Review Cats melt the AFL Nepo plastics by 24 points

[winty]

Speaking of umps, has anyone worked out what the Ben King free kick in front of goal was for?

Watched the mini-match thingy on Kayo - apparently it was for holding the man. Couldn't see any hold though.

 

[you pick one]

Watched the mini-match thingy on Kayo - apparently it was for holding the man. Couldn't see any hold though.

And not one of 4 eagle eyed umpire seen O'Connor have his head ripped off late after he'd kicked the ball. Incredible.

 

[frggr]

God the hand wringing over the Stewart bump is insane.

Anderson has been cleared of injuries - that's the end of it, surely

 

[frggr]

Watched the mini-match thingy on Kayo - apparently it was for holding the man. Couldn't see any hold though.

Yeah they commentators were like "Uh, can't quite see why that was paid".

It was a real Charlie Curnow level free

 

[frggr]

And not one of 4 eagle eyed umpire seen O'Connor have his head ripped off late after he'd kicked the ball. Incredible.

And nobody's talking about it "being looked at by the MRO"

 

[frggr]

The league should have a better way of evaluating umpire biases, in my opinion.

Measure an umpire's frees for and against each team throughout the years. The longer they work, the better the data.

Contrast their data with the league average for all other umpires. Any striking anomalies makes umpire X less likely to be given games with teams they have perceptual biases against.

It's a real thing and it's frustrating as hell. I follow NHL very closely and my team (which has been winning about 55% of it's games over the last 3 years) has lost 19 of 21 when a particular ref is involved in games, regardless of the opposition.

We have a good enough grasp on data analytics these days to be able to do away with people who are shit at their job.

The (stupid) answer to this is always "But these are professionals and we shouldn't need to do this blah blah blah"

I legitimately think a declaration of the team they support/supported needs to be made too.

In light of the Troy Pannell story, it needs to be handled better.

 

[frggr]

Sorry but this would be "make up frees" on steroids. Having our work judged by data analytics makes pretty much all of us worse in our vocations. Workers everywhere gotta fight that.

Very few of our vocations are influenced by sports betting though - it's important for a whole host of reasons

 

[frggr]

Good news for both Noah and Stew....

View attachment 2337017

Tom Stewart - 6 weeks for winding Noah Anderson

 

[Spearman]

Watched the mini-match thingy on Kayo - apparently it was for holding the man. Couldn't see any hold though.

SDK's right hand may have touched King's right arm before the actual contest. Hard to tell it was on other side of body from cam angle, but only thing could guess. Very soft.

 

[Play it Sam]

Jack Riewoldt.

Check out his body language when the other guy says nothing in it.
Moved lips like sucking on sour lemons.
Sick of these twerps and their confirmation biases.

 

[standupand]

Glad he is okay. My neighbour told me this morning he heard me call out "Stewy just killed a man" which I did in fact yell at the time. Classic hip and shoulder from Stewart.

Classic. Could've been the Cypress Hill CD you had playing.. "Here is something you can't understand.. Stewy just killed a man"

 

[Play it Sam]

Classic. Could've been the Cypress Hill CD you had playing.. "Here is something you can't understand.. Stewy just killed a man"

Back further. "Mama, i killed a man"

 

[standupand]

Very few of our vocations are influenced by sports betting though - it's important for a whole host of reasons

True. There needs to be a high degree of scrutiny around irregularities in betting etc, and to be frank a collective resistance to betting culture around the sport.

 

[thegerman]

Yeah I'm not denying he has burnt team mates. Like I said, you get one or two of those moments a game. It'd be perfect if it was zero.

I guess what I'm saying is that because he is a high volume player who is heavy on (non scoring shot) score involvements, disposals, clearances - many of which involve assisting his team-mates - then you can forgive the odd misjudgement. More so than if he was just bobbing up with the ball 5 times a game.

Mannagh buzzes around relentlessly for 4 quarters like an all action Duracell bunny. Sometimes the moment gets to him. Remember, he's only played like 30 games at this level. I realise he's a mature ager but nothing is like the intensity of actual AFL grade stuff.

I get it though. It's human nature to lay the boot in on a couple of mistakes and brush aside the 15-20 good moments. We've done it with Duncan his whole career. Dangerfield too.

