Analysis Stadium deals - what, how, when - why we need a new one and the SA footy paradigm shift happening

[Kwality]

Lets get down to the most important point You say you barracked for Port ? Why did you jump ship and start supporting WC ?

I am/always was a Subi supporter first & foremost, transferred to Adelaide, lived near Jack Cahill, worked in Gillman, loved Alberton, loved winning & my closest competitor was El Presidente of Norwood, one aka Nugget.

Was back in WA when Subi won the 1986 flag, our side was gutted first by the Vics then the Eagles. 1987, went back to Melbourne (tfrd from Adelaide earlier for a couple of years) unsure if I followed Carlton ( in my time in Melbourne Fitz captained them, a Subi boy originally) mid season & could not cop the crap purported as fact pushed by the Melbourne based media claiming to report on the national comp.

Was an Eagles fan during the lead up to the 1992 flag & the crap purporting to be fact was a tsunami - my young (at the time) daughters remember the sleaze/prejudice served up to a very young Chris Lewis by Demons fans at Waverley ... no way, I would ever support anyone but the Eagles.
Always follow Port, they should be allowed the jail bar guernsey every time except v the Pies, the picture of Choco holding high his tie remains with me vividly, the footballers out of Port are testimony to the club - Kochie was a breath of fresh air, Thomas is a top act ... Wingard, the recruiters arent ordinary.

Long story, love footy. I support the Eagles, as I live in Melbourne I' will prosecute the case for footy outside Victoria, because Victorians have more trouble than most for critical appreciation of their own.

& REHs posts are a must for me .. a quality I aspire to.

 

[proman_x]

I am/always was a Subi supporter first & foremost, transferred to Adelaide, lived near Jack Cahill, worked in Gillman, loved Alberton, loved winning & my closest competitor was El Presidente of Norwood, one aka Nugget.

Was back in WA when Subi won the 1986 flag, our side was gutted first by the Vics then the Eagles. 1987, went back to Melbourne (tfrd from Adelaide earlier for a couple of years) unsure if I followed Carlton ( in my time in Melbourne Fitz captained them, a Subi boy originally) mid season & could not cop the crap purported as fact pushed by the Melbourne based media claiming to report on the national comp.

Was an Eagles fan during the lead up to the 1992 flag & the crap purporting to be fact was a tsunami - my young (at the time) daughters remember the sleaze/prejudice served up to a very young Chris Lewis by Demons fans at Waverley ... no way, I would ever support anyone but the Eagles.
Always follow Port, they should be allowed the jail bar guernsey every time except v the Pies, the picture of Choco holding high his tie remains with me vividly, the footballers out of Port are testimony to the club - Kochie was a breath of fresh air, Thomas is a top act ... Wingard, the recruiters arent ordinary.

Long story, love footy. I support the Eagles, as I live in Melbourne I' will prosecute the case for footy outside Victoria, because Victorians have more trouble than most for critical appreciation of their own.

& REHs posts are a must for me .. a quality I aspire to.

Thanks for explaining where you are coming from, Kwality. So basically you are a die hard WC man but have a soft spot for us old wharfiies!

As for REH, I wonder at times if he is the result of genetically engineering between human and computer

 

[DSL64]

For your information its not about politics, its historical fact - lived in SA , barracked for Port ... check out what your more learned brethren have posted.

Up until REH posted the majority of my 'more learned brethren' were leaning my way - not yours - so I stand by what I stated...

 

[wilbur_15]

The SANFL have put their 2014 Annual Report on line ( The_Wookie this one and the report in my post above can be added to your Sky Drive documents link). Last year they had 3 pages of financials Balance Sheet, P&L and Cash Flow Statement. This year they have drop the Cash Flow Statement - dont want to give us too much info. It's a little difficult to work it all out from suh little info but there is some useful stuff if you dig around the comments See

http://www.sanfl.com.au/files/_system/File/PDFs/2015/2014AR.pdf

The show a net profit of $77,331,455 from continuing operations? How did they do that? They introduced on their books the value of
Adelaide Oval leased asset value.................................... $73,461,000
Net Present Value of future AFL licence transfer payments.... $9,983,416 ( ie the $18.31mil the crows and Port pay between 1st Nov 2013-31st Oct 2028)
But Wrote of the value of AFL Licence value in SANFL books ($6,081,000)
Net Loss after netting out these book adjustments.................. ($31,961) - but they never say that loss anywhere after allowing for these book entries

Also as they sold the land in November and received a $10m deposit after the books closed but they booked a $10,870,000 revaluation of property increase (effective profit) which made their comprehensive profit for the year $88,201,455. In the Group accounts ie + Port and Crows - they booked a loss of ($25,650,720) from discontinued operations ie for selling the Port's and crows' licences.

