1993 Preliminary Final vs Essendon

[Lurkalot]

Hate to re-open old wounds by bringing up this match, but I need to know whether the umpires included one Darren Goldspink?

I'm having "discussions" with an Essendon mate on how, I believe, Goldspink umpired them into the GF's of 1993 & 2001. He refutes he was one of the ump's in your match.

I can remember the umpires doing a number on you during the Bombers second half comeback & the stats I've found confirm this (32-15 with Wanganeen getting 8!)

Can't find a thing on the net about which umpires officiated so any help is appreciated.

cheers

 

[Riggy1]

Goldspink and Sheehan

this can be proved on pages 34 and 111 of the AFL Record Season Guide 2009 in each clubs' section of evry final ever played

 

[Lurkalot]

Goldspink and Sheehan

this can be proved on pages 34 and 111 of the AFL Record Season Guide 2009 in each clubs' section of evrey final ever played

Thanks mate, you've always got the goods

 

[SA Tricolours]

I made comments about the free inbalance in the 1993 prelim in another thread earlier in the week.

Without watching the game again - I think I may still have on a video - I seem to recall we got about 1 or 2 frees for the whole of the second half (after being 6 goals 6 behinds in front at half time).

 

[Kaiser Powser]

Hate to re-open old wounds by bringing up this match, but I need to know whether the umpires included one Darren Goldspink?

I'm having "discussions" with an Essendon mate on how, I believe, Goldspink umpired them into the GF's of 1993 & 2001. He refutes he was one of the ump's in your match.

I can remember the umpires doing a number on you during the Bombers second half comeback & the stats I've found confirm this (32-15 with Wanganeen getting 8!)

Can't find a thing on the net about which umpires officiated so any help is appreciated.

cheers

After watching a replay of the 2008 grand final, I don't think Hawks fans should be complaining about umpires affecting games. They obviously went into the game with the mind-set to protect the 'underdog' and every 50-50 call went Hawthorn's way. Disgraceful effort, which rely denied Geelong getting any momentum in the 2nd half.

And I think you'd need to watch the 93' prelim, rather than just comment on the number of frees, I was at the game, but I can't exactly recall many of the umpiring decisions. But it's fair to say that Essendon dominated the 2nd half and generally a free kick count goes in favour of the team that is dominating. I'm not saying we may not have had a blessed run, we probably did, I can't recall, but I don't think you can form that opinion just on the numbers.

 

[icrow32]

I made comments about the free inbalance in the 1993 prelim in another thread earlier in the week.

Without watching the game again - I think I may still have on a video - I seem to recall we got about 1 or 2 frees for the whole of the second half (after being 6 goals 6 behinds in front at half time).

Goldspink was definitely umpiring that game, it is in grained into my mind for ever. Some interesting free kick stats from that game are as follows:

-Final free kick count was something like 32-12 in Essendons favour
-Second half free kicks were something line 15-2 in Essendons favour
-Gavin Wanganeen got 8 fre kicks by himself, including 6 in the second hald (more than the entire Crows team)
- Darren Bewick kicked 6 goals with 5 of them coming off free kicks.

And they say umpires don't influence games.

 

[Kaiser Powser]

Goldspink was definitely umpiring that game, it is in grained into my mind for ever. Some interesting free kick stats from that game are as follows:

-Final free kick count was something like 32-12 in Essendons favour
-Second half free kicks were something line 15-2 in Essendons favour
-Gavin Wanganeen got 8 fre kicks by himself, including 6 in the second hald (more than the entire Crows team)
- Darren Bewick kicked 6 goals with 5 of them coming off free kicks.

And they say umpires don't influence games.

Can anyone with a fresh memory of the game recall if there were any stinkers though?

As I said above I don't think the stats themselves can determine whether the umpiring was terrible or not.

The Bewick one seems a worry, but I would query that stat, especially since he only received 4 free kicks.

Wanganeen has always been the master of milking soft free kicks.

 

[jackster83]

Goldspink and Sheehan

this can be proved on pages 34 and 111 of the AFL Record Season Guide 2009 in each clubs' section of evry final ever played

This guy was an all out shocker of an umpire.

I seem to remember him costing us one or two close games in 98 or 99. It was either a game against Freo (when Smart missed in the dying seconds) where Jarman gave away a 150m penalty or that shocker against North Melbourne where Rehn got pinged for holding the ball and they gave Bell the free kick from a much better angle.