Picking up a deficiency isn’t laying the boot in. We love Mannagh’s game, he’s given so much drive and energy. However, he does have a fairly obvious deficiency in his game around the goals where he could have a little more team orientation.

From an era where SJ, Mooney and others would handball 4 times in a goal square to give someone else a goal, at times I’d like Mannagh to look to pass off a little more instead of blazing away.

That’s not chastising him, or saying anything derogatory, it’s just something I’d like to see more in his game.

 

[standupand]

Back further. "Mama, i killed a man"

"Swear there was no contact to the head
Hip and shoulder to the chest.."

 

[Lana]

The league should have a better way of evaluating umpire biases, in my opinion.

Measure an umpire's frees for and against each team throughout the years. The longer they work, the better the data.

Contrast their data with the league average for all other umpires. Any striking anomalies makes umpire X less likely to be given games with teams they have perceptual biases against.

It's a real thing and it's frustrating as hell. I follow NHL very closely and my team (which has been winning about 55% of it's games over the last 3 years) has lost 19 of 21 when a particular ref is involved in games, regardless of the opposition.

We have a good enough grasp on data analytics these days to be able to do away with people who are shit at their job.

Between the amount of gambling that happens + social media, I don't trust the general public with such information

 

[Heckler]

Well 5 of Mannagh's 6 score involvements weren't shots at goal. 22 of his 23 disposals weren't shots at goal.

So despite that one "hungry" moment (and he does have 1 or 2 each game), he did a hell of a lot of other things that served his team-mates. Like every week.

I wouldn't be surprised in fact if Scott told Mannagh it's fine to pull the trigger every now and again - since Miers and Close usually pass off. Obviously in the heat of battle it can be tricky determining exactly when those moments should be.

If Mannagh passed to a teammate in a better position
Then this teammate fumbled... rushed... and missed.
Mannagh's critics would be howling and complaining
Asking:Why didn't Mannagh just kick the goal himself
Consider this : Ball is round. Boot is curved
Ball drop is inconsistent. Player is running.
Time is rushed. Player is fatigued or injured.
Ground is wet. Wind is blowing. Angle is tight.
Pressure of the occasion creates anxiety
Crowd is in anticipation. The kick is a gamble.
Even the greatest forwards missed sitters
The result brings either elation or deflation.
It is the not knowing that releases emotions
If every kick was a certainty it would be boring
There would be nothing to bitch about...right?

 

[Mr Meow]

Picking up a deficiency isn’t laying the boot in. We love Mannagh’s game, he’s given so much drive and energy. However, he does have a fairly obvious deficiency in his game around the goals where he could have a little more team orientation.

From an era where SJ, Mooney and others would handball 4 times in a goal square to give someone else a goal, at times I’d like Mannagh to look to pass off a little more instead of blazing away.

That’s not chastising him, or saying anything derogatory, it’s just something I’d like to see more in his game.

I rarely see the "balance" in these posts though. Like I said, Mannagh has had around 200 disposals this season. How many have been erratic, low percentage shots at goal? He is a clearance, score involvement, disposal, tackle machine linking the midfield and attack.

It gets frenetic at times when he breaks into that 50m strike zone - where there's a split second to decide on shooting or passing. Once or twice a game he sees red and goes for the goals when maybe it was wiser to pass. Boy do we get hysterical about that, amongst his 20 odd disposals a game (of which over 15 have nothing to do with kicking for goal).

I just find it interesting that we tend to focus on the negatives from his high volume work, for someone who has only played at this intense level for 30 odd games.

I'm fine for people to be that way, I'm merely adding the balance and perspective.

 

[Mr Meow]

If Mannagh passed to a teammate in a better position
Then this teammate fumbled... rushed... and missed.
Mannagh's critics would be howling and complaining
Asking:Why didn't Mannagh just kick the goal himself
Consider this : Ball is round. Boot is curved
Ball drop is inconsistent. Player is running.
Time is rushed. Player is fatigued or injured.
Ground is wet. Wind is blowing. Angle is tight.
Pressure of the occasion creates anxiety
Crowd is in anticipation. The kick is a gamble.
Even the greatest forwards missed sitters
The result brings either elation or deflation.
It is the not knowing that releases emotions
If every kick was a certainty it would be boring
There would be nothing to bitch about...right?

