Victorian club pokies revenue the last financial year

[Gigantor]

What I like is how you completely ignore the fact that you were completely wrong about the the Bulldogs and their lack of finances being due to Hawthorns pokie machines.

I blamed the bulldogs being broke on Hawthorn? Really? I'm not sure where you got that. I like it how people like you complain that I am repeating myself, but you never appear to know what I've said.

I have been saying that I find it distasteful that the wealthiest club in the AFL, from the leafy, well-to-do Eastern suburbs is gouging millions of dollars out of the people of the Western suburbs, an area at the polar extreme of where Hawthorn is both geographically and in socio-economic terms, while the one AFL club representing the area hasn't got two coins to rub together.

To repeat another description I have used a few times - I find that screwy - especially when the AFL is trying to work out how the competition can be made more even, while Hawthorn tell clubs like the bulldogs to find their own revenue streams, afterall, don't the bulldogs have the whole of the Western suburbs to draw upon? (well, at least they have whatever is left over after Hawthorn has fleeced everyone)

WE can be thankful the bloke who ushered in this new world source of ill-gotten gains and filthy lucre also presides over the NGO which deals with the human cost of such ventures. The synergy is breathtaking.

The bulldogs should also be thankful that Hawthorn shares the burden of expressing concern for the Western suburbs by satisfying the community service obligations that come with fleecing the western suburbs of tens of milions of dollars in ill-gotten gains.

The people of Melbourne's disadvantaged West are forever thankful to the Hawthorn FC I'm sure.

 

[blue harvest]

fleecing the western suburbs of tens of milions of dollars in ill-gotten gains.

Our pokies pay back about 90% of those millions in our majority market, the affluent citizens domiciled in the East.
I believe the pay out ratio is similar for the remainder of our machines in the impoverished West.

 

[telsor]

So that makes it right then? because someone else does it, it makes it ok for others? Especially when the AFL promote their high moral position in our community?.
Your low brow view of the place of pokies in sports clubs is disappointing.
For the record I'm not purely against poker machines. However I do believe they should be regulated much more strictly to limit the damage they do in society to people who have gambling problems which affects them & their families.
The place of pokies in the AFL, or in any sports or community organisation which promoted the health image, is very problematic IMO.
Its all about the scale & the nature of the pokies problem & the psychology the use to lure people in. It is a problem.

Tell me, why does it matter who owns them?

My view, as stated many times, is that we'd be far better off with fewer in total, but given that an AFL club refusing to own them wont change that total number at all, then the clubs might as well own them.

You and Gigantor don't seem to care about dealing with the actual problem, just so long as Victorian football clubs don't benefit from it (although Gigantor just seem to obsess about one club). I do find it curious how you ignore Port Adelaide owning machines, or Brisbane...

 

[telsor]

I think it's hilarious that the supporters of these Vic clubs actually think it is their onfield exploits & m'ships that are keeping them afloat & so 'wealthy'!

As opposed to Sydney who has been living off charity from Vic clubs for it's entire life?

 

[Tedeski]

As opposed to Sydney who has been living off charity from Vic clubs for it's entire life?

........the same Vic clubs that benefitted from having an AFL club fight for it's survival for 30 years in the mostt populated state in the country so that they could say that they were truly part of a National Compettition which in turn generated more TV rights dollars to help line the pockets of these Vic clubs so that they could have a greater sense of entitlement & arrogance.

 

[madmug]

Tell me, why does it matter who owns them?

My view, as stated many times, is that we'd be far better off with fewer in total, but given that an AFL club refusing to own them wont change that total number at all, then the clubs might as well own them.

You and Gigantor don't seem to care about dealing with the actual problem, just so long as Victorian football clubs don't benefit from it (although Gigantor just seem to obsess about one club). I do find it curious how you ignore Port Adelaide owning machines, or Brisbane...

That is a complete load of crap.
You clearly didnt read what I wrote.
Another twisted topic with Telsor.

