Hogan in the 80's

[Kong]

Why was this guy so massive?

Was it simply that Americans were more patriotic in the 1980s, so they lapped it up?
Were the audiences even "dumber" than they are right now?

Right now, all I ever hear is wrestling fans paying out "Super Cena", yet Hogan had an even better record. Wasn't he undefeated for like a year or two straight?

Even The Rock and Austin were regularly getting done over. With Austin, he was always fighting a losing battle, whereas Hogan seemed to just "hulk up" or whatever it was and become invincible, similarly to Cena now.

Why the difference?

 

[boncer34]

Because Hogan was in evvvvvery main event and in those days people respected a bloke who could carry a title for months.TBH the whole 'wrestling is fixed' mantra wasn't big then IMO.

People genuinely believed the Hulkster was at the top because he deserves it and he was the clear cut best.

Good luck finding anyone above 15 who thinks that bout Cena.

 

[Kong]

Exactly, so why's it any different now?

Hogan was rubbish in the ring, similar to Cena.

 

[Pera]

Basically, not many knew wrestling was scripted like they do now. There was no internet (or was very rarely used) and people just believed Hogan was a monster inside and outside the ring. He was terrible in the ring, has always been terrible but his charisma and amazing storytelling made him so popular.

You weren't a wrestling fan unless you were a Hulkamaniac in the 80's. With Cena, its all 12 y.o. little boys who too, have no idea about kayfabe and just think everything is real. That why it appeals/appealed to their respective audiences. Put an 80's Hogan in the now, and he too would probably have a s**t load of children cheering him on while the 18+ demographic would absolutely hate him. It's just the way things were back then that make them different.

 

[SA1NTER]

Exactly, so why's it any different now?

Hogan was rubbish in the ring, similar to Cena.

I reckon it was because Hogan was so charismatic in the 80's while Cena is just the same boring bright orange wearing goody two shoes 1 dementional character all the time. Hustle, loyalty, respect won't appeal to wrestling fans post Austin and the attitude era.

 

[flight23]

he slammed Andre
he beat bundy
he brought pride to america against slaughter

they way they sold it back then those events were massive
the only time Hogan was good in the ring was when he would wave the finger and get up and when he dropped the leg to end it (and both reasons are the same THE CROWD WENT ABSOLUTELY FRICKING BANANAS)

he really was like the big brother of all the charismatic wrestlers back then as well

bundy and andre were complete duds on the mike and slaughter played his part to perfection

 

[Freomaniac]

he slammed Andre
he beat bundy
he brought pride to america against slaughter

they way they sold it back then those events were massive
the only time Hogan was good in the ring was when he would wave the finger and get up and when he dropped the leg to end it (and both reasons are the same THE CROWD WENT ABSOLUTELY FRICKING BANANAS)

he really was like the big brother of all the charismatic wrestlers back then as well

bundy and andre were complete duds on the mike and slaughter played his part to perfection

You forgot to mention he beat the Iron Sheikh to get his 1st wwf title run, which was at the time where there were troubles in the Middle east especially Iran. Keep in mind that back in those days you would be considered a decent champ if you didnt hold a world title for a year minimum. it was common for guys to hold world titles for 2-3 years straight.

Keep in mind that back in the 1980s wwf had a long deep talent pool and a lot of Monster heels in that era Like king kong bundy, andre the giant, Big john studd, One man gang/Akeem, Big Boss Man etc.

Slaughter always looked lke a heel, his voice was very terrifying.

 

[Ry009]

For all his motives, Hogan at least had the fore-site to totally refresh his character and mix it up.

Hogan makes Cena look like technical wrestling god in the ring, but the limit of Cena's variation is the color of his t-shirt.

WWE are missing a massive opportunity to turn him heel at WrestleMania, there wont be a better time to do so.

 

[DarkPhoenix]

For all his motives, Hogan at least had the fore-site to totally refresh his character and mix it up.

Hogan makes Cena look like technical wrestling god in the ring, but the limit of Cena's variation is the color of his t-shirt.

WWE are missing a massive opportunity to turn him heel at WrestleMania, there wont be a better time to do so.

QFT. I was actually happy when Cena started mixing it up and using the Flaming Legdrop etc, however 3 weeks later it all but dissapeared from his move set.