Spot on. At the end of the day he is averaging very, very well on goals, inside 50s and score involvements. He is one of our best clearance players while also being one of our most consistent forwards. The occasional **** up is pretty normal in that role unless you are a locked in All Australian. And it only looks bad when he misses.

At times all of our players have ignored possible options inside 50. Of the ones complained about, I'd estimate half have merit and half he was justified in having a shot. In the grand scheme of his productive play, it's a drop in the ocean.

 

[Generalissimo]

And I can 100% guarantee that, if that shot had gone through, nobody would be criticising him for being too hungry.

 

[Mr Meow]

Picking up a deficiency isn’t laying the boot in. We love Mannagh’s game, he’s given so much drive and energy. However, he does have a fairly obvious deficiency in his game around the goals where he could have a little more team orientation.

From an era where SJ, Mooney and others would handball 4 times in a goal square to give someone else a goal, at times I’d like Mannagh to look to pass off a little more instead of blazing away.

That’s not chastising him, or saying anything derogatory, it’s just something I’d like to see more in his game.

Just as a follow up, Mannagh has had 25 shots at goal this season. That's 2.5 per game from his 19 disposal average. 87% of his disposals are not shots at goal...for a forward.

He's had 69 score involvements. Only 20 of those were his own scores. 49 were assisting team mates scores. So he is helping someone else score 2.5x as often as he is scoring himself.

We can pick out a handful of other times he should've handed off to someone else. But the stats show us he is one of our highest volume players for assisting his team mates scoring.

 

[thegerman]

Just as a follow up, Mannagh has had 25 shots at goal this season. That's 2.5 per game from his 19 disposal average. 87% of his disposals are not shots at goal...for a forward.

He's had 69 score involvements. Only 20 of those were his own scores. 49 were assisting team mates scores. So he is helping someone else score 2.5x as often as he is scoring himself.

We can pick out a handful of other times he should've handed off to someone else. But the stats show us he is one of our highest volume players for assisting his team mates scoring.

I don’t disagree, however, I’d like to see him with more of a team first focus, which at times he doesn’t have.

 

[thegerman]

I rarely see the "balance" in these posts though. Like I said, Mannagh has had around 200 disposals this season. How many have been erratic, low percentage shots at goal? He is a clearance, score involvement, disposal, tackle machine linking the midfield and attack.

It gets frenetic at times when he breaks into that 50m strike zone - where there's a split second to decide on shooting or passing. Once or twice a game he sees red and goes for the goals when maybe it was wiser to pass. Boy do we get hysterical about that, amongst his 20 odd disposals a game (of which over 15 have nothing to do with kicking for goal).

I just find it interesting that we tend to focus on the negatives from his high volume work, for someone who has only played at this intense level for 30 odd games.

I'm fine for people to be that way, I'm merely adding the balance and perspective.

Yep and I can tell you that only highlighting positives in high performance sport isn’t at all realistic.

I agree on every point you’ve made on his abilities and performance, however, I would also like to see some team goals as well.

Surely people can raise that?

 

[Mr Meow]

I don’t disagree, however, I’d like to see him with more of a team first focus, which at times he doesn’t have.

87% of the time he has a team focus. Of the 13% where he decides to go for goal instead, maybe a small fraction of that could also be assisting team mates. A player winning the ball 20 odd times across half forward will likely have a ping at goal 2 or 3 times a game, unless they're Miers (who is an exceptionally rare type of player).

Want me to run the stats on Cameron? They'll show he has a MUCH more selfish profile concerning scoring shot to score involvement/disposal ratio. And I'd argue most of the time he is also justified in that.

 

[catsfootyfan89]

The (stupid) answer to this is always "But these are professionals and we shouldn't need to do this blah blah blah"

I legitimately think a declaration of the team they support/supported needs to be made too.

In light of the Troy Pannell story, it needs to be handled better.

100%. Find me a human being that doesn't have any bias towards anything and I'll show you a perfect impartial umpire. We also have a strange proclivity to disavow anyone who complains about the various judicial proceedings in competitive sports. I get that harping on about umpiring is fairly distasteful, but I just think we should strive for perfection in every facet of professional sports, not just the performance of the players.