Year end list management - Who would you delist?

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- DELIST
Keefe
Thomas
Armstrong

- RETIRE
Young

- TRADE
Ben Kennedy? Would get a better run of it at another club I think, too many in-front of him at the moment.
Fasolo, but only if he can get same games and build some currency.

- ANOTHER YEAR
PK - Give him another year to see how he goes with another pre-season with us, needs to improve speed dramatically
Sinkers - Understands the game plan and is dedicated
Macaffer - Hard worker, if he can get it together, will be a fantastic addition to our top 22. Can kick goals, can tag and gives a solid effort on each appearance
 
Keeffe and Thomas both presumably are gone until we hear otherwise.

In terms of who I would delist. Macaffer (let go in free agency), Dwyer and White are those others I'd like to see let go.
*Taggers who can't win the contested ball and win clearances are a liability. And beyond playing as a tagger Macaffer doesn't offer anything in any other position we lack. So I'd let a Geelong, Fremantle or whoever wants a tagger to snap him up.
Dwyer moves well and uses the footy well, but he is the worst tackler on the list and turning 29 by seasons end, as a player who isn't a part of our best 22 and not a great fit for our gameplan, he for me isn't a required player.
Then White while he has performed less badly to this point in the season, we're still yet to play any good teams and he while he is not dropping his marks as much, he still isn't that marking presence who can draw the ball and genuinely take the pressure off Cloke, to enable our front half to function sufficiently.

Young is one who may retire depending on how his health is over the second half of the season but I hope he comes back for another season with so few outside options and his ability to penetrate still there when healthy good enough to get him games most weeks for me.

As rookies I would let go of Gault and Armstrong and promote Frost to the senior list.

Otherwise in the right deal I'd be prepared to move anyone other than Pendlebury, Grundy, Elliott, Sidebottom, Cloke, Swan, Langdon, Scharenberg, Seedsman, Moore, De Goey, Toovey, Broomhead, Fasolo and Freeman.
*In the cases of Broomhead, Fasolo and Freeman it's not so much they are of untouchable quality, though they can all be best 22 for us, but rather that due to injuries and performance not being where it should be, they are must retains as players who if traded would not give us more value than they would lose us.
*Of those bigger names who could be had via trade. Witts and Reid are the two higher level players who would have to attract a star level player - preferably a key forward. For any team to get a Brown, Frost or Marsh similarly the trade would have to be an appealing one with all very much required players and like with Witts or Reid there only because we have so many alternatives at their positions. Then the others for the right deals - be it for established players or picks would need to be deals that can help to improve our best 22 or future projected best 22 in the case of picks.
 

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Knightmare said:
Keeffe and Thomas both presumably are gone until we hear otherwise.

In terms of who I would delist. Macaffer (let go in free agency), Dwyer and White are those others I'd like to see let go.
*Taggers who can't win the contested ball and win clearances are a liability. And beyond playing as a tagger Macaffer doesn't offer anything in any other position we lack. So I'd let a Geelong, Fremantle or whoever wants a tagger to snap him up.
Dwyer moves well and uses the footy well, but he is the worst tackler on the list and turning 29 by seasons end, as a player who isn't a part of our best 22 and not a great fit for our gameplan, he for me isn't a required player.
Then White while he has performed less badly to this point in the season, we're still yet to play any good teams and he while he is not dropping his marks as much, he still isn't that marking presence who can draw the ball and genuinely take the pressure off Cloke, to enable our front half to function sufficiently.

Young is one who may retire depending on how his health is over the second half of the season but I hope he comes back for another season with so few outside options and his ability to penetrate still there when healthy good enough to get him games most weeks for me.

As rookies I would let go of Gault and Armstrong and promote Frost to the senior list.

