Play Nice Indigenous AFL players call out Adam Goodes's treatment ahead of The Final Quarter documentary release

[tony__montana]

"The way he carried on" being, ya know, standing up for his people against racism, celebrating his culture (in the round dedicated to that culture) and being a proud indigenous Australian? And he got boo'd for that?

Sounds a bit racist to me..

No, people have applauded and continue to applaud indigenous Australians for standing up for their people against racism.

 

[Kram]

"The way he carried on" being, ya know, standing up for his people against racism, celebrating his culture (in the round dedicated to that culture) and being a proud indigenous Australian? And he got boo'd for that?

Sounds a bit racist to me..

How come blokes like Winmar were pretty much treated like heroes for making their stand? Eddie Betts is also one of the most popular players in the league.

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

Well genius of course unless you go ask every single person to do a sign a ballot form about if they did in fact boo that dill because he was aboriginal then no not catagogally. But people who run the AFL are apologizing on behalf of everyone stipulating they catagogally know that it was racial. Was Cyril booed, buddy Franklin booed, The burgoin brothers or hill brothers etc? NO. You can keep going on about this all you like, but people didnt like they way he carried on. And booed appropiatly. Now back in your box with you.

Neither I nor the AFL are concerned about the non-racial booing.

But any idiot can see that at least part of the booing was racially motivated.

That alone is justification for them to condemn it.

Your sacred right to boo people you don't like is more important that someone else's right to basic human dignity?

OK then. Glad we cleared that up.

Such a proud booer, you. Get some business cards made up.

Now back to your X Box, coz I don't think you're up to the cut and thrust of robust public debate.

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

She was thirteen. Children of 14 have been not just ‘called out’ but sentenced for murder. Recently too. They were found to have understood the consequences of their actions in a court. But in this instance, apparently she’s do young or some such crap. And apparently too young even for one man to defend her and ask that she be educated about how her behaviour might be hurtful.

Go easy.

It seems the people who love to bandy about the term “snowflake” are the biggest snowflakes of the lot when it comes to admitting the consequences of their actions.

Waaaah mummy! I said something racist and now that nasty man called me racist!

 

[Ron The Bear]

Exactly. It’s ok for a white man to preach his rights are being restricted because he can’t be a bigot, and that his free speech is contravened, but a black man saying something? Wow! No way! We’ve given them enough haven’t we? After decades of persecution and racism we let them in, god they should be bloody well grateful we let them be part of our society in their country.

How dumb of me.

Why does it surprise you that people aren't receptive to being beaten over the head with a black armband view of history?

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

You guys just keep missing the point. The argument of whether a 13 year old should be aware is not the crux of the issue here, there are too many mitigating factors to argue such as the childs environment, mental capacity of parents/family to educate & help establish a moral compass, mental capacity of the child etc. You can continue to brush over this point like it doesnt matter, but it does, you simply cant make generalisations like that to validate your argument. What if the child had learning disabilities? Was autistic or on the spectrum?

I dont think any reasonable human being could argue against her being appropriately educated on the issue.

However,
I do find it fascinating that on one hand people like you feel its ok to protect the identity of a minor when they, you know, murder someone, but its perfectly reasonable in your mind for a minor who has made a dumb mistake(whose history you know nothing about), to be publicly shamed.

Who knows what went through Goodes’ mind in the split second between being called an ape and pointing out the perpetrator, all in the highly-charged environment of a professional sporting event with thousand of people watching and potentially hundreds of thousands more on television?

Let’s not forget, we’re talking about an elite sportsman here, conditioned to react in a millisecond without conscious thought.

So let’s give Goodes a bit of slack here. I personally think he was entirely right to call her out, but let’s say that later that night, he thought to himself “oh f***. That was really dumb of me.”

Even if he entirely regretted what he’d decided to do in a split second in that highly-charged environment, even if he wished he could have wiped the episode completely, would that justify the way he was treated?

And don’t his comments at the press conference the next day make it crystal clear to anyone with a functional brain that this was a decent, compassionate human being, displaying immense concern for the welfare of the teenage girl?

