List Mgmt. How many list openings do we need heading in to 2015?

[The Punter]

Eli won't get promoted. He's too valuable as a rookie next year (salary, spot on the primary list). Chances are he'd be promoted very early anyway.

Two are already gone. TDL would make three. Can't see Jones hanging around. Dunell in the same boat. That's five pretty quickly before you start to make difficult decisions on blokes like Gwilt who have skills that the list is deficient in. Schneider will probably retire.

Delist six

Promote one

Draft five

But if major trades happen with players going out, that changes all of that.

 

[bird_man]

We need to look at trading someone with value like Montagna. That way we free up another spot whilst getting a high draft pick.

If then delist Dunnell, Jones and TDL.

Hayes and Maister retired.

That's 6 spots, upgrade Weller and Shenton and use draft picks 1, 20, 25*, 38.

 

[Rors]

Delist: Dunnell Jones TDL

Retire: Lenny Schneider Maister

Trade: Montagna* Gwilt**

Leaves 7 spots on the list.

Draft picks:
Pick 1
Pick 21
Pick 25*
Pick 39
Pick 40**

I'd then consider trading off 'package deals' of both 2nd or 3rd rounders for earlier picks... ie: 21 & 25 for #13*; or 39 & 40 for #28**

Leaving us then with 2 setups:
Pick 1 / Pick 1
Pick 13 / Pick 21
Pick 39 / Pick 25
Pick 40 / Pick 28

Thus,

We've drafted 4 players, elevated 1-2, & picked up someone in the PSD = 6-7 spots taken (maybe trade in another/pick up a Delisted free agent to make it 7)

 

[Geebarism]

We need to look at trading someone with value like Montagna. That way we free up another spot whilst getting a high draft pick.

If then delist Dunnell, Jones and TDL.

Hayes and Maister retired.

That's 6 spots, upgrade Weller and Shenton and use draft picks 1, 20, 25*, 38.

Yeah - think the Joey trade is probably most likely. Wouldn't think you'll get a great pick for him though. It is going to be really interesting to see if he does go, given all the banging on about the need for leaders/seniors to usher through the new brigade from Richo & co.

 

[Rors]

Yeah - think the Joey trade is probably most likely. Wouldn't think you'll get a great pick for him though. It is going to be really interesting to see if he does go, given all the banging on about the need for leaders/seniors to usher through the new brigade from Richo & co.

I'd say the 'senior leaders' crap is a bit overrated. I cant wait to see the blokes like Gilbert, Gears, Armo, Dempster, Ray & Steven be the ones to really step up to being the leaders of our club. Roo, Chips, Joey & Schneids really need to just focus on their own game, keeping themselves injury free & fit as they can be. Let the guys a few years younger become the 'senior heads' & allow them to blossom into it, instead of having to keep relying on Roo & co

We won;t end up being a basket case like Melbourne, because we will still have 5-10 guys in that 25-30yr old age bracket.... Melbourne basically got rid on everyone over 26, which absolutely killed their younger blokes development. We aren't stupid enough to do that IMO

 

[The Punter]

Dempster is 30 years old. It is really up to blokes like Gilbert and Steven to join Armo and Geary and provide that leadership.

 

[Rors]

Dempster is 30 years old. It is really up to blokes like Gilbert and Steven to join Armo and Geary and provide that leadership.

Always forget Sean's age. I keep thinking he's about 27-28

 

[STK2020]

Trade bait : Montagna , Siposs , Gilbert , Simpkin , Gwilt ,Milera , ( 2 will go )
Gone : Hayes , Maister , Dunnell , TDL
Jones , Schnieder ,
Upgrade : Templeton , Weller
Hopefully that gives us 4 selections in Draft .
Sign 1 out of contract player
Give Saad his spot back .

 

[bird_man]

Trade bait : Montagna , Siposs , Gilbert , Simpkin , Gwilt ,Milera , ( 2 will go )
Gone : Hayes , Maister , Dunnell , TDL
Jones , Schnieder ,
Upgrade : Templeton , Weller
Hopefully that gives us 4 selections in Draft .
Sign 1 out of contract player
Give Saad his spot back .

I'd add Jones to the gone list. If he can't cement a spot in the side at his age then he probably shouldn't be there, better off giving that spot to a kid.

 

[Geebarism]

I'd add Jones to the gone list. If he can't cement a spot in the side at his age then he probably shouldn't be there, better off giving that spot to a kid.

A lot of people keep mentioning Jones, and yes, I understand the reasoning. Let's not forget he had the best game of his career (39 touches) this year, albeit against Melbourne. Admittedly he dropped off through rounds 11-15, hence getting dropped, but I still (rightly or wrongly) believe he has something to offer - whether that's through development of the guys in the 2's or a hard body to protect the youngsters in the seniors.

 

[Geebarism]

Trade bait : Montagna , Siposs , Gilbert , Simpkin , Gwilt ,Milera , ( 2 will go )
Gone : Hayes , Maister , Dunnell , TDL
Jones , Schnieder ,
Upgrade : Templeton , Weller
Hopefully that gives us 4 selections in Draft .
Sign 1 out of contract player
Give Saad his spot back .

