Expansion Joondalup Falcons in the AFL?

[Tranquilli37]

Would be great to see TAS and NT, but definitely not enough player depth and quality to get 20 teams. Eventually a couple of teams in Vic may go bye bye...
Out of curiosity, how many sports/ leagues around the world dont have a team based in their country's capital?

 

[Upgrayedd]

How many people would actually ditch their current teams to support a third WA team?

Team number 20 should either be Canberra or NT

A few. Considering the wait times for membership, the % of immigration to the northern suburban sprawl it would be perfect over places like NT/Canberra

 

[Billy ray]

The entire premise is wrong. Nothing wrong at all with 19 teams. An odd number of teams is perfect - a weekly bye will increase fixturing flexibility also. Teams coming of bye can play a thursday night game v a team who played the friday night week before.

 

[DirtySandman]

Less is more.

 

[The_Reaper]

The only push for WA3 is to get 20 teams.

Team 20, if it happens should be Canberra.

Bunbury and Busselton might be an option in 20 years


I'd prefer Canberra to get the 20th position if a Vic team doesn't relocate to create Tassie

Bunbury and Busselton might become a candidate for team 40 in the year 2121

 

[Johnny Bananas]

Fremantle is half the club is West Coast and a third team will be half of the Dockers.

So be it. An AFL heartland city of 3 million should have at least three teams. Perth will get to that figure by 2040. By that time even half the Dockers will be a viable team.

It's extremely difficult for a third team to poach fans.

But not impossible, particularly if they market to kids.

 

[The_Reaper]

So be it. An AFL heartland city of 3 million should have at least three teams. Perth will get to that figure by 2040. By that time even half the Dockers will be a viable team.


But not impossible, particularly if they market to kids.

I'm nearly 30 years old and I can't not recall a team when Fremantle was not a viable team.
They are extremely stable off field, with minimal support from the AFL, despite a quarter of a decade of mediocrity.

The idea that there needs to be a huge investment and marketing campaign just for the possibility of creating a viable team is completely at odds with the premise that WA3 is the logical choice because it will instantly be able to support itself.

 

[The_Reaper]

Agree, unfortunately the AFL don’t like traditional clubs even though 12 of the now 18 clubs are traditiona clubs.
I honestly don’t think a third franchise will work here, it will have to be a traditional club.

Its always West Perth that gets named but I'd argue that Swan Districts would be the most viable choice especially when looking at a timeframe of a few decades into the future.

It's just that they wear black and white stripes and are called the Swans

 

[demondavey]

Just put a team in Tasmania and be done with it. Gold Coast are shot.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

Its always West Perth that gets named but I'd argue that Swan Districts would be the most viable choice especially when looking at a timeframe of a few decades into the future.

It's just that they wear black and white stripes and are called the Swans

Swan districts are a tiny club compared to West Perth. Why would Swan even be mentioned? Who is mentioning swans ever?

 

[Scotland]

No WAFL club is joining the AFL, it's not 1980. We're also not putting a team in the SW. There are more people in Hobart than there are in the entire SW region.

WC and Freo aren't truly geographical. Any third WA team would just play out of Optus Stadium and whatever their branding would be cannibalising WC and Freo to some degree. If you live in the East or North or South or wherever and already go for WC/Freo, why would you switch?

 

[The_Reaper]

No WAFL club is joining the AFL, it's not 1980. We're also not putting a team in the SW. There are more people in Hobart than there are in the entire SW region.

WC and Freo aren't truly geographical. Any third WA team would just play out of Optus Stadium and whatever their branding would be cannibalising WC and Freo to some degree. If you live in the East or North or South or wherever and already go for WC/Freo, why would you switch?

I'd be interested in what percentage of Freo supporters either live or lived south of the river and west of the highway.
There are plenty of West Coast supporters south of the river but Fremantle definitely have a geographical base.

 

[The_Reaper]

Swan districts are a tiny club compared to West Perth. Why would Swan even be mentioned? Who is mentioning swans ever?

In 2021 no WAFL club is remotely near big enough to get promoted to the AFL.
Its pity because West Perth is a great football club and I love the idea of one of the WA football's foundation clubs making it to the AFL.

If a national 20 team football league had been created in the 1980s out of scratch, West Perth would deserved inclusion and would have grown to the extent that they would be a self sufficient club at national level.

If the AFL wants 20 teams in the near future then WA3 is one of only two viable candidates. In this case Joondalup is the best candidate to be WA3. However it makes no sense whatsoever for WA3 to be West Perth.

1. No WAFL team has the finances, the facilities or the organisational structure to take the step up to the AFL. Any successful will be reliant on a combination of government (state and local), AFL, WAFC and private support.

2. In the time frame we are talking, anyone old enough to remember following the WAFL pre Eagles will be in their 50s or older and have supported an AFL team for the last 40 years. And people born after the Eagles were founded are unlikely to jump ship.
In terms of AFL support the West Perth name will only bring over a couple of thousand people max.

3. The city of Joondalup is almost certain to make its support conditional on WA3 having the Joondalup name. This is understandably non-negotiable for West Perth supporters. So you'd have the ridiculously situation of a team called West Perth, training in Joondalup and playing home games in Burswood.
Considering that the only reason West Perth is even considered as a candidate to be WA3 is that you are based in Joondalup it would just make more sense for the AFL to create the Joondalup Football Club from scratch. Maybe chuck on a St George's cross and call them the Dragons for all the poms.

