Apples' Training Reports

[ottoman]

Doesn’t anyone wonder why bucks boys always gets banned?
Doesn’t pay so he’s out.

Exactly. Joins with the free trial period and as soon as the time comes for him to pay his extortion/membership fees, he's gone.

 

[Saintly Viewed]

Exactly. Joins with the free trial period and as soon as the time comes for him to pay his extortion/membership fees, he's gone.

Exactly.
All his posts are simply exuberant pro Collingwood posts.

Then he won’t pay and obviously they send sicarios around...

 

[ottoman]

The praise he receives is also ridiculous. I reckon he's got some excellent qualities, but I really dislike his style of game. His possession and mark stats came predominantly from backwards receives in a crabby game style and then he used the ball sideways. Thus many of his stats were irrelevant water treading. He's got some of the tools to become a solid defender, but he needs retraining in my mind.

I think this year will tell us a lot.
I have been very underwhelmed with what I have seen so far. Like you say many of his possessions are meh. However we can't just dismiss what he has gone through.
He should by now have some confidence in his body. Let's see what he brings to the table this year.

 

[sr36]

I think this year will tell us a lot.
I have been very underwhelmed with what I have seen so far. Like you say many of his possessions are meh. However we can't just dismiss what he has gone through.
He should by now have some confidence in his body. Let's see what he brings to the table this year.

Agreed, but to me it is a playing style issue and may take more than a year to reprogram him and that's assuming there is a desire to change his style. If he doesn't get reprogrammed - Meh

 

[Gone Critical]

If Scharenberg hadn’t had his injuries youd be thrilled with his numbers. Nearly 19 disposals and 7 marks per game for a 14 gamer is exceptional, the criticism this kid cops given his experience and the interruption he’s had to his career thus far is ridiculous.

I think Shaz is building but I think it's a stretch to call his numbers exceptional. Playing a cumulating role off HB is similar to what the likes of Oxley or Smith did in their 1st 14 games and their stat numbers would be very similar.

The concern with them was the unaccountable and pretty bruise free footy they play and Shaz has had a similar start. What we hope is he has scope to change that around given the highly ranked junior he was. His stat numbers at this point of his career for the role he is playing are not exceptional though.

 

[Scodog10]

I think Shaz is building but I think it's a stretch to call his numbers exceptional. Playing a cumulating role off HB is similar to what the likes of Oxley or Smith did in their 1st 14 games and their stat numbers would be very similar.

The concern with them was the unaccountable and pretty bruise free footy they play and Shaz has had a similar start. What we hope is he has scope to change that around given the highly ranked junior he was. His stat numbers at this point of his career for the role he is playing are not exceptional though.

Yeah nah. They’re on par with the rising star winner of 2017 they are exceptional numbers for 14 gamers. I deadset feel for the kid at times with the entry into the system he had. Last year was a free pass!

 

[Old Spice]

Yeah nah. They’re on par with the rising star winner of 2017 they are exceptional numbers for 14 gamers. I deadset feel for the kid at times with the entry into the system he had. Last year was a free pass!

Smith averaged 19.6 disposals and 6.6 marks per game in 2016, so yeah, nothing outstanding from Scharenberg. And it's pretty evident watching that he hasn't done anything to get too excited about yet. He's had one good game V Port Melbourne in the VFL, that's it. Here's hoping etc.

 

[Gone Critical]

Yeah nah. They’re on par with the rising star winner of 2017 they are exceptional numbers for 14 gamers. I deadset feel for the kid at times with the entry into the system he had. Last year was a free pass!

Not sure what makes it exceptional if Smith and Oxley posted similar numbers early in their career unless we want to tag all of them as exceptional statistically. Dilutes that word too much for mine. It's part of the problem with Shaz is too many posters want to paint some of the stuff he has done so far as exceptional or whatever when it clearly isn't yet. Others look and cant understand what that group are seeing and so the diverging views are enhanced.

I agree 100% on the freepass for 2017. I was long an advocate of dampening expectations for Shaz in 2017, a full season on the park was enough to expect at any level. His career has just been cruelled as you say. This is really his season to start to show what he will bring to the table longer term.

 

[Scodog10]

Smith averaged 19.6 disposals and 6.6 marks per game in 2016, so yeah, nothing outstanding from Scharenberg. And it's pretty evident watching that he hasn't done anything to get too excited about yet. He's had one good game V Port Melbourne in the VFL, that's it. Here's hoping etc.

Smith was a mature age recruit with 60+ state league matches behind him. Apples and oranges. Ryan Burton with extremely similar numbers is the next big thing seems legit. My best guess is that because we’ve seen it all before from Langdon it’s automatically assumed that it’s a given that a guy will come in and have that sort of impact.