Would like to see Saad back, don't know if he'd still be up to it, but would still like to give him a shot at it. As for those trade options, can't see too many clubs wanting to 'trade' for Siposs, Simpkin or Milera - wouldn't of thought they'd have any currency. See above from The Punter regarding Templeton - probably not a wise list move to upgrade him. Just retain him on the RL and bring him on to the senior list for 2016.

 

[Smoke_Me_AKipper]

We are 18th on the ladder with 4 wins, there is not that many on the list that should be safe if we are to improve as a team players like Gwilt, Jones , Schnider have to be moved on. I believe it will be 8 - 10 spots

I agree, somewhere between 7-10. We need to shape this list and there needs to be some kind of clean out. I guess it is balancing those players that are close to retiring this year/next year versus players that are back-ups to freeing up spots for new draftees.

Eli will stay on rookie list as only played 5 games and we don't have room, unless both Minch and Shenton are gone which I don't think will happen. Both have shown enough to get a 2 year contract IMO to see what they can do. The rest is up to them. Weller will be upgraded without doubt.

I don't envy Pelchen, Bains, Richardson, and Elshaugh as they have some work to do and decisions to make. Delisting, drafting, & trading - going to be fascinating to watch it unfold. The most important will be what we do with pick 1 - Petracca v McCartin v trade to GWS (either pick plus player a la Melbourne last year or straight swap like was mentioned recently for Cameron with other tweeks) v Wright.

 

[bird_man]

We are 18th on the ladder with 4 wins, there is not that many on the list that should be safe if we are to improve as a team players like Gwilt, Jones , Schnider have to be moved on. I believe it will be 8 - 10 spots

Who would be the 10 players you would delist/trade and how do you intend on getting another 10 players onto our list? That's a massive turnover of players.

 

[cooperrules]

I agree, somewhere between 7-10. We need to shape this list and there needs to be some kind of clean out. I guess it is balancing those players that are close to retiring this year/next year versus players that are back-ups to freeing up spots for new draftees.

Eli will stay on rookie list as only played 5 games and we don't have room, unless both Minch and Shenton are gone which I don't think will happen. Both have shown enough to get a 2 year contract IMO to see what they can do. The rest is up to them. Weller will be upgraded without doubt.

I don't envy Pelchen, Bains, Richardson, and Elshaugh as they have some work to do and decisions to make. Delisting, drafting, & trading - going to be fascinating to watch it unfold. The most important will be what we do with pick 1 - Petracca v McCartin v trade to GWS (either pick plus player a la Melbourne last year or straight swap like was mentioned recently for Cameron with other tweeks) v Wright.

I dont envy big footy stkilda. It could go into meltdown.

 

[Mowman]

Who would be the 10 players you would delist/trade and how do you intend on getting another 10 players onto our list? That's a massive turnover of players.

Retierd - Lenny, Maister , Fisher ?
Delist - TDL, Jones, Milera, Dunell, Simpkin, Schneider
contracted but try to move on- Siposs, Lee if the Dockers offer something good
That's 11 players there. I don't think any of those mentioned above will help us win a flag 2018-2020. Every player there except for Lenny hasn't contributed a whole lot this year or even last year. We are in total rebuild stage, my belief is that we keep turning the list over until we find the right ones.
Up grade: Weller and Shenton. I personally would upgrade Templeton. From what I have read on this forum if we had a pick in last year's draft in the forties we would have picked him. That's 3 spots filled.

How many did we turn over last year ?

 

[Grav]

Think that the way he is playing, Montagna knows he is being shipped next year. Now which team is looking for a decent midfielder? Or better still where are we willing to send him to improve our draft prospects. GWS, Melbourne?

 

[Geebarism]

Who would be the 10 players you would delist/trade and how do you intend on getting another 10 players onto our list? That's a massive turnover of players.

Agreed. 25% of the list turned over? Highly unlikely!

 

[Armitage2Riewoldt]

Who would be the 10 players you would delist/trade and how do you intend on getting another 10 players onto our list? That's a massive turnover of players.

Last year we removed 8: Milne, Blake, Kosi, Dal, McEvoy, Ledger, Lever, Staley.

Brought in: Billings, Duntan, Acres, Templeton, Weller, Savage, Bruce, Longer, Delaney

And in 2012 we did more than that: Clarke, Gram, Goddard, Cripps, Crocker, Peake, Polo, Andreoli, Archer.

I think 10 is unlikely. But 7-8 almost a certainty.

 

[Nutsngum]

Also Saad.

 

[stfan]

3 SLOTS - National Draft - (1st, 2nd & 3rd picks)

.

Could be four depending how deep the draft runs this year.

ie 1, 20, 38, 56 ( I am not sure of how many extra picks are in the system, and FA's may produce more).

However the Saints, or may not, believe that someone useful could be around at pick 60-ish.

