Prediction 2024 Round 1 Team

[Kobe Gryant]

Watch the Essendon game again. Clark was probably our second best player behind Holmes.

I don't care what the stats say. Watch the game and see the impact he had. He dominated. And yes doing that while lining up against quality AFL players massively outweighs a good but not dominant VFL season 2 years ago.

Lmao so stats matter for Neale but not for Clark. Got it.

Unless of course when it suits what you're saying, then they do.

 

[Footy Smarts]

Lmao so stats matter for Neale but not for Clark. Got it.

Unless of course when it suits what you're saying, then they do.

Please don't lie about what I said. I never mentioned game stats for Neale.

I don't care that he only got 4 touches. I care that he was often uncompetitive and didn't bring the ball to ground.

I don't care that Clark got 17 touches. I care that he tackled and pressured defensively, used his body well to help teammates out, won a decent amount of ball on the inside and was extremely clean and damaging with the ball.

 

[Cataholic]

We need the footy to start. Enough of the offseason already.

 

[year of the cat]

Re the Clark v Neale argument (which is an odd 2 to compare but anyway…) I think their relative rating as juniors is relevant. Clark was touted to be one of the leading players, let alone midfielders in his draft class. Neale more a speculative, athletic tall who most thought would most likely develop into a ruck rather than a key forward.

Whilst draft position isn’t the be all and end all in assessing the likelihood of a player’s prospects, it does provide a pretty useful guide these days. Clearly, on that, Clark we would expect to have a better career than Neale’s.

I don’t think it would be any shock to see Clark “preferenced” in front of Neale. I use that term even though they aren’t in any way competing for the same position. But I’d say that the coaching staff have pretty lofty ambitions for Clark whereas they’d be more circumspect when assessing Neale’s likelihood of having a meaningful AFL career.

So if Clark plays and Neale doesn’t, we shouldn’t be shocked or feel that the MC are being inconsistent.

 

[Gazza Greatness]

My point was Footy Smarts whole argument regarding Neale is based on runs on the board in the VFL.

If we're playing that game, Neale is ahead of Clark by every objective measure. He can't have that both ways.

Think it's important to note too, neither BORIS332 or I are saying Neale should play ahead of Hawkins, Cameron, or O Henry.

What we're saying is that if he's battling for that 4th spot with Rohan, it's negligent to have a 4th year key forward rotting away in the VFL when we're about to have a Hawkins sized hole there in a few months time, and he's already proven that leaving him in the VFL isn't going to help his development.

Stengle, Close, Miers, & Dempsey is plenty in terms of speed, pressure and crumbing ability.

Even if it means Neale isn't in our best side if we're a premiership threat come August/September, at this point in time we have to try it.

Like I said before, SDK wasn't SDK either until he had 6 weeks of consistent game time to actually find his feet.

Once he had that, he blossomed and looked like a completely different player to his first couple games.

I tend to agree with both you guys as Neale is a bit of a tease at present, looks to have so much potential as he's a imposing individual with great physical attributes but currently he drops too many marks that he should be taking. However I do agree that it is harder for him to get into side with us having such a strong forward line, with the reverse being the case for the on-ballers which gives someone like Clark a better shot at it. But I'd like to point out one issue that may help Neale get a few games in the senior side (maybe even first game?) and that is that Hawkins or Cameron are not contested pack marking players, nor do we want them to be and it maybe in the clubs best interests in suitable games during the year (pending player match ups) for Neale to actually get a few games because he can do all the heavy lifting in the contested pack marking arena, making sure that he hits the packs hard with his imposing physic and who knows may come good and take a few big grabs, which will then take a lot of pressure of Hawkins and Cameron, in fact I'm very sure that both Hawkins and Cameron are very aware of this fact and do very much appreciate him being around but also the coaching staff. If we want a very fit and healthy Hawkins and Cameron for the majority of year but also critically for finals if we are well placed to make them, then getting Neale to come into the picture on the provision he can get his act together, may help things work out very well for both him and club and take a lot of physical pressure off Hawkins and Cameron through a long AFL gruelling season.