 

[Dogs till i die]

The Cats have 80 machines in Point Cook, Collingwood 66 in Caroline Springs as well and the Dons 90 in Melton.
Why the Hawthorn focus?

Not to mention Carlton who have pokie establishments in Laverton and Williamstown

 

[blue harvest]

The Cats have 80 machines in Point Cook, Collingwood 66 in Caroline Springs as well and the Dons 90 in Melton.
Why the Hawthorn focus?

Why? See below, pretty much the reason for most threads these days.

 

[Prudster]

I blamed the bulldogs being broke on Hawthorn? Really? I'm not sure where you got that. I like it how people like you complain that I am repeating myself, but you never appear to know what I've said.

I have been saying that I find it distasteful that the wealthiest club in the AFL, from the leafy, well-to-do Eastern suburbs is gouging millions of dollars out of the people of the Western suburbs, an area at the polar extreme of where Hawthorn is both geographically and in socio-economic terms, while the one AFL club representing the area hasn't got two coins to rub together.

To repeat another description I have used a few times - I find that screwy - especially when the AFL is trying to work out how the competition can be made more even, while Hawthorn tell clubs like the bulldogs to find their own revenue streams, afterall, don't the bulldogs have the whole of the Western suburbs to draw upon? (well, at least they have whatever is left over after Hawthorn has fleeced everyone)

WE can be thankful the bloke who ushered in this new world source of ill-gotten gains and filthy lucre also presides over the NGO which deals with the human cost of such ventures. The synergy is breathtaking.

The bulldogs should also be thankful that Hawthorn shares the burden of expressing concern for the Western suburbs by satisfying the community service obligations that come with fleecing the western suburbs of tens of milions of dollars in ill-gotten gains.

The people of Melbourne's disadvantaged West are forever thankful to the Hawthorn FC I'm sure.

My god could the sky be falling any more with you? There are plenty of pokies venues in the Western suburbs that have no affiliation with Hawthorn. If the one Hawthorn venue is doing that much damage to the Western Bulldogs' ability to find revenue streams in the Western suburbs, then there are far bigger issues at play than Hawthorn owning pokies out there.

Hawthorn rightly so are telling the Bulldogs to find their own revenue streams. If Hawthorn didn't have a pokies venue in the west, the Bulldogs would almost certainly be in the exact same position, so the two issues are completely unrelated.

Nobody gives a s**t what Jeff Kennett is doing or has done. He's already hated for his time in politics and his antics as Hawthorn president, so you can stop bringing him up because nobody cares, and it's completely irrelevant to the discussion on Hawthorn, our pokies, or any other clubs' pokies.

People wouldn't need to tell you to stop repeating yourself if you didn't just keep posting the same hyperbolic, irrelevant s**t. Maybe if you actually tried addressing the very valid concerns with your arguments that multiple posters have brought up, you might find this discussion actually goes somewhere.

 

[Gigantor]

The Cats have 80 machines in Point Cook, Collingwood 66 in Caroline Springs as well and the Dons 90 in Melton.
Why the Hawthorn focus?

Well, Point Cook is about half way to Geelong isn't it?

As for the other two - they can almost be placed in the same category as Hawthorn (although Essendon has a North-West focus, and Collingwood is a club born on the wrong side of the tracks).

But there is a reason why I am focusing on Hawthorn.

Hawthorn could focus its energy entirely on the vast, never-ending Eastern Suburbs. It's a prosperous area, above-average incomes, well-educated, etc.

Why doesn't it limit its filthy poker machine endeavours to the vast, never-ending Eastern Suburbs? (being its very own backyard)

Because those with an above-average income have a lower propensity to use poker machines.

Unfortunately, those with a below-average income (and lower education), as are to be found in the slums of the Western suburbs, have a higher propensity to use poker machines.

Those who can least afford it, are more likely to gamble away the little that they have.

Hawthorn chooses to put the bulk of its machines in an area far away from where they are domiciled because there are profits to be made from other people's misery.

