Changes v Gold Coast

[Janus]

The only people who were wanting Harvey included were the key forward zealots who wanted to ignore every other aspect that makes an AFL footballer an AFL footballer because he's tall and might clunk a few marks and kick some goals.

Those who actually believe that hard running, tackling, forward defensive pressure and overall general work rate are non-negotiables for any player, including a key forward - like me - have never been sold on the idea. In terms of giving a decent forward structure, Butcher >>>> Harvey. At least for the moment.

 

[Dylan8]

People who wanted Harvey in just wanted a key forward - any key forward - in, because at that point we weren't into Dixon and the only key forwards we had were Ryder and old ass Schulz and another year without KPF development at AFL level would have made this year an abject failure.

 

[ozph1870]

Clearly your standards are lower than mine. I would expect Lobbe to utterly destroy any ruckman in the SANFL. He's played two games, one to the required standard, and one well, well below that. And once again, offered not a damn thing around the ground. His form has deserted him, and his call up is as baffling as O'Shizes.

I wouldn't have picked lobbe. Saying lobbe was pants by bass is way off the mark, lobbe had a far greater impact on the game than bass did.

 

[Janus]

People who wanted Harvey in just wanted a key forward - any key forward - in, because at that point we weren't into Dixon and the only key forwards we had were Ryder and old ass Schulz and another year without KPF development at AFL level would have made this year an abject failure.

Ah yes, the magic pixie dust of 'development at AFL level' - where a player that can't do the minimum requirements such as running, chasing, tackling and impacting the general play in a slower, lower league suddenly metamorphoses into a beautiful key forward that does all those things in a faster, elite league. Also known as the O'Shea Effect.

I'm pretty sure that Hinkley is fully aware of our lack of firepower up forward going into the future, in spite of what some on here might think. But that being said, he hasn't put a foot wrong in the development and reward of any player since he's been here because he doesn't gift games to players who aren't doing the core fundamentals and putting in 100% effort. People need to have some faith in our coaches, list management and recruiting staff who have their careers on the line making these sorts of decisions.

 

[Dylan8]

You call it magic pixie dust and then cite a player who actually does perform better in the AFL system

 

[Janus]

You call it magic pixie dust and then cite a player who actually does perform better in the AFL system

Just because it's rare doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

 

[Young Gun #6]

What's the bet lobbe basically the rucks the whole game and isn't even tested as a 50% + forward. We got the win over the Hawks boys now back to what was one of the Main reasons we were failing with !

 

[edgie]

No, I do believe the earlier calling for Harvey was at the same time as the dismissal of Butcher. It had less to do with a key forward, and more to do with most of the posters having seen enough of Johnny Boy that they would've rather seen an ill prepared Harvey, cause he was kicking 2 goals a game.

 

[Powerstufff]

In the 12 starts we have had 2 ruckmen: we have amassed 21 goals from them ...

Bit of a meaningless stat surely? Put me and Adam Goodes in a room and we average one Brownlow and one premiership each.

 

[FallingLiefs]

Bit of a meaningless stat surely? Put me and Adam Goodes in a room and we average one Brownlow and one premiership each.

I was pointing towards the fact that playing two rucks upped our average from about 0.18 goals/ per game (last 2 years when rucking solo) to just under 2, that suggests the two tall combo is working. I wasn't pumping up Lobbe's goal scoring ability more so suggesting that these two players will no doubt be in our best 22.

 

[OneGreatClub]

Ah yes, the magic pixie dust of 'development at AFL level' - where a player that can't do the minimum requirements such as running, chasing, tackling and impacting the general play in a slower, lower league suddenly metamorphoses into a beautiful key forward that does all those things in a faster, elite league. Also known as the O'Shea Effect.

I'm pretty sure that Hinkley is fully aware of our lack of firepower up forward going into the future, in spite of what some on here might think. But that being said, he hasn't put a foot wrong in the development and reward of any player since he's been here because he doesn't gift games to players who aren't doing the core fundamentals and putting in 100% effort. People need to have some faith in our coaches, list management and recruiting staff who have their careers on the line making these sorts of decisions.

Well said.

 

[edgie]

Has anyone here ever played the Guitar Hero games on a hard setting, then when going back to an easy setting, completely ****ed everything up and had a shithouse score?

Performing worse in a lower competition is very real.

 

[Powerstufff]

I was pointing towards the fact that playing two rucks upped our average from about 0.18 goals/ per game (last 2 years when rucking solo) to just under 2, that suggests the two tall combo is working ....

I'd say most supporters, and pundits don't think it's working. Principally that Lobbe has been ineffective in ruck this year, and elsewhere on the ground. And that when Lobbe is in ruck and Ryder elsewhere on the ground Ryder has not given much.

..... I wasn't pumping up Lobbe's goal scoring ability more so suggesting that these two players will no doubt be in our best 22.

Lobbe's just been unambiguously dropped for 2 weeks, I think there's every doubt both will be in our best 22 going forward. I don't know why after Lobbe's solid performances last year. I'm not happy about it. But unless Lobbe reinvents himself there's no spot for him.

