EDFL Premier Division

[Keston]

Has a point system ever actually worked in a major league or is it like a "salary cap" good idea but ineffective?

I can't see how you can limit the capacity of players to continue to play the game by introducing a point limit which may exclude them from playing in a competition - reckon there could be a few restraint of trade issues that would come from that.

Surely its better to have the clubs self regulate - pay what they can afford - maybe even submit a playing budget to the league before they start with explanations on how they can afford to pay - bit like a financial statement - if the books say they are illiquid then they can't recruit etc....

The points ystem looks like you will get one ex-AFL player per team and the rest of the blokes who get delisted can sit on the sidelines or play the early game so as kids get to play....

The payment issue has been happening for years - ever since Bobby Rose left Collingwood to play in the O&M because he got paid more - Fred Fannings last VFL game was one where he kicked 18 goals - next game with Hamilton because of the cash - a problem with EDFL grounds is you can charge entry to recoup player costs....

The idea is to insure locals play at clubs that they played juniors with and the $$$ from within community and local sponsors are not waisted clubs can spend upwards of 250,000 and not win the flag all clubs are not for profit clubs I reckon another reason is the cash paid out there might be a big bird looking over this as well and instead of opening Pandora's box may be given afl vic the chance to rectify it !
The point system means clubs will have to insure over a period players from outside stay to reduce there points and alow the club to recruit others
The point system talked about above sounds right the points might be 34 but it would be interesting to do the figures based on say deer park Abbas
And other clubs to see what they where at last year ?

 

[shagshouli]

On another note, the big winners of a points system would be,

Craigieburn
Greenvale
Abers
Taylors Lakes
Roxburgh Park
Keilor

Big catchment areas especially the 10 - 14 year age group.
Craigieburn under a points system would become a powerhouse after a 5 year period.

 

[Grassbag]

It would also be the death of Airport West and Pasco Vale. Demographically not enough young men living in those catchments to field teams and can't recruit because of a points system. Quandary???

Would not be the death of pacco.... Would reduce their strength significantly but they've had plenty of juniors they've been unable to retain.... Probably because they haven't been able to get a game due to recruits

 

[Grassbag]

On another note, the big winners of a points system would be,

Craigieburn
Greenvale
Abers
Taylors Lakes
Roxburgh Park
Keilor

Big catchment areas especially the 10 - 14 year age group.
Craigieburn under a points system would become a powerhouse after a 5 year period.

Craigieburn should be a powerhouse already... But agree with what you're saying growth area clubs are the big winners under this system

Maybe the clubs in areas such as Fawkner glenroy Hadfield jacana that have an older demographic and a lot of clubs in close proximity should receive a couple extra points as compensation

 

[Shadow Master]

I believe so. The template I seen, from memory, was something like this:

- A total of 30 points per team

- Player from an opposition team within the same competition = 6 points
- AFL player = 5 points
- State league player = 4 points
- Major Country or Metro league player = 3 points
- Minor Country or Metro league player = 2 points
- Junior player with club = 1 point

- Players points begin to be reduced after having played 2 consecutive years at a club.

- Possibility for teams that finish last to score an extra point for the next season in leagues without a relegation/promotion system.

Again I am just going from memory after reading this earlier in the year. No perfect system/template but will be interesting to see how a trial would pan out. Definitely see this having some legs, especially in the country where no relegation/promotion exists and the bottom teams that can't compete with the big spending teams are simply getting flogged every week, year in year out.

From what I've told 'dunedog', the total number of points allocated for each club on a weekly basis would vary from competition to competition, for the more vibrant competitions such as the EFL and the EDFL the number of allocated points could be as high as 55 on a weekly basis, especially while the points system is in it's infancy.

Suggested points scale:
5 points for an ex AFL listed player.
4 points for an ex State League listed player.
4 points for a player who has played for an opposing club.
2 points for a player from all other competitions.
1 point for talent returning home.
1 point for a home grown player.
-1 point for a home grown current underage player.

