2018 All Australian Squad Announced

[00Stinger]

I guess when Oliver is a premiership captain and Brownlow medallist then we can compare, boy.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Both of which arguably he did not deserve

Won the Brownlow only because Watson handed it back 3 years later
Was a premiership captain only because the AFL didn't enforce the correct rules in suspending him for a hit in the PF

 

[peternorth]

At the end of the day, Cotchin is not in the AA team

 

[Grizza]

If Oliver's career mirrors Cotchin's I'll be disappointed. Cotchin is a terrific player, but Oliver is in another league.

Cotchin's one AA is an accurate reflection of his career.

Now, try getting over yourself, kid.

So if Oliver is a Brownlow medalist, premiership captain, AFLCA winner and multiple best and fairest winner, you’ll be disappointed? Righto. Until he surpasses those accolades, he is inferior to Cotchin. Feel free to quote me if he does, I will happily hear you out. Until then, he is nothing but potential. I also wouldn’t want him to go the same way as Hogan, who Melbourne supporters claimed would be as good as Carey after his debut season.

 

[The Falcon Strike]

Jack Riewoldt has won the Coleman and missed selection, so it’s not a guarantee.

They key difference was goals from free kicks:

Brown: 16 / 61
Jack: 4 / 65

Not sure that is a relevant stat

If you are good enough that a player has to infringe upon you to stop you - then that's not a negative for selection.

The reason Brown wouldn't get selected is because he brings goals and not much else.

He doesn't set them up, he doesn't tackle, he's not huge on contested grabs.

So it is goals or bust - Josh Kennedy is a little the same although he is high on defensive pressure as well.

JR, Hawkins and Buddy all bring other skills.

So unless Brown topped goal scoring (his strong suit) he isn't getting selected.

 

[Richo83]

The Brownlow is nice, but I'd value AA selection as more meaningful. Woewodin won a Brownlow and didn't even make AA. That said, his Brownlow is more marketable.

Woewodin was very lucky to win that brownlow, and mainly won it due to playing in a side which managed to win a lot of games but lacked much star power and finished with a record of 14-8 and 118.4%. They weren't a great team. Notably, McLeod, West and Koutoufides made the AA team. Woewodin was just a product of luck.

Brownlows matter more than All-Australians for the following reasons:

1. Brownlows are determined by game by game ratings of players as opposed to making a decision on players at the end where early season form is often forgotten.

2. As we've seen with this team, the selectors have all sorts of requirements and rules which mean certain great players don't get selected because of some team balance nonsense, which doesn't happen with the brownlow medal.

3. It's decided by a bunch of media types who may have experience playing the game, but haven't seen every game every player has played for the season, and thus is ranking players on incomplete data. At least the brownlow medal counts every game.

4. Only one Brownlow is given out each season, but 22 jackets are given out each season.

 

[captain blood 17]

Both of which arguably he did not deserve

Won the Brownlow only because Watson handed it back 3 years later
Was a premiership captain only because the AFL didn't enforce the correct rules in suspending him for a hit in the PF

Okay, so what you are saying is people should be allowed to take performance enhancing drugs. Interesting. So, big Lance Armstrong fan i take it. You like your Russian Olympic teams?
As for the Shiel hit, how was it that Shiel racked up another 10 touches afterwards? What people don't talk about is the second massive clash Shiel had with Astbury which actually stuffed him. I was there, i saw it, and it's on a dvd I could lend you as well.
So, try again. Or try harder and smarter. Whichever floats the boat.

 

[nineteen eighty]

I don't ever see Oliver being captain of the MFC. And nor does it matter. But I can envisage Norm Smith type performances should the team ever make a GF.

The Brownlow gives me no jollies. Shane Woewodin won a Brownlow. That said, Oliver is every chance.

But I'll be shocked if Oliver never earns AA honours again. Like Martin, Oliver will be a regular.

It's no slight on Cotchin. Oliver is just a better footballer. And he's 5 years from his prime.

I'm not sure why you're so sensitive. I guess you're one of those supporters that can't evaluate footy without seeing your club colours first.

You're surely trolling all on this thread now. Cotchin has remodeled his game to play a true leaders, selfless role. Premiership captain, leader of men and best of all, a winner. Oliver is a good footballer who is very good at winning contested ball. Let's revisit a number of years down the track to see how Oliver's career pans out.

 

[captain blood 17]

cotchin run of luck with afl is ridiculous
if the tigers didnt get a dream run, their flag could well have been a non event
jumper punches went un punished

Lol, dream run. What will be your excuse when the demons knock you out next Friday with your holy trinity? And you complain about jumper punches? Really? You ever watch the snipers in Geelong? And you want unpunished? Selwood should be allowed to sue the AFL in years to come for having a scrambled brain as the AFL has allowed his cheat tactics to go unpunished his whole career. Go on, "duck" that one.

