List Mgmt. 2020 List Management, Free Agency & Trade thread

Remove this Banner Ad

Status
Not open for further replies.
This is Part 1

The thread is continued in part 2:

www.bigfooty.com

List Mgmt. - 2020 List Management, Free Agency & Trade thread - Part 2

This Part 2 Continued from Part 1: https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/2020-list-management-free-agency-trade-thread.1241035/ What type of players does our list need? Pace, Skill, Class and and goal threat. A winger, forward flank and forward pocket are the 3 positions that we need, plus...
www.bigfooty.com www.bigfooty.com
 
Basically trading out Hogan would mean that we've had him for the least productive period of his career and he's been in rehab more than available. If true and of course it may not be, hopefully there's a heap more to it than what's on the surface, a heap more. It's pretty much screwing around with a key piece of the future potential of the list.
 
MadMundy said:
I wouldn't be giving up Schultz to the trade table, we have fu** all small forwards as it is and he was good this season, reckon we need to sign him on.
Click to expand...

Sorry shuktz had his moments and you can’t question his commitment, but he is a good honest WAFL/VFL footballer at best, he is expendable. As is his mate Bewley


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app
 
Van_Dyke said:
would be very surprised if they’d be willing to trade Stephens for Hogan, if they are and we could bring in Mihocek as well that’d be the best of a not good situation
Click to expand...
Thing is with Mihoceck there's a greater chance that he's hit his sweet spot with Collingwood and may plateau and go backwards next season and beyond. He's already on a scale of diminishing returns across each of his three seasons and as a mature ager the end can come swift.
 

Log in to remove this ad.

Freoforever86 said:
Ryan Daniels saying Freo not shopping hogan but Sydney have asked about him
Click to expand...
They will probably only offer up Aliir Aliir, a reasonable backman that they tried to turn into a ruck but we really don't need more backmen.
 
Snuffaluphagus said:
I think if true, this is an incredibly stupid move;
1) When you put someone up for trade you get diddly squat
2) I struggle to see how we win a flag with our current forward set-up unless we have convinced Mihocek to come over.
3) We just delisted our only back-up depth.
4) We clearly knew about off-field issues when we got him, in for a penny, in for a pound. If Stringer can run around with a keg for a stomach and De Goey can get a game with his serious off-field issues, I struggle to comprehend why we cant bite the bullet with Hogan.

I am happy for anyone to ping me indefinitely if trading Hogan turns out to be a good move
Click to expand...

Culture > Individual player.

I reckon one of the best things JLo has done, and one of the key reasons you have improved under him is him demanding higher standards and for all players to buy-in. That message gets undermined if you let it slide with a few players.

Bennell, McCarthy, Matera, Hogan...club has done the right thing moving these guys on IMO. Don't think players were enjoying their footy the last few years under Lyon. Your club will be better for it. All talented but lazy players...are they really the type you can rely on in finals? No...so what's the point of keeping them since that's the aim.

You do need more KPF depth but Hogan barely played this year...your 2020 team doesn't get any weaker by trading him. Maybe the club is confident on Mihocek, maybe even someone else you haven't been linked to in the media yet.

And Stringer is a poor example...Essendon are s**t and have publicised culture issues. Stringer is getting games on talent and not workrate which sends a bad message to the rest of the playing group. Essendon aren't going anywhere while they let it slide. De Goey currently is capable of tearing games apart way more than Stringer & Hogan...but even then he has many games where he goes completely missing and now is in a contract stand off with Collingwood.

TLDR: Freo will be better off without Hogan. JLo is setting a standard amongst the playing group and culture that will take Freo back up the ladder.
 
Snuffaluphagus said:
I think if true, this is an incredibly stupid move;
1) When you put someone up for trade you get diddly squat
2) I struggle to see how we win a flag with our current forward set-up unless we have convinced Mihocek to come over.
3) We just delisted our only back-up depth.
4) We clearly knew about off-field issues when we got him, in for a penny, in for a pound. If Stringer can run around with a keg for a stomach and De Goey can get a game with his serious off-field issues, I struggle to comprehend why we cant bite the bullet with Hogan.

I am happy for anyone to ping me indefinitely if trading Hogan turns out to be a good move
Click to expand...

