Autopsy Cats lose to Port by 6 points after being down by 10 goals

[Cataholic]

As a supporter, thats what I believed.
I settled in for the night expecting a solid win.

Be honest how many other supporters felt the same way?

Well, there seemed to be a little of that in the pre-game discussion here, and our selections also seemed to suggest we wouldn't have to do too much to win.

I had to listen to the first quarter on the radio, and the commentators said a number of times that the Cats were simply 'refusing to get their hands dirty'. That suggests the boys didn't see a need to do so, and by the time they realised that Port were there to play it was too late.

They blew us off the park, and were rightly delighted with the win.

It'd be worthwhile for Scott and the boys to sit down and watch / review the last two games.

 

[you pick one]

Disappointing to fall just short after such a comeback but not unexpected given the first half.

I think the concerns about our midfield profile that many held over the summer are starting to surface now. Ruck issues aside, we were absolutely obliterated in the first half and the lack of pressure and clearances directly fed Port’s outside spread. They looked a million bucks and had players swarming everywhere but that’s the result of being so soundly beaten in the middle. I suspect this is why some of the senior players like Duncan looked so slow as well. There will be weeks where Bruhn, Holmes et al step up and play well but given their age and experience there will also be down weeks and it’s becoming increasingly unsustainable to rely on Danger and Guthrie as the experienced mids. I feel there is a pretty firm ceiling on Parfitt and Atkins - they can work well supporting a midfield system with the likes of Danger leading the way but cannot be relied upon to drive the bus. The midfield issue will dog us for the rest of the year and probably until the younger players grow up and/or we trade in a Bailey Smith type. That said, the rest of the field is strong and the coaching staff have been able to put together a plan/style that masks the midfield deficiencies - but do not be surprised if it comes back to bite should we make finals.

Looking at other aspects of the game, I agree with other posters that said we were no clean and seemed to run past a lot of balls. A lot of things just don’t quite go our way but that could be put down to the immense pressure the team put themselves under. Despite all the issues, we still managed some pretty brutal transitions from half back resulting in scores/goals in a manner of seconds.

Z Guthrie again very good down back. And I thought Mullin did well to limit JHF in the second half. His speed will be an asset moving forward.

I had Zuthrie best on for the Cats so smart to trapping Rioli's arm to gain the second 50 during the first 50 march.

 

[you pick one]

This “arrogant match committee” stuff is getting really tired. The club has made it clear they are managing player workloads this season. Winning 7-0 gave us that luxury. Of course the risk is we drop a few games along the way, which is what has happened in the past couple weeks. But the bigger picture is we are 7-2 and priming our players to be cherry ripe when it counts.

You call it arrogance, I call it good player management.

Hang on managing players is fine but for fsake on what planet do you rest 2 mids the week you lose 2 mids,arrogant stupidity madness just plain dumb take your pick.

 

[feelinfeline]

This “arrogant match committee” stuff is getting really tired. The club has made it clear they are managing player workloads this season. Winning 7-0 gave us that luxury. Of course the risk is we drop a few games along the way, which is what has happened in the past couple weeks. But the bigger picture is we are 7-2 and priming our players to be cherry ripe when it counts.

You call it arrogance, I call it good player management.

By my count Bowes has played six games for the year, including one as sub. He’s the only one of our players who gets 20-plus disposals.

If he needs a rest after five full games, we’re in trouble.

 

[Hello Kitty]

I'd say we've never been successful in recruiting an A grade ruckman, as opposed to never gone after one

We tried to get Goldstein in his prime more than once and tried to get in the race for Grundy when it was clear he was done at Collingwood.

What is the story with Grundy? Did Sydney pay big dollars? Does COLA still make Sydney attractive? Grundy is super fit + would be a good fit at Geelong. Did we offer lower dollars because we're considered the go to club?

 

[you pick one]

What is the story with Grundy? Did Sydney pay big dollars? Does COLA still make Sydney attractive? Grundy is super fit + would be a good fit at Geelong. Did we offer lower dollars because we're considered the go to club?