But the booing just got worse.

We’re seeing the very worst of mob behaviour. That’s all this is.

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

Why does it surprise you that people aren't receptive to being beaten over the head with a black armband view of history?

Guess some people just want the truth to be heard.

I’m kinda passionate about truth myself.

 

[demondavey]

You guys just keep missing the point. The argument of whether a 13 year old should be aware is not the crux of the issue here, there are too many mitigating factors to argue such as the childs environment, mental capacity of parents/family to educate & help establish a moral compass, mental capacity of the child etc. You can continue to brush over this point like it doesnt matter, but it does, you simply cant make generalisations like that to validate your argument. What if the child had learning disabilities? Was autistic or on the spectrum?

I dont think any reasonable human being could argue against her being appropriately educated on the issue.

However,
I do find it fascinating that on one hand people like you feel its ok to protect the identity of a minor when they, you know, murder someone, but its perfectly reasonable in your mind for a minor who has made a dumb mistake(whose history you know nothing about), to be publicly shamed.

Again, you’ve missed the point. You have explicitly argued that the 13 year old IS the crux of the issue. Go and look over your postings.

More more and more excuses from you; learning disabilities, environment, autism (spare me). Protecting a minor for murdering someone is very different. Very very different.

Who publicly shamed her? Was it Goodes?

 

[demondavey]

Why does it surprise you that people aren't receptive to being beaten over the head with a black armband view of history?

Because history in this country is reflective of some pretty horrible treatment of indigenous people. The sooner people accept it and face up to it the sooner crap like this is stopped.

 

[Ron The Bear]

Guess some people just want the truth to be heard.

I’m kinda passionate about truth myself.

I'm all for the truth, just not for one-sided versions.

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

I'm all for the truth, just not for one-sided versions.

I actually like you Ron, but I think you have a very blinkered view on some subjects.

There are plenty of impeccably-researched books in your local bookshop or library showing beyond any shadow of a doubt the horrors that indigenous Australians have been subjected to.

Go on, read a couple.

 

[Spanish_Fly]

I think there is one part of this discussion that has been missed here. The interaction between the players and the crowd at football games is more pantomime than real life. I think conflating the 2 is not correct, Ill give an example.

I have the utmost respect for Scott Pendlebury, If I met him in the street I would be happy to shake his hand and congratulate him on an outstanding carreer, and acknowledge how musch respect I had for him on and off the field, and be full of praise for how he has been able to make such a success of his life,

But, if hypothetically, I was at a final this year between the Tiges and Pies, and Sydney Stack ran through him and knocked him into next week within the rules, I would be ectsatic, it would be just about the best thing I'd seen all yesr, I would stand and applaud Syndey and yell to Pendles to get up and stop being a sook or whatever. Most people would act the same I would guess.

This is no way reflects how I would react to Scott in real life, if I saw someone run through him just randomly down the street I would be aghast, I would remonstrate with that person, happily call the police etc. I would not derive any joy whatsoever from this, my reations would be polar opposite. Its the theatre of the football, and pantomime environment that dictates the difference in my reactions, cheering for the hero's and booing the villains, whether those roles are manufactured or not.

I think people are taking too literally the crowd involvlement, I think projecting football behaviour into real life is not approriate and there should be some understanding of the context of the environment.

 

[carloss]

Here's what it sounds like if I boo you because I dislike you. BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
Here's what it sounds like if I boo you because of skin colour. BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Nobody has any right to claim that I am booing on skin colour and not dislike because the difference between the 2 boos is so friggin' obvious.

Former Aussie captain Steve Smith was shown no mercy by English fans on his way out to the middle against England, copping a chorus of boos from the crowd.

English fans boo Steve Smith at Lord's

Former Aussie captain Steve Smith was shown no mercy by English fans on his way out to the middle against England, copping a chorus of boos from the crowd.

www.sportingnews.com

What did the booing sound like in that occasion?

