List Mgmt. 2021 Trade Thread - Part II

[George]

Continued in Part III

List Mgmt. - 2021 Trade Thread - Part III

We are onto Part 3.

www.bigfooty.com

Delisted;
Oscar Clavarino

38

Oscar Clavarino

Age

26

Ht

197cm

Wt

89kg

Pos.

Def

No player stats available

Sam Alabakis

45

Sam Alabakis

Age

28

Ht

211cm

Wt

105kg

Pos.

Ruck

No player stats available

Traded;
-

Retired;
Jake Carlisle

2

Jake Carlisle

Age

34

Ht

200cm

Wt

106kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

13.6

3star

K

8.7

3star

HB

4.9

4star

M

6.2

5star

T

1.6

4star

MG

116.3

2star

D

11.7

3star

K

8.4

3star

HB

3.3

2star

M

5.9

5star

T

1.1

2star

MG

116.3

2star

D

12.4

4star

K

6.4

3star

HB

6.0

4star

M

6.6

5star

T

0.8

3star

Dylan Roberton

17

Dylan Roberton

Age

34

Ht

194cm

Wt

94kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

17.1

4star

K

11.4

4star

HB

5.8

4star

M

4.8

5star

T

1.9

4star

MG

373.2

5star

D

8.0

2star

K

7.0

3star

HB

1.0

1star

M

1.0

1star

T

0.0

1star

MG

215.0

3star

D

14.6

4star

K

10.2

4star

HB

4.4

4star

M

4.6

5star

T

1.6

4star

Shaun McKernan

27

Shaun Mckernan

Age

35

Ht

196cm

Wt

100kg

Pos.

F/R

Career

Season

Last 5

D

13.0

3star

K

8.3

3star

HB

4.7

3star

M

4.5

4star

T

1.8

4star

G

1.0

4star

D

8.4

2star

K

5.6

2star

HB

2.8

2star

M

3.6

4star

T

1.6

3star

G

1.0

4star

D

17.0

5star

K

8.2

4star

HB

8.8

5star

M

3.6

4star

T

1.2

3star

G

0.2

3star

James Frawley

24

James Frawley

Age

37

Ht

193cm

Wt

96kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

14.2

4star

K

9.2

4star

HB

5.1

4star

M

5.1

5star

T

1.9

4star

MG

135.4

2star

D

8.7

2star

K

6.0

2star

HB

2.7

2star

M

3.0

3star

T

0.9

2star

MG

135.4

2star

D

9.0

3star

K

4.0

2star

HB

5.0

4star

M

1.8

2star

T

1.2

3star

Current Players Out of Contract;
7. Luke Dunstan

27

Luke Dunstan

Age

30

Ht

185cm

Wt

86kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

20.7

5star

K

10.1

4star

HB

10.6

5star

M

3.3

3star

T

4.8

5star

CL

4.4

5star

D

21.0

5star

K

13.0

5star

HB

8.0

4star

M

3.0

3star

T

9.0

5star

CL

2.0

4star

D

18.2

5star

K

6.0

3star

HB

12.2

5star

M

2.4

3star

T

6.2

5star

CL

4.2

5star

(RFA) - Link
13. Jack Lonie

13

Jack Lonie

Age

29

Ht

175cm

Wt

70kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.5

3star

K

7.8

3star

HB

4.7

3star

M

3.1

3star

T

2.8

4star

G

0.9

4star

D

10.7

3star

K

7.9

3star

HB

2.9

2star

M

3.7

4star

T

2.6

4star

G

0.7

4star

D

13.4

4star

K

9.0

4star

HB

4.4

4star

M

2.8

3star

T

3.2

5star

G

1.0

4star

- Link
25. Dean Kent

25

Dean Kent

Age

31

Ht

181cm

Wt

83kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.7

3star

K

8.3

3star

HB

4.5

3star

M

3.4

3star

T

2.3

4star

G

1.0

4star

D

10.4

3star

K

7.8

3star

HB

2.6

2star

M

3.6

4star

T

3.0

4star

G

1.2

5star

D

7.6

2star

K

5.4

2star

HB

2.2

2star

M

2.0

3star

T

3.0

5star

G

0.6

3star

- Link
39. Darragh Joyce

41

Darragh Joyce

Age

28

Ht

195cm

Wt

96kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

11.4

3star

K

6.8

3star

HB

4.6

3star

M

1.8

2star

T

1.4

3star

MG

207.6

3star

No current season stats available

D

11.4

3star

K

6.8

3star

HB

4.6

4star

M

1.8

2star

T

1.4

4star

MG

207.6

4star

- Link
41. Paul Hunter

41

Paul Hunter

Age

32

Ht

200cm

Wt

104kg

Pos.

