2023 Brownlow Medal

[Shadow89]

Or Neale 3 votes in a game he had 20 disposals & 4 tackles, while the following efforts from the same match were all overlooked:

• 41 disposals & 4 tackles; 7 coaches votes
• 38 disposals & 8 tackles; 2 coaches votes
• 27 disposals & 6 rebound 50s; 2 coaches votes
• 20 disposals & 4 goals; 1 coaches vote

Along with a couple of other defenders in the votes

If Neale doesn't head scratchingly get votes that match, Bont wins

Edit - did I forget to add that Neale didn't get a single coaches vote in this match...

I'm all over this on the main board. Everyone is in the same boat...except predictably the Brions supporters who somehow think that the umpires have a 'different perspective'...and vote on mids...even though there were 2 mids in that game who were vastly better than him.

Absolute joke this year. Even Lachie doesn't think he should have won:

 

[Spearman]

Wow thought Bont had a better year ..bit rigged ...

If he plays in a requisite number of games and doesn't fall off a cliff, Bont will win next year. Put your money on it.

 

[terry_bright]

Lachie Neale

9

Lachie Neale

Age

30

Ht

178cm

Wt

84kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

27.0

5star

K

11.5

4star

HB

15.5

5star

M

4.0

4star

T

3.7

5star

CL

5.9

5star

D

28.3

5star

K

13.9

5star

HB

14.4

5star

M

4.6

4star

T

4.0

5star

CL

5.9

5star

D

12.0

3star

K

4.6

2star

HB

7.4

5star

M

2.0

3star

T

1.0

3star

CL

0.4

3star

’s win cements the Brownlow as the most overrated award in sport.
Joins a long list of undeserving winners in the last 25 years.
For this award to have any credibility it has to be taken out of the hands of the umpires.

 

[year of the cat]

Geelong players collectively received the third lowest votes of any club. Only WC and Nth scored fewer votes.

 

[feelinfeline]

Lachie looked embarrassed, but the Brownlow has always been a lottery. I think the year Keith Greig won his first Brownlow he finished fourth in North's B&F.

The problem is there's no simple solution or they would have changed it years ago. Who would vote for it? Media, coaches and players all have their own awards.

 

[year of the cat]

Lachie looked embarrassed, but the Brownlow has always been a lottery. I think the year Keith Greig won his first Brownlow he finished fourth in North's B&F.

The problem is there's no simple solution or they would have changed it years ago. Who would vote for it? Media, coaches and players all have their own awards.

There’s been a litany of surprise winners going back decades. Greig as you mentioned . Woewodin, Liberatore, Judd (2nd win), Priddis, Paul Kelly, Graham Teasdale etc etc. Richmond fans particularly incensed with the latter as KB was a strong fancy that night (should possibly have won in ‘74 as well when Greig did).

That’s the Brownlow. There’s as many surprises as there are favs getting up.

 

[Mr Meow]

Interestingly if you converted the coaches votes to "Brownlow mode" (top 3 players get 3, 2, 1) it would come out like this

Cameron: 12
Stewart: 11
Dangerfield: 10

I doubt the umpires have been as generous (especially with Stewart. Umpires are more stingy on defender votes than coaches), but it will be interesting to see how far off these tallies they are.

Well this wasn't too bad of a guide. Dangerfield might have struggled a bit after the rib injury but 12 votes from 18 games (a few he got injured in or clearly played hampered) is a more than respectable effort for a 33 year old. Twice as many as Pendlebury.

Cameron could've saved our season if he maintained that hot start. He gave it a pulse to begin with and then frustrated. I wonder if the shoulder was his only injury or if something else plagued him a bit earlier.

As expected, Stewart did much better with the coaches than umpires. Not many defenders polled well. That's the Brownlow for you.

 

[Vdubs]

Miers is a forward who kicked 7 goals for the entire season. In a side that didn't make finals. Doesn't scream vote winner to me.

Ratugolea was never going to get a vote. Only media-anointed star defenders get votes now, and that isn't him.