 

[demondavey]

How come blokes like Winmar were pretty much treated like heroes for making their stand? Eddie Betts is also one of the most popular players in the league.

Do you know how much flack Winmar copped at the time?

 

[Underarm]

How come blokes like Winmar were pretty much treated like heroes for making their stand? Eddie Betts is also one of the most popular players in the league.

You think the Collingwood supporters just magically all changed their tune and started praising Winmar and indigenous culutre after then? That somehow racism in football died that day?

 

[JackOutback]

You guys just keep missing the point. The argument of whether a 13 year old should be aware is not the crux of the issue here, there are too many mitigating factors to argue such as the childs environment, mental capacity of parents/family to educate & help establish a moral compass, mental capacity of the child etc. You can continue to brush over this point like it doesnt matter, but it does, you simply cant make generalisations like that to validate your argument. What if the child had learning disabilities? Was autistic or on the spectrum?

I dont think any reasonable human being could argue against her being appropriately educated on the issue.

However,
I do find it fascinating that on one hand people like you feel its ok to protect the identity of a minor when they, you know, murder someone, but its perfectly reasonable in your mind for a minor who has made a dumb mistake(whose history you know nothing about), to be publicly shamed.

And you keep missing the point; Goodes didn't publicly name her, the media did. He had a right to point out racial abuse directed at him on the field and did so without knowing her age and circumstances. When she was named, he went to great lengths to absolve her. The fact that you still want to direct some ire at him speaks volumes.

How come blokes like Winmar were pretty much treated like heroes for making their stand? Eddie Betts is also one of the most popular players in the league.

Because people like to rewrite history. Winmar was not roundly celebrated by everyone at the time, he copped plenty. History has been kind to him, just as it will to Goodes.

 

[tony__montana]

Again, you’ve missed the point. You have explicitly argued that the 13 year old IS the crux of the issue. Go and look over your postings.

More more and more excuses from you; learning disabilities, environment, autism (spare me). Protecting a minor for murdering someone is very different. Very very different.

Who publicly shamed her? Was it Goodes?

You’re not even responding to my points, you’re literally making stuff up and shifting the goalposts. You’re first sentence is completely wrong and misses the point. What a time waster you are

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

I think there is one part of this discussion that has been missed here. The interaction between the players and the crowd at football games is more pantomime than real life. I think conflating the 2 is not correct, Ill give an example.

I have the utmost respect for Scott Pendlebury, If I met him in the street I would be happy to shake his hand and congratulate him on an outstanding carreer, and acknowledge how musch respect I had for him on and off the field, and be full of praise for how he has been able to make such a success of his life,

But, if hypothetically, I was at a final this year between the Tiges and Pies, and Sydney Stack ran through him and knocked him into next week within the rules, I would be ectsatic, it would be just about the best thing I'd seen all yesr, I would stand and applaud Syndey and yell to Pendles to get up and stop being a sook or whatever. Most people would act the same I would guess.

This is no way reflects how I would react to Scott in real life, if I saw someone through him just randomly down the street I would be aghast, I would remonstrate with that person, happily call the police etc. I would not derive any joy whatsoever from this, my reations would be polar opposite. Its the theatre of the football, and pantomime environment that dictates the difference in my reactions, cheering for the hero's and booing the villains, whether those roles are manufactured or not.

I think people are taking too literally the crowd involvlement, I think projecting football behaviour into real life is not approriate and there should be some understanding of the context of the environment.

Good post. Everyone should take a deep breath.

 

[demondavey]

And you keep missing the point; Goodes didn't publicly name her, the media did. He had a right to point out racial abuse directed at him on the field and did so without knowing her age and circumstances. When she was named, he went to great lengths to absolve her. The fact that you still want to direct some ire at him speaks volumes.


Because people like to rewrite history. Winmar was not roundly celebrated by everyone at the time, he copped plenty. History has been kind to him, just as it will to Goodes.

