List Mgmt. 2017 List Management: Contracts, Trading, Drafting, Academy

[Bokonon_]

Bit I dont get, if we wont or cant match offerrs on Josh, and we need cap space to retain Devon, Bam Bam and others. Where's the logic in thinking we can go after Dustin Martin who would cost more than Kelly?
If Josh is gone then I really hope retaining Devon is the next priority.

 

[dlanod]

I don't know that anyone realistically thinks we're an option to get Martin.

 

[captainMyCaptain]

So contract talks have opened with HH but still no movement with MK and it seems Hopper has put talks off to end of the year.
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-07-12/numerous-clubs-circling-out-of-contract-giant-jacob-hopper

 

[Andre the Giant]

I'm also a little taken back at how now he might be leaving he isn't as good as he was

I'm hoping he stays, but mostly I'm just hoping there is a call made fast as we need to start work on all the other (then more important) dominos

No that is completely wrong.

All areas of his eliteness were clearly specified so don't put words in my mouth lads.

I just said he is not a match winner. Dangerfield is a match winner, Martin is a match winner, Ablett is a match winner, Bontempelli is a match winner.

Kelly is a very strong contributor, super consistent and elite in many ways but I have not walked away from many games thinking we won it because of him.

 

[Determinant]

So contract talks have opened with HH but still no movement with MK and it seems Hopper has put talks off to end of the year.
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-07-12/numerous-clubs-circling-out-of-contract-giant-jacob-hopper

I recall an interview with MK where he basically said it will get done by the people who do those things, I'm just concentrating on footy

 

[Determinant]

No that is completely wrong.

All areas of his eliteness were clearly specified so don't put words in my mouth lads.

I just said he is not a match winner. Dangerfield is a match winner, Martin is a match winner, Ablett is a match winner, Bontempelli is a match winner.

Kelly is a very strong contributor, super consistent and elite in many ways but I have not walked away from many games thinking we won it because of him.

I wasn't being post specific mate tbh or I'd have quoted yours, was more just the tone of giants fans on him has changed..

FWIW though, the same has been said of Tom Mitchell, and I'd rather have him on our team then play against him.
Dangerfield and Martin have had considerably longer to work on their games, I don't doubt Kelly will reach their standard of influence.

 

[Andre the Giant]

I wasn't being post specific mate tbh or I'd have quoted yours, was more just the tone of giants fans on him has changed..

FWIW though, the same has been said of Tom Mitchell, and I'd rather have him on our team then play against him.
Dangerfield and Martin have had considerably longer to work on their games, I don't doubt Kelly will reach their standard of influence.

Could well do, I think Ray was a bit mischievous suggesting we were just readying ourselves for his exit.

These clubs are offering him Dangerfield money, he is not and is a long way off Patrick Dangerfield. He may turn out to be very influential, but his is currently not a bona fide matchwinner and IMHO will never reach Dangerfield's nor Martins's heights as he does not have their specs. I see him as more Luke Ball than Chris Judd.

If he re-signs I will be over the moon but if he goes I will not resort to cutting myself.

 

[Andre the Giant]

Could be something, could be nothing.

 

[Ellie Aquitaine]

View attachment 391609

Could be something, could be nothing.

If you're young and looking to return to Melbourne on a long term contract, wouldn't you rather be somewhere not about to start the rebuild; no matter what the dollars.

Carlton and St Kilda are more advanced in their planning imho.

 

[Determinant]

If you're young and looking to return to Melbourne on a long term contract, wouldn't you rather be somewhere not about to start the rebuild; no matter what the dollars.

Carlton and St Kilda are more advanced in their planning imho.

If he does go I'm seriously hoping it's to the Saints

 

[Colonial]

If he does go I'm seriously hoping it's to the Saints

It seems like the Saints 0ffer is around the same as Norths?

If so you go Saints as they are on the up and not still going down.
Even the Blues are further along.

If Norths coach leaves as well......

They really have nothing to offer.

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[Orange Agent]

The way its been played out, I dont think North have ever been in the picture. Professional clubs dont have their coach go on TV and confirm offers like this in about rd 5 or whenever it was.

But I hope he stays, that D&T thread will be delicious.

 

[Andre the Giant]

It seems like the Saints 0ffer is around the same as Norths?

If so you go Saints as they are on the up and not still going down.
Even the Blues are further along.

If Norths coach leaves as well......

They really have nothing to offer.

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Blues are the big talk here in Mexico but who knows.

 

[Ellie Aquitaine]

Blues are the big talk here in Mexico but who knows.

