2018 Rolling All Australian Team

[theyellowsash]

He is in the top 2. Brown averaging .3 more goals a game but Hawkins averaging more then 0.5 goal assists per game. Put them together and Hawkins is better. Actually Hawkins is slightly better then franklin as well on the combined goals and goal assist stats.

If you just pick two key forwards it’s Hawkins and franklin right now.

Franklin is only a lock on name alone. Hasn't been that much better than others and as shown before hasn't had as big a scoreboard impact as quote a few others.

But his name is Franklin

 

[00Stinger]

He is in the top 2. Brown averaging .3 more goals a game but Hawkins averaging more then 0.5 goal assists per game. Put them together and Hawkins is better. Actually Hawkins is slightly better then franklin as well on the combined goals and goal assist stats.

If you just pick two key forwards it’s Hawkins and franklin right now.

if only 2 forwards are picked Ben Brown is 100% one of them

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[Damon_3388]

Franklin is only a lock on name alone. Hasn't been that much better than others and as shown before hasn't had as big a scoreboard impact as quote a few others.

But his name is Franklin

#2 in the league in goals per game, #2 in the league in score involvements per game, but "hasn't had as big a scoreboard impact"?

OK

 

[Seeds]

if only 2 forwards are picked Ben Brown is 100% one of them

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Not based on facts he ain’t. Brown is also not in the top 5 key forwards for marks or score involvements or tackles. Hawkins is 1st or 2nd in all 3. He easily eclipses Brown in stats.

 

[Mr north man]

Yeah he has, Brown has played two extra games. Brown averaging 3.0 goals per game and Hawkins 2.70. Though consistency over an entire season should be rewarded IMO.

Brown has 52 goals needs to kick another 20 goals as if his passed on the Coleman Medal count he won't be AA as the AA selectors will go with Hawkins Franklin and Grundy as the forward options as Gawn will be 1st ruck trust me Brown will be screwed over like Tarrant and Goldstein have in the last 8 years .
Plus you have a known North hater on selection panel Luke Darby

 

[Seeds]

Brown has 52 goals needs to kick another 20 goals as if his passed on the Coleman Medal count he won't be AA as the AA selectors will go with Hawkins Franklin and Grundy as the forward options as Gawn will be 1st ruck trust me Brown will be screwed over like Tarrant and Goldstein have in the last 8 years .
Plus you have a known North hater on selection panel Luke Darby

Yep he does. Brown not in top 2 in goal involvements per game and not in top 5 in score involvements per game. He needs a big finish to get back in the frame.

 

[eth-dog]

For a pure forward, I'd say the importance of stats could be ranked something like this:

1. Goals
=2. Contested marks, marks inside 50, goal assists
=5. Inside 50s, score involvements
=7. Tackles and other disposals

For key forwards yes. Small forwards generally don't take that many contested marks, there are only 2 in the league in the top 50 for CM/game. I'd adjust the small forward one to:

1. Goals
=2. Goal assists, tackles inside 50
=4. Inside 50's, score involvements, marks inside 50

And then the rest don't matter as much.

 

[Suma Magic]

Some obvious trolling from Cats’ fans here.

I’d have Brown as the lock.

Darling has only missed three games. I’d have him at CHF.

 

[TiggerMan22]

Among 191cm+ forwards to played 13/17 games in 2018 so far:

Goals Per Game
1. Ben Brown - 3.06
2. Lance Franklin - 3.00
3. Tom Hawkins - 2.73
4. Jack Darling - 2.62
5. Jesse Hogan / Jack Riewoldt - 2.41

Score Involvements Per Game
1. Lance Franklin - 8.50
2. Tom Hawkins - 8.07
3. Jack Darling - 7.77
4. Jesse Hogan - 7.35
5. Jack Gunston - 6.88

Inside 50s Per Game
1. Lance Franklin - 5.00
2. Jack Riewoldt - 3.65
3. Charlie Curnow - 3.27
4. Jack Gunston - 2.94
5. Jesse Hogan - 2.88

Goal Assists Per Game
1. Tom Hawkins - 1.20
2. Jack Riewoldt - 0.88
3. Lance Franklin - 0.86
4. Jack Darling - 0.85
5. Ben Brown / Jarryd Roughead - 0.76

Marks Per Game
1. Tom Hawkins - 7.07
2. Jack Darling - 7.00
3. Lance Franklin - 6.93
4. Charlie Curnow - 6.40
5. Jesse Hogan - 6.29

Contested Marks Per Game
1. Jack Darling - 2.85
2. Tom Hawkins - 2.40
3. Jack Riewoldt - 1.94
4. Charlie Curnow - 1.93
5. Ben Brown - 1.88

