List Mgmt. 2021 Team & Beyond...

[Partridge]

I wouldn't play Hendo, Higgins, Dahl or Rohan. Depth only.

Get Sav, Simpson, Narkle, Close, Jarvis etc in there instead

Completely agree with the last three. And would prefer they weren't even at the club.

Henderson is the weird one. Would have completely agreed even mid-year, but he ended up being our best key defender this year. And in the air, certainly our most reliable. Not sure he makes way. If Taylor retires, I'd pick two of Henry, Kolodjashnij and Blicavs to play alongside him. At least for 2021.

 

[Cataholic]

Completely agree with the last three. And would prefer they weren't even at the club.

Henderson is the weird one. Would have completely agreed even mid-year, but he ended up being our best key defender this year. And in the air, certainly our most reliable. Not sure he makes way. If Taylor retires, I'd pick two of Henry, Kolodjashnij and Blicavs to play alongside him. At least for 2021.

Yeah, Hendo looked done, but credit to him, he put in a solid year as you said.

I think HT should retire, and if that happens, I don't want to see all of Hendo, Henry, Kolo and Blitz in the same backline, but I have a fear that'll happen.

 

[Flander]

FB O'Connor, Henry*, Kolodjashnij*
HB Clark, Blicavs*, Stewart
C Duncan, Simpson, Menegola
HF Higgins, Cameron, Dangerfield
FF Miers, Hawkins, Close
R Stanley, Guthrie, Parfitt
IC Selwood, Narkle**, Bews, Dahlhaus

EMG Ratugolea, Rohan, Tuohy, De Koning

* No idea if this is realistic. Wouldn't mind De Koning.
** Please don't go.

GF side:
IN: Clark, Higgins, Cameron, Close, Narkle
OUT: Ablett (ret.), Taylor (ret.), Henderson (ret.), Rohan, Tuohy

 

[Flander]

FB O'Connor, Henry*, Kolodjashnij*
HB Clark, Blicavs*, Stewart
C Duncan, Simpson, Menegola
HF Higgins, Cameron, Dangerfield
FF Miers, Hawkins, Close
R Stanley, Guthrie, Parfitt
IC Selwood, Narkle**, Bews, Dahlhaus

EMG Ratugolea, Rohan, Tuohy, De Koning

* No idea if this is realistic. Wouldn't mind De Koning.
** Please don't go.

GF side:
IN: Clark, Higgins, Cameron, Close, Narkle
OUT: Ablett (ret.), Taylor (ret.), Henderson (ret.), Rohan, Tuohy

Originally had Ratugolea in for Bews.

I think there's room for him alongside Cameron and Hawkins, as I'd expect Blicavs to spend significantly more time (hopefully all of his time) in defence rather than 60/40 mid/ruck.

 

[Flander]

FB O'Connor, Henry*, Kolodjashnij*
HB Clark, Blicavs*, Stewart
C Duncan, Simpson, Menegola
HF Higgins, Cameron, Dangerfield
FF Miers, Hawkins, Close
R Stanley, Guthrie, Parfitt
IC Selwood, Narkle**, Bews, Dahlhaus

EMG Ratugolea, Rohan, Tuohy, De Koning

* No idea if this is realistic. Wouldn't mind De Koning.
** Please don't go.

GF side:
IN: Clark, Higgins, Cameron, Close, Narkle
OUT: Ablett (ret.), Taylor (ret.), Henderson (ret.), Rohan, Tuohy

Aware I'm probably wrong on Henderson - I wouldn't be against him staying on the list for depth, but I'm keen for us to get some 30+ year olds off the books as possible.

