Analysis 2018 List Management discussion Pt 2

[Soapy V]

Good team Soap. I like it.
I hope we can stay on the park with that line up you have. We will definitely be competitive.

Few "if's and maybe's" to happen yet but I really believe we will be a lot lot better next year

 

[HereComesJuddy]

Few "if's and maybe's" to happen yet but I really believe we will be a lot lot better next year

Yeah theres a few players in each line of the team i have question marks over. But i agree we will be better. I expect us to explode in 2020 though

 

[Gethelred]

We won both the clearances and stoppages on the weekend, + 6 in both

As you mentioned, retention and turnovers kill us, but I also understand the progression of the gameplan

It's also to do with effort, I think. The kids can't match it with the opposition on the outside, and their role model is Cripps, so they overcompensate by going like a bull at a gate at the stoppages to prove themselves, work as hard as they possibly can against mature bodies for as long as they can. The coaching don't interfere, because doing that is great for developing the correct mindset, and as long as they continue to put in all match and don't drop their heads they won't interfere.

That should only go for this season, though. Next year, we should be moving away from needing to do that kind of thing, and into trying to achieve proper quality clearances, in which the ball is either transferred forward of the stoppage by hand to someone like Fish, Dow or Murphy - or whoever is following up on the clearance, hopefully it isn't just restricted to outside mids - who then disposes of the ball into forward 50 to a leading player, or tap, handpass to a player behind the stoppage set up for the hacked kick forwards should the opposition win the clearance, and then kicking onto a leading CHF on the flank.

But then, that's 2 year old midfield craft, basically Hawthorn's structure when they were winning. Hopefully, we can come up with something new and better.

 

[Duigan Alley34]

Essendon are right into him this year too. What if gws want to pull the trigger but we dont have our hat in the ring?

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Yeah fair enough, we would quite possibly miss out. I wouldn't be disappointed if we ended up trading for him and I can see why we would. I just dont think the value lies with trading for him.

 

[mrkyuss]

Yeah fair enough, we would quite possibly miss out. I wouldn't be disappointed if we ended up trading for him and I can see why we would. I just dont think the value lies with trading for him.

Correct, as a free agent he is a great addition. As a trade, when we are talking a top 3 pick, doesn't quite fit. 26 next year, would be late twenties when we move up the ladder. Our demographic of choice should either be 23 or under, or 30 year old has beens who bring in leadership for a year or two.

 

[Tyruddanaut]

Well I had mine first and have had it for quite a while.

Tyruddanaut can change his!

IM sorry you chose the most generic Carlton background

 

[DangerousD]

Send 26 and 28 to Sydney for 14.

What makes you think that the guy taken at 14 will be better than the players taken at 26 and 28 combined?

 

[Red Bull]

What makes you think that the guy taken at 14 will be better than the players taken at 26 and 28 combined?

Charlie ...

 

[JustaBattler]

there’s another positive to come out of being the third best centre clearance team. We will get more opportunities for centre clearances when we score more. It’ll be an exponential growth opportunity.

More goals = more centre clearance opportunities = more centre clearances = more goals = ..... etc.

You get the same number of opportunities to win center clearances irrespective of wether you score or get scored against - or am I missing something? Since Carlton is the most scored against side in the competition I don't think there has been an absence of opportunity...

 

[DangerousD]

Hey Funk. Re gws salary cap issues. Where has that been mentioned by someone in the know or reported? Im not doubting it, just keen to find out more on the subject. Have seen people mention it here but from all it can tell is its guess work.

Cheers

There was an article on Toby Greene, stating that he has already agreed to defer a big chunk of next years salary to later in his contract. This happened only a month or two after signing a big $$$ long term deal.

If a club is trying to shuffle a contract only a few months after signing it then something smells.

They might not have an issue this year but they clearly do next year.

 

[DangerousD]

doesn't quite fit. 26 next year, would be late twenties when we move up the ladder.

The club has stated many many times in the last month that we are targeting players 24-26, he fits right in the middle. He would be late 20's when we move up the ladder, whats the issue there?

 

[DangerousD]

Charlie ...

Charlie was drafted at 12 a few years ago, what makes you think that this year 14 will be better than the 2 picks in the 20s combined?

 

[HereComesJuddy]

There was an article on Toby Greene, stating that he has already agreed to defer a big chunk of next years salary to later in his contract. This happened only a month or two after signing a big $$$ long term deal.