Otherwise in the right deal I'd be prepared to move anyone other than Pendlebury, Grundy, Elliott, Sidebottom, Cloke, Swan, Langdon, Scharenberg, Seedsman, Moore, De Goey, Toovey, Broomhead, Fasolo and Freeman.
*In the cases of Broomhead, Fasolo and Freeman it's not so much they are of untouchable quality, though they can all be best 22 for us, but rather that due to injuries and performance not being where it should be, they are must retains as players who if traded would not give us more value than they would lose us.
*Of those bigger names who could be had via trade. Witts and Reid are the two higher level players who would have to attract a star level player - preferably a key forward. For any team to get a Brown, Frost or Marsh similarly the trade would have to be an appealing one with all very much required players and like with Witts or Reid there only because we have so many alternatives at their positions. Then the others for the right deals - be it for established players or picks would need to be deals that can help to improve our best 22 or future projected best 22 in the case of picks.
Click to expand...

Caff has Signed a 1 year Extentsion so he is going no where.

I would keep Dwyer - Give us a Reliable Out Put.

Doubt we would get rid of Both White and Gault as we have real lack of Depth at the KPP. Unless we trade in another KPP or just draft KPP in the 2015 Draft
 
BIGNEDKELLY said:
Toovey untouchable over goldsack?
Click to expand...

You bet. Toovey is the better stopper. And Goldsack is hardly a rebounder as someone who rarely finds the footy down back and like Toovey doesn't take intercept marks frequently.

Not that either are going anywhere anyway.

TradeDraft said:
Caff has Signed a 1 year Extentsion so he is going no where.

I would keep Dwyer - Give us a Reliable Out Put.

Doubt we would get rid of Both White and Gault as we have real lack of Depth at the KPP. Unless we trade in another KPP or just draft KPP in the 2015 Draft
Click to expand...

I can't help but be disappointed that Macaffer is coming back again next year. Not that I'm surprised. Hopefully Nathan doesn't get tricked into playing him next year and keeps him in the VFL side next season.

I wouldn't be prepared to call Dwyer's output "reliable." In two of his four senior games he had only five disposals. And has from his four games managed a total of 5 tackles. That's terrible. And people denigrate Fasolo for a lack of tackling and pressuring. Fasolo over his career averages roughly twice as many tackles as Dwyer per game in what is considered to be a central part of our gameplan.

You are likely right with White and Gault but I'd look to bring in some better fits - specifically guys who can provide a better marking presence forward of centre. Why not move Gault or White to Essendon for Jon Giles? Essendon need another forward with the versatility to play through the ruck and they clearly aren't high on Giles. And Giles for us could be a factor as a big boy who can take a grab in the front half.
Then Levi Casboult is another who could likely be had cheaply and would be my other solution failing a big name young projected star level key forward as the leading (average per game) contested mark in the competition to this point in the season.
 
“Knightmare" said:
You are likely right with White and Gault but I'd look to bring in some better fits - specifically guys who can provide a better marking presence forward of centre. Why not move Gault or White to Essendon for Jon Giles? Essendon need another forward with the versatility to play through the ruck and they clearly aren't high on Giles. And Giles for us could be a factor as a big boy who can take a grab in the front half.
Then Levi Casboult is another who could likely be had cheaply and would be my other solution failing a big name young projected star level key forward as the leading (average per game) contested mark in the competition to this point in the season.
Click to expand...

Only Reason I would bring in Casboult would be the 2nd Ruckman but he be no worse or worse then White as Levi is a worse kick then Cloke
 
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Knightmare said:
You bet. Toovey is the better stopper. And Goldsack is hardly a rebounder as someone who rarely finds the footy down back and like Toovey doesn't take intercept marks frequently.

Not that either are going anywhere anyway.



I can't help but be disappointed that Macaffer is coming back again next year. Not that I'm surprised. Hopefully Nathan doesn't get tricked into playing him next year and keeps him in the VFL side next season.

I wouldn't be prepared to call Dwyer's output "reliable." In two of his four senior games he had only five disposals. And has from his four games managed a total of 5 tackles. That's terrible. And people denigrate Fasolo for a lack of tackling and pressuring. Fasolo over his career averages roughly twice as many tackles as Dwyer per game in what is considered to be a central part of our gameplan.