Tomahawk island re point 2 with Tabs , it’s not impossible

Tigers only had Reiwolt in 2017


Sent from my iPad using BigFooty.com
 
wahooo said:
Tabs and Lobb are elite contested marks, yes Lobb had a quiet season but he's more than serviceable as back up ruck or forward/ruck. Hogan has the potential to be elite, he's got that lead up mark game and a great deal of footy smarts. We've got Sturt who at his height and pace is going to cause headaches. Henry will hopefully be running amok next year and we'll have Fyfe and Walters rotating through.

We genuinely have a great deal of options up front. Yeah we're lacking a developing tall or depth in the key forward ranks but the recruiting team and Jlo have already said a forward/ruck will be a focus this off season. If we get to use our second there should be some good options available at our pick, who knows we might even use our first on a tall.

We don't need to sell the farm. We've got options. The one time we have genuine options up forward and you're hitting panic stations.

Yeah it'd be nice to be in the top 5 or 6 of the draft picking from the likes of McDonald (who lets face it probably goes top two) or Thilthorpe or DGB (assuming he can actually swing forward).

I firmly hope Hogan stays and that he comes good, we spent a lot on him and it'd be a shame to lose him for anything short of a chance at McDonald. And that's not to say he's beyond criticism, we've seen our coach force him to fight his way back into the line up, Hogan has to know his career is on the rocks.

Also our forwards haven't had the luxury of 50 or 60 inside 50s a game, we were second last for inside 50s averaging 37 a game. Our forwards have barely even had the chance to play together. Let's give them a bloody chance.
Click to expand...

Couldn’t agree more



On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app
 
Looks like Belly is briefing journos on different sides of the country with completely opposite narratives. My interpretation is it's setting it up to allow us to walk both sides. I.E. Everyone now knows for sure we will trade him, but now we can come out and say officially that we expect him to be here next year but if a mutually beneficial deal blah blah blah. That way we can walk away clean if we don't get a good enough offer.

You'd think though the only way value could be leveraged out of a deal this off season, and the only way and deal happens period, is if it any Hogan trade was a necessary condition of part of bringing someone else in (ironically why he is here at all).
 
arsesmart said:
Basically trading out Hogan would mean that we've had him for the least productive period of his career and he's been in rehab more than available. If true and of course it may not be, hopefully there's a heap more to it than what's on the surface, a heap more. It's pretty much screwing around with a key piece of the future potential of the list.
Click to expand...

What makes you think he's a key piece of the future? Because he has talent and showed promise in his first year of AFL footy?

Barely gotten on the park the last few years with you, and when he has he hasn't exactly set games on fire.
Has some off-field issues, doesn't seem very professional...i'm surprised to see so many Freo fans defending him and thinking he's a big piece of the puzzle based on his output the last few years. Paying big $$$ and gifting games to someone who's not committed and training hard etc is not a smart thing to do...I mean the likes of Bennell/McCarthy/Matera were the same...talented but lazy. They can have some nice moments and games but ultimately they are not consistent enough and aren't the answer.
 
Van_Dyke said:
would be very surprised if they’d be willing to trade Stephens for Hogan, if they are and we could bring in Mihocek as well that’d be the best of a not good situation
Click to expand...
Yes, I agree. Best case scenario would be Hogan to Sydney, Sydney’s 2nd selection (if they have one) to Geelong & Clark to us with other bits going between clubs to keep everyone happy.
Then we find out Mihocek is coming.
 
I was irritated that we lost Neale and BHill, but they wanted out and we had to make the best of a bad situation, but actively pushing hogan out the door doesn't seem wise. this seems like a massive over reaction from the club. And he's not a mediocre player in some easy to fill position. He's a talented KPF ffs. They're rare as hens teeth. Sort him out and get him contributing. Don't sell him for nothing to make a rather tired point about culture. I want freo to be playing good high scoring footy and he is a part of that. We have no replacement for him?!?
 
arsesmart said:
Thing is with Mihoceck there's a greater chance that he's hit his sweet spot with Collingwood and may plateau and go backwards next season and beyond. He's already on a scale of diminishing returns across each of his three seasons and as a mature ager the end can come swift.
Click to expand...

