Autopsy Positives and Negatives vs Hawthorn

[Dale Doback]

Clearance numbers weren't our problem tonight, it was our execution. Destroyed on the turnover and rebound. Nic would definitely make us cleaner, though.

The centre clearances are a big problem. As a mid how do you set up around Hickey? He rarely gets a clear hit forward to either 3 or 9 o'clock. Yeo and Shuey can't break forward from a Hickey hitout knowing 2 out of 4 are gonna hit that spot. Nic can give them the chance to set up a structure

 

[Swarhily]

First game I’ve seen live all year

 

[squashface]

Fold the club. Go Brisbane

 

[greatwhiteshark]

I actually thought our best patches were driven a fair bit by Hickey. That run of goals late in the first, and the start of the third quarter, were all started by the typical Hickey follow-up the tap or take it out of the ruck clearances.

Didn’t do enough for long enough, but when he did good things we got rewarded. Frustrating though that he would then just be non existent outside of 10 minutes of purple patch. Not much point being great for 10 minutes and irrelevant for 70.

You are actually defining a great number of players in our team.

 

[kaiserchief13]

Positives? There are none.


The team just butchered not just top two, but top four as well.

With the exception of a miracle, this season is all but over now.


It is now verging on becoming a completely wasted year.

• Hoping that Brisbane can defeat Richmond at the MCG for the first time since 1988.
• Hoping that Naitanui won't just somehow return, but be able to play four weeks in a row if the above result doesn't go our way.

Furthermore, this team has already proven twice this season that coming off travel with a six day break is beyond it. The prospect of three consecutive weeks of travel, in addition to potentially multiple six day breaks is a feat that is near impossible to achieve based on what has been demonstrated this year.


The same issues that have continuously haunted this season arose once again tonight.

The team won the clearances (45-30), yet moved the ball into the attacking fifty less times (53-58).

The contested possessions were once again lost by a double figure margin (133-147), the ninth time that is has occurred this year.


Think about those three sets of figures for a moment. Winning clearances comprehensively, yet not getting the ball forward and losing contested possessions.

What does that suggest? That the opposition is clearly stacking numbers behind the ball and that you are doing nothing to address it.


All season long, opposition numbers taking positions behind the ball and spreading on the counter have caused problems.

Take a look at the intercept figures; 59-75 to the Hawks.

• By three-quarter time 8 of their 11 goals originated from intercepts.
• Hawthorn scored as many points from defensive 50 chains as what the Eagles were able to manage in total over the last three quarters.

It's the same issue all over again. Refusing to make the spares accountable and leave the defence in no man's land when the slingshot occurs.


If anyone disagrees, read through the following once again and tell me how it does not describe what occurred tonight.

The Case for Plan B and how it can be done


It is not like this is some tactical masterstroke plucked just for this game. The previous two weeks against the Giants and Suns, Hawthorn had outscored each by more than 50 points from intercepts. There should have been no surprises that the Hawks were going to play a flood and counter game.

Yet in both setup and execution, West Coast played perfectly into Hawthorn's plan.

As a consequence, tonight became the third week in succession where Hawthorn outscored their opponents by more than 50 points from intercepts.


And that is how a premiership defence ends.

And that is how poor a coach WC has....no doubt he thought we have better players we will win....nekminit...just disgraceful really

 

[kaiserchief13]

The centre clearances are a big problem. As a mid how do you set up around Hickey? He rarely gets a clear hit forward to either 3 or 9 o'clock. Yeo and Shuey can't break forward from a Hickey hitout knowing 2 out of 4 are gonna hit that spot. Nic can give them the chance to set up a structure

What do other teams do? Surely their best mids don't need silver service to do well

 

[frenchconnection]

The team's fate was in their hands tonight, and they dropped it. All they had to do was get a win. Any win. And that was a bridge too far.

Simmo wasn't too confident even before the game making comments like "I'll just he happy with a win - even by 1 point" didn't sound too confident from where I was sitting. Perhaps it rubbed off onto the players?

 

[Dylan82]

The centre clearances are a big problem. As a mid how do you set up around Hickey? He rarely gets a clear hit forward to either 3 or 9 o'clock. Yeo and Shuey can't break forward from a Hickey hitout knowing 2 out of 4 are gonna hit that spot. Nic can give them the chance to set up a structure

Clearances are not the problem.

The team won total clearances 45-30 and outscored Hawthorn 4 goals to zero from centre clearances.

It is everything after the clearance that was a problem tonight.

 

[Jiggyman]

The centre clearances are a big problem. As a mid how do you set up around Hickey? He rarely gets a clear hit forward to either 3 or 9 o'clock. Yeo and Shuey can't break forward from a Hickey hitout knowing 2 out of 4 are gonna hit that spot. Nic can give them the chance to set up a structure

It wasn't our main issue tonight. Our main issue was the Hawks killing us on intercepts, rebounds and turnovers as a result of poor ball use and lack of pressure. We can't just bank on Nic making up the difference, though as stated he would make us more effective and efficient.

 

[kaiserchief13]

2 weeks and our entire season has fallen apart

Comes down to the coaches really. Clearly can't motivate the players. Which one will get the axe for this game?

 

[Brunswick Trap King]

I noticed tonight that Darling would refuse to go for ground balls and would sorta back out of ground ball contests to wait for someone to give it to him even if it meant we were outnumbered. Was the corkie still hampering him and affecting his ability to get low?