Marks Inside 50 Per Game
1. Tom Hawkins - 3.40
2. Lance Franklin - 3.29
3. Jack Darling - 3.23
4. Jack Riewoldt - 3.06
5. Ben Brown - 2.82

Tackles Inside 50 Per Game
1. Jack Riewoldt - 1.47
2. Tom Hawkins - 1.40
3. Charlie Dixon - 1.18
4. Jack Watts - 1.14
5. Josh Jenkins - 1.06

If we're then affording a 5-4-3-2-1 points scale to each of these categories (eg. #1 ranking equals 5 points, #2 equals 4 points, and so on), then the players would be ranked like so:

1. Tom Hawkins - 30 points (of a possible 40 points)
2. Lance Franklin - 24 points
3. Jack Darling - 21 points
4. Jack Riewoldt - 19 points
5. Ben Brown - 8 points
6. Charlie Curnow - 7 points
7. Jesse Hogan - 5 points
8. Jack Gunston / Charlie Dixon - 3 points
9. Jack Watts / Josh Jenkins / Jarryd Roughead - 1 point

Shows that Hawkins is consistent, versatile, and prolific, perhaps moreso than any other key forward this season.

Nice post an all. But that entire ranking system just has no value at all.
Being no.1 in inside 50 marks shouldn't be worth the same as being no.1 in goals.

You've also got 3 seperate stats for marks, which Hawkins is highly ranked in.
So just being good at marking gives you a maximum of 15 points while being a good goal kicker can get you 5 points max? Huh?

Also someone could be 1st by 100 goals and get the same amount of points if they were 1st by 1 goal.

The entire system proves nothing, shows nothing and makes no sense.
So no, that doesn't show that Hawkins is any of things you said he is.

 

[Darkyprotector]

Breust has all non-key forwards covered this year.

Breust is a scavenger

Dines out on easy teams

Not a match winner a finisher

Very over rated and to prove it check his contested ball, marks , contested mark

People don't realise he's hawthorns second forward now


So does he get in before
Darling or those others in contention?

 

[Pack Specialist]

Nice post an all. But that entire ranking system just has no value at all.
Being no.1 in inside 50 marks shouldn't be worth the same as being no.1 in goals.

You've also got 3 seperate stats for marks, which Hawkins is highly ranked in.
So just being good at marking gives you a maximum of 15 points while being a good goal kicker can get you 5 points max? Huh?

Also someone could be 1st by 100 goals and get the same amount of points if they were 1st by 1 goal.

The entire system proves nothing, shows nothing and makes no sense.
So no, that doesn't show that Hawkins is any of things you said he is.

Are you deliberately being obtuse?

The points don't matter, it's the numbers themselves.

Hawkins is clearly in the AA frame IMO.

 

[00Stinger]

Not based on facts he ain’t. Brown is also not in the top 5 key forwards for marks or score involvements or tackles. Hawkins is 1st or 2nd in all 3. He easily eclipses Brown in stats.

The only fact I need to know is the Brown is going to be the runaway Coleman medal winner.

Therefore AA FF lock.

I am not against Hawkins being in the CHF or FP though.

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[TiggerMan22]

Are you deliberately being obtuse?

The points don't matter, it's the numbers themselves.

Hawkins is clearly in the AA frame IMO.

If the points don't matter why was there a point system, point leaderboard and then a paragraph about why those points show Hawkins is versatile and all those other things?

 

[Happy Mastenator]

Among 191cm+ forwards to played 13/17 games in 2018 so far:

Goals Per Game
1. Ben Brown - 3.06
2. Lance Franklin - 3.00
3. Tom Hawkins - 2.73
4. Jack Darling - 2.62
5. Jesse Hogan / Jack Riewoldt - 2.41

Score Involvements Per Game
1. Lance Franklin - 8.50
2. Tom Hawkins - 8.07
3. Jack Darling - 7.77
4. Jesse Hogan - 7.35
5. Jack Gunston - 6.88

Inside 50s Per Game
1. Lance Franklin - 5.00
2. Jack Riewoldt - 3.65
3. Charlie Curnow - 3.27
4. Jack Gunston - 2.94
5. Jesse Hogan - 2.88

Goal Assists Per Game
1. Tom Hawkins - 1.20
2. Jack Riewoldt - 0.88
3. Lance Franklin - 0.86
4. Jack Darling - 0.85
5. Ben Brown / Jarryd Roughead - 0.76

Marks Per Game
1. Tom Hawkins - 7.07
2. Jack Darling - 7.00
3. Lance Franklin - 6.93
4. Charlie Curnow - 6.40
5. Jesse Hogan - 6.29

Contested Marks Per Game
1. Jack Darling - 2.85
2. Tom Hawkins - 2.40
3. Jack Riewoldt - 1.94
4. Charlie Curnow - 1.93
5. Ben Brown - 1.88

