Health The Value of Jesus/God in Your Life

[Shane Heard]

I have unwavering faith in the goodness and compassion of humanity. The vast majority of humans on this rock are good people..and all of us have flaws in some form.

It’s the bad minority that make it all feel like the world is ####ed.

It’s just a chosen mindset of how you look at things.

 

[Procrastinator35]

I have unwavering faith in the goodness and compassion of humanity. The vast majority of humans on this rock are good people..and all of us have flaws in some form.

It’s the bad minority that make it all feel like the world is ####ed.

It’s just a chosen mindset of how you look at things.

Merchant bankers....Most of our Western governments have been bought off & corrupted by them, unfortunately.....The philosophy of selfish greed.

The money lenders/usurers have taken over & now rule our Temples.....With Christ no where in sight to evict them.

 

[Shane Heard]

Merchant bankers....Most of our Western governments have been bought off & corrupted by them, unfortunately.....The philosophy of selfish greed.

The money lenders/usurers have taken over & now rule our Temples.....With Christ no where in sight to evict them.

Yes I hear ya. But that stuff has been going on for centuries.
Just part of life.

 

[Procrastinator35]

Yes I hear ya. But that stuff has been going on for centuries.
Just part of life.

Therein lies the heart of the problem.....Apathy.

As Plato noted in his Republic....Until the Philosopher Kings are restored to the throne as the rightful moral arbiters, then greed & corruption will continue to run amok.

Bankers & industrialists have no place at the table when it comes to social & economic justice, environmental issues & equal human rights & a voice for all.

Their sole concern & raison d'etre is profit.....And it's always at someone else's expense.

 

[Exe Gesis]

if you have a thought, can you pluck it from the mind and place it on the table for all to see?

if you take a bite of an apple and taste that sweetness, can you remove that sensation and place it on the table for all to see?

if you burn your finger on a candle, and that pain runs up your arm to your brain, can you pull that sensation out and place it on the table for all to see?

this is similar to the god topic. you cant demand visual proof of sensations, yet you believe in their existence. you will say...i believe because i experience those sensations. but so is god believable because people can and do experience that sensation. anyway, there is visual proof of god just like that video perthgal posted.

 

[Firestarter]

I don't have a religious equivalent of Jesus/God. I believe in karma.

 

[Shane Heard]

if you have a thought, can you pluck it from the mind and place it on the table for all to see?

if you take a bite of an apple and taste that sweetness, can you remove that sensation and place it on the table for all to see?

if you burn your finger on a candle, and that pain runs up your arm to your brain, can you pull that sensation out and place it on the table for all to see?

this is similar to the god topic. you cant demand visual proof of sensations, yet you believe in their existence. you will say...i believe because i experience those sensations. but so is god believable because people can and do experience that sensation. anyway, there is visual proof of god just like that video perthgal posted.

Visual proof?

Where is this post? I’m lazy and can’t be ####ed looking it up.

 

[Exe Gesis]

War
Famine
Pedophilia
Gun violence.
The Holocaust
The plague
AIDS
Ebola
The Crusades
Rape
Murder
Poverty
Slavery
Hitler
Trump
Idi Amin
Pol Pot
Stalin
etc
etc
etc
etc
...

And you people believe in God?

Give me a spell.

Ever heard of Satan?

 

[Shane Heard]

Ever heard of Satan?

You really need to re-read Blooms’ “the lucifer principal “

There is no Satan.

It’s the human condition that causes “evil”.

Read it again.

 

[Exe Gesis]

You really need to re-read Blooms’ “the lucifer principal “

There is no Satan.

It’s the human condition that causes “evil”.

Read it again.

Evil (and Good) are hard-coded into sentient life. It wasn't learned/acquired. That means there was a creator. And that hard-coded duality was put there for an obvious reason. That's how you test and hone and challenge beings.

That said, Satan might not exist at all. But if there's a Good and an Evil nature, it can make sense that there'd be an AGENT of Good and an AGENT of Evil.

 

[Shane Heard]

Evil (and Good) are hard-coded into sentient life. It wasn't learned/acquired. That means there was a creator. And that hard-coded duality was put there for an obvious reason. That's how you test and hone and challenge beings.