 

[OneGreatClub]

I'd say most supporters, and pundits don't think it's working. Principally that Lobbe has been ineffective in ruck this year, and elsewhere on the ground. And that when Lobbe is in ruck and Ryder elsewhere on the ground Ryder has not given much.

Lobbe's just been unambiguously dropped for 2 weeks, I think there's every doubt both will be in our best 22 going forward. I don't know why after Lobbe's solid performances last year. I'm not happy about it. But unless Lobbe reinvents himself there's no spot for him.

Jonas was pretty crap this year too until he was dropped. Sometimes they need a shakeup to find some form again. Both great players. Keep the faith.

 

[Powerstufff]

...Sometimes they need a shakeup to find some form again. Both great players. Keep the faith.

Yeah I've got high hopes Lobbe can switch on, take marks, compete around the ground like I'm sure I remember from 2014. I guess he has two games left this year to leave a good impression for next year. Without injury it would be weird for a high performing ruckman one year to go to fill-in player two years later.

 

[raptalia]

Lobbe's inclusion is interesting. Maybe Ken is looking at match ups or maybe he thinks the opposition might be window shopping. I thought Ryder as the no1 ruck worked pretty well last week so why go back to a combination that has hardly worked all year? It must be a match up thing or maybe Paddy is not quite over that achilles problem ?

Good to see Amon back in the side. Like Brendan AhChee, Amon is definitely a work in progress and at this stage the more games of AFL he gets the better. I suspect that either Amon or Young will start as the sub. If it were up to me I would make Brad Ebert the sub, just to give him a wake up call. 2015 has not been a good year for Brad.

Aaron Young has potential but he is at the stage where he needs to impose himself on AFL football. He has ability but has too many games where he does a couple of good things and that is it. Young is like Andrew Moore, a player who we are searching for a position that suits. If Young gets a run I would not be surprised if Ken chucks him into the midfield to see how he copes. Just as he has done with Sam Gray.

 

[Andre]

Has anyone here ever played the Guitar Hero games on a hard setting, then when going back to an easy setting, completely stuffed everything up and had a shithouse score?

Performing worse in a lower competition is very real.

So delist Lobbe unless he wins X-Factor?

 

[Kingfish73]

I have thoroughly enjoyed watching our midfield excel under Ryder's ruck work. Lobbe will be under pump to show his talent at the bounce. And his 2nd and 3rd ground work efforts. He is not a forward and does not have the natural abilities to position, body and balance to take contested marks. He won't get traded imo but is very quickly loosing significant ground in being in our best 22. Sliding door times for lobbe

 

[Powerstufff]

Lobbe's inclusion is interesting .... I thought Ryder as the no1 ruck worked pretty well last week so why go back to a combination that has hardly worked all year? ..

I'd say it wouldn't have happened if we were able to make finals, or were in them and trying to improve our position. I doubt we're trying to give him value as trade bait, who would be convinced by two good games at the end of the year? I think it's simply he has been sat in the naughty corner and now has a chance to show he has listened to whatever he hadn't been listening to before.

 

[Coobk001]

Harvey isn't injured. He's been left out and told to work his arse off on the track. Contract not guaranteed.

I find this extremely hard to believe. Source?

I watch Johann and Howard (as a forward) under perform week after week yet they drop Harvey? Doesn't seem right.

 

[badbeats]

Mitchell can qualify for SANFL finals. Needs 1 more game to do so.

 

[woffy]

....Lobbe's just been unambiguously dropped for 2 weeks, I think there's every doubt both will be in our best 22 going forward. I don't know why after Lobbe's solid performances last year...

This is a common theme, that Lobbe had a great 2014, and if he re-discovers this form, he's best 22.
His career & 2014 stats are almost identical - in fact averaged less marks (2.04) & less goals (0.25) per game in 2014 then career. The only stat really better in 2014 was his tackling, from those great 2nd & 3rd efforts after the ruck. In regards the actual taps / hit-outs, he didn't dominate, rather stopped the other ruckmen dominating.
His contested efforts in the ruck & rucking pretty much solo the entire year blinded us all to his overall ability (or lack of). I fear he'll never be the ruck / forward we need. Hope he proves me wrong, 'cause he's a top bloke.

 

[OneGreatClub]

I find this extremely hard to believe. Source?

I watch Johann and Howard (as a forward) under perform week after week yet they drop Harvey? Doesn't seem right.

Making AhChee and Sam Gray work their butts off to get up to standard worked. In Ken we trust. He wants his boys to each reach their full potential, for the team's sake and for theirs. A gun forward has been, and continues to be, our weakness especially with Schulz lacking form or injured and whoever wants that spot in the future needs to bloody well earn it.

 

[SgtSchulz]

Ryder to kick 6.
Wingard to kick 7.
Butcher to kick.
Lobbe 60 hitouts.
Dixon to don a Port guernsey in the second half.

 

[Papa G]

I find this extremely hard to believe. Source?

I watch Johann and Howard (as a forward) under perform week after week yet they drop Harvey? Doesn't seem right.

Do you see his name on the injury list?

Source: although second hand to me, was Mitch Harvey.