Exactly. Have a good read of this tony__montana

You seem to continue to think that the fault of publicly shaming her was on Goodes. Do you think that in the moment he should’ve ignored being called an Ape? Stop hiding behind the girl, you’re using this to detract from the issue which is a black player calling out racism and then vilifying him for the actions against the 13 year old girl to which he publicly stated he wanted people to go easy on her.

1. You don’t get to choose what offends people
2. You don’t get to tell someone to keep quiet because it might upset a teenager
3. You don’t get to think this isn’t an issue present within our society.

 

[demondavey]

You’re not even responding to my points, you’re literally making stuff up and shifting the goalposts. You’re first sentence is completely wrong and misses the point. What a time waster you are

You actually I am missing the point? You’re so far tangled up in your own mess here that you can’t even see it.

I am responding directly to your points.

 

[Dont_Shoot_TheMessenger]

You actually I am missing the point? You’re so far tangled up in your own mess here that you can’t even see it.

I am responding directly to your points.

Goodes is a dog, no one liked him. Specific teams supporters booed him for dog acts, then they got told not to so everyone started doing it. Its so simple. CARLTON was bottom of the ladder, we played them at the scg, they were up by 50 points and he kicks a goal and runs at the crowd doing a dance and throwing an imaginary spear. He was booed that night for a campaigner act. Seriously.

If crowds are racist, why dont they boo the aboriginal in Sydney making millions of dollars a year and banging a WHITE supermodel?

I'll tell you why, because they aren't ******* racist

 

[demondavey]

Goodes is a dog, no one liked him. Specific teams supporters booed him for dog acts, then they got told not to so everyone started doing it. Its so simple. CARLTON was bottom of the ladder, we played them at the scg, they were up by 50 points and he kicks a goal and runs at the crowd doing a dance and throwing an imaginary spear. He was booed that night for a campaigner act. Seriously.

If crowds are racist, why dont they boo the aboriginal in Sydney making millions of dollars a year and banging a WHITE supermodel?

I'll tell you why, because they aren't ******* racist

God forbid he opens his mouth to give the crowds a ******* excuse.

 

[Dont_Shoot_TheMessenger]

God forbid he opens his mouth to give the crowds a ******* excuse.

So now we get to the point where "if he opens his mouth he will be booed " grasping at straws.

There are bad eggs in every section of society, to say that all the fans are racists is outlandish.

 

[demondavey]

So now we get to the point where "if he opens his mouth he will be booed " grasping at straws.

There are bad eggs in every section of society, to say that all the fans are racists is outlandish.

I didn’t say all fans were racists. There’s obviously a section that booed him for what happened. I honestly can’t recall him doing anything of note that was seriously dog like.

Can you? Did you watch the documentary?

 

[tony__montana]

Who knows what went through Goodes’ mind in the split second between being called an ape and pointing out the perpetrator, all in the highly-charged environment of a professional sporting event with thousand of people watching and potentially hundreds of thousands more on television?

Let’s not forget, we’re talking about an elite sportsman here, conditioned to react in a millisecond without conscious thought.

So let’s give Goodes a bit of slack here. I personally think he was entirely right to call her out, but let’s say that later that night, he thought to himself “oh f***. That was really dumb of me.”

Even if he entirely regretted what he’d decided to do in a split second in that highly-charged environment, even if he wished he could have wiped the episode completely, would that justify the way he was treated?

And don’t his comments at the press conference the next day make it crystal clear to anyone with a functional brain that this was a decent, compassionate human being, displaying immense concern for the welfare of the teenage girl?

But the booing just got worse.

We’re seeing the very worst of mob behaviour. That’s all this is.

All fair points and a good post. I believe whats causing so much angst in this issue is the inane commentary over it that is being reinforced by some in this thread. Too many people are black and white and dont believe in shades of grey. Shes a racist so deserves everything coming her way or he called her out so he doesnt deserve any sympathy or rights to stand up for his people.

Just one thing I want to add - I find it strange that people are arguing Goodes showed compassion and empathy for the young girl the next day(which I dont deny), yet most of those same posters show absolutely zero empathy for the child themselves. Fascinating stuff