That said, Satan might not exist at all. But if there's a Good and an Evil nature, it can make sense that there'd be an AGENT of Good and an AGENT of Evil.

No mate. We live in social groups the same as many animals and creatures/insects.

It’s the law of nature that violence occurs.

I can’t be stuffed writing about it all over again. The front bar is on.

We are apes and monkeys and act very similar.

There is no agents of anything.

 

[Procrastinator35]

No mate. We live in social groups the same as many animals and creatures/insects.
It’s the law of nature that violence occurs.
I can’t be stuffed writing about it all over again. The front bar is on.
We are apes and monkeys and act very similar.
There is no agents of anything.

Hmmm, Yes.....I've been meaning to write a letter to my long lost cousin, the Great Ape.

 

[Procrastinator35]

You really need to re-read Blooms’ “the lucifer principal “
There is no Satan.
It’s the human condition that causes “evil”.
Read it again.

The concept of 'evil' itself is a human construct, though it derives from our higher conscious nature & awareness about our will & the fundamental moral choice of acting according to or against our conscience....From whence does that higher conscious will derive, that appears to mark us out as so fundamentally different to all other species?.....The answer to which we give the name God.....For it is a divine mystery.

We must honour that divine, inherent spark of reason within us, not cast it out & trash it by using the glib 'we are animals' as an appalling excuse for our actions & behaviour.

 

[M Malice]

No mate. We live in social groups the same as many animals and creatures/insects.

It’s the law of nature that violence occurs.

I can’t be stuffed writing about it all over again. The front bar is on.

We are apes and monkeys and act very similar.

There is no agents of anything.

I've read The Lucifer Principal and I got much the same as you from it, excellent book, have you read The Runaway Brain by Christopher Wills, very interesting read as well, a lot of complicated stuff in there, I had to read it twice to fully take it in.

 

[Shane Heard]

I've read The Lucifer Principal and I got much the same as you from it, excellent book, have you read The Runaway Brain by Christopher Wills, very interesting read as well, a lot of complicated stuff in there, I had to read it twice to fully take it in.

I’ll check it out..thanks mate

 

[Shane Heard]

Hmmm, Yes.....I've been meaning to write a letter to my long lost cousin, the Great Ape.

https://daftarche.com/attachments/%d9%be%d8%b2%d8%b4%da%a9%db%8c-%d9%88-%d8%a8%d9%87%d8%af%d8%a7%d8%b4%d8%aa-19/1157d1356807750-%da%a9%d8%a7%d8%a8%d9%88%d8%b3-%d9%88-%da%86%d8%b1%d8%a7%db%8c%db%8c-%d8%a2%d9%86-howard-bloom-lucifer-principle.pdf

 

[Procrastinator35]

https://daftarche.com/attachments/%d9%be%d8%b2%d8%b4%da%a9%db%8c-%d9%88-%d8%a8%d9%87%d8%af%d8%a7%d8%b4%d8%aa-19/1157d1356807750-%da%a9%d8%a7%d8%a8%d9%88%d8%b3-%d9%88-%da%86%d8%b1%d8%a7%db%8c%db%8c-%d8%a2%d9%86-howard-bloom-lucifer-principle.pdf

 

[Shane Heard]

View attachment 722995

There is no devil..no Satan.

There’s no mysterious forces hovering around us.

At the age 49..I just can’t be ####ed pondering this stuff anymore.

It’s a waste of time.

Nothing matters. Nothing is worth getting worried about. We are all going to die one day. Death is certain and after that we are dust.

There’s life and all it’s worries and anxiety..and then there’s death.

As Tennyson said..” love is the only gold”

Everything else is just getting sidetracked with frivolous concerns.

 

[Perth gal]

There are a lot of mysterious forces surrounding us.

 

[The Speaker]

What an interesting collection of views on the nature of good and evil we have on this page.

Shane Heard says that people are fundamentally good, though flawed, and that there is a bad minority - thereby saying that there is objectively good and evil. Furthermore, nothing matters, for we are animal formed from dust, yet he values human love (and therefore human good) highly, because every flawed human creates evil as a result of their condition, which (as animals) consists of a striving for power through violent competition. Love rejects this striving, which is of great value because it is good for others rather than ourselves.

