Rumour Dees pull out of tough training camp

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Hafey did get Collingwood to four GF's in six seasons. Given they didn't play in a GF for six seasons pre-Hafey and seven seasons post-Hafey, an alternative view might be that his methods worked.

given that tapering is a well known training strategy nowadays in all sports, I call bullshit on that theory.

We're off topic and yes his fitness regime certainly worked. But it hindered when it mattered.

 

[peppy la pew]

Well you've answered your own question.

2017 is a long way from the 70s, 80s, 90s and even the start of the decade. Sport Science had developed exponentially since those days, and the players calling bullshit on some 'camp' run by a macho insecure full metal jacket drill sergeant is something I've got no issue on.

In that case you must be highly critical of your coaching & fitness dept's for organising the boot camp for a second time.

Also there must be an underlying problem if the players went to the AFLPA, instead of the coaches

There most definitely is something going on

 

[Ricketz]

That’s not the point though.

The point is that the coaching staff have proposed this game again.
And that the players have had to speak to The aflpa.

So whether uou think the players should toughen up or be better looked after, it appears to be the case that Melbourne FC hold BOTH positions on the matter.

So? They have found an incongruity with their training program and are now addressing it. How is this even a big ticket thing for all the Esmay's here tut tutting over another footy clubs training programs? I mean, given your faux concern, shouldn't you still be untangling your knickers over the lost time that came from Cyril's poor hamstring treatment?

Trolling or just nothing better to do with time for many posters here.

 

[rank and file]

Should be fined $500k for tanking a training camp.

Have you been up to your old tricks with backpacks again Brick Loosener?

 

[Lance Uppercut]

Got to love all the macho chest puffing from keyboard warriors here, 'Melbourne are this and that'. Can't wait for a thread to start saying 'Goodwin has lost the players'. Biggest load of overrated spin that has captured all the BF cynics on the way down the hill.

At the end of the day, the players don't need some SAS style training camp unless they're actually training for the SAS. It's 2017 and we are playing football for gods sake, just because they aren't standing in front of some drill sergeant with about as much relevance in the world as my nearly cut grass, doesn't mean they are soft, especially considering an injury occurred last year whereby it was no doubt conducted under extreme and not relevant situations.

Oh, come on - its clear you guys are trolling. You are speculating big time - on a topic that the players clearly should be praised for, if we have learned anything from the Essendon saga and repeat concussion issue. Players need to protect their livelihood, but you think their bodies are for your entertainment only. Its a pretty immature perspective, to be honest.

actually I'm going to do most un-BigFooty thing here and concede that I've gone off a bit half-cocked on this one.

More recent reports suggest the players merely asked the AFLPA for advice on how to approach the club. Then raised it with the club, who cancelled it due to their concerns and feedback.

If that's how it happened then it's probably a case of right result and decent enough process, so apologies Dees fans. It's not as bad as all that after all

 

[chiwigi]

I have two thoughts on this:

1. Goodwin is a nutter with his army “push em to the limit” approach.

2. Endless fuel for opposition sledgers. This will not go well for the dees public image.

Even the army have stopped doing stupid s**t like that.

 

[demondavey]

but... if A and B then C is absurd. And therefore so is D. How can you be giving it the old move on nothing to see here treatment?

The players and the coaches are fundamentally at odds. The players had to get the union to step in. You yourself think that "the players don't need some SAS style training camp unless they're actually training for the SAS. It's 2017 and we are playing football for gods sake, just because they aren't standing in front of some drill sergeant with about as much relevance in the world as my nearly cut grass".

And yet this is clearly not what your club's coaches think. To the point that union intervention was required?

Why didn't the coaches accede to the players demands themselves?

How is that nothing to see here?

Your making a mountain from a molehill. This will be forgotten about by mid January when there is a new story.

There is no problem with being at odds with people, it's part of life. It's how you work these issues that's more critical.

This is just a typical overreaction from BF posters looking to dramatise something that isn't there, you'd swear half the people here operate under the alias of Mark Robinson.

