List Mgmt. 2023 List Management thread

[Snuffaluphagus]

Mod notice after Mr Bob did a lot of annoying work in moving days of posts out of here. As we are heading into offseason, this thread is for 2023 list management only. Getting upset on previous trades can be taken to the vent thread. Lets keep this thread on track in the part of the year it's actually relevant

 

[Polo342]

Nope.

The way he plays, is a perfect foil for Amiss.

His aggression, desperation, team first mentality and natural forward instincts are going to be vital if we want to go all the way.

I love all this yes. But at some point if he is going to take a Key forward spot he has to start kicking goals regularly.

 

[Wizard]

Bloody hard to know where to rate Treacy. He does look too good for WAFL, and is still young - but next year is his fourth in the AFL system and I reckon we will have more of an idea then. He really needs to improve his marking. Drops a lot of them for a tall forward. At the end of the day, he still has only kicked 15 goals for the year. Needs 30-40 to be a good centre half forward at AFL level. Mihocek has averaged 40 goals a year for the past 3 years. If he reaches Mihoceck level in the next 2/3 years it will go a long way towards us winning a premiership. It's a big if though.

Mihocek is also 30.
At JTs age he was still 4 years away from getting drafted.

 

[Alfonz]

Mcdonald is a big upgrade on Treacy. Is it possible most are over rating Treacy?

Maybe Treacy is being overrated. But it's also possible you are overrating McDonald. There is no clear cut evidence yet as to which player will turn out better. McDonald has performed better so far but that doesn't mean it will stay that way. And don't forget Treacy had his fitness ruined by glandular fever. Not sure what McDonald has had to deal with except a minor ankle injury he did against us.

I'd want to see another year or two from McDonald to make sure he keeps progressing, rather than turning out like Ryan Murphy for example. Who was another slowish, old school full forward that was the first KPF taken in his draft year. Murphy averaged 9.9 touches, 5.4 marks and 1.8 goals in his 3rd year, in which McDonald is currently averaging 9.7 touches, 4.3 marks and 1.6 goals.

 

[Wizard]

I love all this yes. But at some point if he is going to take a Key forward spot he has to start kicking goals regularly.

Remember Ash Hansen being the second key forward in an Eagles premiership side?
His best goal kicking season of his career was 24....

 

[Purple Suit]

Remember Ash Hansen being the second key forward in an Eagles premiership side?
His best goal kicking season of his career was 24....

People get too obsessed over goals with forwards. This was Collingwoods top 10 spread and they are favourite for the flag.

Rank	Name	Games	Total
1​	Brody Mihocek​	21​	44​
2​	Jamie Elliott​	21​	38​
3​	Bobby Hill​	21​	25​
4​	Ash Johnson​	15​	21​
5​	Nick Daicos​	20​	18​
6​	Daniel McStay​	12​	16​
6​	Josh Daicos​	23​	16​
6​	Beau McCreery​	22​	16​
6​	Mason Cox​	16​	16​
10​	Jordan De Goey​	18​	15​

Compared to Freo

Rank	Name	Games	Total
1​	Jye Amiss​	22​	41​
2​	Lachlan Schultz​	23​	33​
2​	Michael Walters​	20​	33​
4​	Michael Frederick​	19​	26​
5​	Luke Jackson​	23​	22​
6​	Sam Sturt​	14​	17​
7​	Sam Switkowski​	22​	16​
8​	Josh Treacy​	17​	15​
9​	Bailey Banfield​	14​	11​
9​	Andrew Brayshaw​	23​	11​

Exactly the same number from the top 10 goal kickers!

We need more goals from somewhere but it's probably midfield first and maybe another 5-10 from Treacy / Jackson each and eventually 60+ from Amiss.

Our forwardline is actually looking ok this year and in the right direction without the need to sell another farm.

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

Maybe Treacy is being overrated. But it's also possible you are overrating McDonald. There is no clear cut evidence yet as to which player will turn out better. McDonald has performed better so far but that doesn't mean it will stay that way. And don't forget Treacy had his fitness ruined by glandular fever. Not sure what McDonald has had to deal with except a minor ankle injury he did against us.

