List Mgmt. 2024 List Management discussion

[Dalions]

I actually don’t have a problem with that. If you are a top 8 team, getting access to a top 5 prospect, it’s an unfair double whammy for bottom teams.

They don’t have access to a top rated kid, plus it sees a good team getting better and potentially extending their ability to remain at the top.

And if your are a good team with a production line of good players, and able to pick up kids far above your draft position across multiple rounds, that’s genuinely against competition balance.


Nor should we be complaining about access to “our kids”, while then complaining about Vic teams wanting to bring “their kids” home.

Who let you in

 

[Dalions]

I actually don’t have a problem with that. If you are a top 8 team, getting access to a top 5 prospect, it’s an unfair double whammy for bottom teams.

They don’t have access to a top rated kid, plus it sees a good team getting better and potentially extending their ability to remain at the top.

And if your are a good team with a production line of good players, and able to pick up kids far above your draft position across multiple rounds, that’s genuinely against competition balance.


Nor should we be complaining about access to “our kids”, while then complaining about Vic teams wanting to bring “their kids” home.

I would like to see the evidence of a Northern Club that is flat out unbeatable due to their Academy talent.
It’s an over reaction from the big VIC clubs because of GC draft last year.
And any rise of the Suns may, just guessing, be partially because of the countless first round talent that they already have on their list via other AFL handouts and from being so shit for so long.

Also no different the GWS scaring the shit out of the competition many years ago due to their academy borders and the VIC Clubs and media crying about it until a change was made.

 

[Maboo]

Looking forward to academy product Cooper Hodge coming to the Lions otherwise he'd be on the Broncos books already.

Was listening to Hodgey on the radio a while ago where he was constantly pushed on wether Cooper would nominate the Hawks as a father son, but all he would keep saying was that he would make up his own mind when the time comes, which is the standard response but there was a real frustration from the other members of the panel.

 

[briztoon]

BT can you post your entire analysis of every graduate since 2013, I need to validate your analysis.

If only I had kept it.

I meant those who had made it to the AFL.

 

[mpal6]

Was listening to Hodgey on the radio a while ago where he was constantly pushed on wether Cooper would nominate the Hawks as a father son, but all he would keep saying was that he would make up his own mind when the time comes, which is the standard response but there was a real frustration from the other members of the panel.

The only reason he's not saying Hawks would be..... let me guess.... oh no, I don't want Hawks fans chasing me down haha

 

[Elixuh]

If only I had kept it.

I meant those who had made it to the AFL.

Looks like you have some work to do on your days off this week.

 

[briztoon]

Looks like you have some work to do on your days off this week.

Weekend, family time.

The only two players I couldn’t find out about family of origin and ties to VFL, were Ballenden and Payne.

Keays family had ties back with Mathieson’s family in Geelong. Hipwood and Andrews were from Vic. Kiddy was from the NT, but a footballing family.

Suns academy was the same, but they had a few more players from WA. Even Jed Walter is from a WA football family.

We have a few kids currently coming through with strong ties to QAFL families.

I’m not part of any QAFL club, have any connections or know anyone, other than what people post here, but it wasn’t that hard searching online to find where players families originated from and their ties to footy.

But I really couldn’t be arsed doing it all over again.

But I very much doubt we’re winning a tug of war against the NRL up here. If the kids aren’t indoctrinated into AFL by their parents, we’re probably not getting too many wins in the battle of the codes.

 

[M Malice]

I would like to see the evidence of a Northern Club that is flat out unbeatable due to their Academy talent.
It’s an over reaction from the big VIC clubs because of GC draft last year.
And any rise of the Suns may, just guessing, be partially because of the countless first round talent that they already have on their list via other AFL handouts and from being so s**t for so long.

Also no different the GWS scaring the s**t out of the competition many years ago due to their academy borders and the VIC Clubs and media crying about it until a change was made.

It was Garry Lyon or Kane Cornes (I've only watched FC & OtC this week) who were bemoaning the Northern Academies and the incoming domination, saying Jake Rogers was the next Daniel Kerr and Jed Walter was a cross between Plugga and Dunstall, get used to multiple Grand Finals featuring the Giants and Suns....he went on to say the Suns list is dead set scary good.

 

[SizeMatters]

What a weird comment from Berry essentially saying he will follow Hugh. wtf. Has he not or does not want to make strong connections outside of Hugh? Though his family moved here iirc. So the pull of the love of a man is stronger than that of his family.