 

[Lurkalot]

After watching a replay of the 2008 grand final, I don't think Hawks fans should be complaining about umpires affecting games. They obviously went into the game with the mind-set to protect the 'underdog' and every 50-50 call went Hawthorn's way. Disgraceful effort, which rely denied Geelong getting any momentum in the 2nd half..

Laughable....I have not once heard the umpiring being used as an excuse even by Geelong supporters. Did you lose some money on the Cats champ?


Thanks for the input Crows...it's obvious Goldspink gave the Bombers a leg up into 2 out of their past 3 Grand Final appearances. We would have been thrashed by the Lions of 2001....How would you guys have fared against Carlton?

nb. Goldspink's wife is a mad Bombers fan.

 

[brucetiki]

This guy was an all out shocker of an umpire.

I seem to remember him costing us one or two close games in 98 or 99. It was either a game against Freo (when Smart missed in the dying seconds) where Jarman gave away a 150m penalty

That was Grant Vernon in 1998, who was replaced by Michael Vozzo at the end of the seaon

or that shocker against North Melbourne where Rehn got pinged for holding the ball and they gave Bell the free kick from a much better angle.

That was John Harvey, and the AFL had to stop programming him for North Melbourne games when it was revealled he barracked for North Melbourne.

 

[Vader]

Thanks for the input Crows...it's obvious Goldspink gave the Bombers a leg up into 2 out of their past 3 Grand Final appearances. We would have been thrashed by the Lions of 2001....How would you guys have fared against Carlton?

Seemed pretty obvious at the time, watching that game on TV, that the winner of the PF was going to slaughter Carlton in the GF. I know they beat us the week before, but the PF against Essendon was played at a much higher standard by both sides.

A week earlier we spent the whole game bombing it long to the goal square where their defenders just knocked it through for a behind. So many F50 entries that went begging. A week later, Adelaide & Essendon put on an exhibition. I sincerely doubt the Crows would have made the same mistakes if given a re-match against the Blues.

Mind you, these are just my recollections of games which happened 16 years ago, based on impressions I formed at the time as a 19yo kid.

 

[FandangoDingo]

I suggest you refresh your memory of the actual match before passing judgement on umpires giving Essendon a "leg-up". Adelaide were blown away in the 2nd half. Simple as that. Watch the game again (I have the video and remind myself regularly ) and I'm sure you'll conclude that Essendon was the deserving victor on the day. 11 goals to 2 after half time.

You might be quite surprised at just how quickly that 42 point half-time lead was hauled in.

I had a bet on that match (with a West Coast supporter) and she was giving me an absolute earful at half time. At which point, mainly just to shut her up, I doubled the bet. Sweetest collect ever!

PS. Re: The 2001 Preliminary Final.
Free kicks FOR: Ess = 15 Haw = 23

 

[Ex President]

I bought the game recently from Name-A-Game and watched it.

One thing that was obvious to me was how many of the Crows players disappeared after half time. Players such as Liptak dominated the first half and looked dangerous every time they got the ball, yet hardly got a touch in the 2nd half, or when they did, didn't use it well.

And then I couldn't believe Cornes kept Brown in the forward line instead of Hodges for the majority of the 2nd half, when Modra and Hodges killed us in the first half.

TBH Adelaide should have been up by 10+ goals at half time if not for bad kicking.

 

[Black Flag]

Never forgive the Crows for that loss. Cost us a flag.

 

[Lurkalot]

I suggest you refresh your memory of the actual match before passing judgement on umpires giving Essendon a "leg-up". Adelaide were blown away in the 2nd half. Simple as that. Watch the game again (I have the video and remind myself regularly ) and I'm sure you'll conclude that Essendon was the deserving victor on the day. 11 goals to 2 after half time.

You might be quite surprised at just how quickly that 42 point half-time lead was hauled in.

I had a bet on that match (with a West Coast supporter) and she was giving me an absolute earful at half time. At which point, mainly just to shut her up, I doubled the bet. Sweetest collect ever!

PS. Re: The 2001 Preliminary Final.
Free kicks FOR: Ess = 15 Haw = 23

Saw the 2nd 1/2 of the Crows Prelim on a TV footy marathon a few years later & all I can remember was free after free to the Bombers...whether that was because you were on top, first to the ball, etc I can't remember.