 

[ike2112]

My thinking is;

2 SLOTS - Upgrade both Weller & Templeton (this is where we could lessen the number of slots required by keeping both on the Rookie List - I believe we can do that for 2 years, can someone confirm?)

3 SLOTS - National Draft - (1st, 2nd & 3rd picks)

1 SLOT - Preseason Draft - Most likely for Saad.

I think we need more space, because doing as highlighted is a waste. We are likely to have the top preseason draft pick. Don't take Saad with that - use it to blackmail clubs into letting us trade for their out of contract guys, at the threat of us definitely being able to select the player here. We definitely need to take best available talent here.
Then we use the next pick on a slider, or Saad. Saad is almost our backup plan, like Jolly was last year. If an Eli Templeton type that we ranked in the top 35 of the draft falls to us, then so be it. I think I am right in saying that if the National Draft occurs and we think there's 3 people we like including Saad, we can then decide at that point to delist someone else to allow us the space.

Also - yes we can keep Weller and Templeton on the rookie list another 2 years. But that means that unless someone else has a reasonably serious injury, they couldn't play round 1. I don't think that would necessarily be a bad thing for Eli, let him get some VFL time and hopefully some high-possession games, some around the ground work. He didn't get that opportunity this year - we threw him straight in at the deep end and whilst he gave us a spark, I feel we need to be careful with his development. Let him get plenty ball and opportunity in VFL and round his game out a bit more.
However I'd probably want Weller in our best 22 all of next season though, so cant see us rookie-ing him again.

 

[ike2112]

I also however think Jones is likely to stay. He has nowhere else to go other than getting a real job, so he will cling to any opportunity presented.
The club needs a decent enough backup option in the midfield. This year there have been games where we were literally playing all of the fit inside mids on our list - not a single inner mid at Sandy. That is the dearth of ability but also propensity for injury in our squad.

Im not sold on Seb Ross either, so there would be weeks when, say Weller is injured and Geary needed at the back, playing Jones as the tagging/pressure player would be reasonable enough. He can also play more on-ball at Sandy. Its not great for him to maybe be signing up for playing maybe only 4-5 AFL games in 2015, but for a player of his limited talent it beats getting a real job.

Not only that, but I suspect Armitage is a goner via trade, so Jones will be handy just as an older body in that area. Armo was the major expected trade bait on this forum at season start, and most were not overly sad to see him potentially go. A few good weeks, many examples of the worth he brings in smashing through huddles of players, and all of a sudden we appreciate him more. But I dont feel he is essential to the rebuild, and he is good currency. Remember Pelchen emptied a lot of good players at Hawthorn in order to draft in those who went on to win their flags. I think they ended up with 3 or 4 picks in the top 16. He will do it again.

If it was not for the fact they all play in the same part of the ground, I'd say Pelchen would give up all of Armo, Steven and Joey. As it stands he'll need to keep at least one if not two of them.

I am very intrigued by it all however, as I think he'll also bring in one mature-ish recruit, to balance the age profile a little, and I'm keen to see who it might be.

 

[Saint_Dos]

4-5 picks in NAB draft. 1 preseason if needed. 2-3 in rookie. IMO

 

[StJimmy]

I also however think Jones is likely to stay. He has nowhere else to go other than getting a real job, so he will cling to any opportunity presented.
The club needs a decent enough backup option in the midfield. This year there have been games where we were literally playing all of the fit inside mids on our list - not a single inner mid at Sandy. That is the dearth of ability but also propensity for injury in our squad.

Im not sold on Seb Ross either, so there would be weeks when, say Weller is injured and Geary needed at the back, playing Jones as the tagging/pressure player would be reasonable enough. He can also play more on-ball at Sandy. Its not great for him to maybe be signing up for playing maybe only 4-5 AFL games in 2015, but for a player of his limited talent it beats getting a real job.

Not only that, but I suspect Armitage is a goner via trade, so Jones will be handy just as an older body in that area. Armo was the major expected trade bait on this forum at season start, and most were not overly sad to see him potentially go. A few good weeks, many examples of the worth he brings in smashing through huddles of players, and all of a sudden we appreciate him more. But I dont feel he is essential to the rebuild, and he is good currency. Remember Pelchen emptied a lot of good players at Hawthorn in order to draft in those who went on to win their flags. I think they ended up with 3 or 4 picks in the top 16. He will do it again.

If it was not for the fact they all play in the same part of the ground, I'd say Pelchen would give up all of Armo, Steven and Joey. As it stands he'll need to keep at least one if not two of them.

I am very intrigued by it all however, as I think he'll also bring in one mature-ish recruit, to balance the age profile a little, and I'm keen to see who it might be.

I disagree with your thoughts on Armo, with Lenny in retirement Armo is required more than ever for midfield grunt. By all reports he's also a great clubman and touted as a future leader.

 

[Rors]

My list changes prediction: 8 spots to be made available

Retire: Lenny Maister Schneider

Trade: Gwilt

Delist: Dunnell TDL Jones Milera

Thus,
3 spots for NAB draft
2 rookie upgrades (Mav & Panther, as has been mentioned)
2 players traded in
1 PSD