I'd want to see another year or two from McDonald to make sure he keeps progressing, rather than turning out like Ryan Murphy for example. Who was another slowish, old school full forward that was the first KPF taken in his draft year. Murphy averaged 9.9 touches, 5.4 marks and 1.8 goals in his 3rd year, in which McDonald is currently averaging 9.7 touches, 4.3 marks and 1.6 goals.

That’s really interesting comparing Murphy and McDonald because I was looking at KPFs and 30 goals for Logan this year is still pretty good and I thought maybe I’d been harsh on him. Will be interesting to see how he goes next year

 

[fnerd]

All this negative McDonald talk is missing one crucial point….

If wallsy rates the guy then who the **** are we to argue!!??

Enough BF expert smack talk and just let the great man get to work and bring Logan home!

 

[Docker82]

People get too obsessed over goals with forwards. This was Collingwoods top 10 spread and they are favourite for the flag.

Rank	Name	Games	Total
1​	Brody Mihocek​	21​	44​
2​	Jamie Elliott​	21​	38​
3​	Bobby Hill​	21​	25​
4​	Ash Johnson​	15​	21​
5​	Nick Daicos​	20​	18​
6​	Daniel McStay​	12​	16​
6​	Josh Daicos​	23​	16​
6​	Beau McCreery​	22​	16​
6​	Mason Cox​	16​	16​
10​	Jordan De Goey​	18​	15​

Compared to Freo

Rank	Name	Games	Total
1​	Jye Amiss​	22​	41​
2​	Lachlan Schultz​	23​	33​
2​	Michael Walters​	20​	33​
4​	Michael Frederick​	19​	26​
5​	Luke Jackson​	23​	22​
6​	Sam Sturt​	14​	17​
7​	Sam Switkowski​	22​	16​
8​	Josh Treacy​	17​	15​
9​	Bailey Banfield​	14​	11​
9​	Andrew Brayshaw​	23​	11​

Exactly the same number from the top 10 goal kickers!

We need more goals from somewhere but it's probably midfield first and maybe another 5-10 from Treacy / Jackson each and eventually 60+ from Amiss.

Our forwardline is actually looking ok this year and in the right direction without the need to sell another farm.

I've been saying this for a bit but our midfielders need to kick more goals. Brayshaw gets a tick in this area. For our other mids it's an area of improvement.

Look how many mids are in Collingwood's top ten compared to ours.

There's more forwards in our top ten goalkickers than we play each week. That's not great reading.

 

[Swiggy]

Mcdonald is a big upgrade on Treacy. Is it possible most are over rating Treacy?

Don’t need treacy to be a star, just need him to play a role, more games forward for Jackson & he could still be the one. If he starts holding his marks he could be anything

 

[Alfonz]

That’s really interesting comparing Murphy and McDonald because I was looking at KPFs and 30 goals for Logan this year is still pretty good and I thought maybe I’d been harsh on him. Will be interesting to see how he goes next year

Yeah, 30 goals is definitely pretty good. Murphy only played 12 games that year, so only made it to 22. But came into the team later in the year, even got 3 Brownlow votes from 5 goals, and also kicked 2.2 from 14 touches in a final. So it appeared that Murphy was looking good after his first 3 years, but ended up being a WAFL gun only. Old school leading player that lacked speed/agility, and that's why I am not sold on McDonald yet. Will be interesting to see how he goes against Carlton. I hope he kicks a bag.

 

[Taylor]

I've been saying this for a bit but our midfielders need to kick more goals. Brayshaw gets a tick in this area. For our other mids it's an area of improvement.

Look how many mids are in Collingwood's top ten compared to ours.

There's more forwards in our top ten goalkickers than we play each week. That's not great reading.

That's certainly one of our issues, taking a scan of the midfielders with the highest total shots on goal per game, the top twenty has:
Port - 3
Pies - 4

Fairly even spread.

Caleb Serong comes in first Fremantle mention at #38 - his goal accuracy is 19% ... but he sits 6th for goal assists.

That might not be a terrible result for us, we would rather he kicks his goals but he is creating more for others. It's the area he needs to improve on next for his first Brownlow Medal.