So whilst all these entries are book entries the SANFL has given us a sneak look into how well they might do out of the AO deal. In their 2011 Annual Report they said

From the 2014 financial year, however, the SANFL will be able to bring a “leased” asset onto its balance sheet that represents the fair value of future net earnings from Adelaide Oval. This asset has been estimated at approximately $55 million. This will offset a large part of the AAMI Stadium write-down.

Using an interest or discount rate of 6% in both 2011 and 2014 the SANFL is saying they effectively will get an annual net cash flow from AO deal in perpetuity of $3.3mil back in 2011 and at the end of 2014 they had upped that to $4.4mil. I basically took the figures they said in their annual reports and calculated a net cash flow annuity in perpetuity.

Some interest things from the AR

Page 3
FINANCIAL PERFORMANCE
The SANFL recorded an increase in cash reserves of $1.34 million following the first full year of operations at Adelaide Oval.
The SANFL achieved a positive net cash flow from operating activities of $1m compared to $0.3m in 2013
and, at 31 October 2014, had cash on hand of $1m and a further $2m offsetting debt.
Some key points regarding the 2014 financial result include:
• A statutory net profit of $77.33m and an increase in net assets of $83.48m from $27.89m to
$111.37m. This was mainly due to recognising the Adelaide Oval leased asset of
$73.46m representing the estimated net present value of future cash flows and the net present
value of future AFL Licence transfer payments of $9.98m; and
• An estimated net improvement in stadium generated revenue from moving from AAMI
Stadium to Adelaide Oval of approximately $3.78m.

In May 2014, SANFL refinanced its debt facilities to Bendigo Bank who provided the SANFL with five year
committed facilities. As part of its debt reduction strategy, the SANFL applied the $10m received from the sale of
the first parcel of land at AAMI Stadium in December 2014 to reducing debt. Debt is expected to be fully amortised within seven years.

The League is anticipating a moderate surplus in 2015 – the first year of the new Adelaide Oval financial model, which will return more revenues to the AFL clubs.

Page 3
AAMI STADIUM
In November 2014, the SA Football Commission formally signed a contract with developer Commercial & General
for the sale and 20+ year redevelopment of the AAMI Stadium precinct.

As part of the agreement, the SANFL received an upfront payment of $10 million which was transferred to the AFL to retire debt, money borrowed as part of the $16.25m provided to Port Adelaide to keep the club viable ahead of the move to Adelaide Oval.

Commencing in 2016, the SANFL will start to receive payments totalling a further $61 million by 2027 as part of a staged redevelopment of the precinct.

The existing oval will be retained for training by the Adelaide Football Club, which has a lease over the site until 2048.

It is anticipated the project will eventually include at least 1600 homes with an array of living options available including architecturally designed homes, townhomes and apartments. The project is set to deliver a cosmopolitan café and dining culture, boutique shopping strip, public open spaces and lifestyle offerings.

With the signing of this agreement, the SANFL has secured a legacy for our code and one that will benefit football across the State.

Page 4
AFL LICENCES
In March 2014, the SA Football Commission officially reached agreement with Adelaide and Port Adelaide to transfer the two AFL licences to the clubs in return for payments totalling more than $18 million.

The agreement will see the two clubs pay the Commission annual Club Game Development grants totalling $18.311 million, concluding in 2028. Adelaide will pay $11.326 million while Port Adelaide will pay $6.985 million in grants between 2013 and 2028.

As part of the agreements signed, the AFL confirmed that the SANFL will continue to manage Game Development in South Australia and committed to provide the SANFL with annual AFL Game Development Grants over the same period, a figure which would total approximately $29 million with CPI.

The AFL also committed to continue to provide appropriate annual AFL Talent Development Fees to the SANFL, a figure which would total approximately $16 million at existing levels (average of $1.0 million per year). [pretty sure this is the transfer fees when players are drafted then play certain amount of games additional payments are made by AFL clubs to state leagues and junior teams]

View attachment 116773
This bit belongs after the peragraphs on the left had side of this attachement.

The SANFL achieved a positive net cash flow from operating
activities of $1m compared to $0.3m in 2013 and had cash
on hand of $1m and a further $2m offsetting debt. This
represents an increase in cash of approximately $1.34m
compared to 2013.

The positive cash flow was mainly due to higher revenue
generated from moving AFL Football from AAMI Stadium to
Adelaide Oval. The financial uplift from moving to Adelaide
Oval has been measured at approximately $3.78m.

In addition to this uplift of $3.78m, SANFL benefited from
hosting an unbudgeted AFL Final at Adelaide Oval and the
Bon Jovi Concert at AAMI Stadium.

So the bottom line - the SANFL got an extra $3.78m from AO, the benefit of a final and Bon Jovi and basically broke even (small $31k loss) when yu take out all the book entries and increased their cash position by only $1.34m

Nice summary of info there REH.

