List Mgmt. 2025 List Management discussion - part 2

[puppy_dog7]

He's very similar to Marshall in that he tends to win his own ball and dump kick forward without much of a plan.

The real advantage might come if they re introduced the run up in the ruck dual but give it three months and a the first ACL and the AFL are likely to change it back.

We built a ruck set up for the third man up and they changed it all on us.

It's ironic that the AFL ruled out the 3rd man up rule, but at the same time wanted to limit congestion and the number of stoppages.

I actually think the 3rd man up rule was good for the game, if you wanted to go up as 3rd man than you'd wanna hope your direct opponent doesnt get on the end of it. I'd consider bringing it back under the condition that the 3rd man up can't grab it out of the ruck.

 

[phantom13]

Darcy Cameron

14

Darcy Cameron

Age

30

Ht

204cm

Wt

103kg

Pos.

Ruck

Career

Season

Last 5

D

6.0

1star

K

3.3

1star

HB

2.7

2star

CL

0.3

2star

HO

5.3

5star

D

7.5

2star

K

4.5

2star

HB

3.0

2star

CL

0.5

3star

HO

3.5

5star

D

6.0

2star

K

3.3

2star

HB

2.7

3star

CL

0.3

2star

HO

5.3

5star

re signed.

Another day with no Nas news.

Im sure thats a good sign though right?

 

[Dr Spaceman]

Maybe Terry is annoyed at the club because we've said what it's going to take in a trade to get him home.

Why does anyone think he's annoyed at the club?

Well then he’s an idiot.

This whole Terry thing is based on him supposedly telling an old sponsor that they would prefer Nas lived close to home.

But we’ve always known that. Of course they WOULD prefer it.

And he’s at the Saints game with kids in Saints gear.

Talk about jumping at shadows.

PRO TIP: Nothing’s changed.

 

[beside the seaside]

But why do you think he's annoyed?

Just over analysing the comments "we just want him close to home" because there's no other news.

 

[Gavinmitchell11]

If only it was Finn Callaghan who took the bait on $1.7. The TDK idea is looking horrible with Dodson in all likelihood being the GOAT.

 

[stavro#4]

alot of that is never going to happen. you're just carrying on now.

there's every possibility Wilson and Trav don't make it. especially on Wilson. there's huge red flags coming though his game now that suggest theres atleast a level of concern if he can make it.

you're splitting hairs over guys, caminiti aside, who are barely best 22, some of the names you mentioned haven't even cracked the best 22 yet.

if you're not going to retain NAS by atleast matching the adelaide and port offers over the years, but you're concerned over a bunch of blokes who aren't even at 3/10 of the level NAS is, then I don't know what to say.

“Carrying on” and then says every possibility that Wilson and Trav don’t make it to justify Windy getting a million bucks

There would be very little saints fans who think 1 or both don’t make it and if they don’t, we have blown our rebuild considering that’s a pick 18 and a pick 8.

Windy is great around the club. Love his standard setting stuff. Great runner on matchday. Great role player. However he is undeniably an Absolute ball butcher.

At the same point of Wilson’s and Windys careers. I reckon Wilson’s ahead and that’s with plenty to work on. Has already had a game with 3 goals and 4x 2 goal games

They have also had similar high disposal games in their first 2 years with 3 or Windys top 5 accumulation games coming this year - year number 4.

Whatever standards we set now have to be the ones that tie into the young core who are also on today’s list and not far behind the likes of Nas (he will get absolutely and rightly paid - just don’t know how much) + Windy. Infact I reckon Owens probably did the team thing and was somewhat club friendly.

You evidently struggle to see the long game to list building if everyone needs to get paid at the 11th best side.

 

[stavro#4]

If only it was Finn Callaghan who took the bait on $1.7. The TDK idea is looking horrible with Dodson in all likelihood being the GOAT.

And just like the Darcy Cameron story today. It’s likely a hell of an agent story that people have spun into gospel and likely not accurate.

What was posted in here the other day is probably more accurate

 

[puppy_dog7]

If Marcus Windhager is asking for 850k then we wish him the best and get a first for him in a trade.

Basically telling the comp we have money to burn re TDK has made agents go insane lol

I love Windy but i agree.

He's valuable to us, but he's not worth $850k yet. Needs to prove it by being more consistent for a longer period.