 

[Grizza]

Both of which arguably he did not deserve

Won the Brownlow only because Watson handed it back 3 years later
Was a premiership captain only because the AFL didn't enforce the correct rules in suspending him for a hit in the PF

LOL. Yeah Watson handed the Brownlow back for drug cheating. I think that was a fair result.

 

[nineteen eighty]

Woewodin was very lucky to win that brownlow, and mainly won it due to playing in a side which managed to win a lot of games but lacked much star power and finished with a record of 14-8 and 118.4%. They weren't a great team. Notably, McLeod, West and Koutoufides made the AA team. Woewodin was just a product of luck.

Brownlows matter more than All-Australians for the following reasons:

1. Brownlows are determined by game by game ratings of players as opposed to making a decision on players at the end where early season form is often forgotten.

2. As we've seen with this team, the selectors have all sorts of requirements and rules which mean certain great players don't get selected because of some team balance nonsense, which doesn't happen with the brownlow medal.

3. It's decided by a bunch of media types who may have experience playing the game, but haven't seen every game every player has played for the season, and thus is ranking players on incomplete data. At least the brownlow medal counts every game.

4. Only one Brownlow is given out each season, but 22 jackets are given out each season.

Just to clarify, he won it because of a pharmacist. That same supplier that also happened to be supplying one of the assistant coaches at the Bombers earlier this decade. And who has since moved into a head coaching role.

 

[Richo83]

Cotchin won a brownlow after 64 games in his fifth season. Oliver is up to 57 games, I'm sure most people thought Cotchin would become a great of the game around the same age too.

 

[Mahlepi]

LOL. Yeah Watson handed the Brownlow back for drug cheating. I think that was a fair result.

lets be clear, he was not suspended once in a year, when the afl was forced to change the rules because of his behaviour
and supended players for lesser offences

 

[Richo83]

Just to clarify, he won it because of a pharmacist. That same supplier that also happened to be supplying one of the assistant coaches at the Bombers earlier this decade. And who has since moved into a head coaching role.

And if it weren't for Koutoufides and a certain James Hird getting injured in 2000 and missing games he may have never won it in the first place. Most awards have peculiar results which don't make sense, but I don't think it invalidates the award.

 

[Topkent]

Woewodin was very lucky to win that brownlow, and mainly won it due to playing in a side which managed to win a lot of games but lacked much star power and finished with a record of 14-8 and 118.4%. They weren't a great team. Notably, McLeod, West and Koutoufides made the AA team. Woewodin was just a product of luck.

Brownlows matter more than All-Australians for the following reasons:

1. Brownlows are determined by game by game ratings of players as opposed to making a decision on players at the end where early season form is often forgotten.

2. As we've seen with this team, the selectors have all sorts of requirements and rules which mean certain great players don't get selected because of some team balance nonsense, which doesn't happen with the brownlow medal.

3. It's decided by a bunch of media types who may have experience playing the game, but haven't seen every game every player has played for the season, and thus is ranking players on incomplete data. At least the brownlow medal counts every game.

4. Only one Brownlow is given out each season, but 22 jackets are given out each season.

So after saying Woewodin was very lucky you just named 4 reasons why it's a highly valued award he must have thoroughly deserved

 

[00Stinger]

As for the Shiel hit, how was it that Shiel racked up another 10 touches afterwards? What people don't talk about is the second massive clash Shiel had with Astbury which actually stuffed him. I was there, i saw it, and it's on a dvd I could lend you as well.
So, try again. Or try harder and smarter. Whichever floats the boat.

Shiel had 7 touches for the game

Not sure how he managed to rack up a further 10 after the hit. Maybe you can explain to me how you get negative possessions? Maybe your dvd explains that...........

 

[Grizza]

I’m surprised to see Melbourne supporters still overrating their own. Haven’t they learned to be conservative with their opinions?

 

[captain blood 17]

Shiel had 7 touches for the game

Not sure how he managed to rack up a further 10 after the hit. Maybe you can explain to me how you get negative possessions? Maybe your dvd explains that...........

I’m gonna go out on a limb here, maybe it was 7 after the Cotchin contact. I know right. Mind = Blown. And the fact he played the quarter out on top of 2 hits Shiel recieved may have been in the thought process when assessing the incident. I know right, like wow, that’s pretty inciteful stuff right there. Are you still with me brother on that revolutionary stuff.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Cactus_]

cotchin run of luck with afl is ridiculous
if the tigers didnt get a dream run, their flag could well have been a non event
jumper punches went un punished

zzz zzz zzz

You so boring.

 

[Cactus_]

The Brownlow is nice, but I'd value AA selection as more meaningful. Woewodin won a Brownlow and didn't even make AA. That said, his Brownlow is more marketable.

Being the AFLCA player of the year is a higher honour than the Brownlow imo. And Cotchin already has one of those, so he has both, which is an excellent feat.