 

[Scodog10]

Not sure what makes it exceptional if Smith and Oxley posted similar numbers early in their career unless we want to tag all of them as exceptional statistically. Dilutes that word too much for mine. It's part of the problem with Shaz is too many posters want to paint some of the stuff he has done so far as exceptional or whatever when it clearly isn't yet. Others look and cant understand what that group are seeing and so the diverging views are enhanced.

I agree 100% on the freepass for 2017. I was long an advocate of dampening expectations for Shaz in 2017, a full season on the park was enough to expect at any level. His career has just been cruelled as you say. This is really his season to start to show what he will bring to the table longer term.

As above both were state league recruits.

 

[Darkyprotector]

As above both were state league recruits.

So your implying that neafl is a better springboard to afl than tac?
If that's the case, the Murray trade is exceptional value
Certainly didn't cost as much as shaz

 

[neilk]

So your implying that neafl is a better springboard to afl than tac?
If that's the case, the Murray trade is exceptional value
Certainly didn't cost as much as shaz

Did Shaz play in the SANFL prior to being drafted?

 

[jackcass]

Did Shaz play in the SANFL prior to being drafted?

Didn't play seniors as far as I recall, likely due to the foot injury. But point taken, what does that do to the fruit salad comparisons.

 

[Gone Critical]

Smith was a mature age recruit with 60+ state league matches behind him. Apples and oranges. Ryan Burton with extremely similar numbers is the next big thing seems legit. My best guess is that because we’ve seen it all before from Langdon it’s automatically assumed that it’s a given that a guy will come in and have that sort of impact.

As above both were state league recruits.

Not sure we will get anywhere in this discussion so I will stop with this comment.

You can split hairs and say that the other 2 were state league players but they were also lowly rookies with limited expectation attached so its splitting hairs to say Shaz is exceptional but they are not.

What I dont get is the desire to paint Shaz as exceptional all the time. Since he played his 1st VFL games certain posters have gushed about the special qualities they see in him and get very defensive when other posters dont agree. I have watched Shaz closely from his 1st VFL game because I shared the interest we all had in this highly rated kid. He has had a shocking run and his development has had a big hit for all the time he has spent out. Not surprisingly he has looked tentative and played a very outside type of game with low contested numbers, tackles etc. He needs a chance to be gain confidence and not be burdened by over the top expectation

Its unlikely he will reach the heights he could have but hopefully will still be a very good long term player for us. Tagging him with exceptional thus far, even on stats, just ups this unrealistic expectation he has been given by a few on this board.

 

[Old Spice]

Smith was a mature age recruit with 60+ state league matches behind him. Apples and oranges. Ryan Burton with extremely similar numbers is the next big thing seems legit. My best guess is that because we’ve seen it all before from Langdon it’s automatically assumed that it’s a given that a guy will come in and have that sort of impact.

So we could slot him in somewhere between rising star and some role players from state leagues? The fact is Scherenberg has barely been best on at VFL level, so not really sure what the hopes are being pinned on. Let's hope he comes on.

 

[Darkyprotector]

Smith was a mature age recruit with 60+ state league matches behind him. Apples and oranges. Ryan Burton with extremely similar numbers is the next big thing seems legit. My best guess is that because we’ve seen it all before from Langdon it’s automatically assumed that it’s a given that a guy will come in and have that sort of impact.

Also Langdon was the same as a lot of draftees who do go on with it, Being a Top age over age TAC players ( sack, Elliott) seems to help!
I year older , mentally and physically better prepared kids who missed the boat first time and have the bit between the teeth
IMHO Each year on , tac is becomming less of a guide, private school footy I believe has passed it ( scholarships) in talent id
We have far too many SA kids , who all seem to play without motzy ( RENDALL), can't name too many with that beast competitive attitude that shows you there gonna make it( Maynard, Powell pepper, Robinson, hodge , Mathews , Williams , adams, Millane) because it ain't natural they can't be consistent Think this has been acknowledged with BUDDAH, recruitment of Murray and drafting this year ( all proven competitors) including rookies
That's why with aish , broomhead, shaz , Langdon , fasolo ,Phillips I just can't see it and others do too
Including opposition clubs
Somehow we have to increase their value to either keep em or trade, we've given em games but they all are still Nowhere
Concern at this point is the value
If you look at our list out of contract ( huge number)this year there's some names that will need to show a fair bit for us to get anywhere
Moore, Howe, de goey , Levi are must re signings the rest , I ain't losing too much sleep at this stage
It's why we resigned Crocker and wills both are fierce competitors as is dunne , crisp , varcoe
Maybe a bundle of shaz, aish, broomhead might get us a 2nd and third with ports core getting older
One thing I do know , it won't stay the same

 

[KrispyKremePie]

Walked past Victoria Park on my daily morning tea walk and noticed that there were carlton players training there... Would be nice if the Pies trained there occasionally.