If you think you're worth $850k, then im sure having a contract highly geared towards triggers that increase his earning capacity is the way he should get it.

 

[PandaG]

If only it was Finn Callaghan who took the bait on $1.7. The TDK idea is looking horrible with Dodson in all likelihood being the GOAT.

I dont get the logic or hysteria around TDK

We have gone down this path because the AFL has no idea how to runa comp.

Indirectly Acquiring a Pick: Since we can't directly buy a draft pick, we can achieve a similar outcome by overpaying for a player, such as TDK. The extra money they pay TDK beyond his market value is essentially the "payment" for the pick.

Converting the Player into a Pick: The player, TDK, is now an asset of the Saints. We hold onto him for a few years. When we no longer need him (for example, when a younger player like Dodson is ready to take his place), we can trade him to another team. The return for trading TDK would be a draft pick.

This strategy allows us to use their salary cap to acquire a valuable asset (TDK) and then convert that asset into a draft pick later on, effectively bypassing the rule against buying picks outright.

So there are options. Once you have the asset you control what happens next.

My hope we get him in and he is a star for the next 6-7 years.

 

[gringo2011]

You mean like Essendon and Carlton.

Granted, it’s not always easy to predict ahead of time who is going to be up and about and who isn’t ( Crows for example) - that’s why you share it around and and least try to make it equal.

They get viewers even when shit because they have huge supporter bases. Carlton also should have been in the hunt for a flag this year. They usually go off a year before.

 

[Mat Mann]

Why can't we rort the system like Geelong? Pay sh!t salaries with high paying ambassador jobs from Seek.com. pay Nas 2.5 mil a year that way and Windy can have 1 mil. AFL seem happy to allow that to happen, why not us?

Moose toys.......

 

[Grav]

Darcy Cameron re signed.

Another day with no Nas news.

Im sure thats a good sign though right?

Not Tuesday yet

 

[StCicatriz]

“Carrying on” and then says every possibility that Wilson and Trav don’t make it to justify Windy getting a million bucks

There would be very little saints fans who think 1 or both don’t make it and if they don’t, we have blown our rebuild considering that’s a pick 18 and a pick 8.

Windy is great around the club. Love his standard setting stuff. Great runner on matchday. Great role player. However he is undeniably an Absolute ball butcher.

At the same point of Wilson’s and Windys careers. I reckon Wilson’s ahead and that’s with plenty to work on. Has already had a game with 3 goals and 4x 2 goal games

They have also had similar high disposal games in their first 2 years with 3 or Windys top 5 accumulation games coming this year - year number 4.

Whatever standards we set now have to be the ones that tie into the young core who are also on today’s list and not far behind the likes of Nas (he will get absolutely and rightly paid - just don’t know how much) + Windy. Infact I reckon Owens probably did the team thing and was somewhat club friendly.

You evidently struggle to see the long game to list building if everyone needs to get paid at the 11th best side.

wow

Windy is on a million bucks now... next week he's going to be worth 1.2m.

you can't even accurately re-tell your own rumour.

you're not arguing in good faith. you're just blatantly making shit up now, or deliberately mis-representing what has been posted to deflect.

 

[stavro#4]

wow

Windy is on a million bucks now... next week he's going to be worth 1.2m.

you can't even accurately re-tell your own rumour.

you're not arguing in good faith. you're just blatantly making shit up now, or deliberately mis-representing what has been posted to deflect.

The rumour was north of 850k.

There wasn’t a set amount on it. Just that they were asking for a lot.

And what am I deflecting? I’ve literally said there are 40 + guys on the list we need to manage and there are players on the list right now that will be up for pay days who will look at windy and say I want that.

I said his contribution has improved. But he isn’t significantly better than the best we have seen of Wilson and Travaglia is only in his first year. By year 4 he could be well ahead of windy.

Your argument centres around the Salary cap. Which the club only knows what the cap will be up until 2027. Which the story is that Windy has a 2 year deal infront of him. You’ll be the same bloke arguing he should be getting 1.2m on his next renewal or until it impacts another player you like.

Maybe trying to find a middle ground approach to retain them all is the best path forward which is what seems to be at play but you react to a headline like you always do.

 

[Diehard Saint]

They get viewers even when shit because they have huge supporter bases. Carlton also should have been in the hunt for a flag this year. They usually go off a year before.