 

[winty]

B: Bews Blicavs Kolodjashnij
HB: Stewart Henderson Selwood
C: Parfitt C.Guthrie Menegola
HF: Duncan Hawkins Simpson
F: Miers Cameron Close
Foll: Stanley Dangerfield Narkle
Int: O'Connor Henry Kreuger Fogarty

Ins: Cameron Close Narkle Kreuger Fogarty
Out: Taylor Ablett Dahlhaus Tuohy Rohan

 

[Farmer2Goggin]

We gave it our best shot but in reality we came up against a dynasty and selected the oldest GF team in history.
Even then we had the ascendancy but as we have done in the past conceded a game losing amount on turnover - some forced but much unforced.
I don't see our game plan as the core problem - sure there are things we can tweak but execution seems to be our achilles heel.
You can argue turnovers are pressure related but so much of ours seemed to be unforced ( skill error) and poor decision making.

There are a few problems , some recurring that we need to address :

> Turnovers - we either skill up the offenders or replace them.
> Inability to defend the ground ball in defence - too tall and too slow - restructure required. It's noticeable when one of our talls gets a ground ball they either take forever to use it or a lot of the time it's because they don't have an option - need more speed in defence.
> Midfield depth - improved this year but still needs work
> Small forwards - too many are slow and can't kick over 35m - get the balance right.
> Veterans and changes - we need to be a bit ruthless here with retirees and moving on those who can't take us forward.
> Game Plan - I like the way we tried to play on quicker V Pies and Lions but it dried up v Tigers. That may get better if we train for it and implement better.
> Ball Movement - Two tall forwards will necessitate quicker delivery into F50 - need a structure and players who can do this.
> Team Composition - go easy on getting in older players , play the talented kids we have , give them a chance to prove themselves.
> Psychology? - are we mentally damaged? Ben Crowe and Amber have done wonders with the Tigers - could this be another "Leading Teams" moment for us like 2007?

This great Club will re- group , I really hope we address our weaknesses.
Go Cats

 

[winty]

The cull has begun apparently.

 

[Mad_Hatter]

Well done to Blake to still walk out with his head held high, some would sulk and sook but well done.

 

[Moggy]

Don't see the point giving [the captaincy] to Danger for only a year or 2.

Worked ok with Cameron Ling

 

[Turbocat]

We gave it our best shot but in reality we came up against a dynasty and selected the oldest GF team in history.
Even then we had the ascendancy but as we have done in the past conceded a game losing amount on turnover - some forced but much unforced.
I don't see our game plan as the core problem - sure there are things we can tweak but execution seems to be our achilles heel.
You can argue turnovers are pressure related but so much of ours seemed to be unforced ( skill error) and poor decision making.

There are a few problems , some recurring that we need to address :

> Turnovers - we either skill up the offenders or replace them.
> Inability to defend the ground ball in defence - too tall and too slow - restructure required. It's noticeable when one of our talls gets a ground ball they either take forever to use it or a lot of the time it's because they don't have an option - need more speed in defence.
> Midfield depth - improved this year but still needs work
> Small forwards - too many are slow and can't kick over 35m - get the balance right.
> Veterans and changes - we need to be a bit ruthless here with retirees and moving on those who can't take us forward.
> Game Plan - I like the way we tried to play on quicker V Pies and Lions but it dried up v Tigers. That may get better if we train for it and implement better.
> Ball Movement - Two tall forwards will necessitate quicker delivery into F50 - need a structure and players who can do this.
> Team Composition - go easy on getting in older players , play the talented kids we have , give them a chance to prove themselves.
> Psychology? - are we mentally damaged? Ben Crowe and Amber have done wonders with the Tigers - could this be another "Leading Teams" moment for us like 2007?

This great Club will re- group , I really hope we address our weaknesses.
Go Cats

I dont particularly like Malthouse but he seemed to have nailed a few points in here

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But the boost came from the midfield with a lift in intensity and pressure and flipped the game on its head.

Martin in the forward line was brilliant. His inspirational best.