I've said it before, the only time Cena is interesting is in a major PPV match (3 times a year?) where he pulls his finger out and trys something different to the 5 moves of doom. You cant fault him as a worker, one of the hardest working guys in the business, but why cant he mix it up occasionally, look at Taker, Christian, to a lesser extent Kane. All guys who have been around the traps for a long time, yet theyve repeatedly added strings to their bows.

Its like Cena is scared to expand his repertoire.

 

[Hawks1523]

Savage was always better than Hogan, just sayin'.

What Hogan lacked in the ring, he more then made up for with his charsima.

Cena is capable of pulling off good matches, but his promos, character, and look are just incredibly boring and stale. The same can be said for Hogan but different times and audiences now. Cena going heel is this generations Hollywood Hogan (okay, maybe exaggerating that a little)

 

[Pera]

I'm not sure why everyone wants Cena to go heel. Is it because you just want change? In 96' when Hogan went heel, he aligned himself with two invading monsters that had the ambitions of taking over a whole organization. They created their own successful stable that was cool, fun and great to watch.

With Cena, I cant see any point in turning him heel. He has been hugely successful with what he has done as a face and earns the WWE a heap of money. How exactly would you get him over as a heel? I can't see him leading a heel stable and certainly cant see him getting over as a heel on his own so would it be a good business move? I think not.

The whole superman gimmick works great if you're a face but scrapping that like Hollywood Hogan did is something I cant see Cena pulling off.

 

[Ry009]

Cena going heel is this generations Hollywood Hogan (okay, maybe exaggerating that a little)

In terms of reactions, if he does do it, would be on par.

In a perfect world, I would hope the lead in to Mania has a whole 'everyone still loves the Rock despite never being here' theme, then finally cracking it to cheat to beat The Rock at Mania.

Could you imagine the heat that Cena would get cheating to win in Orlando?

Pay off would be massive.

Despite Mania 17 being the sheer awesomeness it was, and even the match and ending itself. Austin's heel turn was way too late.

I will be massively pissed off if there is a mutual respect/shaking of hands after the match if they put it last and that eventuates.

Nexus and the WCW/ECW Invasion were botched and Austin's heel turn never really paid off as good as he was. Time to correct some creative mistakes next year and remove the bad taste of Mania 27.

Hogan at least had the balls to risk the 'love of the kids' which obviously lead to the boom of the Attitude era.

 

[THRILLHO]

QFT. I was actually happy when Cena started mixing it up and using the Flaming Legdrop etc, however 3 weeks later it all but dissapeared from his move set.

I've said it before, the only time Cena is interesting is in a major PPV match (3 times a year?) where he pulls his finger out and trys something different to the 5 moves of doom. You cant fault him as a worker, one of the hardest working guys in the business, but why cant he mix it up occasionally, look at Taker, Christian, to a lesser extent Kane. All guys who have been around the traps for a long time, yet theyve repeatedly added strings to their bows.

Its like Cena is scared to expand his repertoire.

Disagree.

Austin was the biggest star in wrestling and he got over using only three moves. All he had was mud-hole stomping, Lou Thesz press and the stunner. But it was goddamn entertaining because he wasn't the same character cutting the same promo and the only guy allowed to be number one for six years.

It's Cena's character that is annoying and why everyone hates his five moves of doom. It's because of the whole "HLR", "never give up", CeNation" and that he's booked as a Superman that people just get bored of it.

Every wrestler has their "five moves of doom". It's safe practice for the workers and it gives people a chance to cheer when they see their favourite moves.

I guarantee we'll see Rocky's Dragon Screw takedown into Sharpshooter, DDT into kip-up and stalking for the Rock Bottom and Spinebuster into People's Elbow.

Cena's problem with his five moves is that they're always completed in the same way and in succession. We always get two shoulder blocks, missed punch into sit-out powerbomb, you can't see me, five knuckle shuffle and then the countered AA, only for him to hit the AA minutes later.

I'm not sure why everyone wants Cena to go heel. Is it because you just want change? In 96' when Hogan went heel, he aligned himself with two invading monsters that had the ambitions of taking over a whole organization. They created their own successful stable that was cool, fun and great to watch.

With Cena, I cant see any point in turning him heel. He has been hugely successful with what he has done as a face and earns the WWE a heap of money. How exactly would you get him over as a heel? I can't see him leading a heel stable and certainly cant see him getting over as a heel on his own so would it be a good business move? I think not.