COLA is out isn't it?

 

[Hello Kitty]

COLA is out isn't it?

No idea, should have Googled. Say it's out, still have to ask, was a higher salary from Sydney the reason? I left in 2014, looked at Geelong, which offers a superior lifestyle to Sydney, IMO. Or did Grundy think Sydney had more chance of winning a premiership?

Just seems we missed a chance to get a ruckman.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

Sorry for the intrusion but I think you need your list manager to work his magic and get Sean Darcy at seasons end. Failing that, happy to give you guys Pete Ladhams

Nah, we won't be chasing him. They're all in on Conway, his body just isn't ready yet.

I don't see a stop gap with chasing either tbh. We'll persist with blitz and neale until then I think

 

[kickazz]

Thread title should be changed for posterity, we were only down by 8 goals, not ten.

Still a good effort to get back.

 

[fpm84]

No idea, should have Googled. Say it's out, still have to ask, was a higher salary from Sydney the reason? I left in 2014, looked at Geelong, which offers a superior lifestyle to Sydney, IMO. Or did Grundy think Sydney had more chance of winning a premiership?

Just seems we missed a chance to get a ruckman.

I don’t know how hard or not we chased Grundy, but he’s an inner city kinda guy who isn’t into the surf / farm lifestyles the surf coast provides.

Additionally, any ruckman in the league would look good tapping to Gulden, Heeney, Warner, Parker etc - see Tom Hickey’s career revitalisation at the Swans for example.

 

[Hello Kitty]

Conway barely has the tank to play 2 weeks in a row though and it will take time to fix.
Edwards is a kid and hasnt even played a vfl game yet.

We definitely need to trade/FA in some sort of ruck.

Tim English (Bulldogs) is a restricted free agent

Dangerfield is a restricted free agent

Geelong - unrestricted free agents:
Jed Bews
Mitch Duncan
Tom Hawkins
Jack Henry
Jake Kolodjashnij
Mark O'Connor
Brandan Parfitt
Rhys Stanley
Tyson Stengle*
Emerson Jeka*
Zach Tuohy
*Previously delisted

Any bargaining chips?

Our friend Kane Cornes:
“So Western Bulldogs fans, if (English) holds out, you offer him a deal that is fair and reasonable and good, but if he leaves, you take the first-round compensation and then go and get a B-grade ruckmen from somewhere else and use the compensation to bolster the talent on your list.”

"Ugle-Hagan and Smith, who should be the Dos’ number one re-signing priority?"

“Jamarra by a mile,”

Just throwing it out there ???

 

[dangerwood]

I hate when you lose on a Friday and then the VFL have a bye.

 

[Turbocat]

Port desrved the win. Their mid group beat us like eggs in a Kenwood. We just did not have the power to stop JHF early.

The way we started ..was it us being a little too relaxed? It seemed like just did not expect what they dished up.

Did Hawkins start to turn the corner? Not sure ..his touch is still at lower end of what he capable and it exposes his reliance in lead/feed.

Mullins did a good job

Zac Guthrie might be on the way to a B&F

Cameron reminds me of SJ… when he has a mare he can look selfish and out of sort.

Stanley...


Max Holmes..good effort to play on under duress.


Stengle is on the way to a huge contract ..and he will be worth it..


That aside.. I dislike the way the game is being umpired atm. its gone way past giving some sort protection bias to the man with the ball ... it almost impossible to be found to be holding the ball when tackled. Just hold on to it , take it to ground cause a ball up. Dont cough it up unless you see a team mate.

Not only is this making it a contested game ..which is the target for teams with a mid/ruck advantage … its also has to be encouraging players to absorb contact. Is that what we really want? Leigh M .., who is a strong advocate for the man with the ball even mentioned it on his Sun night show last week. Its getting out of hand .. My bet would be if you counted there would be 100’s of tackles accros the comp ..and less than 10% are rewarded with HTB.