 

[FootyLad0]

Figured it was weird that we nearly have two pages worth comparing spots of Scratcher Neale and Jhye Clark since they play entirely different positions and roles but anyway....this is why the season needs to start.
Just illogical comparisons of guys who don't even matchup lol.

Just a reminder to anyone who needs to remember how Clark played on the weekend and how we'd be crazy to not play him with Cuthrie now out.

Just for anyone curious, Clark's stats were:

17 disposals at 94.1% efficiency (TEAM HIGH)
10 contested possessions (TEAM HIGH)
6 intercept possessions (2nd highest on team)
5 free kicks for (TEAM HIGH)
4 tackles (2nd highest on team)
4 clearances (2nd highest on team)

Any naysayers about Jhye Clark and not picking him for Round 1 are crazy.
There's been a few here criticising his disposal which as per above should quiet that noise down.

He has more than proven he's ready to go!

 

[calder_daddy]

I feel the same.

He actually has never really dominated the VFL.

This year would be a good time to start doing so.

Ollie Henry averaged nearly 3 a game in the VFL in his second year… and that was playing as a skinny flanker type and not the main target that Neale will be.

So far we are just going on hope and potential projection for Neale.

This is the year when he should be able to start really getting it done in the VFL and hopefully when he is called upon to step into the AFL side he starts to look better.

I worry about his competitiveness to be honest and for a key forward, it’s not an area where you’d wanna be lacking in the AFL.

I’m of the opinion us and a few other clubs will chuck JUH just about the biggest contract in AFL history to try to get him out of the Doggies and locked away for 10 years.

He's averaged 2.2 goals per game over the past two VFL seasons, why is a 3-goal average the magical pass mark?

To be fair our VFL team for the past few years has been terrible to be kind, also if I also remember correctly 2 seasons ago he was trialled for much of the season in the backline.

If he plays VFL this year with the players we have, he will average 3 goals a game
Quite easily

 

[CatToTheFuture]

I feel the same.

He actually has never really dominated the VFL.

This year would be a good time to start doing so.

Ollie Henry averaged nearly 3 a game in the VFL in his second year… and that was playing as a skinny flanker type and not the main target that Neale will be.

So far we are just going on hope and potential projection for Neale.

This is the year when he should be able to start really getting it done in the VFL and hopefully when he is called upon to step into the AFL side he starts to look better.

I worry about his competitiveness to be honest and for a key forward, it’s not an area where you’d wanna be lacking in the AFL.

I’m of the opinion us and a few other clubs will chuck JUH just about the biggest contract in AFL history to try to get him out of the Doggies and locked away for 10 years.

I feel like I might be throwing a pointless grenade here because the comparison is silly, but, you know who wasn't tearing the vfl apart before being thrown into senior football? Jamarra Ugle Hagan, who was averaging 1.8 goals per game.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

If you can't see the value in blooding a 21-year old, 203cm monster with an elite running capacity as a third tall then you're beyond help.

I will say he doesn't play as a third tall.

If he's playing Cameron is running around the ground feeding the inside 50s. Not the worst look but I think not our best structure.

 

[BORIS332]

Figured it was weird that we nearly have two pages worth comparing spots of Scratcher Neale and Jhye Clark since they play entirely different positions and roles but anyway....this is why the season needs to start.
Just illogical comparisons of guys who don't even matchup lol.

Just a reminder to anyone who needs to remember how Clark played on the weekend and how we'd be crazy to not play him with Cuthrie now out.

I watched most of his VFL games last year and was really disappointed with Clark. He didn’t seem to have the hunger at the contest we’d heard so much about. He seemed very much like a Darcy Lang 2.0. But his preseason this year has turned that perception around. Some of the stuff he did without the ball against Essendon was outstanding. It’s the stuff I saw in his U18 year, team lifting stuff. I’m still not sold that he’ll be starting 22 come round 1, but he’s close.