After the 2001 Prelim I've always wanted to join the Goldspink dots b/w the two games hence my op.

Yep we got more frees in 2001 but Goldspink killed us in the 1st quarter....3 of the softest frees in your I50 for 3 goals. I was seated at the end of a Hawthorn bay next to the Essendon bay and a few of your supporters were honestly apologetic at 1/4 time. Later one of the more staggering decisions I've ever seen was Goldspink over-ruling the Goal Umpire to award a Bombers goal when he was watching from the forward flank!! A blatant cheat

 

[johnnypanther]

Never forgive the Crows for that loss. Cost us (Carlton) a flag.

errr no.... we cost us (AFC) a flag

 

[marvin]

or that shocker against North Melbourne where Rehn got pinged for holding the ball and they gave Bell the free kick from a much better angle.

That was John Harvey, and the AFL had to stop programming him for North Melbourne games when it was revealled he barracked for North Melbourne.

In fairness to John Harvey, the only reason Bell had the ball was that Evan Hewitt, who laid the tackle on Rehn, passed it to him.

However, the only reason Bell got the ball was that John Harvey allowed Evan Hewitt to play on from over the mark while John Harvey put a great shepherd on Bell's opponent. He played a ripper last quarter.

 

[smoovy]

We should have beaten Carlton at Waverly too 13.8 to 8.20

You should ask Graham Cornes what he thinks about Bryan Sheehan.

What made the Crows efforts so great that season was the fact they had to overcome the shocking and blatantly biased umpiring we always used to suffer away from home. This was a common theme until we seemed to earn some respect in 1997.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Swings and roundabouts.

1993 prelim vs Essendon.... 1997 semi vs Geelong

We're 1-1 for finals arse rapings.

In fairness to John Harvey, the only reason Bell had the ball was that Evan Hewitt, who laid the tackle on Rehn, passed it to him.

However, the only reason Bell got the ball was that John Harvey allowed Evan Hewitt to play on from over the mark while John Harvey put a great shepherd on Bell's opponent. He played a ripper last quarter.

I remember that game. Harvey paid 6 holding the ball free kicks North Melbourne's way in the last quarter alone. While his kids cheered him on from the stands with their Kangaroos' guernseys on.

 

[smoovy]

Swings and roundabouts.

1993 prelim vs Essendon.... 1997 semi vs Geelong

We're 1-1 for finals arse rapings.

Don't conceed that Geelong game, that is an urban myth based on a single decision!

 

[Kaiser Powser]

Laughable....I have not once heard the umpiring being used as an excuse even by Geelong supporters. Did you lose some money on the Cats champ?


Thanks for the input Crows...it's obvious Goldspink gave the Bombers a leg up into 2 out of their past 3 Grand Final appearances. We would have been thrashed by the Lions of 2001....How would you guys have fared against Carlton?

nb. Goldspink's wife is a mad Bombers fan.

I like they way you have come to this conclusion despite no one with a clear memory of the game actually supporting this theory. Aside from mentioning the numbers, no one has suggested the umpiring was bad.

Keep up the good work Champ.

 

[marvin]

Swings and roundabouts.

1993 prelim vs Essendon.... 1997 semi vs Geelong

We're 1-1 for finals arse rapings.

I'd dispute that. The Colbert non-mark was a travesty (and a Vernon special), but so was the Modra non-mark. And so was the rushed behind that Bickley kicked through that counted as a goal to Burns. It was just a horribly umpired match all round, but it wasn't all one way.

I remember that game. Harvey paid 6 holding the ball free kicks North Melbourne's way in the last quarter alone. While his kids cheered him on from the stands with their Kangaroos' guernseys on.

I've got no problem with 6 holding the ball decisions (a) if they are there and (b) if they are consistent with what happened the rest of the day (and on the rest of the field). The Rehn one was probably there, to be honest, but given the one Glen Archer got away with down the other end a few minutes before, just capped off a very special last quarter by umpire Harvey.

 

[Macca19]

I think I still have the 2nd half of that Prelim at my parents house on a video somewhere. Ill see if I can find it next time im there and see how many frees there were.

 

[NSWCROW]

A JARMAN missing one that most of us coulda kicked with our DICKS didn't help matters.

 

[lincsPJ]

A JARMAN missing one that most of us coulda kicked with our DICKS didn't help matters.

neither did Bicks' half time fart