I mentioned Sav because, iirc, he got 10 coaches votes at least once, maybe twice, and Miers because other non Cat supporters mentioned him several times to me this year. Miers had a good season, but also reflects our poor season that he will go close to B & F.

 

[Sticksman]

Maybe Gulden didn't show the umps what they consider 'sufficient respect'. I am sure these control freaks would allow that to influence their votes. Umps should be stripped of allocating Brownlow votes. These are the people who gave the whole Geelong team just 4 free kicks in a whole game late in the season. That is industrial strength bias.

 

[Vdubs]

If he plays in a requisite number of games and doesn't fall off a cliff, Bont will win next year. Put your money on it.

Player called Nick Daicos will challenge, surely

 

[Vdubs]

Or Neale 3 votes in a game he had 20 disposals & 4 tackles, while the following efforts from the same match were all overlooked:

• 41 disposals & 4 tackles; 7 coaches votes
• 38 disposals & 8 tackles; 2 coaches votes
• 27 disposals & 6 rebound 50s; 2 coaches votes
• 20 disposals & 4 goals; 1 coaches vote

Along with a couple of other defenders in the votes

If Neale doesn't head scratchingly get votes that match, Bont wins

Edit - did I forget to add that Neale didn't get a single coaches vote in this match...

Given that Lethal Matthews, Ablett snr, Carey, Whitten, Barassi, have never won a Brownlow- all arguably in the top 10 of all time- let's just accept that the umpires regard fairest > best?

 

[rocker_oz33]

Given that Lethal Matthews, Ablett snr, Carey, Whitten, Barassi, have never won a Brownlow- all arguably in the top 10 of all time- let's just accept that the umpires regard fairest > best?

Imagine losing a Brownlow because of a tackle, not sling .

Eg close or Sicily types of tackle ..

 

[Partridge]

Given that Lethal Matthews, Ablett snr, Carey, Whitten, Barassi, have never won a Brownlow- all arguably in the top 10 of all time- let's just accept that the umpires regard fairest > best?

I'd prefer to think in a game where it has gotten faster and faster, the amount of umpires has increased from 2 to 3 and then to 4, not to mention having to keep up with an unending amount of ridiculous and unnecessary rule changes, perhaps they've already got too much to do?

It's very similar to how boxing was when the referee would vote on the rounds as well. Wisely abandoned.

 

[Mr Meow]

I mentioned Sav because, iirc, he got 10 coaches votes at least once, maybe twice, and Miers because other non Cat supporters mentioned him several times to me this year. Miers had a good season, but also reflects our poor season that he will go close to B & F.

Sidenote, as we have had this late age Dusty Vs Pendles vs Danger discussion throughout the year.

Were you surprised that Dangerfield played less games, had more injury concerns but almost polled as many Brownlow votes as Martin and Pendlebury combined? And this was with his late Collingwood game not getting a vote despite 12 score involvements. Pretty impressive stuff.

He is 14 votes off Ablett for 1st in all time Brownlow votes (Dangerfield 2nd, Pendlebury 6th, Martin 8th). Danger almost certainly won't catch Ablett but he's put together a hell of a catalogue.

 

[Baudolino]

Geelong players collectively received the third lowest votes of any club. Only WC and Nth scored fewer votes.

Not surprising really. It's a midfielder award and this year our midfield was trash.

 

[Spearman]

Player called Nick Daicos will challenge, surely

He could very well, but I can see them getting it to Bont since he may have been robbed.

 

[rocker_oz33]

 

[Partridge]

Sidenote, as we have had this late age Dusty Vs Pendles vs Danger discussion throughout the year.

Were you surprised that Dangerfield played less games, had more injury concerns but almost polled as many Brownlow votes as Martin and Pendlebury combined? And this was with his late Collingwood game not getting a vote despite 12 score involvements. Pretty impressive stuff.

He is 14 votes off Ablett for 1st in all time Brownlow votes (Dangerfield 2nd, Pendlebury 6th, Martin 8th). Danger almost certainly won't catch Ablett but he's put together a hell of a catalogue.