Procrastinator35 sees a fundamental battle between good and evil taking place, though not really a spiritual one so much as a temporal one. The forces of evil currently reign, with no good 'philosopher kings' to rule over the apathetic people. Selfishness is the great problem, which is a similar conclusion to Shane's and likewise Proc says that evil is a human construct, but rather than belonging to all equally, it belongs primarily in the hands of the corrupters, who seek to influence those in power for their own gain, and to the loss of humanity, who willfully go along with their evil out of apathy for changing their lifestyles, denuding their consciences just as the corrupters do.

GG.exe proposes that good and evil, far from being a scientific inevitability which we have come to explain in such terms, is actually a spiritual reality which is reflected in our world. Humans have been created with the capacity for both, which means that there must be a creator who has placed both good and evil within us (and the understanding of it) for a purpose. That purpose, he says, is to test us in order that we might become the best possible people - if we succeed.

Interestingly, all three have touched on different realities that Christians agree with. Shane and Proc recognise that selfishness is the fundamental flaw on humanity. I say likewise, because the basic definition of 'sin' is selfishness. Shane also states that love is the only thing worthwhile, which I agree with, because God demonstrated the ultimate love for us through Jesus. Proc recognises that the rule of the average person will never work out, which I agree with, because the only rightful ruler is all-loving, all-just, almighty God, and that rule will be fulfilled in total when Jesus returns to rule over the new creation, in which everything will be made perfect. GG recognises that there is a real, spiritual reality in this world, involving a creator, which I agree with, because that is the truth of creation as God has revealed to us by his word.

However, all come to different conclusions based on what they presuppose to be the case. Shane presupposes that we are animals and that there is no spiritual reality, so love is just an extraordinary thing because there is no logical reason to do so on an individual level, even though there is every reason to do so collectively - but ultimately, all of it is futile. Proc believes that there are actually potentially people who would be great rulers over us other than God (who he likewise rejects, though only in part, instead claiming that our consciences direct us to call upon something we give the name God, for we know not where our consciences come from), and that if only we had them over us to enact justice properly for the sake of all equally, the world would become right. GG presupposes that we are the most important part of the universe, thereby believing that the spirit we call God/Jesus/whatever that created us gave us both good and evil from the start, thus rendering God the author of evil, and that God does so in order that we might achieve greatness by ourselves by rising to the challenges presented to us.

There are all dead end paths - though Shane knows this already, and just accepts it. Procrastinator fights on, hoping that good rule will come in his lifetime - but he too will die, and what then will be the purpose of having good rule at all? Furthermore, if humanity is so easily corruptible, why should we have any expectation of another philosopher king? And GG's path, well, if the whole point of the entire spiritual realm is to sharpen humanity for our extraordinarily short lives on this Earth and nothing more, what higher purpose could that possibly serve for a creator God, surrounded by a entire spiritual realm? For God's whole purpose to essentially be reduced to giving us clues as to what we are truly meant to be is basically to reduce God to that of a butler, going around seeking to prop us up and beyond himself.

As Tennyson said..” love is the only gold”

Which is why Tennyson thought so highly of the Biblical Jesus.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

Ever heard of Satan?

I grew up being forced to go to church every Sunday morning and evening for my entire childhood. Plus youth group and other associated drip feeding of propaganda and indoctrination. The way my brother and I were treated by certain people within the church, supposedly God-loving people was abhorrent.

I have absolutely no reservation in saying that it is all bullshit and frankly care little about offending the perpetually righteous with that view.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

The problem with the religious is that there is never any onus on them to prove anything. We have to rely on their alleged first hand accounts of encounters with whatever higher power they worship.

Frankly, they should all be committed to asylums.

Religion is a social control device. Nothing more.

 

[Exe Gesis]

The problem with the religious is that there is never any onus on them to prove anything. We have to rely on their alleged first hand accounts of encounters with whatever higher power they worship.

Frankly, they should all be committed to asylums.

Religion is a social control device. Nothing more.

atheism is also a social control device if you want to look at everything so black and white.

reroof

Health - The Value of Jesus/God in Your Life

I have unwavering faith in the goodness and compassion of humanity. The vast majority of humans on this rock are good people..and all of us have flaws in some form. It’s the bad minority that make it all feel like the world is ####ed. It’s just a chosen mindset of how you look at things.

www.bigfooty.com

 

[Exe Gesis]

post 306

 

[Shane Heard]

What an interesting collection of views on the nature of good and evil we have on this page.

