Recruiting Draft Watch 2021

[eDPS]

eDPS's 2021 Draft Rankings

Lore's 2021 Provisional Draft Order
Any issues with it please tag Lore in this thread: https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/2021-provisional-draft-order.1251001/

 

[JayJ20]

Don’t want the moaning from the masses when another early pick is stuck in the queue to get midfield minutes because he is hardly different to what we already have.

We all have our favourites and in this case, no point selling to the blind when one can’t see the whole picture


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I'll preface this by saying I am probably one of Dodoro's biggest critics when it comes to list balance, particularly midfield balance.
My opinion is that he got this selection 100% right with the available players and I'll explain why.

Don't let height deceive you. We actually don't have many of his type when you look at ability, strength and the way he plays rather than just his height. Hobbs is easily the most defensively minded of our midfield group. As good as Parish is, tackling is not his strength.
Hobbs excels in every area that our midfield lacks except aerial presence. Parish is the only one that even compares to what he brings to our midfield.

Stoppage clearances, contested possessions, ferocious tackling that sticks, strong in contests, good in the rain, excellent by hand, can push forward, doesn't extract and bomb the ball but looks for options etc. The inside bull we've crying out for. Height, athleticism and perhaps speed are the only things he lacks, but that's not a problem when you consider our overall list.
The alternative in Johnson is great and fits our list needs too, but the lack of winning contested ball means he's also a questionable selection for our list profile.

Dodoro was essentially left with:
Option A - A tall mid in Johnson who struggles to win contested ball.
Option B - A pure contested ball winning inside mid, but his height is similar to our other mids.

I'd be very happy with either, but given how the EF panned out, I agree with our list managers that Hobbs' qualities address a bigger list need than Johnson's. Rutten publicly stated that we're looking to improve our contested work, so Hobbs is almost the perfect pick for that.

If he was 2-3 cms taller, then no one would have an issue with picking him up. We now have 3, possibly 5 mids (Parish, Stringer, Hobbs and possibly Caldwell and Perkins) that can reliably win the ball. Given that Stringer and Perkins are likely only attending centre bounces, we have more options around stoppages.
That's the type of depth in the middle that wins premierships. Obviously the glaring need is still some height in the middle, but we'll see how we can work our way around that.

 

[Lance Uppercut]

And Johnson ended up sliding out of the first round entirely. He sounded good but it's not like we passed him and he got snapped up. Not one club rated him as worthy of their first round pick. Not one. Despite how appealing he seems on paper.

Every year there's phantom darlings who end up ultimately not rated by those paid to make the decision.

 

[JayJ20]

And Johnson ended up sliding out of the first round entirely. He sounded good but it's not like we passed him and he got snapped up. Not one club rated him as worthy of their first round pick. Not one. Despite how appealing he seems on paper.

Every year there's phantom darlings who end up ultimately not rated by those paid to make the decision.

Yep and by West Coast, Richmond and Sydney, who all desperately need big mids.

I like Johnson and wouldn't even mind offering Freo an F1 for him, but Hobbs is the reliable pick between the two IMO.

 

[coastalpipeline]

Yep, may be the best on the draft board but who does he play in front of in the real world at AFL level?


I’ve enjoyed what Dodoro has done but this has just about put a line through my defence of him.


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Usually if you play for the Bombers, he would play infront of Bomber fans that attend the games or watch on TV.

 

[coastalpipeline]

After hearing his name called out…Hobbs Sobs, I’ll show myself out

Was probably more relieved to get a call out, having been ranked as top 5. He didn't want to return tomorrow, for tomorrow he wants to get on with the job to play for us- that's what he said.

 

[coastalpipeline]

Big picture [emoji848]


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He plays similar to Boak & Adams. Has similar grunt to Stringer. Can play back mid or forward mid. Has huge tackling fuel. Could rotate with Caldwell. There are a tremendous amount of options with this player. Dodoro did a great job getting him.