Fortunately for this underclass, they can be assured that their misery will be attended to, because the person who brought in the policy to profit from those who can least afford it also presides over an NGO whose mission is to raise awareness of the scourge of depression in modern society.

 

[blue harvest]

Well, Point Cook is about half way to Geelong isn't it?

Geography not your strong point again.
Pt Cook only about 20km from Footscray, it's in their backyard, yet it is Geelong 2-3 times the distance away fleecing those slum dwellers.

Hawthorn could focus its energy entirely on the vast, never-ending Eastern Suburbs. It's a prosperous area, above-average incomes, well-educated, etc.
Why doesn't it limit its filthy poker machine endeavours to the vast, never-ending Eastern Suburbs? (being its very own backyard)
Because those with an above-average income have a lower propensity to use poker machines.
Unfortunately, those with a below-average income (and lower education), as are to be found in the slums of the Western suburbs, have a higher propensity to use poker machines.
Those who can least afford it, are more likely to gamble away the little that they have.

Diversification is good business.

Hawthorn chooses to put the bulk of its machines in an area far away from where they are domiciled because there are profits to be made from other people's misery.

Once again geography not your thing. The bulk of the machines are across the road from their training base in the East.

 

[eggtardo]

Unfortunately, those with a below-average income (and lower education), as are to be found in the slums of the Western suburbs, have a higher propensity to use poker machines.

.

You haven't actually been to Footscray or the inner west for over 20 years have you? MEdian house prices and average income would exceed the sprawling outer east you speak of.

 

[MacMum]

Slums?? The western suburbs are considered the trendy place to be now.......and housing prices have gone through the roof.

Good portion of footballers, execs, professional people live there now.

Very little difference between east and west these days.....both sprawling with housing developments

 

[Gigantor]

You haven't actually been to Footscray or the inner west for over 20 years have you? MEdian house prices and average income would exceed the sprawling outer east you speak of.

Below average incomes, below average education standards, the perfect place to put machines if you wish to profit on other people's misery.

 

[Gralin]

I blamed the bulldogs being broke on Hawthorn? Really? I'm not sure where you got that. I like it how people like you complain that I am repeating myself, but you never appear to know what I've said.

I have been saying that I find it distasteful that the wealthiest club in the AFL, from the leafy, well-to-do Eastern suburbs is gouging millions of dollars out of the people of the Western suburbs, an area at the polar extreme of where Hawthorn is both geographically and in socio-economic terms, while the one AFL club representing the area hasn't got two coins to rub together.

To repeat another description I have used a few times - I find that screwy - especially when the AFL is trying to work out how the competition can be made more even, while Hawthorn tell clubs like the bulldogs to find their own revenue streams, afterall, don't the bulldogs have the whole of the Western suburbs to draw upon? (well, at least they have whatever is left over after Hawthorn has fleeced everyone)

WE can be thankful the bloke who ushered in this new world source of ill-gotten gains and filthy lucre also presides over the NGO which deals with the human cost of such ventures. The synergy is breathtaking.

The bulldogs should also be thankful that Hawthorn shares the burden of expressing concern for the Western suburbs by satisfying the community service obligations that come with fleecing the western suburbs of tens of milions of dollars in ill-gotten gains.

The people of Melbourne's disadvantaged West are forever thankful to the Hawthorn FC I'm sure.

I think you will find West Coast are the wealthiest AFL club in Australia not Hawthorn.
Hawks are based in Mulgrave, not the leafiest of suburbs they back onto the Monash Freeway.
As has been mentioned half of the machines Hawks have a license for are in the eastern suburbs
Why are you not worried about Collingwood, or Carlton or any of the other clubs that have business outside their suburb?
The Footscray Football club is what the Western Bulldogs used to be called before they figured they could tap a wider market with a name change in 1996 a full 14 years before Hawks opened a venue in Caroline Springs, and yet there are many venues out that way not owned by Western Bulldogs...
It seems to me your issue is with Hawthorn and more particularly the Jeff Kennett era which in case you hadn't realised ended in 2011

 

[Gralin]

Well, Point Cook is about half way to Geelong isn't it?