On the grants the AFL provides the SANFL, are the ones mentioned in the licences section there the only ones you're aware of or are there others? Also, perhaps the "annual AFL Talent Development Fees to the SANFL" is for the under-age state teams or is that not SANFL funded?

Lastly, do you think we may have done well/got somewhat lucky on the timing of the licence buy back agreement (notwithstanding we effectively were paying for it a second time)? Perhaps that's one "good" thing to come off the back of our all time low point as a club (2011/2012) in that the value of our licence was at a similar low.

 

[DSL64]

Always follow Port, they should be allowed the jail bar guernsey every time except v the Pies, .

Never heard it called a jail bar guernsey before mate...
You sure you're a Port supporter, or just someone who's heard of Port Adelaide?

 

[Doctor Feel]

Can't believe this hasn't been posted.

 

[Sleezy]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-03-18/brayshaw-slams-etihad-deal

"So (Port Adelaide chairman) David Koch is complaining about their new deal at Adelaide Oval where they're getting $4.5 million (a year), but we played 11 games and made $600,000. - See more at: http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-03-18/brayshaw-slams-etihad-deal#sthash.nPHenzFy.dpuf

According to afltables.com.au north averaged 26474 attendees across 2011 at Etihad. Wonder what that $600k would have turned into had they been averaging 40k attendances at Etihad?

 

[Doctor Feel]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-03-18/brayshaw-slams-etihad-deal

"So (Port Adelaide chairman) David Koch is complaining about their new deal at Adelaide Oval where they're getting $4.5 million (a year), but we played 11 games and made $600,000. - See more at: http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-03-18/brayshaw-slams-etihad-deal#sthash.nPHenzFy.dpuf

According to afltables.com.au north averaged 26474 attendees across 2011 at Etihad. Wonder what that $600k would have turned into had they been averaging 40k attendances at Etihad?

Wait, they actually made money from 26k? They have no idea how easy they have it.

 

[Sleezy]

Wait, they actually made money from 26k? They have no idea how easy they have it.

I seem to remember reading that their break even was around 23k.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

Nice summary of info there REH.

On the grants the AFL provides the SANFL, are the ones mentioned in the licences section there the only ones you're aware of or are there others? Also, perhaps the "annual AFL Talent Development Fees to the SANFL" is for the under-age state teams or is that not SANFL funded?

Lastly, do you think we may have done well/got somewhat lucky on the timing of the licence buy back agreement (notwithstanding we effectively were paying for it a second time)? Perhaps that's one "good" thing to come off the back of our all time low point as a club (2011/2012) in that the value of our licence was at a similar low.

When the players are drafted the AFL clubs pay fees and more when they debut and play 10th and 50th game. These payments fit in the definition of the phrase you bolded. I dont know if fhere are additional amounts included in that. Re our licence I reckon they were bugger all given the loss we have made between 2008-13.. Part of me wonders if we were driven into the ground financially as a way to break the Sanfl shackles.

 

[TeeKray]

Brayshaw's comments are fairly disingenuous but his overall point is valid. North would be better off playing its home games against non-Victorian teams at Arden Street, which is just totally wrong. The model is broken and needs fixing.

 

[Sleezy]

Brayshaw's comments are fairly disingenuous but his overall point is valid. North would be better off playing its home games against non-Victorian teams at Arden Street, which is just totally wrong. The model is broken and needs fixing.

Totally agree. $600k for approx 290k attendees is just over $2 bucks a head. Whenever I used to go to docklands - even as a student ($10 entry) - I'd end up spending 30 or 40 bucks at least. That is a laughably small cut.

 

[Kwality]

Never heard it called a jail bar guernsey before mate...
You sure you're a Port supporter, or just someone who's heard of Port Adelaide?

You ever heard of Carl Fragomeni?

 

[Papa G]

Totally agree. $600k for approx 290k attendees is just over $2 bucks a head. Whenever I used to go to docklands - even as a student ($10 entry) - I'd end up spending 30 or 40 bucks at least. That is a laughably small cut.

But, but North made a "profit" last year with $34 mill revenue. Seriously, North Melbourne and Brayshaw can EAD.

 

[*PAF]

Brayshaw's comments are fairly disingenuous but his overall point is valid. North would be better off playing its home games against non-Victorian teams at Arden Street, which is just totally wrong. The model is broken and needs fixing.

Not sure that would be totally correct.
All clubs including us make a bucket load of money from the TV deal and part of that deal requires games to be played at certain venues to reduce the TV broadcasters costs, improved coverage and general TV appeal.
The other part regarding Etihad is that the operators have no option but to make RTI in a fixed timeframe as the stadium will be given back to the AFL in not too long and then the AFL wikl be the one banking that profit.
At the moment the AFL has two choices play high drawing games at the MCG or Etihad, or to put it in another way games that draw 23,000 spectators at Etihad or the MCG.
When looking at that Its not hard to work out which games should be played where.