 

[Zach Package]

He plays similar to Boak & Adams. Has similar grunt to Stringer. Can play back mid or forward mid. Has huge tackling fuel. Could rotate with Caldwell. There are a tremendous amount of options with this player. Dodoro did a great job getting him.

He plays a similar game style to all the inside players that always destroy us because they can actually get around the ground.

This means we don’t have to go chasing our tail to find an inside player tonight and can focus on players with a few tricks and more athletic utility types, of which there are plenty around.

Also worth bearing in mind that it’s not looking like we’ll be picking a contested ball winner early next year so RFK get a big tick from me for picking the right player at the right time.

 

[boncer34]

Height is one aspect. It is not the primary defining factor that determines points of difference. In fact, it's ******* bizarre how hung up on it you are.

The idea that 4 players are all the same because they are somewhat similar heights is utterly ridiculous.

What about, for example, their: kicking, attack on the ball, attack on the contest, defensive running, spread, attitude, skill level, ability to extract, toughness, physicality, leadership ability, desire, dedication, muscle mass, footy IQ, stamina, courage, body shape and frame, gut-running ability, spring, two-sidedness, handballing capability, vision, decision-making, hunger, athletic ability, overhead marking, ability beneath their feet, goal kicking nous, set-shot ability, ball handling, agility, temperament, tackling, ability to one touch, will to win, game awareness, ability to slow time, capacity to perform under pressure, wet weather skills, core strength, passion, training desire, speed off the mark, reading of the play, communication skills, x-factor - I mean, I could literally not stop here. This is just off the top of my head.

Yet this kid is universally rated the best inside mid in the draft, maybe in the best half-dozen of them overall, but you're moaning that none of this matters simply because he's similar in height to others in our team?! And you're accusing others of being too blind to appreciate the bigger picture?!

******* lol, give me a spell

I wish I could like this post twice. The fixation on one element of a player is mind numbing.

 

[GUMBLETRON]

Don’t want the moaning from the masses

Be the change you want to see.

 

[Lore]

Not many of our early picks got stuck in the queue. In fact it was only really Kav and he came to the club with an injury history and needed to be eased through his first year anyway. McGrath played. Parish played, Melksham played, Hurley played, Cox played , Perkins played , Langford got some games so did Merrett. Heppell played. Where is our history of parking early picks ?

Parish played in 2016 because half our team was suspended and then after that took a couple of years to build his craft between the VFL midfield and the AFL forward flank. He hasn’t really been in the guts until this year.

Francis was a bit patchy for a while too. Langford also spent a bunch of time in the VFL. Draper’s debut was probably delayed a little and then the ACL added a year to that. Laverde was perpetually injured so I don’t think you can judge that one, he played when fit.

Under Worsfold playing the kids didn’t really happen much after 2016, with the exception of McGrath. They had to force their way in and there seemed to be a lot of reluctance from the selection committee to go away from underperforming senior players.

Could be that we traded out the early picks and didn’t play the later picks though (Ridley being the best example). Many of the later picks ended up delisted anyway so not playing them probably wasn’t a big loss.

 

[ant555]

Parish played in 2016 because half our team was suspended and then after that took a couple of years to build his craft between the VFL midfield and the AFL forward flank. He hasn’t really been in the guts until this year.

Francis was a bit patchy for a while too. Langford also spent a bunch of time in the VFL. Draper’s debut was probably delayed a little and then the ACL added a year to that. Laverde was perpetually injured so I don’t think you can judge that one, he played when fit.

Under Worsfold playing the kids didn’t really happen much after 2016, with the exception of McGrath. They had to force their way in and there seemed to be a lot of reluctance from the selection committee to go away from underperforming senior players.

Could be that we traded out the early picks and didn’t play the later picks though (Ridley being the best example). Many of the later picks ended up delisted anyway so not playing them probably wasn’t a big loss.

