Fraser V Hille

[DapperDon]

Both ruckmen from the same draft, Fraser went at pick 1, Hille at pick 40.

Both very similar types of players, not the greatest tap work but they make up for it around the ground. Which club has ended up with the better bargain

Fraser at pick 1

Or

Hille at pick 40

(Collingwood and Essendon supporters please don't vote)

 

[trueblue_91]

Fraser is a gun

 

[Jeremias]

Essendon got the MUCH bigger bargain.

 

[jnash196]

Better player-Fraser

Better deal-Essendon

 

[DonMania#5]

Seeing as though a Collingwood supporter voted for Fraser even though Essendon and Collingwood supporters weren't supposed to vote, i voted for Hille

 

[monty1104]

Yeah I didnt read that bit about not voting

Oh well, Hille got my vote anyway. He has really stepped up this year. If this poll was last year though, Fraser would have had my vote.

 

[lookkg386]

both are poor, but Fraser just.

 

[Cassius_Clay]

Bwahahahahahaha

Fraser's a star, Hille's a dud.

Its shocking how underrated Fraser is.

 

[DonMania#5]

Bwahahahahahaha

Fraser's a star, Hille's a dud.

Its shocking how underrated Fraser is.

Yeh, Hille's a dud

 

[Cassius_Clay]

Yeh, Hille's a dud

He is compared to Fraser.

 

[DonMania#5]

He is compared to Fraser.

Yeh, because their is no better than Fraser

 

[Masss#10]

Fraser cant ruck for crap, Hille for sure

 

[Cassius_Clay]

Yeh, because their is no better than Fraser

Cox and Everitt clearly are. ******s like Sandilands and Hille arent.

 

[Vinnie Vegas]

Josh Fraser may not be a great tap ruckman, but as a follower he is miles ahead of David Hille, and every other ruckman in the league not named Dean Cox.

I mean, I actually used David Hille as an example the other day of why we should be happy with Fraser - Last Friday night, he got the ball out in space on the wing, and Lucas (might have been Lloyd) was leading out wide, and Hille dribbled the ball 10m short and 15m wide of the target.

Josh Fraser is an immaculate kick of the ball, and you could expect him to hit that target 9/10 times. I'd much rather have a guy who uses the ball well 15-20 times a game and offers 15 hitouts a game, than a guy who gets 25 hit-outs a game but only 6-7 possessions, and most of them suck.

 

[DonMania#5]

Cox and Everitt clearly are. ******s like Sandilands and Hille arent.

That's why he is averaging 27 hitouts a game

 

[Cassius_Clay]

That's why he is averaging 27 hitouts a game

27 hitouts of which 3 are effective.

Idiots like you dont see how ineffective his HO's are.

 

[DonMania#5]

27 hitouts of which 3 are effective.

Idiots like you dont see how ineffective his HO's are.

Yeh, i'm sure he only averages 3 effective hitouts per game

 

[monty1104]

both are poor, but Fraser just.

Yeah, coz u have a whole production line of great ruckmen going on down there

 

[samthemanlonergan]

Josh Fraser may not be a great tap ruckman, but as a follower he is miles ahead of David Hille, and every other ruckman in the league not named Dean Cox.

I mean, I actually used David Hille as an example the other day of why we should be happy with Fraser - Last Friday night, he got the ball out in space on the wing, and Lucas (might have been Lloyd) was leading out wide, and Hille dribbled the ball 10m short and 15m wide of the target.

Josh Fraser is an immaculate kick of the ball, and you could expect him to hit that target 9/10 times. I'd much rather have a guy who uses the ball well 15-20 times a game and offers 15 hitouts a game, than a guy who gets 25 hit-outs a game but only 6-7 possessions, and most of them suck.

Hille is not a terrible user of the footy, remember that goal he kcied from 65 against Richmond?

He is not a lace out midfielder, but very few players of his side are. And he gets the ball more that 6 times a game too. He is having a bit below par year atm, but: http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_player_compare?tid1=5&pid1=167&tid2=6&pid2=348


Anyway, to the debate.

Fraser is a shocking ruckman, hardly ever gets taps and even more rarely directs them. He is a good player though, gets the ball and uses it well. Handy goal kicker.

Hille is a brute. A lot of people seem not to notice how many clearances this guy gets. He was 2nd at our club for clearances last year and the leading ruckman in the comp in this department iirc. His tap work is not great, but he gives a good contest and stops the opposition ruckman from getting easy, well directed hitouts. He is also a better contested mark than Fraser.


