List Mgmt. 2019 Trade Thread - Part III

[BrutThough]

100% disagree sorry.
Not in my top 3..

Thats hilarious. You are rating players that aren't actually midfielders ahead of someone who is clearly performing as our best midfielder this past season, and consistently over the past 3 seasons. And the sad thing is, I actually think you seriously believe it too.

Never change BigFooty.

 

[Stewart66]

100% disagree sorry.
Not in my top 3..

Particularly end of next season with Fiorini.

 

[ScrappyDo]

Thats hilarious. You are rating players that aren't actually midfielders ahead of someone who is clearly performing as our best midfielder this past season, and consistently over the past 3 seasons. And the sad thing is, I actually think you seriously believe it too.

Never change BigFooty.

I'd wager the trade market for Hunter is stronger than for Seb. And l believe it.

Higher trade value probably = better

 

[gringo2011]

Particularly end of next season with Fiorini.

I love how our best players are never actually on our list.

 

[Indie Rock]

I must have missed the pages suggesting we trade Billings.

Billings and Hill on the wings is more marketable than the King twins.

One is clean cut and a bit dorky, the other is a bit of a bad boy and likes a drink. One is white, the other indigenous. There are a lot of opposites between them but together they get the job done (from different sides of the oval).

They will make a movie out of it, ‘the Wingmen’ starring Steve Farrell and Chris Tucker.

It’s a comedy but it chronicles the St Kilda 3 peat from 2021 to 2023 which is led by these two and an engine room of :
Marshall (Dolph Lundgren)
Hannebery (Sean William Scott)
Steele (Eric Bana)
Clarke (Chris Hemsworth)
Bytel (Matt Damon)

Plus the King twins (both played by Jason Momoa) as the book ends.

 

[Dr Spaceman]

If Bing wants to come you just make it happen. Not sure how he compares to Rowell and Anderson but surely he’d be at least top 3 this year.

Just from a commercial perspective bringing in bing for the cost of a few draft picks is worth its weight in gold.

We want higher membership tallies, higher attendance, more Friday night games, more revenue or even A grade players to nominate us.

Well bringing in bing and re-uniting him with Ming, will finally attract outside interest into our club and positively influence all the above mentioned.

As long as we are smart about how we get him across, this can only be seen as a win win.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[DT_35]

What a waste of f****** time reading those 10+ pages

 

[austinnn]

Never said Hunter won't be a better midfielder in 2-3 years time. But right now he isn't even playing in there.

At this exact moment, Seb is our best midfielder.

And we are the 5th worst team in the league.

 

[Doug Hogan 23]

This place is funny, all we have been banging on about for years is that we drafted Billings over Bont, now we get the chance to get rid of him for a great return and he's all of a sudden untouchable. I just love how he runs into an open goal and kicks it on the full!

Having said that, I'd want a swap of pick 2 for 6 along with Ben for Jack and it's done! Turning Jack into Anderson and Ben King is a no brainer, but probably won't happen, Jack will leave for nothing in free agency instead

 

[Max the great]

Absolute mad house in here.. why stop at Billings or Gresh? Let's offer them Marshall and Clark for Bing and a 2nd.

Get a ******** grip people for god sake!

 

[gringo2011]

And we are the 5th worst team in the league.

And you lose your best mid and become the worst in the league is good how?

 

[gringo2011]

Absolute mad house in here.. why stop at Billings or Gresh? Let's offer them Marshall and Clark for Bing and a 2nd.

Get a ******** grip people for god sake!

I tell you what I stayed away and I felt sane for the first time in ages. I'm too triggered to get off but after tomorrow I'm not logging back in until trade period ends ........if I can discipline myself. Saintsational is like tea and cucumber sandwiches on the lawn compared to this place now. It's like 30 primates flinging turds at each other tonight.

 

[Doug Hogan 23]

Absolute mad house in here.. why stop at Billings or Gresh? Let's offer them Marshall and Clark for Bing and a 2nd.

Get a ******** grip people for god sake!

You miss the point of the original post, that being that at least Fold Coast have engaged us regarding Bing.

 

[StCicatriz]

You miss the point of the original post, that being that at least Fold Coast have engaged us regarding Bing.

Fold coast hahahahahahahaha love it

 

[TheJackal]

You miss the point of the original post, that being that at least Fold Coast have engaged us regarding Bing.

Exactly, it's not about Billings or Gresh, it's about Bing and the dialogue between the two clubs.

Fold Coast (well played) keeping the trade door ajar should be cause for a mini celebration - instead the chicken littles in here want to focus on that falling sky!

 

[stfan]

Lethlean mentioned during the season multiple times we need to get our average age up to 25 and average games played up to 100 as quick as possible because teams contending/playing finals generally have that type of profile.

I see targeting Hill, Gray, Jones is all to help that process along as quick as possible instead of fielding half a team with under 50 games experience each week. Then Ryder is because of the lack of ruck options.

While I agree we lack middle age players, I think the idea of improving our average just to make it a higher average, by recruiting older players who may be a bit past it when hopefully our next GF tilt is on is a deeply flawed one.

For the Dogs recruiting older players like Bruce and Keath makes enormous sense as they are ready for the next step.

So with the saints I would hope like hell that our recruiting is not driven by just wanting to mathematically drive our average up, and hopefully is more driven by wanting to improve the leadership at the club. Various ITKs have hinted that a core problem is lack of elite professionalism in our playing group where many might be just motoring along rather than excelling. If so then that is a strategy I can understand, that I can get behind and have faith in.

Hill is a superb pick up.