Shane Heard says that people are fundamentally good, though flawed, and that there is a bad minority - thereby saying that there is objectively good and evil. Furthermore, nothing matters, for we are animal formed from dust, yet he values human love (and therefore human good) highly, because every flawed human creates evil as a result of their condition, which (as animals) consists of a striving for power through violent competition. Love rejects this striving, which is of great value because it is good for others rather than ourselves.

Procrastinator35 sees a fundamental battle between good and evil taking place, though not really a spiritual one so much as a temporal one. The forces of evil currently reign, with no good 'philosopher kings' to rule over the apathetic people. Selfishness is the great problem, which is a similar conclusion to Shane's and likewise Proc says that evil is a human construct, but rather than belonging to all equally, it belongs primarily in the hands of the corrupters, who seek to influence those in power for their own gain, and to the loss of humanity, who willfully go along with their evil out of apathy for changing their lifestyles, denuding their consciences just as the corrupters do.

GG.exe proposes that good and evil, far from being a scientific inevitability which we have come to explain in such terms, is actually a spiritual reality which is reflected in our world. Humans have been created with the capacity for both, which means that there must be a creator who has placed both good and evil within us (and the understanding of it) for a purpose. That purpose, he says, is to test us in order that we might become the best possible people - if we succeed.

Interestingly, all three have touched on different realities that Christians agree with. Shane and Proc recognise that selfishness is the fundamental flaw on humanity. I say likewise, because the basic definition of 'sin' is selfishness. Shane also states that love is the only thing worthwhile, which I agree with, because God demonstrated the ultimate love for us through Jesus. Proc recognises that the rule of the average person will never work out, which I agree with, because the only rightful ruler is all-loving, all-just, almighty God, and that rule will be fulfilled in total when Jesus returns to rule over the new creation, in which everything will be made perfect. GG recognises that there is a real, spiritual reality in this world, involving a creator, which I agree with, because that is the truth of creation as God has revealed to us by his word.

However, all come to different conclusions based on what they presuppose to be the case. Shane presupposes that we are animals and that there is no spiritual reality, so love is just an extraordinary thing because there is no logical reason to do so on an individual level, even though there is every reason to do so collectively - but ultimately, all of it is futile. Proc believes that there are actually potentially people who would be great rulers over us other than God (who he likewise rejects, though only in part, instead claiming that our consciences direct us to call upon something we give the name God, for we know not where our consciences come from), and that if only we had them over us to enact justice properly for the sake of all equally, the world would become right. GG presupposes that we are the most important part of the universe, thereby believing that the spirit we call God/Jesus/whatever that created us gave us both good and evil from the start, thus rendering God the author of evil, and that God does so in order that we might achieve greatness by ourselves by rising to the challenges presented to us.

There are all dead end paths - though Shane knows this already, and just accepts it. Procrastinator fights on, hoping that good rule will come in his lifetime - but he too will die, and what then will be the purpose of having good rule at all? Furthermore, if humanity is so easily corruptible, why should we have any expectation of another philosopher king? And GG's path, well, if the whole point of the entire spiritual realm is to sharpen humanity for our extraordinarily short lives on this Earth and nothing more, what higher purpose could that possibly serve for a creator God, surrounded by a entire spiritual realm? For God's whole purpose to essentially be reduced to giving us clues as to what we are truly meant to be is basically to reduce God to that of a butler, going around seeking to prop us up and beyond himself.



Which is why Tennyson thought so highly of the Biblical Jesus.

Great post

I’ll never really dismiss the idea of a higher power such as God. But you could say I’m the ultimate agnostic and until I see something with my very own eyes Ill be uninterested in religion.

I do however believe there are spirits of the dead around us. The evidence is pretty solid and can’t be ignored.

Basically though, I go about life not really pondering all this stuff to heavily.
I’m more interested in human connection and seeing the good in people and just ignore negative minded humans who blame everything and everyone for their problems.

Reading stuff from Dale Carnegie and Og Mandino in my 20s really helped me remove the blame mindset and eliminate habits of complaining and negativity.

If it has to be, it’s up to me...is my mantra.