As for the other two - they can almost be placed in the same category as Hawthorn (although Essendon has a North-West focus, and Collingwood is a club born on the wrong side of the tracks).

But there is a reason why I am focusing on Hawthorn.

Hawthorn could focus its energy entirely on the vast, never-ending Eastern Suburbs. It's a prosperous area, above-average incomes, well-educated, etc.

Why doesn't it limit its filthy poker machine endeavours to the vast, never-ending Eastern Suburbs? (being its very own backyard)

Because those with an above-average income have a lower propensity to use poker machines.

Unfortunately, those with a below-average income (and lower education), as are to be found in the slums of the Western suburbs, have a higher propensity to use poker machines.

Those who can least afford it, are more likely to gamble away the little that they have.

Hawthorn chooses to put the bulk of its machines in an area far away from where they are domiciled because there are profits to be made from other people's misery.

Fortunately for this underclass, they can be assured that their misery will be attended to, because the person who brought in the policy to profit from those who can least afford it also presides over an NGO whose mission is to raise awareness of the scourge of depression in modern society.

You obviously haven't spent any time in the eastern suburbs of Melbourne if you think they are all leafy never ending rows of high income family homes

 

[Kwality]

My god could the sky be falling any more with you? There are ....

People wouldn't need to tell you to stop repeating yourself if you didn't just keep posting the same hyperbolic, irrelevant s**t. Maybe if you actually tried addressing the very valid concerns with your arguments that multiple posters have brought up, you might find this discussion actually goes somewhere.

People have a right to judge - some people have a dislike of bleeding pensioners, be it Woolies, the Hawks or anyone else & Giga the GWS fan is every bit entitled to have his say.

 

[Gigantor]

You obviously haven't spent any time in the eastern suburbs of Melbourne if you think they are all leafy never ending rows of high income family homes

Well, let's put it this way, any Hawthorn fan living in and around Hawthorn will be unlikely to trade it in for a housing commission flat in Braybrook.

 

[Gigantor]

I think you will find West Coast are the wealthiest AFL club in Australia not Hawthorn.
Hawks are based in Mulgrave, not the leafiest of suburbs they back onto the Monash Freeway.
As has been mentioned half of the machines Hawks have a license for are in the eastern suburbs
Why are you not worried about Collingwood, or Carlton or any of the other clubs that have business outside their suburb?
The Footscray Football club is what the Western Bulldogs used to be called before they figured they could tap a wider market with a name change in 1996 a full 14 years before Hawks opened a venue in Caroline Springs, and yet there are many venues out that way not owned by Western Bulldogs...
It seems to me your issue is with Hawthorn and more particularly the Jeff Kennett era which in case you hadn't realised ended in 2011

All correct about the Western Bulldogs, which is why I view the WEstern Suburbs as their natural constituency.

Bottom-line: it would be better if the league as a whole had less reliance on such filthy lucre and ill-gotten gains, and a good start is for Hawthorn to not trade off the misery of a far away underclass community which has absolutely zero connection with Hawthorn, both geographically and socio-economically. Stick to the machines you have in the leafy, well-to-do Eastern suburbs, and leave the slums of the Western suburbs alone for a club which barely has two coins to rub together.

 

[Gralin]

Well, let's put it this way, any Hawthorn fan living in and around Hawthorn will be unlikely to trade it in for a housing commission flat in Braybrook.

Hawthorn is only one suburb out east you know.

All correct about the Western Bulldogs, which is why I view the WEstern Suburbs as their natural constituency.

Bottom-line: it would be better if the league as a whole had less reliance on such filthy lucre and ill-gotten gains, and a good start is for Hawthorn to not trade off the misery of a far away underclass community which has absolutely zero connection with Hawthorn, both geographically and socio-economically. Stick to the machines you have in the leafy, well-to-do Eastern suburbs, and leave the slums of the Western suburbs alone for a club which barely has two coins to rub together.