 

[FootyLad0]

I will say he doesn't play as a third tall.

If he's playing Cameron is running around the ground feeding the inside 50s. Not the worst look but I think not our best structure.

Agreed absolutely correct. If i could add to that....

Our 2022 Premiership side won because of running and gunning, taking risks and being exciting.
To use the team's motto.

"It's dangerous out in open water, lets drag em out there on our level and not be safe and swim between the flags like other sides."

Playing Hawk and Jez with a smattering of medium and small forwards makes us deadly, we are the best forward line in the comp by far. It would make zero sense to go backwards by introducing Neale and making us too top heavy with Neale, Jez and Hawk and i like Scratcher...

He's not a medium hitup forward like Ollie or Rohan who can play tall or small. He's not a defensive forward like Close or Dempsey. He's not a crumbing/attacking forward like Miers or Stengle. He's a tall forward, he should only be going in for Jez or Hawk being out resting/suspended/injured etc.

 

[cats_09]

possible hint for a round 1 debut

 

[FootyLad0]

possible hint for a round 1 debut

OMFG YES! Bring him in!!!!

 

[Footy Smarts]

Just a reminder to anyone who needs to remember how Clark played on the weekend and how we'd be crazy to not play him with Cuthrie now out.

The stats don't do it justice either.

5 frees sounds like he was gifted some easy ball but 3 of them were from run down tackles in open play. And the disposal efficiency makes it sound like he was chipping the ball around the back line but he was winning the hard ball and just didn't fumble or miss a target by hand all day.

Considering he's not played for 9 months he couldn't do much more to win a spot. Maybe they play him as sub because they're worried about his match fitness but I'd just start him. I can't imagine they'll leave him out of the squad after that.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

possible hint for a round 1 debut

Sub?

 

[CatToTheFuture]

possible hint for a round 1 debut

Looking at the whole post, I would prefer the 5th picture of Guthrie suggesting a surprise inclusion

 

[D BRIDGE]

The Mannagh thing is confusing me.

Just when I come to a realisation and accept that he is likely isnt going to play, this drops.

He looks the goods to me.

Not sure why we’d use pick 36 or whatever it was on a guy that’s 26 if we don’t have a role for him or want to play him.

But then they go playing him for 1.5 quarters in each match and it just seems that they don’t really wanna see him up against AFL players for a full games… which I find kinda weird because already know he is too good for the VFL, so what’s the point recruiting him and having him need to play VFL to prove himself.

Anyway I hope he plays and plays a full game… but the way he come on late in both practice matches and instantly impacted shows he could be a handy sub.

I really don’t know.

Time will tell I guess.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

The Mannagh thing is confusing me.

Just when I come to a realisation and accept that he is likely isnt going to play, this drops.

He looks the goods to me.

Not sure why we’d use pick 36 or whatever it was on a guy that’s 26 if we don’t have a role for him or want to play him.

But then they go playing him for 1.5 quarters in each match and it just seems that they don’t really wanna see him up against AFL players for a full games… which I find kinda weird because already know he is too good for the VFL, so what’s the point recruiting him and having him need to play VFL to prove himself.

Anyway I hope he plays and plays a full game… but the way he come on late in both practice matches and instantly impacted shows he could be a handy sub.

I really don’t know.

Time will tell I guess.

The same post has photos of O'Sullivan and Cam Guthrie. Fairly certain neither of them are playing

Also Mullin and Humphries.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

The Mannagh thing is confusing me.

Just when I come to a realisation and accept that he is likely isnt going to play, this drops.

He looks the goods to me.

Not sure why we’d use pick 36 or whatever it was on a guy that’s 26 if we don’t have a role for him or want to play him.

But then they go playing him for 1.5 quarters in each match and it just seems that they don’t really wanna see him up against AFL players for a full games… which I find kinda weird because already know he is too good for the VFL, so what’s the point recruiting him and having him need to play VFL to prove himself.