 

[dlanod]

Weekend, family time.

The only two players I couldn’t find out about family of origin and ties to VFL, were Ballenden and Payne.

Keays family had ties back with Mathieson’s family in Geelong. Hipwood and Andrews were from Vic. Kiddy was from the NT, but a footballing family.

Suns academy was the same, but they had a few more players from WA. Even Jed Walter is from a WA football family.

We have a few kids currently coming through with strong ties to QAFL families.

I’m not part of any QAFL club, have any connections or know anyone, other than what people post here, but it wasn’t that hard searching online to find where players families originated from and their ties to footy.

But I really couldn’t be arsed doing it all over again.

But I very much doubt we’re winning a tug of war against the NRL up here. If the kids aren’t indoctrinated into AFL by their parents, we’re probably not getting too many wins in the battle of the codes.

I don't think this is as big a link as you claim though.

I'd done stats on the overall numbers coming out, which have undoubtedly increased over the years of the academy.

There's always been families in Queensland with Victorian links. From memory Voss's family moved up from Victoria. Aker too. Riewoldt came from Tassie. The elite always made it, but the next level weren't anywhere to be seen. Now we're seeing quantity more in line with what we should be producing - regardless of where they moved from. Focusing on those links is ignoring the actual shift we've seen.

 

[briztoon]

It was Garry Lyon or Kane Cornes (I've only watched FC & OtC this week) who were bemoaning the Northern Academies and the incoming domination, saying Jake Rogers was the next Daniel Kerr and Jed Walter was a cross between Plugga and Dunstall, get used to multiple Grand Finals featuring the Giants and Suns....he went on to say the Suns list is dead set scary good.

Brown was on SEN talking up the Suns academy, with Lyons. Was really talking up how much talent they have coming through.

Lyons then made the Leap that all 4 academies must be on the verge of global domination.

 

[mpal6]

Brown was on SEN talking up the Suns academy, with Lyons. Was really talking up how much talent they have coming through.

Lyons then made the Leap that all 4 academies must be on the verge of global domination.

 

[Elixuh]

It was Garry Lyon or Kane Cornes (I've only watched FC & OtC this week) who were bemoaning the Northern Academies and the incoming domination, saying Jake Rogers was the next Daniel Kerr and Jed Walter was a cross between Plugga and Dunstall, get used to multiple Grand Finals featuring the Giants and Suns....he went on to say the Suns list is dead set scary good.

Imagine being afraid of a team that has never made finals.

GWS and GC have been one step away from a 10yr dynasty for 10 years.

 

[mighty_lions]

What a weird comment from Berry essentially saying he will follow Hugh. wtf. Has he not or does not want to make strong connections outside of Hugh? Though his family moved here iirc. So the pull of the love of a man is stronger than that of his family.

what a strange take, that's not what he meant at all

 

[mighty_lions]

Imagine being afraid of a team that has never made finals.

GWS and GC have been one step away from a 10yr dynasty for 10 years.

hairy Garry has obsession with academies tried to make out couple of weeks ago he didn't know much about them, but spent 20 minutes bringing it up to tell everyone

if hairy Garry wants equality, we share around grand final day, Anzac Day, dreamtime, gather round and Melbourne clubs do more travelling

 

[briztoon]

I don't think this is as big a link as you claim though.

Not sure if you are missing the point.

The majority of the elite kids come from families that already are AFL families.

Our academy isn’t pulling in many talented kids from other sports or kids saying they want to play AFL from elsewhere.

Gold Coast has been putting in a lot of effort in getting AFL in to schools, where the sport becomes an option for kids from any background.

I'd done stats on the overall numbers coming out, which have undoubtedly increased over the years of the academy.

I wasn’t talking about the numbers coming out. Just whether the kids who do make it come from an AFL family or not.

Jake Rogers is on Fox right now, talking about how his family is originally from Vic.

There's always been families in Queensland with Victorian links. From memory Voss's family moved up from Victoria. Aker too. Riewoldt came from Tassie. The elite always made it, but the next level weren't anywhere to be seen. Now we're seeing quantity more in line with what we should be producing - regardless of where they moved from. Focusing on those links is ignoring the actual shift we've seen.

 

[dlanod]

Not sure if you are missing the point.

The majority of the elite kids come from families that already are AFL families.

Our academy isn’t pulling in many talented kids from other sports or kids saying they want to play AFL from elsewhere.

Gold Coast has been putting in a lot of effort in getting AFL in to schools, where the sport becomes an option for kids from any background.