Not Pendlebury, as he's been declining for ages now (studiously ignored by the entire footy media), but I thought Martin was very stiff in a couple of games where he was clear BOG. Was roundabout the mark over all.

Having said that, the way they vote now makes it very different to past players. McLaughlin gushing over Daicos as no second year player had ever polled so many votes, you'd think there's never been good second year players before. I wonder if anyone bothered to tell the clown there have been second year WINNERS of the Brownlow.

 

[Hinkley29]

I might be in the minority but I like the fact the umpires award it without looking at stats simply going by the feel of the game.
Try awarding best players when you see a game live and see how it differs from possession getters.

It’s a unique perspective because they are out there and obviously see how the players interact with officials and each other.

I am pretty sure that the umpires do have access to the stats after the game when doing their votes. I think this changed a few years back and is why we now get the same pool of players getting the votes every week.

When the umps didn’t check the stats you used to get a much wider spread of votes and you were a real chance to win the award with 18-22 votes. These days if you aren’t in the very high 20’s or 30’s you really have no chance to win.

 

[Pollywaffle]

Given that Lethal Matthews, Ablett snr, Carey, Whitten, Barassi, have never won a Brownlow- all arguably in the top 10 of all time- let's just accept that the umpires regard fairest > best?

Correct. There are plenty of other accolades for players.
It is the ‘umpires medal’ after all and it is logical that they would view things this way. Gives it a point of difference.
‘Neale receives a lot of attention from stoppers, rarely retaliates, just puts his head down and plays.
Bont was a bit stiff though.

 

[gogeelongcats]

Lachie was paying $1.20 half way through the count. An extraordinary amount of money was placed on him.

I think there must have been a leak.

On the basis of performances after this several players would have been favoured more than him.

 

[Vdubs]

Sidenote, as we have had this late age Dusty Vs Pendles vs Danger discussion throughout the year.

Were you surprised that Dangerfield played less games, had more injury concerns but almost polled as many Brownlow votes as Martin and Pendlebury combined? And this was with his late Collingwood game not getting a vote despite 12 score involvements. Pretty impressive stuff.

He is 14 votes off Ablett for 1st in all time Brownlow votes (Dangerfield 2nd, Pendlebury 6th, Martin 8th). Danger almost certainly won't catch Ablett but he's put together a hell of a catalogue.

Danger's best is as good as any player in the comp, but we will see less and less of it each year. That was my only point, and to be expected. His game is way more physically taxing than the others, and have been told he does the bare minimum at training.
I was more concerned he dnw last year's NS.

Lachie was paying $1.20 half way through the count. An extraordinary amount of money was placed on him.

I think there must have been a leak.

On the basis of performances after this several players would have been favoured more than him.

May be, but Neale polled well early on, and was not necessarily expected to.
Either way, he was one of the favourites.
The angst about his win is possibly affecting those who bet on this for other favourites, for which I have zero care factor.

 

[Hamingja]

Lachie Neale’s win cements the Brownlow as the most overrated award in sport.
Joins a long list of undeserving winners in the last 25 years.
For this award to have any credibility it has to be taken out of the hands of the umpires.

Even if you restrict it to midfielders, the best midfielder has won it probably only 3 of the last 10 years.

 

[Vdubs]

Even if you restrict it to midfielders, the best midfielder has won it probably only 3 of the last 10 years.

How do YOU define who is the best midfielder in any season?
Who was it this year?
As a pure mid, it's hard to go past Neale.
Always inside, but uses it beautifully.
None of us sees every game, unless we have no lives.

The coaches' MVP voting system is flawed.
The players' MVP voting system is severely flawed.
The clubs' B&F voting is nuanced.

 

[Hamingja]

How do YOU define who is the best midfielder in any season?
Who was it this year?
As a pure mid, it's hard to go past Neale.
Always inside, but uses it beautifully.
None of us sees every game, unless we have no life.

The coaches' MVP voting system is flawed.
The players' MVP voting system is severely flawed.
The clubs' B&F voting is nuanced.

Daicos getting injured threw a spanner in the works granted but I would still have Bont & Petracca miles and miles above Neale