In regard to Swans, well maybe 30-40 years down the track the AFL might be looking at WA4 in which case Mandurah, the City of Swan and a southern eastern team based around Armadale/Gosnells/Kalamnda would be the main candidates.

Then again, neither Collingwood or Sydney would allow Swan Districts to join the AFL in any form still recognisable as Swan Districts so they are probably not a candidate either.

So barring the event of Perth relocating to Armadale and then getting elevated to the AFL, the only WAFL team that might make the step up to AFL level are the Freo reserves.

 

[kane249]

What's West Perths debt situation?

Weren't they almost bankrupt a few years ago?

Not sure they would be the best club to push up. Someone like Subiaco would be better as they seem a lot more financially stable.

 

[Righteo]

Yet another WA3 thread created by someone not from WA filled with posts by other people not from WA.

Another team will simply cannibalise existing support; especially for Freo. And they'd get 15k at absolute best to their games all the while depending on AFL handouts. That's the long and short of it. The market is tapped out; in Perth anyway. Maaaybe the SW could be an option with a high-speed integrated rail network stimulating growth. In like 50 years. Maybe.

The only two places that make sense for further expansion are Canberra and Tassie, and the talent pool will be spread wafer thin to accomodate them.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

The idea that there needs to be a huge investment and marketing campaign just for the possibility of creating a viable team is completely at odds with the premise that WA3 is the logical choice because it will instantly be able to support itself.

You just made that "premise" up. Who said it will instantly be able to support itself? Certainly not me. The entire point of this team is for 20 years time. Leave things as they are and West Coast will move from being one of several rich clubs of the league to being the only true Goliath of the league. You may want that to happen, but I don't, because I don't want any team to be overly financially dominant. A third team allows more people in Perth into games while being a check on the power of West Coast.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

Another team will simply cannibalise existing support; especially for Freo.

Good.

 

[Goosecat]

I'm nearly 30 years old and I can't not recall a team when Fremantle was not a viable team.
They are extremely stable off field, with minimal support from the AFL, despite a quarter of a decade of mediocrity.

The idea that there needs to be a huge investment and marketing campaign just for the possibility of creating a viable team is completely at odds with the premise that WA3 is the logical choice because it will instantly be able to support itself.

2002

The Dockers had just come off a season in which they lost the opening 17 matches, collecting the 2001 wooden spoon with just two wins.

Worse still, the club had accumulated debts of $8 million and its membership and crowd figures were poor. A confidential report written by AFL football operations manager Andrew Demetriou described the Dockers' board as "dysfunctional" and its chairman Ross McLean as "tired and distracted".

Entering 2002 the club had new faces in every leadership role: Chris Connolly was appointed coach; dual Kangaroos premiership player Peter Bell returned as captain; businessman Rick Hart took on the presidency; and Cameron Schwab was appointed chief execuitve officer.

 

[MrBronson]

Yes! So I can stop supporting that absolute trash bag team I support!

 

[StevenwellerHFC]

17, 18, 19 already to many teams, so who gives a s**t. Make it 24 teams. After that we can make teams have less players. Let's make this game as bad as possible.

 

[pz5151]

Its always West Perth that gets named but I'd argue that Swan Districts would be the most viable choice especially when looking at a timeframe of a few decades into the future.

It's just that they wear black and white stripes and are called the Swans

Don't worry, they can just sign an agreement to not use the stripes or call themselves the Swans which they can disregard later.

 

[RedV3x]

but definitely not enough player depth and quality to get 20 teams.

People keep repeating this statement without thinking.
People keep repeating this statement because they link the entertainment value of the game with the quality of the players.
The entertainment value of AFL is linked crucially with the AFL coaching strategies.

If we go back to the WAFL in pre-AFL days the games were highly attractive and did draw relatively large crowds.
This was because kicking was more varied, champions stood out and defensive strategies amounted to man-o-man.
Today we have champions and learned champions all playing in tight defensive patterns.
Only the most adventurous teams run the ball down the centre corridor.

If you want more attractive football then dilute the talent and spread it evenly around.

 

[RedV3x]

Its always West Perth that gets named but I'd argue that Swan Districts would be the most viable choice especially when looking at a timeframe of a few decades into the future.

No WAFL club has near the following or the financial security to push for AFL inclusion on it's own.
West Perth is broke and is the heart of WCE support. Subiaco has no followers.

The focus is alway on the west coast from Joondalup down to Bunbury.
The forgotten entity is the east with Swans in the N.E. and Armadale in the S.E.
Any talk of a 3rd perth team has to centre on the east of Perth.

 

[BarbieITFC]

I don't think it would happen for a bunch of reasons, not least the weather, but I love the idea of a Northern Australia team that represents NT and FNQ, splitting their home games between Darwin and Cairns, with perhaps the odd game in Alice Springs.

100% this. Eagles and Freo fans are rusted on now - no way a new club gets more than 10-15k members in 10 years.

A team split across Darwin and Cairns would cater for the last untapped market and has to be as viable as a Tassie club. Then we have a true national comp.

 

[300Weatherby]

It will be either Hawthorn or North who relocates to Tassie and then plays 4/5 home games in Melbourne