Life is full of generalities. It's hardly controversial to suggest Oliver should be a better player at 26 than 21. That would be the norm for most players. Why you'd try to argue otherwise is beyond me, but it gives me an introduction into your cognitive abilities.

Captains do matter, but Oliver being captain doesn't. Jack Viney will continue to develop into a great captain, so it's nice to have that base covered.

As for Oliver being a long way from matching Cotchin's career ? Wow, thanks for being so insightful. It's a revelation that a 57 game player hasn't had the time or opportunity to match the feats of a 218 game player. Oliver should be ashamed.

Oliver already has been AFLCA young player of the year. Already finished top 5 in the AFLCA player of the year. Already won a B&F. And he's also made AA in less games than any recent great you can think of except Robert Harvey, who he equaled (both 57 games).

As I said, if Oliver merely matches Cotchin's career I'll be disappointed.

Oliver good young player and may well go one to be great. Especially if he grows up a bit. So far he’s shown himself to be a bit of a prawn of a bloke. Still time for him though. Could do worse than modelling himself on Cotch.

 

[Socrates2]

I'm finding it interesting people saying Franklin is a surprise selection as Captain.He is probably in the top 5 players of all time, and is an absolute leader and game breaker.Also interesting the crap Shane Edward's is copping.He is 2nd in the league to Dangerfield in that elite stats thingo.Both indigenous players too.Probably the same people who hate Adam Goodes because he talks too much.Casual rasicm I reckon.

 

[Hannabal]

So if Oliver is a Brownlow medalist, premiership captain, AFLCA winner and multiple best and fairest winner, you’ll be disappointed? Righto. Until he surpasses those accolades, he is inferior to Cotchin. Feel free to quote me if he does, I will happily hear you out. Until then, he is nothing but potential. I also wouldn’t want him to go the same way as Hogan, who Melbourne supporters claimed would be as good as Carey after his debut season.

Why would I be disappointed if Oliver was a Brownlow medalist, premiership captain, AFLCA winner and multiple best and fairest winner ? Your premise is stupid, disingenuous and not reflective of what I said.

I would be disappointed if he doesn't have a better career than Cotchin. Cotchin is a great player. I expect Oliver to be demonstrably better than a single year AA player such as Cotchin. 2012 was great for Cotchin and it was great for him to finally start playing like a leader in the second half of 2017. He won his Brownlow, AA, and AFLCA player of the year all in 2012. He also had many mediocre years.

And to say Oliver is nothing but potential is ignorant. He's already an AA and B&F winner.

EDIT: I said 2018 and meant 2017.

 

[Hannabal]

Woewodin was very lucky to win that brownlow, and mainly won it due to playing in a side which managed to win a lot of games but lacked much star power and finished with a record of 14-8 and 118.4%. They weren't a great team. Notably, McLeod, West and Koutoufides made the AA team. Woewodin was just a product of luck.

Brownlows matter more than All-Australians for the following reasons:

1. Brownlows are determined by game by game ratings of players as opposed to making a decision on players at the end where early season form is often forgotten.

2. As we've seen with this team, the selectors have all sorts of requirements and rules which mean certain great players don't get selected because of some team balance nonsense, which doesn't happen with the brownlow medal.

3. It's decided by a bunch of media types who may have experience playing the game, but haven't seen every game every player has played for the season, and thus is ranking players on incomplete data. At least the brownlow medal counts every game.

4. Only one Brownlow is given out each season, but 22 jackets are given out each season.

I've never been overly excited by the Brownlow. It's just a personal opinion and I accept others will disagree.

 

[Richo83]

So after saying Woewodin was very lucky you just named 4 reasons why it's a highly valued award he must have thoroughly deserved

It's an award that is subject to quirks, like the fact that a BOG performance in a side without many superstars often counts more than a BOG in a side where there is more guns. My point is that in 2000, there were a number of unique circumstances that lead to an unlikely winner. But in general, it's a fairly good award.

The All-Australian award is subject to even more quirks. Like how there's only really seven or so spots for midfielders, including wingmen and bench players, even though the midfield is more important than ever. Like how the panel doesn't quite know what players really are and often put up fairly arbitrary divisions between outside and insdie midfielders, midfielders and forward flankers and forwards. This is because players often play a number of roles and trying to pick a side with 22 players playing 22 set positions doesn't really make sense given that's not how players play.

 

[Socrates2]

People who think Cotchin and Shane Edward's are overrated don't understand the game.They are both incredibly skilled in heavy traffic and Cotchin is as tough as nails.

 

[Richo83]

I've never been overly excited by the Brownlow. It's just a personal opinion and I accept others will disagree.

Of course it's personal opinion, but they generally pick a deserving winner to win it and it's an award where, unlike the AA honours, players are rated by every game they play, unlike the AA where early season form is often overlooked and panelists are going in without seeing a significant amount of games. It's a flawed process. If it were up to me, I'd give the AA selection to the coaches.