 

[new breed]

Probably be a chance to play Hawks or Essendon next game it's a positive to just knock one of these campaigner teams out ...it would be so good !!

 

[Dale Doback]

Comes down to the coaches really. Clearly can't motivate the players. Which one will get the axe for this game?

Hey Simpson pulled a Woosha and threw McGovern forward late....

 

[JackDoff]

If we know how to beat Hawthorn now, isn't that more important than winning/losing?

Depends on the story. Or something.

You are one depressing dude. A typical "I told you so" campaigner.

 

[Gaffy Duck]

Hey Simpson pulled a Woosha and threw McGovern forward late....

Why did this happen? No wonder they got so many late goals

 

[kaiserchief13]

Hey Simpson pulled a Woosha and threw McGovern forward late....

Yeah cool don't worry about the goals kicked against Barrass McGovern etc. Keep letting them go for intercepts

 

[Rowan18]

That was absolutely pathetic. Our ball use was so slow and predictable out of defense. We just kept kicking long down the line to a contest, praying for a contested mark. Hawks knew this so just had big bodies crash the pack and smalls to pickup the crumbs. Meanwhile our mids and HFF had moved forward assuming we'd win the contest, so we got killed on the counter.

At the start of the 4th I figured the coaches would at least change up and go for, instructing quick play on through the middle. Instead I saw the stupidest move of the day, Gov forward and Allen back. All I could figure was that they were trying to double down and figured Gov might help mark it when we kick long down the line. Instead, poor Allen got monstered in defense and Gov didn't get near it. Then when the game was gone, they finally switched him back.

Season is over if we don't fluke our way to top 4 from a Brisbane win. Finish 5th and we're making up numbers, may win week 1 (may very well not win) and then get smashed wk 2. What an utter waste of a season.

 

[Jiggyman]

Season is over if we don't fluke our way to top 4 from a Brisbane win. Finish 5th and we're making up numbers, may win week 1 (may very well not win) and then get smashed wk 2. What an utter waste of a season.

I wouldn't strictly say that it's over. Imo the Collingwood game was a bigger punch in the gut, decided I might as well try and enjoy the roller coaster after that.

 

[Ok Boomer]

I don't know if this is on the coaches or the players but we got beaten by what we should have known.

Hawthorns defensive structure. Took us 3 quarters to do something about Ben McEvoy dropping back as the loose big man for the high balls.

I don't know if it was because he was sore from last week but Darling played like 2016/17 Darling, no vigor or fight whatsoever.

 

[Ok Boomer]

That was absolutely pathetic. Our ball use was so slow and predictable out of defense. We just kept kicking long down the line to a contest, praying for a contested mark. Hawks knew this so just had big bodies crash the pack and smalls to pickup the crumbs. Meanwhile our mids and HFF had moved forward assuming we'd win the contest, so we got killed on the counter.

At the start of the 4th I figured the coaches would at least change up and go for, instructing quick play on through the middle. Instead I saw the stupidest move of the day, Gov forward and Allen back. All I could figure was that they were trying to double down and figured Gov might help mark it when we kick long down the line. Instead, poor Allen got monstered in defense and Gov didn't get near it. Then when the game was gone, they finally switched him back.

Season is over if we don't fluke our way to top 4 from a Brisbane win. Finish 5th and we're making up numbers, may win week 1 (may very well not win) and then get smashed wk 2. What an utter waste of a season.

I think it was an attempt to make their loose defender accountable, it didn't work because our mids got smashed early in the quarter.

 

[Matera92]

Positive - I didn't have to subject myself to this mess due to working.
Negative. - only have England 2 down on the cricket.

 

[Dale Doback]

Why did this happen? No wonder they got so many late goals

It was

Yeah cool don't worry about the goals kicked against Barrass McGovern etc. Keep letting them go for intercepts

He should throw Gov forward more often. Best mark in the league. If he's having no real impact back throw him to CHF. We'd need Schofield or Allen to roll onto his opponent but it would upset match ups for the opposition

 

[BrotherDodge]

Need to be realistic here - Nic Nat is not Jesus Christ!

True. Jesus probably would've gone easier on Karl Amon

 

[Bramax]

It is funny how pp think every time your team loses its because you played bad. incorrect. sometimes you just gotta take your hat off to the opposition team ( including the coach) who just outplayed you. ffs dogs won a flag from 8th ppl. have some faith.

Hawks played about as well as they could and Eagles had an off night. It happens. Last week on the MCG, you took Richmond apart in the first quarter. That half hour of footy was as good as there’s been this year. Without sounding biased, some patches of footy the Pies played earlier in the season and your first quarter last week, is the best of any teams.
I’m glad you’re keeping the faith. The Eagles are a formidable team. Nic Nat will have an impact too. Your mids are transformed when he plays, giving first use of the footy.
If any team can win the flag from outside the 4, it’s West Coast. And who knows, the Lions may do you a favour tomorrow. Good luck for the finals mate.

 

[twinkletoes#17]

I noticed tonight that Darling would refuse to go for ground balls and would sorta back out of ground ball contests to wait for someone to give it to him even if it meant we were outnumbered. Was the corkie still hampering him and affecting his ability to get low?

I would say so given I sit 8 rows back and he had a huge visible bruise on the back of his knee/lower hammy area on his right leg - that was the size of a small country...

I tried and failed to get a decent pic as it was mainly on the inside of his leg but you can see some of it in this pic. Looked darker than this at the game.