I have many Carlton supporting friends who have completely turned off. Even stopped their memberships. My family and their Bombers memberships too.
AFL are living in the past - “its good for footy when Blues and Bombers are doing well”
Heads up, AFL, they have been unsuccessful clubs for decades now.

Carlton only just made the finals last year by the skin of his teeth their teeth - thanks to Freo.

 

[CaptainRisky]

 

[stfan]

I dont get the logic or hysteria around TDK

We have gone down this path because the AFL has no idea how to runa comp.

Indirectly Acquiring a Pick: Since we can't directly buy a draft pick, we can achieve a similar outcome by overpaying for a player, such as TDK. The extra money they pay TDK beyond his market value is essentially the "payment" for the pick.

Converting the Player into a Pick: The player, TDK, is now an asset of the Saints. We hold onto him for a few years. When we no longer need him (for example, when a younger player like Dodson is ready to take his place), we can trade him to another team. The return for trading TDK would be a draft pick.

This strategy allows us to use their salary cap to acquire a valuable asset (TDK) and then convert that asset into a draft pick later on, effectively bypassing the rule against buying picks outright.

You are being too logical for this thread.

 

[jwikked]

Moose toys.......

Nas can have $1.8million per year, and 6 of these bad boys sent to address monthly

Jeremy Cameron wishes he had access to electro chrome plated yo-yos

 

[akaifu]

some of the names you mentioned look miles off it. its questionable if they make it.

its too speculative. you should know in another 12-36 months if they will, which would probably be windys contract length (3 years).

True but the longer you wait, the less return you get

If you trade him now, not only do you get a very solid return, but you also start pumping games into the ‘speculative’ guys to accelerate their development

As opposed to waiting let’s say 4 years to free agency whilst overpaying him and probably getting the same return in draft capital via compo if he leaves while the kids either leave or stall in development

I also think LOC, Hastie, Trav could all be best 23 worthy with another pre-season so I guess that depends more on opinion

 

[bergholt]

Converting the Player into a Pick: The player, TDK, is now an asset of the Saints. We hold onto him for a few years. When we no longer need him (for example, when a younger player like Dodson is ready to take his place), we can trade him to another team. The return for trading TDK would be a draft pick.

Problem is if we've overpaid TDK in the first place then it's hard to find another club who wants to take on his massive salary. I guess we can always keep paying a portion of it though.

 

[g_TRAIN]

Would rather pay Windy $1.7m than TDK let alone NAS

 

[The Punter]

Worth pointing out that St Kilda is one of only a few clubs reported to not include automatic increases in contracts based on salary cap increases. Not sure if that is changing, but 800k in 2026 will be not as tough to stomach as 800k in 2029.

If we front load TDK as well...

 

[phantom13]

The rumour was north of 850k.

There wasn’t a set amount on it. Just that they were asking for a lot.

And what am I deflecting? I’ve literally said there are 40 + guys on the list we need to manage and there are players on the list right now that will be up for pay days who will look at windy and say I want that.

I said his contribution has improved. But he isn’t significantly better than the best we have seen of Wilson and Travaglia is only in his first year. By year 4 he could be well ahead of windy.

Your argument centres around the Salary cap. Which the club only knows what the cap will be up until 2027. Which the story is that Windy has a 2 year deal infront of him. You’ll be the same bloke arguing he should be getting 1.2m on his next renewal or until it impacts another player you like.

Maybe trying to find a middle ground approach to retain them all is the best path forward which is what seems to be at play but you react to a headline like you always do.

I sort of agree with you BUT you were also the bloke ****ing sure we could do Rowell, TDK AND NAS in the same salary cap. Now you’re worried about windy getting an extra hundred K.

It’s a bit inconsistent.

 

[akaifu]

Problem is if we've overpaid TDK in the first place then it's hard to find another club who wants to take on his massive salary. I guess we can always keep paying a portion of it though.

TDK deal will almost definitely be front-loaded so if he was traded in say 3 years it’d be at most like 1.4m per year before considering the fact we can pay a % of the salary

 

[Diehard Saint]

Problem is if we've overpaid TDK in the first place then it's hard to find another club who wants to take on his massive salary. I guess we can always keep paying a portion of it though.

Front-loaded I’m sure.
And if we want to offload him in say 5 years time his salary probably won’t be that exorbitant.

But we’ve done it before - Billings I think?

( Ok, basically just repeated post above)