If the above points scale was used in the 2014 EDFL Grand Final, Strathmore FC would have amassed 62 points and Aberfeldie FC would have amassed some 63 points.

'YOU GET WHAT YOU PLAN FOR'

'INTERESTING TIMES AHEAD FOR SOME CLUBS'

 

[leo tolstoy]

Points system is weighted, less junior/no juniors and others considerations are made before allocating points total. Also players after a period of time become local.

 

[Keston]

From what I've told 'dunedog', the total number of points allocated for each club on a weekly basis would vary from competition to competition, for the more vibrant competitions such as the EFL and the EDFL the number of allocated points could be as high as 55 on a weekly basis, especially while the points system is in it's infancy.

Suggested points scale:
5 points for an ex AFL listed player.
4 points for an ex State League listed player.
4 points for a player who has played for an opposing club.
2 points for a player from all other competitions.
1 point for talent returning home.
1 point for a home grown player.
-1 point for a home grown current underage player.

If the above points scale was used in the 2014 EDFL Grand Final, Strathmore FC would have amassed 62 points and Aberfeldie FC would have amassed some 63 points.

'YOU GET WHAT YOU PLAN FOR'

'INTERESTING TIMES AHEAD FOR SOME CLUBS'

Interesting can you work out what say the bottom sides points would have been last year in div 1

 

[ItsAllAboutMe]

Points system is weighted, less junior/no juniors and others considerations are made before allocating points total. Also players after a period of time become local.

This is sounding way too complex and going to be a debacle, just like AFL rules changes the clubs will quickly work out loopholes and just make a joke of the whole rule.

 

[1992edfl2012]

I believe that he has signed with VFL Club Coburg

don't think that is happening anymore. Jedd might actually be lost to footy

 

[Keston]

This is sounding way too complex and going to be a debacle, just like AFL rules changes the clubs will quickly work out loopholes and just make a joke of the whole rule.

Works in WA

 

[Canplaythisguy]

On another note, the big winners of a points system would be,

Craigieburn
Greenvale
Abers
Taylors Lakes
Roxburgh Park
Keilor

Big catchment areas especially the 10 - 14 year age group.
Craigieburn under a points system would become a powerhouse after a 5 year period.

Cragieburns juniors are terrible there under 18s are good but nothing else coming through.
Taylors lakes juniors are in huge trouble and Roxy park are struggling!

Keilor
Abers
Greenvale
Douttas
Strathmore

Would be the winners out of the point system.

 

[bsddbsfbfd]

So a player playing in 3rd Division WRFL would be worth the same as a player from a 1st Div NFL side?

 

[Jackos]

Staff this point System an all the crap that's been said it's local footy boys just deal with it
You've got the $$$ you buy players
NS BEAT ABERS AT ABERS
not always $$$ buys you always flag

 

[muppet007]

Greenvale looks beyond addition of third open-age team with plans for Superules and women's sides - http://www.heraldsun.com.au/leader/...and-womens-sides/story-fngnvocb-1227152192759

A THIRD open-age team will be just the tip of the iceberg at Greenvale, according to club president Bruce Kent.
It comes after the Essendon and District Football League announced it would introduce a third open-age competition in 2015, revealing seven clubs had expressed interest, including Greenvale.

 

[shagshouli]

Cragieburns juniors are terrible there under 18s are good but nothing else coming through.
Taylors lakes juniors are in huge trouble and Roxy park are struggling!

Keilor
Abers
Greenvale
Douttas
Strathmore

Would be the winners out of the point system.

Craigieburn under a points system would become a powerhouse after a 5 year period.

 

[ItsAllAboutMe]

Craigieburn under a points system would become a powerhouse after a 5 year period.

They should already be given there demographics, yet still rarely produce and develop star players, Jake Carlisle is the only notable player to get drafted from Craigieburn that I can remember and here would only be a handful of Craigieburn juniors currently playing at A Grade clubs.