Anyway I hope he plays and plays a full game… but the way he come on late in both practice matches and instantly impacted shows he could be a handy sub.

I really don’t know.

Time will tell I guess.

Also, it's not like that draft had heaps of obvious late options we were walking past. You could do worse than a guy who is your 23rd to 26th best player for 5 years

 

[Catastrophe!]

The Mannagh thing is confusing me.

Just when I come to a realisation and accept that he is likely isnt going to play, this drops.

He looks the goods to me.

Not sure why we’d use pick 36 or whatever it was on a guy that’s 26 if we don’t have a role for him or want to play him.

But then they go playing him for 1.5 quarters in each match and it just seems that they don’t really wanna see him up against AFL players for a full games… which I find kinda weird because already know he is too good for the VFL, so what’s the point recruiting him and having him need to play VFL to prove himself.

Anyway I hope he plays and plays a full game… but the way he come on late in both practice matches and instantly impacted shows he could be a handy sub.

I really don’t know.

Time will tell I guess.

Or that they specifically have him in mind for the sub option?

If they didn't rate him at all, there are plenty they could have played in front of him. Parfitt, O'Sullivan and Knevitt come to mind for a start.

 

[Vdubs]

Rohan isn't in the side for his ground ball gets, is he?

The role he plays is as a marking target and pressure forward, that's a role Neale can play, what does ground ball gets have to do with that role?

Who cares if Neale can't do everything Rohan can do? Rohan can't do everything Neale can do, e.g. pinch-hit in the ruck. The only thing that matters is they both have the attributes to play the 3rd tall forward role.

Neale does very little in any capacity to win a spot in our 23, unless we are plagued by injuries. He is simply not up to "scratch", pardon the puns. He hardly dominates VFL games, and is not a reliable mark, and is hardly a scary ruckman.

 

[Footy Smarts]

The Mannagh thing is confusing me.

Just when I come to a realisation and accept that he is likely isnt going to play, this drops.

He looks the goods to me.

Not sure why we’d use pick 36 or whatever it was on a guy that’s 26 if we don’t have a role for him or want to play him.

But then they go playing him for 1.5 quarters in each match and it just seems that they don’t really wanna see him up against AFL players for a full games… which I find kinda weird because already know he is too good for the VFL, so what’s the point recruiting him and having him need to play VFL to prove himself.

Anyway I hope he plays and plays a full game… but the way he come on late in both practice matches and instantly impacted shows he could be a handy sub.

I really don’t know.

Time will tell I guess.

Could just be Dempsey shot the lights out in preseason meaning he can't get a spot without the roles in the front half really shifting around and they don't want to experiment with that yet?

 

[Catastrophe!]

Neale does very little in any capacity to win a spot in our 23, unless we are plagued by injuries. He is simply not up to "scratch", pardon the puns. He hardly dominates VFL games, and is not a reliable mark, and is hardly a scary ruckman.

So I guess we'll just write him off at 21, hey? Seems to be what this board does with a lot of our kids.

Still can't believe some of the nonsense written about Jhye, Tanner and Dempsey, who are all tracking well this PS. Give kids time and exposure, they can't all be Selwood from the get go. Look at Zach Guthrie as a prime example.

 

[Vdubs]

Montagna is still bullish about our top 8 chances this year

 

[Vdubs]

So I guess we'll just write him off at 21, hey? Seems to be what this board does with a lot of our kids.

Still can't believe some of the nonsense written about Jhye, Tanner and Dempsey, who are all tracking well this PS. Give kids time and exposure, they can't all be Selwood from the get go. Look at Zach Guthrie as a prime example.

No way, but he is simply not a valid inclusion for our best 23 yet, and that is something we have been saying for a while. Do you think he should be given games so he doesn't lose faith or confidence, or because you rate him as a good player worthy of best 23?