Banter Who will be Better in 2025, Collingwood or Carlton? Part 4

[Jeremias]

More then 65% agree with me.

Lol, what?

The poll question is not asking whether pick 3 will have an immediate impact.

Comprehension failure, or simply being obtuse for the sake of it?

Go cry in the corner and don’t spoil the thread by getting your back up at peoples opinions.

I'm not 'getting my back up' about anything. You are free to hold any opinion you want.

I'm simply asking you to expand on something. And you're clearly not able to do it, and that's OK too. Everyone has their limits.

If you want to continue on thinking that Daicos and Reid are the only two players in recent seasons to have had an immediate impact at AFL level, and that is what you've said, then all power to you.

You're horribly wrong, but being right isn't for everyone I guess. Especially those not willing or able to look at things objectively.

 

[beerbandit]

Lol, what?

The poll question is not asking whether pick 3 will have an immediate impact.

Comprehension failure, or simply being obtuse for the sake of it?



I'm not 'getting my back up' about anything. You are free to hold any opinion you want.

I'm simply asking you to expand on something. And you're clearly not able to do it, and that's OK too. Everyone has their limits.

If you want to continue on thinking that Daicos and Sheezel are the only two players in recent seasons to have had an immediate impact at AFL level, and that is what you've said, then all power to you.

You're horribly wrong, but being right isn't for everyone I guess. Especially those not willing or able to look at things objectively.

If you really want to know why I think pick 3 doesn’t make you better next year then fine I’ll give you some points.

To explain why picking a player at pick 3 in the AFL draft may not immediately make a team better the following year, I’ll break it down into a few key points for you.


1 - Development Time for Young Players
Most players selected early in the draft, especially in positions like pick 3, are still in the early stages of their careers. While they have potential, they usually need significant development in terms of skills, fitness, and game awareness before they can make a major impact at the senior level. This means that while the player might show flashes of brilliance, it’s unlikely they’ll be consistently contributing at the level needed to transform the team in just one year.

2 - The Pace of AFL
The AFL is a fast-paced, physically demanding competition, and it can take time for young players to adjust to the speed and intensity of the senior game. Even top draft picks often experience a "settling-in" period, where they may struggle with the rigors of the league or need time to fully adapt to the team's playing style.

3 - Team Needs vs. Individual Talent

While a player at pick 3 may be highly talented, their individual contribution may not be enough to immediately fix a team's structural or tactical issues. AFL teams often have broader needs that go beyond a single player, such as improving team chemistry, addressing weaknesses in key positions, or developing a better game plan. A single draft pick, no matter how good, can't address all of these factors.

4 - The Impact of Experience
Teams with mature players, veterans, or strong leadership structures tend to be more successful in the short term. If a team is rebuilding and relies heavily on younger players or a new draft pick, their overall improvement might take longer as these younger players gain experience and grow into their roles.

5 - Uncertainty of Young Talent
Draft picks are not guaranteed successes. Even high picks like number 3 overall don't always pan out as expected. Injuries, form slumps, or issues adapting to AFL can mean a top draft pick doesn't make the expected impact in their first year, or even in their second.

In short, while a top 3 pick can be an exciting prospect, the immediate improvement of the team isn’t guaranteed. Player development, adjustment to the AFL, and overall team dynamics are all factors that can limit the immediate impact of any single draft selection.

Hope this is enough for you Jeremias

Unless I’ve missed something from all the talent scout and media reporting on it, I don’t think this year has the next Leigh Matthews, Gary Ablett or Nick Daicos, but hey I’m happy to be wrong.

 

[Jeremias]

Hope this is enough for you Jeremias

Thank you. I appreciate you finally taking the time to answer the que......what's that? It wasn't you?


Oh well, it's better than nothing, I guess.

Can we also dispel the notion that only Harley Reid and Nick Daicos have been the only ones to have an impact at AFL level straight away, or is that too much to ask?

 

[beerbandit]

Thank you. I appreciate you finally taking the time to answer the que......what's that? It wasn't you?
View attachment 2158686

Oh well, it's better than nothing, I guess.

Can we also dispel the notion that only Harley Reid and Nick Daicos have been the only ones to have an impact at AFL level straight away, or is that too much to ask?

What do you think I didn’t write there?

WTF is wrong with you ?

 

[Fadge]

Can we also dispel the notion that only Harley Reid and Nick Daicos have been the only ones to have an impact at AFL level straight away, or is that too much to ask?

How many players in each draft have a material impact at AFL level in their first season?

 

[Jeremias]

What do you think I didn’t write there?

WTF is wrong with you ?

OK, it was too much to ask.

Thank you for your time.