 

[kittypurry]

I dont like some of the adjectives used , like he is garbage , some one in the preview said he was Dog S and bear in mind most if not all of the posters on this forum have played 1st Grade nothing

He is a Premiership player and played alot of good games for the Cats , and last week he was more than serviceable against Max Gawn

The bottom line with Geel , is while Dangerfield is still playing the Cats can be dangerous and do something . Once he is retired ( and there will be other older players go too ) then thats when the curtain gets drawn , and unless they get fluckingly lucky drafting/selecting players then they will be like Richmond today

But ive got no angst with that , because they have stayed up for nearly 20 years which is a sensational effort - plus the 4 Flags

Mate, we are 7-2? And we've lost both games by only a goal. It's hardly the end of the era.

We are blooding a lot of good young mids, which takes time. When Danger retires, it's not the end. It's the next chapter.

 

[BORIS332]

Hang on managing players is fine but for fsake on what planet do you rest 2 mids the week you lose 2 mids,arrogant stupidity madness just plain dumb take your pick.

We rested Bowes and Tuohy, Bruhn was injured. Tell me which two mids we ‘lost’ and which two mids we ‘rested’?

 

[catempire]

I think the criticism of Stanley is way over the top , he was very poor last night , maybe he went in injured , the week before against Gawn ( who is a champion ruckman and the best ruckman/ruck rover / midfielder all in one thats how good he is ) in the comp , and i thought Rhys was ok against Max . And some of the unpleasant stuff said tonight/today about Rhys a premiership player is kindergarten stuff

And he is not the only ruckman to be subbed off so early

To put a Geelong slant on it , Billy Goggin when he was coaching Footscray ,and Ian Bluey Hampshire was playing in the ruck for the Dogs in a game , they in the 1st qtr like the Cats last night , got smashed it was about 7 goals to nothing , and it was the 19th/20th man back then , so once you came off you were finished for the game .And at Qtr time Billy said to Bluey your off , 19th man came on , and i think Blueys respone to Goggin was he said you and the next 3 words started with L F and B - hah

Yeah really s**t. Stanley clearly went in injured and the plan was to play Conway. It didn’t work out but the commentary on his character/effort is pathetic.

 

[CHAWKTS]

So just watched the first qtr (I couldn’t re watch it last night!) and I actually feel better - it was just one of those nights early. More about mistakes actually than something permanent. And not really due to pressure just human error led to 3 of Ports first 4 goals.

Dempsey poor kick made worse by fumble from Kolo led to turnover goal….MOC just misjudged ball coming into forward line leading to another goal and then lack of concentration from SDK and Holmes thinking it would be a behind when it went back in to Rioli for this goal.

To me they are more than we would normally do and one of those nights…it continued a bit in the first half where our tap ons missed and every mis kick from Port worked out well for them!

I am not saying that our MF wasn’t beaten - it was…but at least the bad start for me was more about mistakes - maybe not switched on…

EDIT: And then the 6th one was just Stewart not coping with the attention and giving 50 metre away

Bad lost but this is very fixable

 

[Hello Kitty]

It's a difficult position, well, it's been awful for years.

I'm not keen on Blitz playing full time ruck. I do support Conway, despite his lack of tank, playing with Blitz rucking when Conway needs a breather. Does that mean Conway rests on the bench, or can he play forward to rest? Then there's Neale, who is a forward + according to some here, can ruck. So Neale playing, with Blitz rucking when Neale rests forward. Considering Conway + Neale, with Blitz doing some ruck work, could they be rotated? Getting games into them + resting when needed?

I have no idea, just a thought.

https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/thre...-being-down-by-10-goals.1381053/post-83514003

I’m not sure that Conway “isn’t ready”. He’s not ready to play a whole game in the middle but he can probably play 60%. Play Blicavs the other 40. Or you could bring Neale in as well and he could take the forward 50 stoppages to relieve part of the load.

I’d bring Mannagh in for Duncan. Bruhn and Bowes straight back in. Think Clark probably needs a run in the VFL - Hardie finally gets his opportunity.

YPO expressed it better than I + these are two good possible options, rotating Conway + Neale.

60% of a Conway game is 200% of a Stanley game (on average).