 

[shagshouli]

Lets get off this points topic.
If it not implemented then its pointless discussing it.

 

[puffpuffgivemo]

From what I've told 'dunedog', the total number of points allocated for each club on a weekly basis would vary from competition to competition, for the more vibrant competitions such as the EFL and the EDFL the number of allocated points could be as high as 55 on a weekly basis, especially while the points system is in it's infancy.

Suggested points scale:
5 points for an ex AFL listed player.
4 points for an ex State League listed player.
4 points for a player who has played for an opposing club.
2 points for a player from all other competitions.
1 point for talent returning home.
1 point for a home grown player.
-1 point for a home grown current underage player.

If the above points scale was used in the 2014 EDFL Grand Final, Strathmore FC would have amassed 62 points and Aberfeldie FC would have amassed some 63 points.

'YOU GET WHAT YOU PLAN FOR'

'INTERESTING TIMES AHEAD FOR SOME CLUBS'

How'd you work your calculations for each club - with a counting frame?

I've Abers at 43 points based on the above and Strathmore at mid 30's

Points dropping down for years of service at a club i.e. Johnsy been at Abers for four years this season and prior to that had been out of the AFL system for 2 years so this year worth 2 points at most.

Luke Davis a 5 but is Paul Dimmatina a 5 too at Airport West or as per Johnsy?

On other clubs improving - I agree that Craigieburn should be a powerhouse and perhaps it'll realise in 5 - 10 years times when children from those younger families who've bought property are able to play but it hasn't happened yet and I wonder why?

Big population numbers don't necessarily deliver high junior participation and talent either.

Aberfeldie - 4,000 people
Strathmore - 8,000 people
Greenvale - 12,000 people
Keilor - 5,000 people
Craigieburn - 40,000 people

 

[Stax on the mill]

How'd you work your calculations for each club - with a counting frame?

I've Abers at 43 points based on the above and Strathmore at mid 30's

Points dropping down for years of service at a club i.e. Johnsy been at Abers for four years this season and prior to that had been out of the AFL system for 2 years so this year worth 2 points at most.

Luke Davis a 5 but is Paul Dimmatina a 5 too at Airport West or as per Johnsy?

On other clubs improving - I agree that Craigieburn should be a powerhouse and perhaps it'll realise in 5 - 10 years times when children from those younger families who've bought property are able to play but it hasn't happened yet and I wonder why?

Big population numbers don't necessarily deliver high junior participation and talent either.

Aberfeldie - 4,000 people
Strathmore - 8,000 people
Greenvale - 12,000 people
Keilor - 5,000 people
Craigieburn - 40,000 people

Totally agree, massive over estimation by Shadow Master. The supposed 63 and 62 points attributed to Abers and Strathmore were figures just plucked out at random, without any individual details to back them up, or any apparent allowance for years of service at either club.

 

[ItsAllAboutMe]

How'd you work your calculations for each club - with a counting frame?

I've Abers at 43 points based on the above and Strathmore at mid 30's

Points dropping down for years of service at a club i.e. Johnsy been at Abers for four years this season and prior to that had been out of the AFL system for 2 years so this year worth 2 points at most.

Luke Davis a 5 but is Paul Dimmatina a 5 too at Airport West or as per Johnsy?

On other clubs improving - I agree that Craigieburn should be a powerhouse and perhaps it'll realise in 5 - 10 years times when children from those younger families who've bought property are able to play but it hasn't happened yet and I wonder why?

Big population numbers don't necessarily deliver high junior participation and talent either.

Aberfeldie - 4,000 people
Strathmore - 8,000 people
Greenvale - 12,000 people
Keilor - 5,000 people
Craigieburn - 40,000 people

How do you get Aberfeldie at 4000? They basically have the whole of Moonee Ponds, Ascot Vale and half of Essendon as there 'catchment' area and are the club of choice for kids who go to both St Bernard's and PEGS.