And for the record, I too enjoy ChatGPT. But it's easy to detect - there are sites that do this specifically!

 

[Fadge]

Thank you. I appreciate you finally taking the time to answer the que......what's that? It wasn't you?
View attachment 2158686

Oh well, it's better than nothing, I guess.

Are you suggesting it was AI generated, and it didn't come back with 'there is a high probability that the 4th best player in the draft will have a material impact in his first season'?

 

[Fadge]

I hope the blues supporters were all over Cattoggio in race 8 at Flemington today. Its about the best thing thats happened to them in 25 years

Even better if they had the Quinella or exacta with Bosustow...

 

[Fadge]

Take your anti Carlton behaviour where the sun don't shine, amigo.

I'm 'Anti Carlton' because I didn't see Cripps as having one of the all time greatest individual seasons in the history of the game...

 

[Scritchyscroony]

I'm 'Anti Carlton' because I didn't see Cripps as having one of the all time greatest individual seasons in the history of the game...

"Anti-Carlton" sounds like a preventative medicine they should inject all the 5 year old kids with.
It could alleviate a lot of suffering.

 

[Worm4]

Collingwood are a very well coached side that does not rely on individuals to carry the team. Collingwood won three of their last four games played without Nick Daicos, including a final.

What year was that ?

 

[Fadge]

What year was that ?

His Fadgelow year, and Collingwood's premiership year - 2023.

 

[Worm4]

Take pick 3 out, you’ve gone backwards with your trading.

Clubs flying past.

You can't take out pick 3. It exists and won't be taken away.
removing marchbank, Martin and Cunningham I would have thought was a good move - agree or not ?
Tell me how Owies and Kennedy were going to improve as players also coz I'd like to really know the secret to holding onto those player types and not regenerating in any way

 

[Fadge]

Tell me how Owies and Kennedy were going to improve as players also coz I'd like to really know the secret to holding onto those player types and not regenerating in any way

Why not get rid of Cripps and Weitering as well? How are they going to improve as players? (If that's your rationale for trading Kennedy and Owies).

 

[Worm4]

Take pick 3 out, you’ve gone backwards with your trading.

Clubs flying past.

You can't take out pick 3. It exists and won't be taken away.
removing marchbank, Martin and Cunningham I would have thought was a good move - agree or not ?
Tell me how Owies and Kennedy were going to improve as players

 

[Worm4]

His Fadgelow year, and Collingwood's premiership year - 2023.

So not this year, or next year

 

[Worm4]

Why not get rid of Cripps and Weitering as well? How are they going to improve as players? (If that's your rationale for trading Kennedy and Owies).

Both cripps and Weitering improved this season.

 

[Worm4]

I'm 'Anti Carlton' because I didn't see Cripps as having one of the all time greatest individual seasons in the history of the game...

You have Carlton finishing 15th in 2025. An opinion shared by about 2% of the AFL supporting population

 

[Fadge]

So not this year, or next year

Well this thread is no longer about 2024, and my crystal ball doesn't tell me about when Daicos does or doesn't play in 2025, and Collingwood's results in those games.

But you did ask the question about how Collingwood would perform without Daicos, and we have some historical information that gives us an insight into the answer to that question.

 

[Fadge]

You have Carlton finishing 15th in 2025. An opinion shared by about 2% of the AFL supporting population

And between 30% and 40% of the AFL supporting population predicted Carlton to be in the top 4 and contending for the premiership in 2024 - it doesn't mean they got it right...

 

[Fadge]

Both cripps and Weitering improved this season.

As did Owies.

 

[Worm4]

And between 30% and 40% of the AFL supporting population predicted Carlton to be in the top 4 and contending for the premiership in 2024 - it doesn't mean they got it right...

Nor does it mean you are right either

 

[Worm4]

As did Owies.

Owies the easier of the 3 options to replace considering 1 of them is a dual brownlow medalist, the other a current AA. But you seem to like Owies

 

[Fadge]

Owies the easier if the 3 options to replace considering 1 of them is a dual brownlow medalist, the other a current AA. But you seem to like Owies

I don't particularly like Owies, but am aware that you need a list of between 30 and 35 AFL level players to contend for a premiership.

Carlton have just let go a 33 goal a year forward, and their 'best clubman' who finished 10th in their best and fairest.

They're a mid table team whose list has gone backwards this off season, entering a year where their top 5 players are in their absolute prime.

 

[beerbandit]

You can't take out pick 3. It exists and won't be taken away.
removing marchbank, Martin and Cunningham I would have thought was a good move - agree or not ?
Tell me how Owies and Kennedy were going to improve as players

hard to argue with any of this Worm4