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

Yeah, 30 goals is definitely pretty good. Murphy only played 12 games that year, so only made it to 22. But came into the team later in the year, even got 3 Brownlow votes from 5 goals, and also kicked 2.2 from 14 touches in a final. So it appeared that Murphy was looking good after his first 3 years, but ended up being a WAFL gun only. Old school leading player that lacked speed/agility, and that's why I am not sold on McDonald yet. Will be interesting to see how he goes against Carlton. I hope he kicks a bag.

On the other hand, Larkey just kicked 70 goals as basically a mark / lead forward. McDonald could well end up like that if it all really clicks

 

[fnerd]

On the other hand, Larkey just kicked 70 goals as basically a mark / lead forward. McDonald could well end up like that if it all really clicks

Yea pretty narrow view of a certain type of player when Ben brown (quintessential lead/mark fwd) kicked what 60/70 goals for 3 years straight in some pretty average north sides.
Personally think Logan’s tracking just fine and will turn out to to be a very good AFL player

 

[MadMac]

I think the big name is Hogan

 

[Big Animal]

Just saying but JVR kicked 28 goals from 19 games in his first season. Could of have had him for Ras. Hope to God we don't sell another farm to bring in Logan when JVR was ours for the picking.

 

[Dockeroo]

Not convinced at all on Logan McD.
Can someone point me to his career best game?
I can remember watching him quite a bit in the last 3 years and he’s been anonymous in games for large portions of that time.
He was dropped for the GF last year.
How much better is he than Treacy? Maybe a little bit.

But how much better is Sam Taylor

15

Sam Taylor

Age

26

Ht

198cm

Wt

95kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

10.0

3star

K

4.6

2star

HB

5.4

4star

M

3.3

3star

T

2.1

4star

MG

130.5

2star

D

8.0

2star

K

2.5

1star

HB

5.5

3star

M

2.8

3star

T

2.5

3star

MG

60.8

1star

D

8.6

3star

K

3.0

1star

HB

5.6

4star

M

1.2

2star

T

2.8

5star

MG

110.8

2star

than our current KPD? Massively so - a huge upgrade.
I’d prefer spend the cash on Taylor.

Also how much would we need to pay Logan? He would be looking for a 7 year deal on $900k I reckon. Jeez that’s a lot for what we would be getting

 

[GingerDocker]

Not convinced at all on Logan McD.
Can someone point me to his career best game?
I can remember watching him quite a bit in the last 3 years and he’s been anonymous in games for large portions of that time.
He was dropped for the GF last year.
How much better is he than Treacy? Maybe a little bit.

But how much better is Sam Taylor than our current KPD? Massively so - a huge upgrade.
I’d prefer spend the cash on Taylor.

Also how much would we need to pay Logan? He would be looking for a 7 year deal on $900k I reckon. Jeez that’s a lot for what we would be getting

Taylor is about the only KPP that I'd go hard for if we had the chance.

That includes McDonald, Naughton and any other name I've seen mentioned recently.

 

[CaseySibosadoHOF]

Also how much would we need to pay Logan? He would be looking for a 7 year deal on $900k I reckon. Jeez that’s a lot for what we would be getting

That's a WILD overestimation. I know wallsy doesn't play hard to get when it comes to those dream targets of his, but I can't see the same list management team that didn't pay Acres below league average salary giving Logan top 5 key fwd in the AFL money.

 

[Nickos66]

People get too obsessed over goals with forwards. This was Collingwoods top 10 spread and they are favourite for the flag.

Rank	Name	Games	Total
1​	Brody Mihocek​	21​	44​
2​	Jamie Elliott​	21​	38​
3​	Bobby Hill​	21​	25​
4​	Ash Johnson​	15​	21​
5​	Nick Daicos​	20​	18​
6​	Daniel McStay​	12​	16​
6​	Josh Daicos​	23​	16​
6​	Beau McCreery​	22​	16​
6​	Mason Cox​	16​	16​
10​	Jordan De Goey​	18​	15​

Compared to Freo

Rank	Name	Games	Total
1​	Jye Amiss​	22​	41​
2​	Lachlan Schultz​	23​	33​
2​	Michael Walters​	20​	33​
4​	Michael Frederick​	19​	26​
5​	Luke Jackson​	23​	22​
6​	Sam Sturt​	14​	17​
7​	Sam Switkowski​	22​	16​
8​	Josh Treacy​	17​	15​
9​	Bailey Banfield​	14​	11​
9​	Andrew Brayshaw​	23​	11​

Exactly the same number from the top 10 goal kickers!