 

[demondavey]

actually I'm going to do most un-BigFooty thing here and concede that I've gone off a bit half-cocked on this one.

More recent reports suggest the players merely asked the AFLPA for advice on how to approach the club. Then raised it with the club, who cancelled it due to their concerns and feedback.

If that's how it happened then it's probably a case of right result and decent enough process, so apologies Dees fans. It's not as bad as all that after all

You're one of a few decent posters who can pull up stumps when he knows not to push it to far.

Kudos.

 

[Leather Poisoning]

So? They have found an incongruity with their training program and are now addressing it. How is this even a big ticket thing for all the Esmay's here tut tutting over another footy clubs training programs? I mean, given your faux concern, shouldn't you still be untangling your knickers over the lost time that came from Cyril's poor hamstring treatment?

Trolling or just nothing better to do with time for many posters here.

It’s not trolling to discuss an issue.

Players at odds with coaching staff is always worth discussing. Seeing which party wins out is what interests me the most.

 

[demondavey]

In that case you must be highly critical of your coaching & fitness dept's for organising the boot camp for a second time.

Also there must be an underlying problem if the players went to the AFLPA, instead of the coaches

There most definitely is something going on

No, not at all. The camp was organised differently after feedback from last year. It's not that they didn't listen. The players ultimately decided they didn't want to do it probably due to being burnt last year and some inherent risk.

 

[dean33]

Hafey cost Collingwood a few flags by overtraining them in GF week, would have been happy if somebody had have been able to reign him back...but thats an aside.

Tommy seemed to do alright at Richmond? Maybe it was more the players not being capable rather then the coach? Didn’t he take them from wooden spooner to grand final in one season?

 

[Farm Boy]

Not a good look for the Demons. They need a coach they all respect.

 

[dean33]

Well you've answered your own question.

2017 is a long way from the 70s, 80s, 90s and even the start of the decade. Sport Science had developed exponentially since those days, and the players calling bullshit on some 'camp' run by a macho insecure full metal jacket drill sergeant is something I've got no issue on.

Maybe you have a point and this style of training has no place in today’s modern game, if this is the case though isn’t it a slap in the face for the football department and high performance trainers organizing such camps?

 

[dean33]

perhaps someone should tell Goodwin and co?

It's strange in the extreme that some Melbourne supporters are acting as though this camp was forced on them by the AFL or something.

Well no, this was a Melbourne planned event, that wasn't cancelled by Melbourne.

It's one of the strangest preseason stories I've heard, that's for sure

Not often I agree with you lance but you are spot on here.

 

[TerryWallet]

actually I'm going to do most un-BigFooty thing here and concede that I've gone off a bit half-cocked on this one.

More recent reports suggest the players merely asked the AFLPA for advice on how to approach the club. Then raised it with the club, who cancelled it due to their concerns and feedback.

If that's how it happened then it's probably a case of right result and decent enough process, so apologies Dees fans. It's not as bad as all that after all

Oh cmon Lance, don't fall for the post-spin. The players fundamentally disagreed with the coaches on their main training camp. And got it cancelled.

If there is a sliver between the coach and the players, there may as well be a mile.

 

[chickentendies]

Kokoda for an inexperienced hiker is tough. Honestly, if you're used to hiking with a pack on, its easy as piss.
But there's a really positive point to the exercise and it resonates strongly with many Australian cultural values, which is where a lot of the benefits are drawn from.
Last years Demon's camp is one of those bullshit 'endorsed by SAS!!1!!' camps loved by Rodney Eade 'if you yell louder people listen' types that has minimal net worth. Demon's management have failed the players in introducing a shitty training camp with minimal benefit.
Put it this way: if they pulled out of a Hawks-esque camp I'd be roasting them hardcore. Its important for training to push your absolute limits and build comradery. But bricks in bags type camps is deprecated bullshit - especially when players are getting injured via these stupid exercises.