At times it was like when we were playing McCarthy as our KF in the pies fwd line this year

Tabs , an up and going Lobb and a workhorse like Mihoceck is a pretty sweet set up if you ask me


Sent from my iPad using BigFooty.com
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

arsesmart said:
Thing is with Mihoceck there's a greater chance that he's hit his sweet spot with Collingwood and may plateau and go backwards next season and beyond. He's already on a scale of diminishing returns across each of his three seasons and as a mature ager the end can come swift.
Click to expand...

I think if we have really placed Hogan on the trade table it must mean we have done a deal to get somebody else. IMO there is no way we would trade Hogan and leave us with only two real tall forward options for 2021 (Tabs who has had injury problems and Lobb who is really a ruck/forward), although obviously Cox is a backup. Th equestrian is who have we done a deal with, Brown of Mihocek. I would not want either ahead of Hogan unless it allows us to get a significant pick upgrade as well. Could that be possible? Given JLo’s history, it’s likely we have agreed some sort of deal for Mihocek.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Purplrrr said:
I was irritated that we lost Neale and BHill, but they wanted out and we had to make the best of a bad situation, but actively pushing hogan out the door doesn't seem wise. this seems like a massive over reaction from the club. And he's not a mediocre player in some easy to fill position. He's a talented KPF ffs. They're rare as hens teeth. Sort him out and get him contributing. Don't sell him for nothing to make a rather tired point about culture. I want freo to be playing good high scoring footy and he is a part of that. We have no replacement for him?!?
Click to expand...
Totally agree with the point of too many people talking about the need to try and clean up the culture, Richmond don't seem too worried about their culture unless you are talking about the culture of WINNING!
 
Midnite65 said:
Totally agree with the point of too many people talking about the need to try and clean up the culture, Richmond don't seem too worried about their culture unless you are talking about the culture of WINNING!
Click to expand...

Oh, there are some things you need to do, and I do think it is important. But I just don't think what hogan has done is THAT bad. A few tweaks here and there. A few serious conversations, etc. but he hasn't stuck Gatorade in a drug test, he hasn't beaten his wife.

And further, on culture, there's an element of setting standards, but there's also an element of your club having your back. Working with you, rather than turfing you.
 
Nothing has changed from my perspective. I said yesterday the rhetoric from the club will be Jesse is tradable for the right price.

The West Australian hearing whispers that some clubs are enquiring and drawing their own conclusion whilst running daily full page spread on the greatness that is Nik Nait.

I’d imagine that a few dominoes would need to fall into place. Like a decent trade price, Mihocek coming across etc.

Sydney aren’t going to give up pick 3 and push themselves down the order. They have probable top 10 pick Braeden Campbell and Errol Gulden and to push their pick 3 down to outside the top 10 would be very silly.

Also Sydney used an early pick on Stephens in 2019 just one year on their list and no way he will be released.

More likely draft picks like future 1st with other pick swaps to make the trade fair value according to the negotiated agreed value. Also we will want a pick around 3rd round to satisfy Collingwood if growing rumours that Mihocek is being courted by Freo for 3-4 year contract.

Id then dangle one of the future 1sts (ours and Sydney’s) in front of Geelong for Jordan Clarke and expect something back in return for 2020 draft (ie like late third round pick) to give us necessary points for Western and Walker.
 
F_therest said:
Culture > Individual player.

I reckon one of the best things JLo has done, and one of the key reasons you have improved under him is him demanding higher standards and for all players to buy-in. That message gets undermined if you let it slide with a few players.

Bennell, McCarthy, Matera, Hogan...club has done the right thing moving these guys on IMO. Don't think players were enjoying their footy the last few years under Lyon. Your club will be better for it. All talented but lazy players...are they really the type you can rely on in finals? No...so what's the point of keeping them since that's the aim.

You do need more KPF depth but Hogan barely played this year...your 2020 team doesn't get any weaker by trading him. Maybe the club is confident on Mihocek, maybe even someone else you haven't been linked to in the media yet.

And Stringer is a poor example...Essendon are sh*t and have publicised culture issues. Stringer is getting games on talent and not workrate which sends a bad message to the rest of the playing group. Essendon aren't going anywhere while they let it slide. De Goey currently is capable of tearing games apart way more than Stringer & Hogan...but even then he has many games where he goes completely missing and now is in a contract stand off with Collingwood.