The whole superman gimmick works great if you're a face but scrapping that like Hollywood Hogan did is something I cant see Cena pulling off.

Not sure if they can turn Cena heel. The ship has sailed. AE guys like me hate his character and give X-Pac heat to him. We simply want him out of the picture for awhile. If he goes heel, we'll still hate him but the lil jimmys will hate him too.

 

[Fade to Gray]

Even as a kid (when I was a total mark) I didn't like Hogan. I never liked guys who "cheated", He would often use dirty moves like an eye rake or a back rake, and to my 7 YO mind this was a complete no-no.

I can't remember the exact circumstance but I do remember a match between Hulk and Hercules Hernandez where Hercules had him in the torture rack, and Hogan tapped, however the ref missed it, Hercules let go of the move thinking he won, only for the match to continue and Hogan to win. This solidified my dislike of him, as it went against my sense of fair-play.

His Big Boot/Leg Drop finishing move also troubled me as I couldn't understand how it was enough to finish guys off. Where as while I didn't like Randy Savage as he was "evil" his finishing move seemed like it was enough to really hurt.

As the years went on and I understood the "truth" of Wrestling. I hated him even more, he had a poor moveset, I didn't find his matches entertaining as they were all the same - Hogan gets beat up, takes the opponents finishing move - he hulks up, waves his finger, a few punches and a big boot/leg drop later and it's match over.

 

[Byron_Clanger]

Ask yourself this question, why is John Cena so massive right now? Then you'll get your answer

 

[Kong]

cause wrestlings an embarrassment?

 

[picko]

Never liked Hogan back in the day. He was boring and repetitive and every match was the same old story. Remember my brother and I being furious after getting out Royal Rumble '91 from the video store and it was the second year straight he won it.

Then we marked out like motherf--kers when the Warrior pinned him at WM6!

 

[TRAWP]

I'd argue that Hogan wasn't as good on the microphone as led to believe. Watching a heap of his promo work made me sad in the pants, but I suppose that was entertainment back then. After you have seen Y2J, Rock and SCSA on the microphone anyone else leaves a stale taste in your mouth.

Cena is better than Hogan for the sheer fact he is better on the microphone.

 

[Rusty Brookes]

I'd argue that Hogan wasn't as good on the microphone as led to believe. Watching a heap of his promo work made me sad in the pants, but I suppose that was entertainment back then. After you have seen Y2J, Rock and SCSA on the microphone anyone else leaves a stale taste in your mouth.

Cena is better than Hogan for the sheer fact he is better on the microphone.

Gotta disagree. Although I hated Hogan at the time, he was great at talking up a match - the over the top facial expressions, the pumping of the muscles, the "brother" bit. While he was no Jake Roberts or Ric Flair on the mike, he was still darned entertaining in small doses and he was charismatic as hell.

Cena on the other hand is totally flat as a face. I thought he was pretty good early on as a heel (I think this is largely forgotten) but I cannot even watch him as the goody two-shoes All American boy. Poop jokes just don't cut it with me.

As for ring ability both are pretty awful but at least Hogan's shtick was over enough with the crowd to generate genuine crowd pop. Cena's crowd reaction is a combination of prepubescent love and genuine hatred from the older fans.

 

[TRAWP]

Gotta disagree. Although I hated Hogan at the time, he was great at talking up a match - the over the top facial expressions, the pumping of the muscles, the "brother" bit. While he was no Jake Roberts or Ric Flair on the mike, he was still darned entertaining in small doses and he was charismatic as hell.

Cena on the other hand is totally flat as a face. I thought he was pretty good early on as a heel (I think this is largely forgotten) but I cannot even watch him as the goody two-shoes All American boy. Poop jokes just don't cut it with me.

As for ring ability both are pretty awful but at least Hogan's shtick was over enough with the crowd to generate genuine crowd pop. Cena's crowd reaction is a combination of prepubescent love and genuine hatred from the older fans.

I think you'd find that Cena would of been over in the 80's though, obviously with a gimmick to suit that era like Hogans. Not taking anything away from Hogan at all though, he made wrestling a big name as they gave him a massive push. He was a larger than life character and was bright, different and had the pythons brother!

Would Hogan of went over in the Attitude Era? Negative.
Would Cena of went over in the Attitude Era? Negative.