 

[A Swallow]

We did it (when I served) to train for decision making under duress and to test leadership capacities when physically and emotionally stressed. I don't see too many similarities with the football field - if it's a bonding exercise fair enough but sleep is vital for recovery and to prevent adrenal fatigue which must be a big risk during AFL pre-seasons.

We still do it - I just got back from the MER, and often we were flying and operating on very little or no sleep. It's relevant training for Defence personnel (in certain positions), not sure how relevant it is to AFL players. Possibly not at all.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Tommy seemed to do alright at Richmond? Maybe it was more the players not being capable rather then the coach? Didn’t he take them from wooden spooner to grand final in one season?

Lacking talent maybe. It was generally the story for a lot of Collingwoods GF losses. All the more reason to ease the workload on the training track in September. Its a long time ago now and off topic so I'll leave it at that....just pointing out that it was generally accepted that Hafey trained his team too hard during the finals.

 

[jack son 5]

Which part, the broken pack or the whole 'boot camp' experience.

The pack thing was a throw away line.

If you can not see the use of a team building exercise like this, then nothing I say to you will convince you otherwise. IMO Melbourne's problem is not this football skills, it is their inability to go that extra inch. The ability to know that no matter how hard a game of football appears to be, they have done something harder, and succeeded.

Until they develop the mental resilience to overcome adversity as a team, we will continue to see performances like 2017 where they will finish mid-ladder and never really push for the premiership.

Spot on. The Pies game was just another embarrassment. Had every chance to over take Collingwood in the second half and play finals.
Same with the Brisbane game two weeks before. Was a snooze fest sitting in the sun watching that garbage. Percentage was on the line for finals and they couldn’t put in that extra inch like you said. Soft.
Melbourne supporters talking top 4 next year, no idea at all.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

In that case you must be highly critical of your coaching & fitness dept's for organising the boot camp for a second time.

Also there must be an underlying problem if the players went to the AFLPA, instead of the coaches

There most definitely is something going on

This time last year many Dees fans were denying any rift between club and Watts after he was berated by the club for being out of shape.

 

[Chuckie357]

Melbourne taking over North Melbourne as the faux tough kings

 

[Heisenberg_]

Salem's was a cracker.
Soon as i read about it i remembered Fanie de Villiers the South African opening bowler who skittled us at the SCG with a 10for around 1993/94???ish. All the talk here in the press for the following tour a few yrs later was about the return of de Villiers, then, before the tour he goes and fiddles with his lawn mower back home and massacres two fingers on his bowling hand. Never saw him here again.

We couldnt figure out whether to laugh or cry last year when Dan Rampe tried to skip over a little 20cm high chain fence outside the SCG after Rnd 1, tripped like a goose and broke his arm, out for 2 months. Horse must have been impressed.

Salem's injury is right up near the top.

Alex Rance gets around on a motorised scooter, fell off it and fractured his foot after round 1 couple of years ago.
Another Richmond one was Mark Coughlan on the comeback from a knee reconstruction, tripped over in the shower and had to be done again, dunno if it's a urban myth of the truth but apparently he was in the shower with his girlfriend when he did it.

 

[demondavey]

Not surprising, they are soft as butter. When you have someone like Bernie Vince trying to rough up other players it's laughable.

Oh yeah, and North are full of heroes aren't they? Please.

 

[jack son 5]

These camps aren’t as bad as people are making out on here. It’s 3 days FFS, and the players get a nice break after.
It’s not all about fitness and bonding. It’s a chance for your own self belief. It’s knowing that you can push yourself that little bit extra.
Salem’s injury was caused because he didn’t pack his gear as he was instructed. It wasn’t his pack that failed, it was his inability to follow orders. Yes he was fatigued, which is the point of the exercise.

 

[Simon_Says]

Skinny 19 year old infantry soldiers have no problem doing this.

Very embarrassing

Not relevant

Infantry soldiers dont get paid to kick a piece of leather around.