 

[TradeDraft]

Walked past Victoria Park on my daily morning tea walk and noticed that there were carlton players training there... Would be nice if the Pies trained there occasionally.

Yeah but they won't leave Eddieland

 

[Darkyprotector]

Did Shaz play in the SANFL prior to being drafted?

No his waxing was done in colts
2 time all aussie junior, WAXING pays off again

 

[Scodog10]

So we could slot him in somewhere between rising star and some role players from state leagues? The fact is Scherenberg has barely been best on at VFL level, so not really sure what the hopes are being pinned on. Let's hope he comes on.

It’s probably fair to do that because his circumstances are unique with his injuries. I wouldn’t have used the exact same language Apex did, but nor would I have called it a stretch to describe them in that way given the exceptional circumstances. That’s all that kicked off the discussion and on the whole 2018 will be a year in which I get tough on him.

Unfortunately that pick 6 status and the continued comparisons with Langdon are seeing him judged harshly by some and with kid gloves by others. We can only hope he takes the next step in 2018 by adding the competitive streak he lacks currently, IMO. If he finds that internal campaigner it’ll benefit the team greatly!

 

[Gone Critical]

Maybe a bundle of shaz, aish, broomhead might get us a 2nd and third with ports core getting older
One thing I do know , it won't stay the same

DP I know you have this strong belief that we are going to do a mass of trading with our uncontracted fringe players come the end of 2018 but its a little OTT.

Take Shaz, Aish and Broomy who I agree are all needing a season to consolidate their position on the list. Options are they step up and become best 22 in which case the players who do that will be signed on again and required.

The group who struggle to be best 22 in 2018 will have just finished either their 5th or 6th season in the AFL and are not best 22. You will not bundle them up for 2nd round draft picks. Why would Port clutter their list with reasonably experienced players who cant get a game at Collingwood. They will be delisted not traded.

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

What has scharenberg done? Ill tell ya its not much
Think he will be average at best...for pick 6 his a bust

Ducks for cover

I feel we should give him at least 1 season without injury interruption. He came back last year after 2 on the trot and played a bit in the second half of the year. I'd wager that if he doesn't cement a spot and show at least glimpses of something worthy of a pick 6 in 2018 then yes, you're right, he's a bust for a pick 6 most definitely.

Which would be a damn shame because that kind of waste sets us back long term but I was also very excited about him leading into that draft.

 

[MoreMoore]

I think the suggestion is that Murray plays the role. If not him then Appleby, but Appleby could be years away from grabbing a spot.

I think Greenwood could be turned into a lock down small defender.
Already has great tagging skills, strength and pace

 

[DaVe86]

The argument regarding Scharenberg is very easily answered.

His statistics last year given his injury background were quite good and deserve recognition, but his influence on games will need to improve to be a solid contributor.

He clearly plays in a position where he will get a lot of cheap possessions, but having said that his ball use was very good and composed. But he'll need to improve his one on one work, because if he can't defend then his spot will go to someone who is either super offensive or a good lock down. His endurance is also an issue, which is understandable given his injury past.

So I think at the same time we can be very pleased with his 2017 season, but also cautious with how good he actually is for now.

The pleasing thing for me is that he clearly look miles ahead at VFL level and he looked comfortable at AFL level. Statistically he already has shown his promise. But he has a lot of work to do. If he churns out the identical year as he did in 2017, then he'll lose his spot. There was plenty to like and dislike at the same time.

I'm confident on him. I think he has overcome a lot in his career, and he'll keep improving as he gains confidence in his body. If he can build some muscle and also a tank then it will help a lot too. I think he needs to play as the 4th defender who can play on talls or loose. At the moment, he seems to skinny to match the talls.

 

[Gone Critical]

The argument regarding Scharenberg is very easily answered.

His statistics last year given his injury background were quite good and deserve recognition, but his influence on games will need to improve to be a solid contributor.

He clearly plays in a position where he will get a lot of cheap possessions, but having said that his ball use was very good and composed. But he'll need to improve his one on one work, because if he can't defend then his spot will go to someone who is either super offensive or a good lock down. His endurance is also an issue, which is understandable given his injury past.

So I think at the same time we can be very pleased with his 2017 season, but also cautious with how good he actually is for now.

The pleasing thing for me is that he clearly look miles ahead at VFL level and he looked comfortable at AFL level. Statistically he already has shown his promise. But he has a lot of work to do. If he churns out the identical year as he did in 2017, then he'll lose his spot. There was plenty to like and dislike at the same time.

I'm confident on him. I think he has overcome a lot in his career, and he'll keep improving as he gains confidence in his body. If he can build some muscle and also a tank then it will help a lot too. I think he needs to play as the 4th defender who can play on talls or loose. At the moment, he seems to skinny to match the talls.

Beautifully balanced opinion.