Ruck

No player stats available

- Link


To see the full list (it gets updated regularly) visit this thread;

List & Contract Status

SENIOR LIST 1. Jack Higgins 2. Marcus Windhager 3. Zak Jones 4. Lance Collard 5. Brad Crouch 6. Sebastian Ross 7. Nasiah Wanganeen-Milera 8. Bradley Hill 9. Jack Steele 10. Mitchito Owens 11. Hunter Clark 12. Max King 13. Ryan Byrnes 14. Liam Stocker 15. Paddy Dow 16. Daniel Butler 17. Isaac...

www.bigfooty.com

Restricted and Unrestricted Free Agency Window
Friday October 1 – Friday October 8

Trade Period
Players: Monday October 4 – Wednesday October 13
Picks: Monday October 4 – tbc (approx. Friday November 19)

List Lodgement 1
tbc (approx. Thursday October 28)

Delisted Free Agency Window 1
tbc (approx. Friday October 29 - Monday November 8)

List Lodgement 2 (Final date for primary list delistings)
tbc (approx. Tuesday November 9)

Delisted Free Agency Window 2
tbc (approx. Wednesday November 10 - Friday November 19)

 

[Groater]

Need another good pick in the draft- the cupboard is a bit bare

It would be great to have a few in the 20/30/40s range. There could be some real gold deeper in the draft given the lack of exposed form.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Trade Radio just discussing clubs, including Essendon, making calls to the Saints about Ben Long.

Oh please be true!

Edit* BrutThough beat me to it.

Hard-nut Saint draws interest from Vic rivals despite contract

Defender Ben Long is believed to be happy at St Kilda but that hasn't stopped other clubs asking questions

www.afl.com.au

 

[gringo2011]

This is it exactly. How much more of an oppurtunity can a young bloke get. the club is copping critisism for moving on a player whom basically Bytel will step in for.
I know it is a bit more complicated than that. Bytel is a bit more mobile than Dunstan and should be able to play the Crouch role that he played in the latter half as a HF going through the guts. he can also go forward. But basically he is a mid predominately.

I don't think this is a pivotal year for him but he has no excuse not to be the fittest he has ever been and string together a large number of consistent games a where he is getting 20 plus possessions. We need to see the development onver2022.

I reckon this is the plan but I reckon Melbourne winning will make the Saints fans even more restless. Watch the backlash next year if we miss finals again. They'll demand that Ratts goes and at some point Ratts will start to coach for his future not the clubs future. I'm still not convinced on their list management yet. We're always busy but yet to see much reward for it all.

I think they feel like they have rebuilt without telling anyone starting 3 years ago but not really laid out a roadmap. It's a great way to disenfranchise people and make them think you are doing it all wrong. They president said we were playing finals this year and again next year. That's not a great idea IMO and seems to be going against they way the list managers are going. We possibly have a plan to build around two King brothers and everything before then is just standing still but they don't articulate it.

Bytel is a single position player and really would have been ideal to develop in the VFL until he was ready come in and be a best 22 player straight away. The 2 missed VFL seasons made that impossible unfortunately. Dunny going is clearing path but we might be pushing him into the deep end before he's learnt to swim. Time will tell I guess.

 

[FQFjt]

If there’s any lesson from the Dees premiership it’s that you have to draft well. Petracca, Olliver, Gawn, Salem, Fritsch... most of their front line stars outside of May and Lever were sourced via the Draft. I can’t really say the same for us, our best players have primarily come via trade and that’s a blight on the clubs drafting and development.

Correlation isn't causation.

 

[gringo2011]

Bytels numbers are pretty bog standard for effectively a second year player. I think someone on the forum put up his numbers against lennys and they were almost the same. That’s not a knock on him. I think he is actually tracking really well. Big preseason and he should start round one in the middle

I followed early Lenny Hayes, Lenny even before he became a gun had an intangible quality. I haven't seen that in Bytel yet. Bytel reminds me more of Steele. I thought Steele was going to be a good solid tagger that sat somewhere between B and C grade. When he went on ball he seemed to go to all the wrong spots and almost needed to be lead to the ball by an opponent. A switch seemed to flick at some point and he exploded. Hopefully that's Bytel as well.