I think it is much easier for ruckman to get possesions than other player, mainly because they simply ignore their opponent and do as they please. So I'd rather take Hille's 13 possies a game and some kind of ruckwork plus getting his own footy over Frasers's 15 possies, and limited ruckwork.


As for who got the better bargain. Not even a contest. I won't vote though because I go for Essendon.

 

[DapperDon]

Yeh, i'm sure he only averages 3 effective hitouts per game

If we are talking about Sandilands, his tap work is awful. sure he gets a heap of them but it very rarely goes to a target, and once it goes to ground he is pretty much useless.

Most overrated ruckmen in the game.

 

[Cassius_Clay]

If we are talking about Sandilands, his tap work is awful. sure he gets a heap of them but it very rarely goes to a target, and once it goes to ground he is pretty much useless.

Most overrated ruckmen in the game.

Exactly. FWIW, Freo get killed in the clearences which simply shouldnt be happening with the 7 foot giant who's sole role is to get effective Hit Outs.

 

[doppleganger]

Hille is not a terrible user of the footy, remember that goal he kcied from 65 against Richmond?

He is not a lace out midfielder, but very few players of his side are. And he gets the ball more that 6 times a game too. He is having a bit below par year atm, but: http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_player_compare?tid1=5&pid1=167&tid2=6&pid2=348

Hille isn't a terrible user compared to other Ruckman, but he is miles behind Fraser.........no shame in that tho!

Fraser is a shocking ruckman, hardly ever gets taps and even more rarely directs them. He is a good player though, gets the ball and uses it well. Handy goal kicker.

This year Fraser is averaging 15.5 HO
Hille is averaging 16.9 HO

That is the only part of their games that Hille can compete with Fraser, and he is only marginally ahead!

Hille is a brute. A lot of people seem not to notice how many clearances this guy gets. He was 2nd at our club for clearances last year and the leading ruckman in the comp in this department iirc. His tap work is not great, but he gives a good contest and stops the opposition ruckman from getting easy, well directed hitouts. He is also a better contested mark than Fraser.

Fraser absolutely smashes Hille in terms of clearances. This year they are both averaging 2.7 a game.

2.7 clearances is a career best for Hille

Fraser's career av. is 2.5 and in 03-04 he averaged 3.8 and 4.0 clearances per game

I think it is much easier for ruckman to get possesions than other player, mainly because they simply ignore their opponent and do as they please. So I'd rather take Hille's 13 possies a game and some kind of ruckwork plus getting his own footy over Frasers's 15 possies, and limited ruckwork.

Fraser plays as a link man, the pies are happy to play through him because he uses the ball so well and can run fairly well, he also gets more clearances and kicks more goals. Hille gets a couple of extra HO which u admit are fairly ordinary anyway

As for who got the better bargain. Not even a contest. I won't vote though because I go for Essendon.

The whole bargain concept is stupid, Fraser was a better junior player than hille........and has proven himself to be a better senior player

Once ur drafted everybody starts at a level playing field

 

[parrot]

Had to laugh when I saw this poll. A Hopeless V Useless shootout. They must be 2 of the most uncoordinated AFL footballers currently playing.

 

[ad4eva]

To me hitouts count for not much unless you are as good as an Everitt or Lade who give it to you lace out.

IMO you have Clarke (STK), Everitt and Lade in the same class as each other when it comes to tap rucking then theres the rest, some slightly better than the others.

Fraser and Hille both fall into this catergory.

Then you can have the catergory of mobility.
There are two clear standouts here. Cox and Fraser, both streaks ahead of the main pack.
Behind them you would have Lade and White and possibly Simmonds.
Then in the pack you would have blokes like Hille, Brogan, McIntosh, Sandilands, Charman, Jolly and Blake.

Without looking at effectiveness, which i know Fraser is right up there, this clearly shows that Fraser is streaks ahead of Hille. Hille is consistency is also an issue and gets bogged down far to often. Fraser also finds the big sticks frequently, usually kicking atleast 1 goal per game.

Having said that Hille is a find from the Bombers at pick 40 however Fraser is the better ruckman and in this modern game his mobility suits while he and Cox have set the bar for ruckman in the future in terms of what they need to be capable of in getting around the ground and getting their hands on the ball.

 

[DapperDon]

Had to laugh when I saw this poll. A Hopeless V Useless shootout. They must be 2 of the most uncoordinated AFL footballers currently playing.

if only we had Cain Ackland............