Twice if not more in big games we have had the game on our terms against Rich but have not been able to withstand it when it flipped.... and Martin can not be denied .. in 8 seconds of football he killed us. The finishing he showed was what wins games. Guys like SJ and Chappy made such a huge difference in our successful era.. and mids like Corey, Bartel, Ablett and Selwood were so good guys like Kelly got pushed out. When things started to go bad they had the ability to stifle and elevate.

Against the best , when effort drops or when we become over matched effort seems to fall short. Even Guthrie making AA this year, he is not a premium, he is just good to very good talent... and Miers is a querky player who may be very good at some stage in the future but at under 50 games is still becoming the best version of himself.

The Danger up forward or onball..is so similar to the same discussion with Gary Sr when we lost in the 90's. Apart from infrequent displays out of the box games he needs some quality help not based on ability to cover , and play to a system etc...thats all great when you have a little more talent than we have.

So are we back to the overdone repeating debate.Can we add enough talent without dropping down. Im. still not sure we can. Parfitt is close to our best young kid taken in the 20's. He would look pretty good in most sides but im not convinced our level is great if he is our best mid. To high degree I feel this year saw a change of luck for us ..shorter quarters , Rich losing their first final , playing a at ground that was neutral.. I think its going to be quite difficult to get back to where we were this year.

The thing is ... Scott is very good..most of the team is good to very good. I doubt we fall away to quickly, especially if we add the likes of the players we have been linked to ... 2021 and beyond... I think it will be challenging for a while unless we unearth a few super high end players,

 

[Moggy]

B: Bews Blicavs Kolodjashnij
HB: Stewart Henderson Selwood
C: Parfitt C.Guthrie Menegola
HF: Duncan Hawkins Simpson
F: Miers Cameron Close
Foll: Stanley Dangerfield Narkle
Int: O'Connor Henry Kreuger Fogarty

Ins: Cameron Close Narkle Kreuger Fogarty
Out: Taylor Ablett Dahlhaus Tuohy Rohan

Curious about Clark.
Given he didn't make your emergency list, you are thinking trade?

 

[Moggy]

The thing is ... Scott is very good..most of the team is good to very good. I doubt we fall away to quickly, especially if we add the likes of the players we have been linked to ... 2021 and beyond... I think it will be challenging for a while unless we unearth a few super high end players,

I totally agree about the talent gap, but I think we can go close again next year... perhaps give ourselves a 1-in-5 chance against the Tiges in a GF as a best case.

 

[winty]

Curious about Clark.
Given he didn't make your emergency list, you are thinking trade?

If the rumour about Freo offering pick 10 for him and a 2nd rounder is true, then yeah. Word is he wants to stay at the club though, so I might have to revisit that team.

 

[Turbocat]

If the rumour about Freo offering pick 10 for him and a 2nd rounder is true, then yeah. Word is he wants to stay at the club though, so I might have to revisit that team.

p10 and r2 this year or in 2021? I think they have 10 and 28 this year.

Anyway it seems club an him are happy so he looks likely to stay, another 12 months of game and training ..its probably a bit like Kelly ..he may lose value or he may hold or be better.

 

[Moggy]

I am torn between going again one more time, or pruning back to promote new growth.
With Hawk still performing, we would be more than likely to finish top 8 again, quite possibly top 4, but there is still the elephant in the room wearing a yellow sash.

In any case, it looks certain that we will top up and try again.

I can live with this, but when is it no longer a viable strategy?
When Hawk and Sel are done? When Danger is done? When Cameron (if he comes) is done?

Surely, the talented core is dwindling, and there is no sign of the next core group of A-grade players as of yet. Furthermore, if we block the path of our current youth with the likes of Higgins and Smith, we might set ourselves back another 2 or three years - which is worth it as long as we win a flag.
A risky strategy to say the least.

 

[Mad_Hatter]

Hawkins is our key. Once he starts to slide we should bite the bullet and look to rebuild.
I certainly don't mean hit the draft and trade out older players, but prioritise the future over the present.