You are likely right with White and Gault but I'd look to bring in some better fits - specifically guys who can provide a better marking presence forward of centre. Why not move Gault or White to Essendon for Jon Giles? Essendon need another forward with the versatility to play through the ruck and they clearly aren't high on Giles. And Giles for us could be a factor as a big boy who can take a grab in the front half.
Then Levi Casboult is another who could likely be had cheaply and would be my other solution failing a big name young projected star level key forward as the leading (average per game) contested mark in the competition to this point in the season.
Click to expand...

Regarding Dwyer's stats. In one of his games this year he started as sub and in another he was subbed out with an injury at half time.
 

Only Reason I would bring in Casboult would be the 2nd Ruckman but he be no worse or worse then White as Levi is a worse kick then Cloke[/QUOTE]

With Casboult's height, weight and ok athleticism. 2nd ruck is something he can do.

I'm ok with Casboult in either role be it permanent forward or 2nd ruck (if Witts happens to be traded).
 
Knightmare said:
Keeffe and Thomas both presumably are gone until we hear otherwise.

In terms of who I would delist. Macaffer (let go in free agency), Dwyer and White are those others I'd like to see let go.
*Taggers who can't win the contested ball and win clearances are a liability. And beyond playing as a tagger Macaffer doesn't offer anything in any other position we lack. So I'd let a Geelong, Fremantle or whoever wants a tagger to snap him up.
Dwyer moves well and uses the footy well, but he is the worst tackler on the list and turning 29 by seasons end, as a player who isn't a part of our best 22 and not a great fit for our gameplan, he for me isn't a required player.
Then White while he has performed less badly to this point in the season, we're still yet to play any good teams and he while he is not dropping his marks as much, he still isn't that marking presence who can draw the ball and genuinely take the pressure off Cloke, to enable our front half to function sufficiently.

Young is one who may retire depending on how his health is over the second half of the season but I hope he comes back for another season with so few outside options and his ability to penetrate still there when healthy good enough to get him games most weeks for me.

As rookies I would let go of Gault and Armstrong and promote Frost to the senior list.

Otherwise in the right deal I'd be prepared to move anyone other than Pendlebury, Grundy, Elliott, Sidebottom, Cloke, Swan, Langdon, Scharenberg, Seedsman, Moore, De Goey, Toovey, Broomhead, Fasolo and Freeman.
*In the cases of Broomhead, Fasolo and Freeman it's not so much they are of untouchable quality, though they can all be best 22 for us, but rather that due to injuries and performance not being where it should be, they are must retains as players who if traded would not give us more value than they would lose us.
*Of those bigger names who could be had via trade. Witts and Reid are the two higher level players who would have to attract a star level player - preferably a key forward. For any team to get a Brown, Frost or Marsh similarly the trade would have to be an appealing one with all very much required players and like with Witts or Reid there only because we have so many alternatives at their positions. Then the others for the right deals - be it for established players or picks would need to be deals that can help to improve our best 22 or future projected best 22 in the case of picks.
Click to expand...

Knightmare i generally like your analysis of things but think that you have cconsistently been very harsh on Caff, both as a player, and at the idea of a Tagger. Lets not forget both Freo and St Kilda got to recent Grand Finals with a true tagger, and the dominant Geelong teams used Lingy primarily in that role (though with the extra quality offensively that a player of his standard also brings)
Any midfield needs to find the right balance. Our midfield since 2010 has been very one-sided with only Ball who provided much inside work, and a few players who got away with providing very little defensively. I think Caff was turned into a tagger at a time when we desperately needed it.

Now the need for a tagger will hopefully be less with Adams, Crisp and Greenwood (when he returns) all able to provide more of that grunt... But i still think there will be times when a true negating player (either in the midfield or on a loose half back) would give us a better matchup on the opponent, and i would like Caff to remain a part of the rotation even if its just to have that option. (but i also think he could provide that defensive presence either in the midfield or forward line, and has also shown that he can take marks and kick goals if used as a small-medium forward)... His contracts been extended for a year and i am happy for him to have that opportunity to push his way back into the 22.
 
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PepperFace said:
I like Dwyer. But hes a good player when things are going well. We are not in a good enough position to keep him on our list
Click to expand...

Why? Do we then just play the Kids then?
 