Wrt making money from 22,000 well not too long ago the break even at AAMI was 32,000.

 

[70sDinosaur]

You ever heard of Carl Fragomeni?

He was originally from East Perth, wasn't he? Didn't you say you were a Subiaco man?

Incidentally, I saw Subiaco play Richmond in the Champions of Australia game at Adelaide Oval in 1973. Was barracking hard for your boys that day. They led for most of the day but couldn't hang on in the last quarter.

 

[Kwality]

He was originally from East Perth, wasn't he? Didn't you say you were a Subiaco man?

Incidentally, I saw Subiaco play Richmond in the Champions of Australia game at Adelaide Oval in 1973. Was barracking hard for your boys that day. They led for most of the day but couldn't hang on in the last quarter.

Right on all counts. Did his bit for Port Fragga, though I'm not sure my critic would know.

 

[tribey]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-03-18/brayshaw-slams-etihad-deal

"So (Port Adelaide chairman) David Koch is complaining about their new deal at Adelaide Oval where they're getting $4.5 million (a year), but we played 11 games and made $600,000. - See more at: http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-03-18/brayshaw-slams-etihad-deal#sthash.nPHenzFy.dpuf

According to afltables.com.au north averaged 26474 attendees across 2011 at Etihad. Wonder what that $600k would have turned into had they been averaging 40k attendances at Etihad?

lol.

Carn' Brayshaw.

We were writing cheques to the SANFL on attendances of 28000 with four gates and associated kiosks locked to save on staffing costs.

 

[NoddyHolder]

You ever heard of Carl Fragomeni?

You're Carl?

can I apologise for all those times in the 90s when you were running the bar at the club that me and my mate would drunkenly dribble endless shit about how devastated we were that you missed out on the '77 premiership and continually asked you if you thought you were probably the player at the club who played the most games without playing in a premiership (can't remember if we decided it was you or Bob Clayton).

 

[El_Scorcho]

lol.

Carn' Brayshaw.

We were writing cheques to the SANFL on attendances of 28000 with four gates and associated kiosks locked to save on staffing costs.

Brayshaw conveniently forgetting the extra 220,000 people we had through the gates we had at home games compared to them, and also the oversized novelty cheques we were writing to the SANFL every week when we matched their 2014 average crowd.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-03-18/brayshaw-slams-etihad-deal

"So (Port Adelaide chairman) David Koch is complaining about their new deal at Adelaide Oval where they're getting $4.5 million (a year), but we played 11 games and made $600,000. - See more at: http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-03-18/brayshaw-slams-etihad-deal#sthash.nPHenzFy.dpuf

According to afltables.com.au north averaged 26474 attendees across 2011 at Etihad. Wonder what that $600k would have turned into had they been averaging 40k attendances at Etihad?

Probably only $1mil. Depends how many home games they play there. I have posted this before in this thread but From the AFL's 2012-16 club funding and equalisation strategy document September 2011. Look at the red line.

 

[Stryke]

James ' Emotional depth of a sock puppet during a button shortage' Brayshaw

FOAD

 

[tribey]

Probably only $1mil. Depends how many home games they play there. I have posted this before in this thread but From the AFL's 2012-16 club funding and equalisation strategy document September 2011. Look at the red line.

And as raw a deal as the likes of North and the Dogs are copping is, at least there's light at the end of the tunnel.

When does Etihad switch hands to the AFL for a dollar? 2025? 2030?

Not only will they all ink generous deals, but they'll be able to extract a share of money out of the likes of Melbourne Victory/concerts as well.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

And as raw a deal as the likes of North and the Dogs are copping is, at least there's light at the end of the tunnel.

When does Etihad switch hands to the AFL for a dollar? 2025? 2030?

Not only will they all ink generous deals, but they'll be able to extract a share of money out of the likes of Melbourne Victory/concerts as well.

31/12/2025 unless the AFL decided to buy it earlier, but when the purchase price is $10 - with no debt transferred from the current owner why go early??

 

[Papa G]

North if I'm not mistaken, declared a "profit" this year. They got 4 home games in against bigger local teams in prime night time slots, got to sell a further 2 games for $1.2 million, had 2 further games against other teams from their own city, and 3 games against "interstaters", with only 1 being a Sunday twilight. They also had a good season making the Prelim Final. Seriously, what more do they actually want? Their membership numbers are rubbish. They have up to 20,000 members in Melbourne they can rely on to turn up when they are going well, and 12,000 when not going so well. That is the reality. They get $3 mill from the AFL, not because they have a shit draw (as illustrated above), but because they don't have enough supporters.

Oh yeah, they also were on nationally televised FTA Friday night games 5 times last year too. Etihad is a modern, centrally located stadium, not some shit hole out in the sticks. I ****ing hate North Melbourne.