 

[Partridge]

I am torn between going again one more time, or pruning back to promote new growth.
With Hawk still performing, we would be more than likely to finish top 8 again, quite possibly top 4, but there is still the elephant in the room wearing a yellow sash.

In any case, it looks certain that we will top up and try again.

I can live with this, but when is it no longer a viable strategy?
When Hawk and Sel are done? When Danger is done? When Cameron (if he comes) is done?

Surely, the talented core is dwindling, and there is no sign of the next core group of A-grade players as of yet. Furthermore, if we block the path of our current youth with the likes of Higgins and Smith, we might set ourselves back another 2 or three years - which is worth it as long as we win a flag.
A risky strategy to say the least.

We're getting very close to that stage already. Those three aren't the worst problems (although I'm suspecting Selwood is in trouble), but it's other veterans that just don't fire shots in finals who will be always in the senior team that are bigger issues. Rohan and Tuohy particularly, and he was great this year, but Henderson is another who won't have too long left.

 

[ATSAM]

I totally agree about the talent gap, but I think we can go close again next year... perhaps give ourselves a 1-in-5 chance against the Tiges in a GF as a best case.

I don't want to go close again next year. Lets take a breather aim for top 8 with some kids who then have chance of nailing it in 22/23

 

[Turbocat]

I don't want to go close again next year. Lets take a breather aim for top 8 with some kids who then have chance of nailing it in 22/23

will not happen..they will top up again .Cameron and a full team of players we have been linked to. Higgins and Smith in the their 30's... we are not thinking breather

 

[Farmer2Goggin]

If the rumour about Freo offering pick 10 for him and a 2nd rounder is true, then yeah. Word is he wants to stay at the club though, so I might have to revisit that team.

Really hope Jordan stays , fantastic kid with high end talent in areas we desperately need.
Reading between the lines he may have found hub life difficult, it was also mentioned he hadn't come prepared as well as he could have for the new season.
Whatever the circumstances I hope he is in a good place and reaches his potential with the Cats.

 

[Chinacats]

We need midfield depth. We wanted to play Paddy both up forward and in the middle. Cameron helps with the F50, but danger will play down there too for a rest /management in a 22 game season. Finals will be back at MCG, so we need young midfield speed. Old legs couldnt get it done at the GABBA wont get it done in a longer season on a bigger ground. Need at least 5-6 young players to get into best 22 next year.

 

[Partridge]

We need midfield depth. We wanted to play Paddy both up forward and in the middle. Cameron helps with the F50, but danger will play down there too for a rest /management in a 22 game season. Finals will be back at MCG, so we need young midfield speed. Old legs couldnt get it done at the GABBA wont get it done in a longer season on a bigger ground. Need at least 5-6 young players to get into best 22 next year.

There's another unpleasant reality with Dangerfield this season. Even when he was the midfield, he was not having the impact he used to and getting caught more than I can ever remember (happened again on Saturday night too). Three of the last six games were really tough midfield contests (Rd 17 v Richmond, QF v Port, GF v Richmond) and he had absolutely no impact. Telling ourselves that he's still the game's best midfielder than we can effortlessly move around the field whenever we please is dangerous and right now misguided thinking. He needs a better 2021.

 

[Sttew]

I wouldn't play Hendo, Higgins, Dahl or Rohan. Depth only.

Get Sav, Simpson, Narkle, Close, Jarvis etc in there instead

If Higgins is being recruited as insurance only why waste the time and draft picks (which is what you are getting at, I guess). If he can hold his own he should play.

Same ought to apply to Dal and Rohan. Too many games Dal was a non contributor. Rohan on the other hand is enigmatic. World beater one week and unsighted the next.

If Hendo can maintain his 2H 2020 form he is an automatic selection, IMO

 

[4quarter_cat]

I see can see Dangerfield moving into the forwardline more permenantly. Suppose he worked on the pressure side of his game, and goal kicking over summer he could end up being a better, more reliable version of Rohan.