But if our best chance of a GF is say in 3 years time is it really wise to pick up players now who will be 31 then? ie Targeting Gray and Keath (no off to the Dogs)


If you believe our targets are who they say, it smacks a lot more of having a tilt at a flag next year. Now while we would all love to be contender next year, is this a prudent strategy to attempt?

Personally I would rather build a new core by recruiting players no older than Hill (ie who should have good years left in them) and younger. Hill adds to Membrey, Clark, Coffield, Marshall, Gresham, King, Bytel.

I think this gives us a platform that we can keeping building each season.

Gaining too many older players just means that they will start sliding out again just when you want to be having a crack.


The trade period has not officially begun, and when it is finished we will be able to judge it better. But so far apart from Hill it makes me very nervous as I cannot discern any clear strategy.


However maybe it is iterative and Ratten and Lethlean want to start by steadying the ship, introducing a new ethos with a higher level of leadership and professionalism and application. I can only hope so.

 

[MOLTEN GANGLANDS]

god damnit, I was bangin on about fold coast a few weeks back on the main board and got no love, no love for the fold! then along comes bloody doug hogan and f me

also billings aint that gr8 come @ me

 

[George]

god damnit, I was bangin on about fold coast a few weeks back on the main board and got no love, no love for the fold! then along comes bloody doug hogan and f me

also billings aint that gr8 come @ me

I'll have you know Doug Hogan is a Saint!

 

[Saint4Life]

2017: mid with one high pick, defenders with the rest of them.

2018: pick 4, best available is a tall.

2019: pick 6, trade it for a wingman.

2020: likely another early pick, give it up for another tall.

Agree, we have not drafted midfielders with high picks for such a long time, annoys the shit out of me, but its OK, we can rely on the "needs to be rebuilt" Hanners and Carlisle who we pay way overs for with a walking stick.... remember that, he had a walking stick not long before we drafted him.... the clubs simply trying to pick 'past' players that are clearly past their best and are paying way overs.... :/

I'd rather we go down the youth path, and just get a bunch of 18-23 yr olds so that in 3-4 years time, we might have a decent group of young talent. Ryder at his age is short term...

 

[Drake Huggins]

You miss the point of the original post, that being that at least Fold Coast have engaged us regarding Bing.

Fold Coast! Gold!

 

[Baker_for_PM]

I never understood the carry on over the Bont vs Billings debate or any other shoulda coulda woulda situation, for most of the year it was always Boyd,Kelly,Billings nearly every club had it that way and even if we did go for the left field pick of Bont do you think much would be different with our club right now. I look at Richmond and think yes they have stars but its the team cohesion that really set them apart. The likes of Ivan Soldo and Jayden Short are not blessed with the greatest of skills but they know their role and on GF day they did it well. Its why a 28 year old debutante can come in and play so well in a side on a 11 game winning streak.
Brisbane again has stars but its Fagan who has galvanized that team, there is a tangible energy which excites the players to achieve.
Obviously it would be great to have more stars but getting our system right whatever Ratten decides that maybe will go a great distance in our improvement.
Because of my frustration that this topic seems to never go away i leave you with a video of when the Saints had it going on.

 

[stfan]

I look at Richmond and think yes they have stars but its the team cohesion that really set them apart. The likes of Ivan Soldo and Jayden Short are not blessed with the greatest of skills but they know their role and on GF day they did it well. Its why a 28 year old debutante can come in and play so well in a side on a 11 game winning streak.

I might get shot for this, but in our last glory years under Lyon that is exactly what St Kilda was such a good team, and why we won as mainly games as we did. Sure we had some great players, but most of the team wasn't.

All the players has bought into the team ethos and worked hard together for success, with each doing their bit, even when that bit was just to guard space and hardly touch the ball.


The Tigers gameplan is the polar opposite of St Kilda's under Lyon, but that player buy in and commitment is exactly the same.

 

[Crusty Undies]

I'll back my pony. You've got Seb..

Clearly the club don't back your pony yet. Might want to give him another year before expecting him to become Fyfe MKII.

 

[Crusty Undies]

We're rebuilding with the King twins so it doesn't really matter

What does it matter who's in the forward line if there's no one to kick it too? Even plugger needed people to give him the ball.

 

[Crusty Undies]

I'm sorry but he is not our best player or for that matter most important player. He is a good player and is expendable for the right price. Can't string a season together yet and plays around 6 good games a year. Below average set shot at goal, and someone who is supposed to be an elite field kick actually butcher's more kicks forward of centre than he actually hits. Is very good at going sideways I'll give him that. Gresham/Marahall/Membrey/Steele are all currently better players than Billings and I would rate him on par with Ross for output. In a few years time the likes of Clark and a few others should be reaching his level minimum.

For starters I said he was arguably a best and didn't even mention most important. Next,Billings is statistically the most likely player at our club to hit someone wearing a saints jumper forward of centre. He was a below average set shot for one year but corrected again this year. Finished with 12 brownlow votes all in the first half of the season which is precisely why I said definitely our best for the first half of the year. Steele is currently a 22 touch a game player who's decent stopping opposition but doesn't damage with his possessions at all. Membrey is good but not a player to build a forward line around. Gresham is good but a significantly bigger butcher than Billings statistically. Marshall is probably our most important player from a structural perspective but not our best. Billings, Ross, Steven are at least all better than him at their best.

Finally why are you speaking about "in a few years"? We've been talking about "in a few years" for nearly a decade now. We aren't bringing Ryder and Hill in so we can be competitive "in a few years". Hunter hasn't played a game through the midfield yet, Ross is currently our best mid and you're kidding yourself if you think trading Billings for King isn't objectively losing that trade. Waste of time even talking about it tbh.