I wasn’t talking about the numbers coming out. Just whether the kids who do make it come from an AFL family or not.

Jake Rogers is on Fox right now, talking about how his family is originally from Vic.

I don't believe I'm missing the point - this was your original exchange:

Without us funding and running the academies many of these prospects don’t exist in the AFL system. It is unreasonably to expect us to fund and run academies for no benefit and even worse to the benefit of our competitors.

I’ll argue this is actually a fallacy.

The vast majority of successful academy graduates come from families that moved from Victoria/SA/WA, or come from local QAFL hardcore families, many of whom are very active with their QAFL club.

I researched this for both the Suns and Lions academy back around 2018.

These kids weren't making it to the AFL system before the academy. That's true, it's reflected in the number of draftees, and what Elixuh originally said. You claimed it's a fallacy because academy kids come from southern immigrants, but those kids were only making it to QAFL, etc, level or switching to league or just dropping out for the better part of a decade or two. It's not like the increase in Qld draftees can be ascribed to immigration because the number of Victorian families in Queensland hasn't spiked significantly until about 2020 with the COVID lockdowns, which is too recent to be reflected in our academy - there's always been a fairly consistent immigration northwards.

 

[Elixuh]

I don't believe I'm missing the point - this was your original exchange:



These kids weren't making it to the AFL system before the academy. That's true, it's reflected in the number of draftees, and what Elixuh originally said. You claimed it's a fallacy because academy kids come from southern immigrants, but those kids were only making it to QAFL, etc, level or switching to league or just dropping out for the better part of a decade or two. It's not like the increase in Qld draftees can be ascribed to immigration because the number of Victorian families in Queensland hasn't spiked significantly until about 2020 with the COVID lockdowns, which is too recent to be reflected in our academy - there's always been a fairly consistent immigration northwards.

I know one of our academy graduates and his family and there is next to zero chance he would have been drafted but for the fact he had been in our academy for many years prior to being drafted.

 

[Nunez]

I know one of our academy graduates and his family and there is next to zero chance he would have been drafted but for the fact he had been in our academy for many years prior to being drafted.

 

[rye]

I actually don’t have a problem with that. If you are a top 8 team, getting access to a top 5 prospect, it’s an unfair double whammy for bottom teams.

They don’t have access to a top rated kid, plus it sees a good team getting better and potentially extending their ability to remain at the top.

And if your are a good team with a production line of good players, and able to pick up kids far above your draft position across multiple rounds, that’s genuinely against competition balance.


Nor should we be complaining about access to “our kids”, while then complaining about Vic teams wanting to bring “their kids” home.

been reading the norf board?

 

[The Flying Belgian]

briztoon just want more draft & trding

 

[Elixuh]

 

[Nunez]

I need a second opinion.

Donald Trump

 

[M Malice]

I need a second opinion.

Donald Trump

 

[briztoon]

I don't believe I'm missing the point - this was your original exchange:



These kids weren't making it to the AFL system before the academy. That's true, it's reflected in the number of draftees, and what Elixuh originally said. You claimed it's a fallacy because academy kids come from southern immigrants, but those kids were only making it to QAFL, etc, level or switching to league or just dropping out for the better part of a decade or two. It's not like the increase in Qld draftees can be ascribed to immigration because the number of Victorian families in Queensland hasn't spiked significantly until about 2020 with the COVID lockdowns, which is too recent to be reflected in our academy - there's always been a fairly consistent immigration northwards.

QLD was producing kids before the academy existed.

Beams, Zorko, Riewoldt, and I’m sure there’s more that I don’t know, because I’ve only been around since 2013. Someone else mentioned Voss.

Ben Keays, Jack Bowes, Jasper Fletcher, were all coached by their dads.

I’m sure they all would have made the State rep teams wether the academies existed or not.

QLD has had positive migration numbers for as long as I can remember. Numbers fluctuate.

A quick google search shows in the early 00’s, we experienced between 20,000 to 30,000+ each year.

3412.0 - Migration, Australia, 2011-12 and 2012-13

www.abs.gov.au

The fallacy I was talking about, is that our academy is growing the game in QLD, i.e attracting new kids to the sport.

My assertion is that this is not the case, because most of the kids making it to the AFL already come from a footy background.

And most of the successful kids up here come from families that migrated from WA or VIC when they were kids. That’s actually a fact. As I said, the only two I couldn’t find their birth state for, were Ballenden and Payne.