Marks Inside 50 Per Game
1. Tom Hawkins - 3.40
2. Lance Franklin - 3.29
3. Jack Darling - 3.23
4. Jack Riewoldt - 3.06
5. Ben Brown - 2.82

Tackles Inside 50 Per Game
1. Jack Riewoldt - 1.47
2. Tom Hawkins - 1.40
3. Charlie Dixon - 1.18
4. Jack Watts - 1.14
5. Josh Jenkins - 1.06

If we're then affording a 5-4-3-2-1 points scale to each of these categories (eg. #1 ranking equals 5 points, #2 equals 4 points, and so on), then the players would be ranked like so:

1. Tom Hawkins - 30 points (of a possible 40 points)
2. Lance Franklin - 24 points
3. Jack Darling - 21 points
4. Jack Riewoldt - 19 points
5. Ben Brown - 8 points
6. Charlie Curnow - 7 points
7. Jesse Hogan - 5 points
8. Jack Gunston / Charlie Dixon - 3 points
9. Jack Watts / Josh Jenkins / Jarryd Roughead - 1 point

Shows that Hawkins is consistent, versatile, and prolific, perhaps moreso than any other key forward this season.

Darling was injured 5 minutes into one game, and that pulls all his per game stats down.

Missed a fair few games though so would need an incredible finish to be in contention.

 

[eth-dog]

Breust is a scavenger

Dines out on easy teams

Not a match winner a finisher

Very over rated and to prove it check his contested ball, marks , contested mark

People don't realise he's hawthorns second forward now


So does he get in before
Darling or those others in contention?

Breust averages vs top 8 sides: 15.4 disposals, 4 marks, 2.6 goals, 0.5 goal assists, 3.4 inside 50's, 1.3 tackles inside 50
Breust averages across all games: 15.9 disposals, 4.3 marks, 2.4 goals, 0.9 GA, 2.9 I50, 1.9 tackles I50

There are two small forwards in the league who are in the top 50 for contested marks per game. Liam Ryan and Dan Menzel. Only two in the top 100 for marks in WHE and Bayley Fritsch.

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

For key forwards yes. Small forwards generally don't take that many contested marks, there are only 2 in the league in the top 50 for CM/game. I'd adjust the small forward one to:

1. Goals
=2. Goal assists, tackles inside 50
=4. Inside 50's, score involvements, marks inside 50

And then the rest don't matter as much.

Yep, fair call.

Goals, then tackles and goal assists and then maybe disposals, I50s, MI50s and score involvements as a tie breaker if required would probably give a pretty good idea of who's been the dominant small forward(s) in the league.

 

[tazaa]

Yep he does. Brown not in top 2 in goal involvements per game and not in top 5 in score involvements per game. He needs a big finish to get back in the frame.

Brown has been consistent each week which Hawkins hasnt. Which is why hes in the majority of teams.
You just look like a muppet trying to make a case for Hawkins

 

[Darkyprotector]

As picked by Kane Cornes, who is an ÜberSpüd.

Irrelevant

Maybe but more relevant than both yours and mine

 

[eth-dog]

Brown has been consistent each week which Hawkins hasnt. Which is why hes in the majority of teams.
You just look like a muppet trying to make a case for Hawkins

Hawkins has kicked multiple goals in 13 of his last 14 games, seems pretty consistent to me. And the one he didn't he had 3 goal assists as well.

 

[theyellowsash]

#2 in the league in goals per game, #2 in the league in score involvements per game, but "hasn't had as big a scoreboard impact"?

OK

That's not what stats posted earlier say

 

[theyellowsash]

The only fact I need to know is the Brown is going to be the runaway Coleman medal winner.

Therefore AA FF lock.

I am not against Hawkins being in the CHF or FP though.

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Didn't help Jack one year. But it's hard to imagine Brown won't be there

 

[tazaa]

Hawkins has kicked multiple goals in 13 of his last 14 games, seems pretty consistent to me. And the one he didn't he had 3 goal assists as well.

And Brown has been ''UP'' all year.
Not stating Hawkins isnt AA worthy. My point is you reward the player who has performed for longer.

 

[eth-dog]

And Brown has been ''UP'' all year.
Not stating Hawkins isnt AA worthy. My point is you reward the player who has performed for longer.

You said he wasn't consistent. He's been very consistent. Apart from his first two games being average, he's been excellent.

 

[Suma Magic]

A quick attempt at a team and squad.

 

[Ricky Vaughn]

Can't pick Hawkins ahead of Brown at this stage.
Hawkins could spend 75% of the season as the more impactful footballer, but Brown will still make it.

After 5 rounds, Hawkins had kicked 4 goals. Ben Brown had 19. No doubt Hawk's had him covered since, but it's a 22 round season.

There's a good group of key forwards fighting it out right now, I'm just glad Hawk is back in that discussion.