Definitely missed some of the youthful energy tonight.

Another good point.

We have options, which could improve our desperate ruck situation.

 

[CHAWKTS]

Mate, we are 7-2? And we've lost both games by only a goal. It's hardly the end of the era.

We are blooding a lot of good young mids, which takes time. When Danger retires, it's not the end. It's the next chapter.

I think you meant “Champ”…

 

[Pure_Ownage]

OK, your opinion and fair enough. It would have been a risk replacing Stanley with Soldo but could have been done.

But that's not the way our club does things. These days they mostly treat their players with respect, for better or worse, and only on rare occasions force players out of the club.

I get that and i like that we respect people but still i can name you a heap of players we have repectfully pushed into retirement in recent years and we will do the same with bews this year.

So why is rhys an outlier why is he such a special case that we cant? Given hes been average for 10 years its not quality related.

Sydney are a good example. They had brought ladhams in like a year before but they didnt let that stop them chasing grundy once he was available. No doubt as a result ladhams will ask for a trade again at the end of the year but sydney dont mind bc they got a clear upgrade in a spot they needed to in order to win a flag. Id like to see us be that ruthless now with our rucks. This us why we should have chased someone like soldo or moyle last year and why we must trade a ruck in at the end of the year.

 

[Jumping Jack]

We rested Bowes and Tuohy, Bruhn was injured. Tell me which two mids we ‘lost’ and which two mids we ‘rested’?

That’s not correct.

I know for a fact that Bruhn was cleared to play. So the club had a choice to make and I think it backfired.

Tuohy is understandable given his age - as is Hawkins / Duncan. But c’mon - resting / managing Bowes and Bruhn was a head scratcher.

If it comes off then great - but as much as I’m a Chris Scott fan - I think when it doesn’t, you need to own it. What other clubs “rest” blokes in the age demographic of Bruhn and Bowes.

The whole player management thing is questionable unless it’s blokes on the wrong side of 32-33



Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[The_Koulouriotis_Fan]

Do you honestly think Atkins would get a game for Carlton, GWS, Brisbane, Sydney, Collingwood?

He is a great tackler, but on the flip side is constantly caught holding the ball. He is a decent ball winner but a very average ball user. He is also too small.

He averages 15 touches a game. This is fine when he is the fourth or fifth midfielder with a defensive role, but last night he was asked to be the main man and was completely exposed. Mullin looked better. Anyway, I never wanted to be the driver of the Atkins is not that great bandwagon but here we are I guess.

Collingwood, Brisbane and Carlton, yes he would. We don’t play a high possession midfield.

The reality is that you can’t argue with results. He was an important player in our premiership year and is still performing in a team that sits 7-2.

He is not in our best 15 players but he is a solid role player and is a clutch player who has always stepped up when it counts.

I think you’re just expecting him to be an A grade midfielder and never will be.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

What is the story with Grundy? Did Sydney pay big dollars? Does COLA still make Sydney attractive? Grundy is super fit + would be a good fit at Geelong. Did we offer lower dollars because we're considered the go to club?

Sydney took over his collingwood contract.

I think we did chase him but i dont think he wanted to move to geelong. Hes a big city type.

 

[Chinacats]

I remember Clarko in his post game presser after their loss against the cats saying they had enough good looks going forward against the cats with open players but weren’t good enough to execute…. Port had free players all over the place and they torched us…. Rioli was left alone half the time… Stewart was off his game early and had to move away from defence to get away from the Port player’s physical approach to him…. And the out the back torching of our lackadaisical defense is deeply concerning given we are playing an open transition style of game.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Yeah really s**t. Stanley clearly went in injured and the plan was to play Conway. It didn’t work out but the commentary on his character/effort is pathetic.

Yes but the club has to own this.
Rhys has never ever been the sort of player to play well while playing injured.
If he wasnt fit he shouldnt have played even with no conway. It would at least have given us an extra runner that we needed.
It was a bad tactical call.

Im sure hes a decent person but he shouldnt have put his hand up to play and MC shouldnt have picked him.