Again their are poorer suburbs both east and west and richer suburbs both east and west.
Your obsession with this image of every suburb east of Melbourne being well to do and leafy and every suburb west being a desert of poor downtrodden people is a fallacy.
Your ideas and comments say more about your obsession with Hawthorn than anything else

 

[Gigantor]

Hawthorn is only one suburb out east you know.


Again their are poorer suburbs both east and west and richer suburbs both east and west.
Your obsession with this image of every suburb east of Melbourne being well to do and leafy and every suburb west being a desert of poor downtrodden people is a fallacy.
Your ideas and comments say more about your obsession with Hawthorn than anything else

Bottom line: Hawthorn doesn't need the revenue, so reduce the amount of one armed bandits, and the best place to reduce them is:
1. where they are likely to do the most harm; and
2. where it's about as far removed from Hawthorn's natural constituency as you can get (without landing on the moon)

 

[Gralin]

Bottom line: Hawthorn doesn't need the revenue, so reduce the amount of one armed bandits, and the best place to reduce them is:
1. where they are likely to do the most harm; and
2. where it's about as far removed from Hawthorn's natural constituency as you can get (without landing on the moon)

I don't get this constituency crap you come up with, we are long past the days of Hawthorn supporters actually living in Hawthorn.
People don't choose where to live based on their support or a sporting club.
One of my mates grew up in Malvern East and is a mad dogs supporter.
I've never lived anywhere near Hawthorn and yet that is my team. Most clubs don't train at their old grounds these days they may have their roots in certain areas but there are supporters for all clubs all over the place these days.
Hawks aren't targeting doggies supporters, they like every other club invested in pokies are targeting gamblers

 

[Gigantor]

I don't get this constituency crap you come up with, we are long past the days of Hawthorn supporters actually living in Hawthorn.
People don't choose where to live based on their support or a sporting club.
One of my mates grew up in Malvern East and is a mad dogs supporter.
I've never lived anywhere near Hawthorn and yet that is my team. Most clubs don't train at their old grounds these days they may have their roots in certain areas but there are supporters for all clubs all over the place these days.
Hawks aren't targeting doggies supporters, they like every other club invested in pokies are targeting gamblers

You are partly correct - but in the case of Hawthorn and the Western Bulldogs - well, you could hardly argue they are two clubs in each others' pockets? They both have very clearly defined constituencies, diametrically opposed, and given how prosperous Hawthorn (the club) is, it really doesn't need to tread on the toes of a club which doesn't have two coins to rub together (especially when we are talking about an ethically dubious source of revenue).

 

[Gralin]

You are partly correct - but in the case of Hawthorn and the Western Bulldogs - well, you could hardly argue they are two clubs in each others' pockets? They both have very clearly defined constituencies, diametrically opposed, and given how prosperous Hawthorn (the club) is, it really doesn't need to tread on the toes of a club which doesn't have two coins to rub together (especially when we are talking about an ethically dubious source of revenue).

You are talking our of your arse. You know what defines a Hawthorn supporter vs a doggies supporter? The club they go for. Not their age, gender, race, level of education, religious beliefs, political affiliations or net worth or any other geographical or social distinction.

 

[Gigantor]

You are talking our of your arse. You know what defines a Hawthorn supporter vs a doggies supporter? The club they go for. Not their age, gender, race, level of education, religious beliefs, political affiliations or net worth or any other geographical or social distinction.

Yeh...nah...the bulldogs have always been the strugglers from the struggling West.

The slums of the West are about as far away as you can get from the happy Hawthorn family. You'd find very few Hawthorn members who have ever dared take a stroll through the tumble down commission housing of Braybrook.

If Dougie Hawkins ever played a game of footy in Hawthorn, he would have thought he was in a different country.

Furthermore, both clubs are rarities in Melbourne in that their respective constituencies are so clearly defined (could also probably mount a case for Essendon as well).