I have the feeling that Vic media believes that everyone who wants to leave gets offered to Carlton first...

 

[Andre the Giant]

I have the feeling that Vic media believes that everyone who wants to leave gets offered to Carlton first...

There is a silly perception there but nothing to it other than the fact SOS had a natural affinity with players he drafted. It will thin out pretty quickly.

 

[Determinant]

I see that Chris has Shipley ranked #12 at the moment, he may end up more expensive than we hoped.

 

[coniglio_number1]

I see that Chris has Shipley ranked #12 at the moment, he may end up more expensive than we hoped.

He is the only person with Shipley in the top 30. Most don't even list him

 

[Determinant]

He is the only person with Shipley in the top 30. Most don't even list him

Agreed, I think his is the one list updated completely post the U18 champs?

 

[Snookers]

Could well do, I think Ray was a bit mischievous suggesting we were just readying ourselves for his exit.

These clubs are offering him Dangerfield money, he is not and is a long way off Patrick Dangerfield. He may turn out to be very influential, but his is currently not a bona fide matchwinner and IMHO will never reach Dangerfield's nor Martins's heights as he does not have their specs. I see him as more Luke Ball than Chris Judd.

If he re-signs I will be over the moon but if he goes I will not resort to cutting myself.

My mail is still strong that he is staying. I'm wavering a bit, but my guy is adamant he is staying.

 

[dlanod]

I see that Chris has Shipley ranked #12 at the moment, he may end up more expensive than we hoped.

Chris tends to run his own lists, which is great reading but don't read too much into it.

 

[Determinant]

Chris tends to run his own lists, which is great reading but don't read too much into it.

True enough, though his list is usually more "compatible" than Quigley's and his I LOVE

 

[Giant Strides]

Chris25 had Shipley at #10 in his previous list, and moved him down to #12 after the Championships. No-one else has Shipley rated in any lists, but they vary between top 25 (so he could technically be 26-50) and top 50, so difficult to judge. But in general, no-one else seems to rate Shipley. I note in the current mock draft (flawed because it's early & no F/S or academy bidding/matching) that Chris took Shipley at #42. While I personally think there's a chance that Shipley could get through to a rookie draft selection, that does illustrate that it only needs one club to rate an academy guy and you have to make a choice to match the bid or let him go.

Of note, Spargo went at #38 - while I'm not his greatest fan I am surprised at that - and Jack Powell not yet taken at #70 - again a surprise. Hard to tell exactly what to read into it, as they're all amateurs, although past mock drafts have given some pointer as to where 70%ish go with a few risers and sliders.

For GWS, too far out really to say with a lot dependent on who we actually lose in trades at the end of the year, and what we get in trade value. Losing Kelly, Hopper, Smith & Himmelberg (plus retirements) would produce a vastly different outcome to just losing Kelly, and Hopper + Smith departing would be different again.

 

[Determinant]

Chris25 had Shipley at #10 in his previous list, and moved him down to #12 after the Championships. No-one else has Shipley rated in any lists, but they vary between top 25 (so he could technically be 26-50) and top 50, so difficult to judge. But in general, no-one else seems to rate Shipley. I note in the current mock draft (flawed because it's early & no F/S or academy bidding/matching) that Chris took Shipley at #42. While I personally think there's a chance that Shipley could get through to a rookie draft selection, that does illustrate that it only needs one club to rate an academy guy and you have to make a choice to match the bid or let him go.

Of note, Spargo went at #38 - while I'm not his greatest fan I am surprised at that - and Jack Powell not yet taken at #70 - again a surprise. Hard to tell exactly what to read into it, as they're all amateurs, although past mock drafts have given some pointer as to where 70%ish go with a few risers and sliders.

For GWS, too far out really to say with a lot dependent on who we actually lose in trades at the end of the year, and what we get in trade value. Losing Kelly, Hopper, Smith & Himmelberg (plus retirements) would produce a vastly different outcome to just losing Kelly, and Hopper + Smith departing would be different again.

I only started to follow the pre draft draft discussions and potential players about 4 years ago, it seems a reasonably inexact science and we are a long way out for sure

 

[Colonial]

Giants need a pressure forward, would pick 2 + Taylor Garner for Kelly (+ a late pick) suffice?

https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/index.php?threads/1130081/

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[Andre the Giant]

Adelaide apparently into Hopper.

What about Hopper for Mitch McGovern straight swap?

McGovern can play mobile high half forward and is a marking threat who could swing down back if we had some troops down.