 

[bergholt]

Hard-nut Saint draws interest from Vic rivals despite contract

Defender Ben Long is believed to be happy at St Kilda but that hasn't stopped other clubs asking questions

www.afl.com.au

Pick inside 30: take it and run
Pick 30 - 40: maybe
Pick 40+: probably not

 

[bird_man]

It would be great to have a few in the 20/30/40s range. There could be some real gold deeper in the draft given the lack of exposed form.

Any pick past 25-30 will likely get used on academy selections.

If we want picks to use in the live draft, we probably need to target a top 20 pick to be sure we could use it

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Pick inside 30: take it and run
Pick 30 - 40: maybe
Pick 40+: probably not

Future 2nd would do it for me.

Pick 30-40 this year likely to be eaten by a NGA, i'd rather chew up our later picks this year, then downgrade our second next year.

 

[Pardon me]

Bombers have picks 48, 53 and 80 something and 1 pick in the first round prior to that. They'd have to do some fancy work to get us a pick for a player that is contracted and played 15 games.
Dont see it happening.

 

[gringo2011]

This is just my opinion but Hunter's build, that of skinny legs and a keg chest say to me that he's never gonna be the fast or burst athlete that you're looking for.
His long gate allows his high cruising speed but with that he loses on top speed and acceleration.

If you're gonna assess him on athletic performances l think you're gonna be perennially disappointed.
And whist l agree he needs to be fitter and stronger l also think it's about using him properly which didn't happen this year largely because of injuries.

One thing I'm sure about is that our midfield is extremely dysfunctional when compared against the GF teams. No real surprise if you look at the number of games played together. But to me the lack of cohesion is costing us at least %20 in effectiveness and that will only be solved with time.

And that right there is why he's cruising around as an unaccountable distributing back man. We have to find the best use for him. He's probably got play that hybrid wing role like DMac and Byrnes do if he can't be a prime mover mid. He's probably not accountable enough to play inside mid unless he pushes up his contested ball winning count to be like a Clayton Oliver type and then that stops him using his super power which is poise in traffic. It will be interesting to see how he's developed. He's got too much talent not to be a gun but it will come down to how we find the best use for him. Agree with the wind up long striding gait, that's sums him up well. He gallops more than bursts.

 

[gringo2011]

Pretty spot on with that. He screams out hff to me, he has got good skills and would be hard to match up on.

I think t was the Hawks game where he slotted a freakish goal. I wouldn't mind seeing him in the forward half.

 

[TheEnsign]

If there’s any lesson from the Dees premiership it’s that you have to draft well. Petracca, Olliver, Gawn, Salem, Fritsch... most of their front line stars outside of May and Lever were sourced via the Draft. I can’t really say the same for us, our best players have primarily come via trade and that’s a blight on the clubs drafting and development.

I don't entirely agree, but that said we have drafted incredibly poorly in the midfield over the last decade and this bleeds over into 'we draft poorly' because a poor midfield means you just can't win enough games.

Not sure if something changed in our setup but the period of ~2010 - 2016 was generally awful drafting; but from 2017 onwards I think we have done excellently - we've drafted all of Clark/Coff/Paton/Wilkie/Highmore/King/Paton/Sharman/Bytel/Byrnes/Connolly. Plus Hind who has shown he can be really good when used correctly so that's on the coaching, not drafting.

The jury is still out on basically all the above in terms of ceiling and to an extent 'will they make it' (except Wilkie; and for King the conversation is more where is his ceiling) - but that's half a best 22 in four drafts and all look very likely.

I guess we'll find out in a couple of years.

 

[11men1cup]

If we can get a pick in the 30s for long, I'd take it. He's decent, but way to frustrating to keep on a list imo. He's always a fair chance of getting suspended. Makes way too many mistakes

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[gringo2011]

I was hungover as fu** yesterday so I decided to lay on the couch and watch our round one game.

There was on instance where Clark was at the back of a stoppage and ended up with the footy about 70 out. He just effortessy turned onto his left foot and put a neat little pass into the only space inside 50 for Membrey to run onto.

Not sure we have anyone else in our midfield that can do that.

He also showed his ability to win the contest footy (12) and clearances (7)

That was the last full game he played as a mid. He didn't even get the opportunity to go into half the amount of centre bounces in any other game as he did against the Giants.

He may well have to get fitter and work harder, but to me he seems the most likely to make a difference in our midfield that anyone on our list.

Petracca was a fat lazy player 2 years ago.

I agree on Clark but I think the idea that Petracca was fat and lazy is hyperbole. Dees mates always swore he was on his way to mega stardom. He wasn't the player he was until he started taking more time in the middle but I think like Steele he was a good player who became a great player at about the same time. Petracca had a very handy habit of being ordinary against us but he played some very good games before 2020.