The point is no one was left waiting in the queue .
I would argue that Worsfold played most. Begley got games early when he was not injured. Much got a look in but also seemed to get injured as soon as he was injured in the side . Francis would have played more but he also had injury issues before his extended break.
As for
Parish . Yes he got games in 2016 but he got games in 2017 and 2018. 20 20 15 games says he did not play too many VFgames today n his first 3 years. He would have got games anyway . As fo not in the middle . He has played 70% of his games in the midfield rotation. Sure he has been more full time
Midfield this year but apart from the first 4 or 5 games in 2020 he has played a lot of midfield .
Langford played 8 games in his first year and high teens in his second.
Draper being a ruck and late pick does not really count.

Like I said not many of the early picks where left waiting in line and just playingVFL. Those who did not really play had injury issues.

 

[ant555]

I know there is some comments on Johnson and
Contested footy. I have watched most of his games on my computer and from my view his contested work is fine .

The fact he has
Not been picked first round is what it is . Clubs looking for various types .

Hobbs is a good get for us. Fills the need
For a genuine inside midfielder so I do not have a lot of issues with it. Someone will get pushed out of the midfield sooner rather than later as he will play pretty soon.

 

[Corleone]

The attitude of some posters on this forum is mind-blowing.

It's not like the kid is 170cm ... He's 183cm tall, if he was 185 literally no one would be complaining at all.

We have been crying out for a pure inside midfielder for years, we finally draft the best one available in a draft year and still people complain.

If height is such a factor why doesn't Kyle Langford

4

Kyle Langford

Age

29

Ht

192cm

Wt

88kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

15.7

4star

K

8.3

3star

HB

7.3

5star

M

3.9

4star

T

3.3

5star

G

0.7

4star

D

17.4

4star

K

9.0

4star

HB

8.4

4star

M

4.4

4star

T

1.6

3star

G

0.7

4star

D

8.2

2star

K

3.2

2star

HB

5.0

4star

M

2.0

3star

T

2.6

4star

G

0.6

3star

(191cm) dominate in the middle? What about Cutler (192)? I mean they've got the height so surely that's all that's required yeah?

Ridiculous

 

[TheGrizz]

Parish played in 2016 because half our team was suspended and then after that took a couple of years to build his craft between the VFL midfield and the AFL forward flank. He hasn’t really been in the guts until this year.

Francis was a bit patchy for a while too. Langford also spent a bunch of time in the VFL. Draper’s debut was probably delayed a little and then the ACL added a year to that. Laverde was perpetually injured so I don’t think you can judge that one, he played when fit.

Under Worsfold playing the kids didn’t really happen much after 2016, with the exception of McGrath. They had to force their way in and there seemed to be a lot of reluctance from the selection committee to go away from underperforming senior players.

Could be that we traded out the early picks and didn’t play the later picks though (Ridley being the best example). Many of the later picks ended up delisted anyway so not playing them probably wasn’t a big loss.

I would argue that the majority of our early picks have required a bit of development, whereas the ones that were physically ready played straight away. Langford, Laverde, Ridley, Kavanagh, Parish all required a reasonable amount of physical development.
Ridley, Langford and Parish required physical development (Darcy was barely 70kgs when drafted and still played due to ASADA) to get to AFL standard. Whereas Laverde, Francis had fitness issues, and Kavanagh had both.

Alternatively, those who were physically ready being Melksham, Heppell, McGrath, Merrett etc all played plenty early.

The other main difference I think is from 2012-2015 and 2017-2020 we had this misguided belief we were a deep finals chance (2016 notwithstanding) so unless the young players were absolutely primed, they weren't playing and we saw Langford, Parish, Laverde (when fit) and Ridley spend long stints in the VFL.

However the club has gone through a massive direction shift under Truck and are clearly investing in youth. A beanpole Cox doesn't play 20 games under Worsfold and Perkins may have gotten a game or two at a time maybe based on his form. We are clearly investing in youth as a priority and so I expect to see Hobbs plenty, and early, next year.