 

[shagshouli]

Totally agree, massive over estimation by Shadow Master. The supposed 63 and 62 points attributed to Abers and Strathmore were figures just plucked out at random, without any individual details to back them up, or any apparent allowance for years of service at either club.

Shadow is developing a reputation for this.

 

[bsddbsfbfd]

How do you get Aberfeldie at 4000? They basically have the whole of Moonee Ponds, Ascot Vale and half of Essendon as there 'catchment' area and are the club of choice for kids who go to both St Bernard's and PEGS.

I think he meant geographically. Kids from other areas may choose to play at Abers, but there location pool is indeed very small.

Moonee Ponds = Moonee Valley FC
Ascot Vale = Maribyrnong Park FC
Essendon = Douttas

Most kids go to the club they either live closest to, or have mates playing at. Craigieburn should be doing a lot better, but at the end of the day a club does need to make themselves look like a good destination.


EDIT: And to be fair, there are a dozen clubs climbing over the top of each other in a very tight area.

 

[puffpuffgivemo]

How do you get Aberfeldie at 4000? They basically have the whole of Moonee Ponds, Ascot Vale and half of Essendon as there 'catchment' area and are the club of choice for kids who go to both St Bernard's and PEGS.

Splitting hairs aren't you - same can be said for Douttas, St. Bernard's, PEGs, Marbi Park etc.

On your logic Craigieburn is in Greenvale's catchment area isn't it and Vicky Versa?

 

[puffpuffgivemo]

How's recruiting at other clubs travelling at this stage?

Some big and quite surprising noise coming out of a few clubs however until confirmed you never know at this time of year.

As most already know recruiting for 2015 has been super this year at Abers - commitment from bulk of the list plus the following ins:

Our U18 graduating talent - huge plus
Al Kefford - returns after a strong season in the VFL
Gareth Phillips - returns after a few injury riddled seasons
Luke Blackwell - quality midfielder - fitted in beautifully already
Jesse Laurie - comes straight from Uni Blacks premiership team - ex Port Adelaide listed and Claremont star
Brad Vassal - good friend of our skipper Josh Cubillo - strong inside midfielder

 

[Shadow Master]

How'd you work your calculations for each club - with a counting frame?

I've Abers at 43 points based on the above and Strathmore at mid 30's

Points dropping down for years of service at a club i.e. Johnsy been at Abers for four years this season and prior to that had been out of the AFL system for 2 years so this year worth 2 points at most.

Luke Davis a 5 but is Paul Dimmatina a 5 too at Airport West or as per Johnsy?

On other clubs improving - I agree that Craigieburn should be a powerhouse and perhaps it'll realise in 5 - 10 years times when children from those younger families who've bought property are able to play but it hasn't happened yet and I wonder why?

Big population numbers don't necessarily deliver high junior participation and talent either.

Aberfeldie - 4,000 people
Strathmore - 8,000 people
Greenvale - 12,000 people
Keilor - 5,000 people
Craigieburn - 40,000 people

Apologies 'puffpuffgivemo', I didn't realise that the EDFL had reverted to AFL 9's..

From the point scale suggested in a previous post:

STRATHMORE
Iacobucci 5
Grima 5
Leech 4
Winter 4
M.Little 4
Jones 4
Arrowsmith 4
Heppell 4
Douglas 2
Grima 2

Total 38

ABERFELDIE
T.Hislop 5
Johns 5
Reimers 5
Blake 5
Cubillo 4
El Houli 4
Allan 4
McNamara 4
Lynch 4
Patak 2

Total 42

'Stuffedupgivemeago" here is a tally on the 2014 EDFL AFL'9's Grand Final with one on the bench to rotate. Not sure where you received your education, sounds like Year 7 might have been the best 5 years of your life. Maybe you shouldn't post replies whilst you have been drinking!