 

[Groater]

Any pick past 25-30 will likely get used on academy selections.

If we want picks to use in the live draft, we probably need to target a top 20 pick to be sure we could use it

Ah right, of course. I suppose we could trade on the night, but it would have to be with future draft picks.

 

[XhazzafootyX]

I’m okay with ben long

22

Ben Long

Age

28

Ht

186cm

Wt

81kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

10.9

3star

K

6.2

2star

HB

4.7

3star

M

3.3

3star

T

2.7

4star

G

0.7

4star

D

12.8

3star

K

6.7

3star

HB

6.2

4star

M

3.3

3star

T

2.3

3star

G

0.0

1star

D

13.4

4star

K

6.8

3star

HB

6.6

4star

M

3.2

4star

T

3.2

5star

G

0.6

3star

leaving

 

[TheEnsign]

If we can get a pick in the 30s for long, I'd take it. He's decent, but way to frustrating to keep on a list imo. He's always a fair chance of getting suspended. Makes way too many mistakes

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using BigFooty.com mobile app

Agree. If Paton comes back at full fitness then lockdown small defender role isn't available; we need to find minutes for the likes of Byrnes and Connolly at AFL level to help their development and I'd rather they had the minutes doing whatever role that Long would otherwise be doing.

Could be good for us, Essendon need some mongrel and he certainly provides that; plus they might overpay a little due to confidence from the Hind trade.

 

[Yawkey way]

Long is a guy who could make us sorry we traded him, I’m not interested in junk picks so second round or jog on.

 

[moirae42]

Unless its under 30 I would be hanging onto Long for depth... at worst.

 

[FQFjt]

I think we tend to forget how good Clark and Coff have looked. Really bullish on both of them and think they can be top 20 players in the comp.

Coff had a really poor season but by season's end he looked very solid again. Clark's was ruined by injury but he did things again that just screamed elite to me.

Clark and Coff got early games based on talent and being top 10 picks. They performed well, per the standard expected of debutants, and maybe even exceeded expectations. But then they seemed to get a bit lazy. Especially fruit toast Coffield, who I imagine thought that after finishing 5th in the BNF after 2020 that he had it all worked out. Turns out that neither of them entered season 2021 anywhere near fit enough. The positive is that this can be remedied, and quickly. But do they have the ambition and the appetite? Time will tell.

Don't take any of this from me, Gallagher basically said this on the public record.

 

[Sainter1873]

I would trade Long. For me he’s not quite good enough and doesn’t really fit in anywhere. Yes he was solid last year but I think we have better defenders now. We also need to start acquiring some picks in the second and third rounds for the NGA kids.

 

[gringo2011]

From Mitch Cleary, Essendon and other clubs asking about Ben Long.

he honestly looks like he's not happy at the Saints. I think he's gone backwards so far that it's almost better to let him go. He could be a really painful one to watch tear it up at another club but it looks like he's clocked out with us. Someone suggested he was cocky in the off season and it looks like he hasn't taken the criticism well. You'd want something decent back though, no Hind type shit.

 

[bird_man]

I agree on Clark but I think the idea that Petracca was fat and lazy is hyperbole. Dees mates always swore he was on his way to mega stardom. He wasn't the player he was until he started taking more time in the middle but I think like Steele he was a good player who became a great player at about the same time. Petracca had a very handy habit of being ordinary against us but he played some very good games before 2020.

It was heavily reported that people thought his fitness wasn't up to scratch and in the 2019-20 off season he completely changed his habits and worked his arse off to get fit and ripped.

The same off season Darren Burgess came to the club.

I highly doubt it was just a coincidence that was his break out year.

He wasn't getting the time in the middle prior to that because he didn't have the tank.

 

[bird_man]

I agree on Clark but I think the idea that Petracca was fat and lazy is hyperbole. Dees mates always swore he was on his way to mega stardom. He wasn't the player he was until he started taking more time in the middle but I think like Steele he was a good player who became a great player at about the same time. Petracca had a very handy habit of being ordinary against us but he played some very good games before 2020.

It was heavily reported that people thought his fitness wasn't up to scratch and in the 2019-20 off season he completely changed his habits and worked his arse off to get fit and ripped.

The same off season Darren Burgess came to the club.

I highly doubt it was just a coincidence that was his break out year.

He wasn't getting the time in the middle prior to that because he didn't have the tank.

 

[gringo2011]

Unless its under 30 I would be hanging onto Long for depth... at worst.

I'd rather keep Long than Lonie to be honest.