Caldwell hasn't gone 4 seasons without a serious hamstring injury, Shiel and McGrath are both coming off serious knees and there could be an argument that by targeting Sinn we might need a halfback so Pidgeon might go back at times. There will plenty of time in the midfield for him.

 

[half time raffle]

Hobbs - blue collar, I like it! This guy will endear himself to the faithful soon enough.

 

[BrunoV]

I know there is some comments on Johnson and
Contested footy. I have watched most of his games on my computer and from my view his contested work is fine .

The fact he has
Not been picked first round is what it is . Clubs looking for various types .

Hobbs is a good get for us. Fills the need
For a genuine inside midfielder so I do not have a lot of issues with it. Someone will get pushed out of the midfield sooner rather than later as he will play pretty soon.

This point cannot be emphasised enough. If the first 6 clubs who took picks in this draft had 6 more picks in the first round it is entirely conceivable that Johnson, Draper, Sonsie and Goater, etc are all gone and we're then left to look for something in the games of different 4 to 6 players that doesn't exist to explain why they 'slid'.

If we rate 2 of the players who were expected to be gone I have no issue with selling the farm to try and get 2 of them. I'd certainly put the future first on the table. An extra year of development into players we considered first round is worth a truck load given that we should be pushing the upper range of the top 8 in the next 24 months.

As for Hobbs, our midfield has nothing close to the runs on the board to suggest that good players cannot force their way in. They'd need to win a significant match.

 

[Lore]

Alternatively, those who were physically ready being Melksham, Heppell, McGrath, Merrett etc all played plenty early.

Didn’t Merrett start on a flank/forward? I don’t recall him being particularly strong back then, but on a flank you don’t need to be (also why Parish, Langford and now Perkins and Cox have spent more time there early days).

 

[Runk]

Height is one aspect. It is not the primary defining factor that determines points of difference. In fact, it's ******* bizarre how hung up on it you are.

The idea that 4 players are all the same because they are somewhat similar heights is utterly ridiculous.

What about, for example, their: kicking, attack on the ball, attack on the contest, defensive running, spread, attitude, skill level, ability to extract, toughness, physicality, leadership ability, desire, dedication, muscle mass, footy IQ, stamina, courage, body shape and frame, gut-running ability, spring, two-sidedness, handballing capability, vision, decision-making, hunger, athletic ability, overhead marking, ability beneath their feet, goal kicking nous, set-shot ability, ball handling, agility, temperament, tackling, ability to one touch, will to win, game awareness, ability to slow time, capacity to perform under pressure, wet weather skills, core strength, passion, training desire, speed off the mark, reading of the play, communication skills, x-factor - I mean, I could literally not stop here. This is just off the top of my head.

Yet this kid is universally rated the best inside mid in the draft, maybe in the best half-dozen of them overall, but you're moaning that none of this matters simply because he's similar in height to others in our team?! And you're accusing others of being too blind to appreciate the bigger picture?!

******* lol, give me a spell

It's not often we see bombs dropped on a Bombers thread but don't you just love to see it.

 

[The Prosecutor]

The attitude of some posters on this forum is mind-blowing.

It's not like the kid is 170cm ... He's 183cm tall, if he was 185 literally no one would be complaining at all.

We have been crying out for a pure inside midfielder for years, we finally draft the best one available in a draft year and still people complain.

If height is such a factor why doesn't Kyle Langford (191cm) dominate in the middle? What about Cutler (192)? I mean they've got the height so surely that's all that's required yeah?

Ridiculous

Every chance he ends up being 185cm too.

 

[The Prosecutor]

I know there is some comments on Johnson and
Contested footy. I have watched most of his games on my computer and from my view his contested work is fine .

The fact he has
Not been picked first round is what it is . Clubs looking for various types .