If a club is trying to shuffle a contract only a few months after signing it then something smells.

They might not have an issue this year but they clearly do next year.

Cheers DD

 

[Red Bull]

Charlie was drafted at 12 a few years ago, what makes you think that this year 14 will be better than the 2 picks in the 20s combined?

The pick Charlie was drafted with was swapped from Footscray for 2 x mid 20's picks (Dunkley&Collins).
Of course there are no guarantee's either way but logic suggests you get a better crack at the premium talent higher in the draft.

 

[Unknown Origin]

Herald Sun again talking about how Carlton should give up pick 1 for Shiel, ignoring the fact he gets to us for free next year.

im confident if we dont trade for shiel this year, he aint going to be available next year for us to take for free like so many on here keep saying. I reckon he is set on leaving this year. Teams like the scum will make a massive play for him this year leaving us with our empty handed. Fwiw, id prefer to skip shiel and keep pick 1 anyway

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[blue healer]

you have an eye for detail....

And a cute earring.

 

[Weiterbot23]

im confident if we dont trade for shiel this year, he aint going to be available next year for us to take for free like so many on here keep saying. I reckon he is set on leaving this year. Teams like the scum will make a massive play for him this year leaving us with our empty handed. Fwiw, id prefer to skip shiel and keep pick 1 anyway

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He may want to come home this year, but why would GWS entertain a trade?

I doubt they'd get higher than pick 10 for him if they trade him this year, but they are in a premiership window this year and next, why not keep him for 2019 to have a crack at the flag then get first round compo?

 

[Blue__Balls]

What makes you think that the guy taken at 14 will be better than the players taken at 26 and 28 combined?

Read the whole post. Or even just the next sentence...

26 and 28 get Sydney extra points to cover Blakey. So rather than just coughing up 14, they get pick 40-odd back as well.

We then package 12 and 14 to GWS, two first rounders for two players.

 

[Blue_Fusion]

Would be rapt if we got 9 wins next year. Can't see it happening but doesn't mean it won't.

Just find it hard to believe some people are basing that off our 2016-17 wins...

Different game plan. Bryce out of the midfield and replacement kids only in their 2nd year. Not to mention the older players had good seasons in those years it's unlikely that they will replicate that form again.

4-5 is more realistic, depending on what we do trade week but I reckon we'll be hitting the draft again this year.

 

[Arr0w]

As opposed to finishing last next year, because we did this year

 

[bigm386]

You may be right BB. I know that he is playing as an interceptor in the VFL atm but I was going off where he was at with Freo, so I figured he would be a more natural defender than Jones.
If as you say, his best comes only as an interceptor, than it might not work out as well for us.
We need a genuine FB atm. Someone that can help from round 1 next year. Not sure how much longer Rowe has left in him as a genuine first option KPD.

I wonder where Kieran Collins is at with the Bulldogs, I liked him in his draft year thought we would take him with pick 20 but we took Cunners and he went 26 to the Dogs. Was a match made in heaven with Weits at TAC club level and has hardly played a game for the dogs I think only 1 game in 2016????

 

[ferrisb]

Now now Aph. You can't keep Crippa all to yourself. Share him around will ya?

No.

To be fair, at 195cm, there is quite a lot of Crippa to go round...

 

[Blue and Blue]

As opposed to finishing last next year, because we did this year

Not yet but nearly ish

 

[Blue and Blue]

I wonder where Kieran Collins is at with the Bulldogs, I liked him in his draft year thought we would take him with pick 20 but we took Cunners and he went 26 to the Dogs. Was a match made in heaven with Weits at TAC club level and has hardly played a game for the dogs I think only 1 game in 2016????

Not an Andrew hopefully. An Ian or a Denis would be nice.

 

[Blue and Blue]

Would be rapt if we got 9 wins next year. Can't see it happening but doesn't mean it won't.

Just find it hard to believe some people are basing that off our 2016-17 wins...

Different game plan. Bryce out of the midfield and replacement kids only in their 2nd year. Not to mention the older players had good seasons in those years it's unlikely that they will replicate that form again.

4-5 is more realistic, depending on what we do trade week but I reckon we'll be hitting the draft again this year.

If we get nine wins I will sing the Beatles song ad nauseum
Number nine , Number nine....