Scale of rating a star should always be rated against the Attitude Era

 

[THRILLHO]

Cena would've been over in the Attitude Era, it's silly to suggest otherwise. The Attitude Era, while good, wasn't this fantastic magical wonderland where all the wrestlers were gods and every single angle was HOLY s**t. There was plenty of crap in there. Cena just wouldn't have had to have been a stale face for as long as he has. He definitely would've done a Corporate Cena angle in AE.

And Hogan was over in the Attitude Era. Not sure if you've heard of the nWo. They were kinda big.

 

[TRAWP]

Cena would've been over in the Attitude Era, it's silly to suggest otherwise. The Attitude Era, while good, wasn't this fantastic magical wonderland where all the wrestlers were gods and every single angle was HOLY s**t. There was plenty of crap in there. Cena just wouldn't have had to have been a stale face for as long as he has. He definitely would've done a Corporate Cena angle in AE.

And Hogan was over in the Attitude Era. Not sure if you've heard of the nWo. They were kinda big.

Big in WCW, never knew NWO were a WWF/E gimmick?

Cena would not have been big, maybe a mid carder at best.
Look at the guys at the top at that time, he would not have stood a chance.

As for you NWO crap, it's funny that it was the death of WCW as well as the start so to say.

 

[Kong]

Look at the Attitude Era. '98-'01.

Triple H was an upper mid card for most of it. He had his eventual main event push when Austin got injured later 2000.

And he really only got his push to upper mid after WrestleMania of that year when he joined the Corporation.

That to me says enough.

Cena wouldn't have been fit to tie the laces of Austin, Rock, Undertaker, Kane, Mankind, Mr McMahon (not in wrestling ability, but he was effectively a main eventer).

He would've been slugging it out with Ken Shamrock, Billy Gunn and co. IMO

 

[Partridge]

Austin was the biggest star in wrestling and he got over using only three moves. All he had was mud-hole stomping, Lou Thesz press and the stunner. But it was goddamn entertaining because he wasn't the same character cutting the same promo and the only guy allowed to be number one for six years.

Also because Austin was one hell of a worker inside the ring, was a seasoned veteran, and most importantly like all great stars wasn't manufactured. He was simply himself with the volume turned way up (just like Flair, Rock etc.).

You can't ever truly predict which wrestler will connect with audience, you just have to run with it if it happens. With Austin they mostly got it right, although they did stupidly turn him heel and cost themselves a ton of money in 2001.

 

[Partridge]

Why was this guy so massive?

Was it simply that Americans were more patriotic in the 1980s, so they lapped it up?
Were the audiences even "dumber" than they are right now?

Right now, all I ever hear is wrestling fans paying out "Super Cena", yet Hogan had an even better record. Wasn't he undefeated for like a year or two straight?

Even The Rock and Austin were regularly getting done over. With Austin, he was always fighting a losing battle, whereas Hogan seemed to just "hulk up" or whatever it was and become invincible, similarly to Cena now.

Why the difference?

Lots of reasons. In the 1980s it was still a WRESTLING business, and the promoters - even Vince McMahon - know how to present it and plan it. As has been mentioned, the business was protected. Outsiders weren't allowed in, there was no internet, and it was presented as real. Wrestling hadn't been fully legitimate since at least the 1920s (and probably earlier), but it was presented as being that way. And an awful lot of people believed it.

The other thing was vastly better booking. Promotions had patience and didn't rush to finish an angle at the next PPV (which of course there were far fewer of). I clearly remember Hogan v Bundy at WM 2 being built for an entire year. They didn't rush it, so the expectation was enormous. The slow buildup almost always works. The biggest PPV that WCW did during their big run in 1996-1998 was Starrcade 97 with Sting v Hogan. The reason? They waited an entire year to have that match. They then of course screwed it all up by not having Sting go over, but that's another discussion.

It wasn't just Hogan that got a monster push and was kept on top for a long time. The legendary Honky Tonk Man held the Intercontinental Title for 18 months straight, even though if anything he was worse than Hogan. The reason? The fans truly hated him, and paid money to hopefully see him get destroyed. That's a great heel.

Hogan was a very limited worker, but he looked great, he had a ton of charisma, the WWF style was nowhere near as challenging as the NWA (which is also why even at his peak Hogan couldn't draw a dime in the Carolinas), his matches were kept short, and he won clean every time. It's not that hard to do, it's just promoters don't have the patience or vision to do it now. A big reason why I don't watch anymore.