TLDR: Freo will be better off without Hogan. JLo is setting a standard amongst the playing group and culture that will take Freo back up the ladder.
Click to expand...
A Carlton poster comes along and injects a bit of realism and sense into the debate. Seen it all now.
 
If Sydney are interested and were willing to put their pick #5 on the table for Daniher then I see no reason why they wouldn't do the same for Hogan.

And I agree that their academy will need to be taken care of, so I would suggest.

Hogan and #28 for #3

Then at the draft once Campbell has been bid on;

Our #10 for their future first and their #52 and #56 (or otherwise later picks to pay for our academy players)
 
Superkoops said:
Nothing has changed from my perspective. I said yesterday the rhetoric from the club will be Jesse is tradable for the right price.

The West Australian hearing whispers that some clubs are enquiring and drawing their own conclusion whilst running daily full page spread on the greatness that is Nik Nait.

I’d imagine that a few dominoes would need to fall into place. Like a decent trade price, Mihocek coming across etc.

Sydney aren’t going to give up pick 3 and push themselves down the order. They have probable top 10 pick Braeden Campbell and Errol Gulden and to push their pick 3 down to outside the top 10 would be very silly.

Also Sydney used an early pick on Stephens in 2019 just one year on their list and no way he will be released.

More likely draft picks like future 1st with other pick swaps to make the trade fair value according to the negotiated agreed value. Also we will want a pick around 3rd round to satisfy Collingwood if growing rumours that Mihocek is being courted by Freo for 3-4 year contract.

Id then dangle one of the future 1sts (ours and Sydney’s) in front of Geelong for Jordan Clarke and expect something back in return for 2020 draft (ie like late third round pick) to give us necessary points for Western and Walker.
Click to expand...
Doesn't mihocek come free if accepts our offer?The fact he's been on their rookie list for so long.
 
The club must be filthy with Hogan if that is true.

I agree what he has done isn't super-bad, but there have been quite a few incidents.

The car crash and the video when he was off his head on MDMA were still damming. As was the drunk photos. Then the covid breach and turning up to training hung over. Taking time off isn't an offence, at least he came back motivated.

Thata a few indiscretions for a guy who we have had for 2 years.

Fyfe gets in trouble for surfing.

If Hogan is shipped off I think that the club knows more and the decision wasn't made lightly.
 
Tbonefreo said:
The club must be filthy with Hogan if that is true.

I agree what he has done isn't super-bad, but there have been quite a few incidents.

The car crash and the video when he was off his head on MDMA were still damming. As was the drunk photos. Then the covid breach and turning up to training hung over. Taking time off isn't an offence, at least he came back motivated.

Thata a few indiscretions for a guy who we have had for 2 years.

Fyfe gets in trouble for surfing.

If Hogan is shipped off I think that the club knows more and the decision wasn't made lightly.
Click to expand...
I am quite sure we don't know the half of it regarding most players, let alone somebody with Jesse's history.

Be mad at doing the deal in the first place. It's sunk cost at this point (assuming greater evils we are not aware of).
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

go_the_dockers
  • Poll
List Mgmt. 2024 List Management thread - Trade Targets
183 184 185 186 187
Replies
5K
Views
233K
Andy Brennan
Andy Brennan
Lore
  • Locked
List Mgmt. 2023 List Management thread - Pt2 Now With Added Wailing & Gnashing of Teeth
304 305 306 307 308
Replies
8K
Views
313K
Snuffaluphagus
Snuffaluphagus
vidwhal
Preview PORT VS FREO - ROUND 5 - POWERED BY THE WHISTLE
2 3 4 5
Replies
100
Views
5K
FreoGirl
FreoGirl
Lach72
  • Locked
List Mgmt. 2023 List Management thread
499 500 501 502 503
Replies
13K
Views
549K
Midnite65
Midnite65
dockerfemme
  • Locked
Game Day Dockers v Crows - 4.30pm Bounce down
26 27 28 29 30
Replies
740
Views
10K
FreoGirl
FreoGirl
Van_Dyke
Review Freo storm home against North
11 12 13 14 15
Replies
361
Views
14K
mattis117
mattis117
Mr Cheese
  • Locked
Game Day Rd 6 - Freo vs Bin Chickens (Away)
42 43 44 45 46
Replies
1K
Views
28K
Tonga Bob
Tonga Bob

Remove this Banner Ad

Back
Top