Apex36 said:
That's not a mitigating factor at all. If you take an illicit substance, there's no possible way to know exactly what you are ingesting. You are responsible for whatever goes in to your body. If you knowingly take a substance without knowing what the ingredients are, you have to suffer the consequences if there's something banned in there.
Click to expand...

I'm just repeating what I read in one of the papers, where the journalist said that the education program about what you just mentioned only started this year, and that that was a mitigating factor. We'll see how it plays out, but I'd still count that as accidental rather than deliberate.
 
Knightmare said:
Keeffe and Thomas both presumably are gone until we hear otherwise.

In terms of who I would delist. Macaffer (let go in free agency), Dwyer and White are those others I'd like to see let go.
*Taggers who can't win the contested ball and win clearances are a liability. And beyond playing as a tagger Macaffer doesn't offer anything in any other position we lack. So I'd let a Geelong, Fremantle or whoever wants a tagger to snap him up.
Dwyer moves well and uses the footy well, but he is the worst tackler on the list and turning 29 by seasons end, as a player who isn't a part of our best 22 and not a great fit for our gameplan, he for me isn't a required player.
Then White while he has performed less badly to this point in the season, we're still yet to play any good teams and he while he is not dropping his marks as much, he still isn't that marking presence who can draw the ball and genuinely take the pressure off Cloke, to enable our front half to function sufficiently.

Young is one who may retire depending on how his health is over the second half of the season but I hope he comes back for another season with so few outside options and his ability to penetrate still there when healthy good enough to get him games most weeks for me.

As rookies I would let go of Gault and Armstrong and promote Frost to the senior list.

Otherwise in the right deal I'd be prepared to move anyone other than Pendlebury, Grundy, Elliott, Sidebottom, Cloke, Swan, Langdon, Scharenberg, Seedsman, Moore, De Goey, Toovey, Broomhead, Fasolo and Freeman.
*In the cases of Broomhead, Fasolo and Freeman it's not so much they are of untouchable quality, though they can all be best 22 for us, but rather that due to injuries and performance not being where it should be, they are must retains as players who if traded would not give us more value than they would lose us.
*Of those bigger names who could be had via trade. Witts and Reid are the two higher level players who would have to attract a star level player - preferably a key forward. For any team to get a Brown, Frost or Marsh similarly the trade would have to be an appealing one with all very much required players and like with Witts or Reid there only because we have so many alternatives at their positions. Then the others for the right deals - be it for established players or picks would need to be deals that can help to improve our best 22 or future projected best 22 in the case of picks.
Click to expand...
Macaffer is contracted....and why the love for young he WAS a good player.....not at the pies unfortunately
 
PepperFace said:
No we wont. Our kids are good....just need more time. Would you rather DeGoey playing like last week. Or Dwyer like the week before?
Click to expand...

De Goey but we seen what teams do when they just play Kids and don’t have many Mature Age Players and I doubt Bucks would do that.
 
TradeDraft said:
De Goey but we seen what teams do when they just play Kids and don’t have many Mature Age Players and I doubt Bucks would do that.
Click to expand...
Its all about getting the balance right. We dont wanna throw all the kids in at once. But you know as much as all of us that we still have kennedy, Marsh, Fasolo, Moore (when fit) and Freeman (when fit) to come into the mix. We arnt going to win a flag this year or next....but these kids need to be rotated through. Dwyer isnt helping the side any more than these kids would
 
PepperFace said:
Its all about getting the balance right. We dont wanna throw all the kids in at once. But you know as much as all of us that we still have kennedy, Marsh, Fasolo, Moore (when fit) and Freeman (when fit) to come into the mix. We arnt going to win a flag this year or next....but these kids need to be rotated through. Dwyer isnt helping the side any more than these kids would
Click to expand...

Then Playing Dwyer at AFL Level now is a Waste of Time?
 
PepperFace said:
I believe so. Unless there is an injury to a swan or pendles.
We have experience in Sidy and Greenwood to come in....so i dont see where Dwyer fits in
Click to expand...

Well Sidebottom and Greenwood are not back yet
 
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