast refuse to find a way to accumulate all of the top 10 picks in the draft and then send them to kardinia park then they don't care about Tim Kelly

 

[STPer18]

and why should we pay overs?

the logic used in this thread only seems to go one way, Geelong are allowed to demand whatever they want because they're looking after themselves, but if west coast refuse to find a way to accumulate all of the top 10 picks in the draft and then send them to kardinia park then they don't care about Tim Kelly

See, there it is again, the narrative being changed. It was a single top 10 pick, and later on pick 11 would have satisfied. Why the necessity to keep making the trade demands out to be something that they weren't from WCE supporters?

 

[Ghossein]

If the article about Caitlin Miller claiming Geelong "haven't given her family enough support" is true, then it makes sense why he would nominate the family-orientated club of west coast over Fremantle. Simpson has spent years trying to create a family-orientated culture.

 

[Ghossein]

See, there it is again, the narrative being changed. It was a single top 10 pick, and later on pick 11 would have satisfied. Why the necessity to keep making the trade demands out to be something that they weren't from WCE supporters?

i was exaggerating

but just so we're clear, i am aware that geelong werent actually demanding west coast find a way to get all of the top 10 picks in the afl draft in exchange for tim kelly

 

[Mad_Hatter]

and why should we pay overs?

the logic used in this thread only seems to go one way, Geelong are allowed to demand whatever they want because they're looking after themselves, but if west coast refuse to find a way to accumulate all of the top 10 picks in the draft and then send them to kardinia park then they don't care about Tim Kelly

Because you approached a contracted and required player.
It's the way it goes ALLL the time.

 

[Ghossein]

The point is Geelong are allowed to demand whatever they want because they're looking after their interests, but if West Coast also look after their interests then they are criticised for "not valuing Kelly". It doesn't make any sense, and it is deeply hypocritical.

 

[Ghossein]

Because you approached a contracted and required player.
It's the way it goes ALLL the time.

again, you're missing the point

read my previous post

 

[Mad_Hatter]

The point is Geelong are allowed to demand whatever they want because they're looking after their interests, but if West Coast also look after their interests then they are criticised for "not valuing Kelly". It doesn't make any sense, and it is deeply hypocritical.

Because, again, you approached him and he's contracted.
If you talk about "interests" then why don't the GFC offer pick 70 for Luke Shuey? They can't be criticised for that offer, afterall it's in their best interest to offer a low pick.
His value was a top 10 pick, it's pretty simple.

 

[Ghossein]

Because, again, you approached him and he's contracted.
If you talk about "interests" then why don't the GFC offer pick 70 for Luke Shuey? They can't be criticised for that offer, afterall it's in their best interest to offer a low pick.
His value was a top 10 pick, it's pretty simple.

... okay, you're still not understanding this

I understand that clubs pay a premium for contracted players. At no point did I deny this. However, it's not in West Coast interests to forfeit all of our decent picks both this year AND next year, and thus a deal wasn't made. This is okay.

What I don't understand is why you guys want to circle jerk about how Geelong bravely looked after their interests, while screaming at West Coast for not bending over backwards to meet Geelong's expectations, without at all seeing the hypocrisy in that.