Hobbs is a good get for us. Fills the need
For a genuine inside midfielder so I do not have a lot of issues with it. Someone will get pushed out of the midfield sooner rather than later as he will play pretty soon.

Looks like a perfect opportunity to either experiment with McGrath forward, try him on half back or take advantage of him being an elite small defender.

 

[Dave]

It's not actually what anyone says is it?

It seems purely comments about team balance to me.

The comments from one poster, who I was replying to, implied that height is why we got smashed by the bulldogs in the final this season. It's complete BS. We got smashed because they had larger, not taller bodies, and *more* mids who are good at contested footy, which surprise surprise is one of Hobbs' strengths. After Parish we fall away quickly when it comes to stoppage contested footy. We've just addressed one of our biggest issues and people are having a tanty because he's not 6'6. How about people cool their jets and wait to see how the kids players before cracking the shits???

 

[Zach Package]

Didn’t Merrett start on a flank/forward? I don’t recall him being particularly strong back then, but on a flank you don’t need to be (also why Parish, Langford and now Perkins and Cox have spent more time there early days).

Merrett averaged 5 contested possessions and 3 tackles in year one and upped that to 10 contested and 6 tackles by year 3. Yeah he played early but he played early as more of an outside player and because he is outrageously good.

 

[The Prosecutor]

Merrett averaged 5 contested possessions and 3 tackles in year one and upped that to 10 contested and 6 tackles by year 3. Yeah he played early but he played early as more of an outside player and because he is outrageously good.

Merrett was basically a sub/forward pocket for his first year admittedly.

 

[JayJ20]

He plays a similar game style to all the inside players that always destroy us because they can actually get around the ground.

This means we don’t have to go chasing our tail to find an inside player tonight and can focus on players with a few tricks and more athletic utility types, of which there are plenty around.

Also worth bearing in mind that it’s not looking like we’ll be picking a contested ball winner early next year so RFK get a big tick from me for picking the right player at the right time.

So much this.

We can now focus on drafting/recruiting dual position/versatile players, which are far easier to find. We can give up a future first to select Goater as a utility or Johnson to complete our midfield. We can finally move on from the constant dialogue about selecting inside mids because we have the best pure inside mid in the draft.

There's also the added bonus of him being pretty much ready to play at AFL level, which works well for our age demographic. It means we can contend much sooner while Parish, Merrett, McGrath, Langford and even Stringer are still in their prime.

 

[BrunoV]

The comments from one poster, who I was replying to, implied that height is why we got smashed by the bulldogs in the final this season. It's complete BS. We got smashed because they had larger, not taller bodies, and *more* mids who are good at contested footy, which surprise surprise is one of Hobbs' strengths. After Parish we fall away quickly when it comes to stoppage contested footy. We've just addressed one of our biggest issues and people are having a tanty because he's not 6'6. How about people cool their jets and wait to see how the kids players before cracking the shits???

I agree that too much is being made of Hobbs' height. We have plenty of room for quality inside mids on the list.

I think the argument starts getting a bit cute when height and body size become compartmentalised. Biggers guys are going to have bigger frames but then there are also guys like Luke Parker, Taylor Adams and even Neale who are as wide as they are tall. They're big bodies in the sense that that have the hips and or shoulders to absorb physical pressure inside to play at their own slow tempo. Hobbs is potentially the first of this type of player we have. I hope we draft another and wont lie that I'd like to see him 190cm and >90kg. Hell, we could add another Hobbs type of inside mid too.

The Dogs had a lot of size on our players. Given the style of mids we have height is a pretty good indicator of the extent to which are were outsized. Stringer aside we don't play with any real grunt whereas they had Bont (who can do it purely because he is a monster, but he doesn't need to), Dunkley who is the prototype of this type of player, Treloar who is a very powerful player inside, Libba whose bread and butter is playing under physical duress. Stringer was only there for the centre bounce. Macrae and Smith are probably on par with Shiel who would be our next most powerful inside player.