We need more goals from somewhere but it's probably midfield first and maybe another 5-10 from Treacy / Jackson each and eventually 60+ from Amiss.

Our forwardline is actually looking ok this year and in the right direction without the need to sell another farm.

Pretty much this.

Look at the Coleman medallist in Curnow. His foil up forward in Mackay - he kicked like 20something goals for the year, which is down by his standards, but it's seen him take a lot of attention off Charlie, and their midfield has seen an even spread of goals also.

I think Treacy is performing his role well, and will only get better - he doesn't NEED to kick 50+ to be a success, as long as he continues doing his job and providing us an alternate option, throwing his body around and taking some hitouts, while also not chewing a hole through our salary cap.

But also, for the club to go forward successfully - our midfield really needs to up their goal scoring potency. All the premiership sides have midfields capable of getting off the chain in front of goal.

 

[Dockeroo]

That's a WILD overestimation. I know wallsy doesn't play hard to get when it comes to those dream targets of his, but I can't see the same list management team that didn't pay Acres below league average salary giving Logan top 5 key fwd in the AFL money.

I’m not so sure it’s that much over the odds.

• We will have to pay a lot overs to prise someone out of Sydney
• there is an increase in the cap of several percent coming in over the next year
• he was a former pick 4 we have chased hard

I didn’t think Luke jackson would be coming back here for $900k in his 4th season either.
I would say we will definitely have to pay $750-800k to land him.

 

[ignoramus]

I've been saying this for a bit but our midfielders need to kick more goals. Brayshaw gets a tick in this area. For our other mids it's an area of improvement.

Look how many mids are in Collingwood's top ten compared to ours.

There's more forwards in our top ten goalkickers than we play each week. That's not great reading.

Without denying that it would nice for our mids to kick more goals (because any of our players kicking more goals is a plus), I don't know that the comparison is that straightforward.

Don't have the stats to hand, but I read something which showed that Brayshaw and Serong in particular attend far more centre bounces than most other mids in the league — like, a lot more. There's every chance that these goal kicking mids in other teams are goal kicking mids by virtue of game plan (resting forward) rather than simple aptitude/hunger. It's a factor, at least.

 

[Paracleet]

Without denying that it would nice for our mids to kick more goals (because any of our players kicking more goals is a plus), I don't know that the comparison is that straightforward.

Don't have the stats to hand, but I read something which showed that Brayshaw and Serong in particular attend far more centre bounces than most other mids in the league — like, a lot more. There's every chance that these goal kicking mids in other teams are goal kicking mids by virtue of game plan (resting forward) rather than simple aptitude/hunger. It's a factor, at least.

All of those goal kicking mids in Collingwoods list are outside mids except De Goey, who is an ex foward and presumably still rotates there.
It's not like Adams, Pendlebury and Mitchell are kicking piles of snags.

Ideally we need more goals from our wingers.

 

[Taylor]

I’m not so sure it’s that much over the odds.

• We will have to pay a lot overs to prise someone out of Sydney
• there is an increase in the cap of several percent coming in over the next year
• he was a former pick 4 we have chased hard

I didn’t think Luke jackson would be coming back here for $900k in his 4th season either.
I would say we will definitely have to pay $750-800k to land him.

Freo and Melbourne offers for Jackson were basically the same.

I don't see why anything would be different for Logan McDonald.

I do remember talk of someone offering McDonald seven to ten years a year ago before he extended with Sydney for two.

 

[purplerunsdeep2]

Treacys hands are just like tabs were at his age, a bit like concrete

Tabs developed in the shadow of Pav

Treacy is coming along nicely in the shadow of Amiss


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[wakojako]

We need more goals from somewhere but it's probably midfield first and maybe another 5-10 from Treacy / Jackson each and eventually 60+ from Amiss.

As this is the draft thread, this is the reason we should draft DeMattia first. He is a 188cm very quick (sub 3 seconds 20m sprint) midfielder who kicks goals. I could not think of a better player to compliment our midfield.