Rumour GFC 2023 Player Trading, Drafting FA, Rumours and Wish lists Pt II

[cats_09]

Yep, this is making an appearance here also, and probably getting more useful as the season draws to a close and this discussion ramps up

 

[FredLeDeux]

You've misinterpreted what that means. In any given week for around half of the season (in total), 6 (let's say 9 was an exagerration although it was around 9 for a month) best 22 players were missing. A different combination each week.

cats_09 had a nice table, although I think it was 2022 premiership players only. I can go through and do this for you if you are keen because you're right, I may have gotten it wrong to the exact number.

And we all know a few players were playing quite injured for a while. Look at all those early surgeries when we finally waved the white flag.

It also undersells the number of times we had major players off the ground injured early in games.

 

[year of the cat]

The major issue for our poor performance this year was being unfit and unmotivated. Yes, injuries contributed - losing C.Guthrie for pretty much the whole season particularly hurt with Joel's retirement - but it was pretty obvious that the fire in the belly wasn't there.

 

[moond0g]

Time to start rectifying some myths.

Dangerfield: more coaches votes and Brownlow votes this year than last, just had an awkwardly timed rib break/lung puncture.
Hawkins: goal/assist average were both above career averages and close to 2022.

Stengle, SDK and Holmes are young with big ceilings and could easily bounce back. Ceglar was always irrelevant. Stanley/Blicavs will remain a solid combo. Bruhn is borderline as a potential break out player and Guthrie returns as our two time BnF midfielder. Duncan should be able to slot back and replace Tuohy's half back drive (leaving Holmes and Dempsey/Knevitt etc for the wings). We do need a Bews replacement - let's hope one of the Irish boys can step up.

We had 6-9 best 22 players missing half the season and usually a few of them were very important ones. It's a ridiculous overreaction to write us off when our having a best 18-19 out of 22 had us beating Melbourne, Port, Adelaide, Bulldogs (first time) etc.

You do a reasonable job of convincing me we might improve next year!

The midfield is still a big concern for me though. Guthrie back will help out immensely, but if you compare the starting 4 we had this year to any other top 8 side I’d say it doesn’t come close. We should improve on our ladder position from this year. But someone like Bruhn or Holmes is going to need a proper breakout year (which may well happen) for me to be convinced we’ll be right back up the top next year.

Also wouldn’t think beating the bulldogs and Adelaide, both of whom didn’t play finals, is the best evidence of anyone being that good lol

 

[Mr Meow]

It also undersells the number of times we had major players off the ground injured early in games.

Very good point. We had the most, and earliest, enforced substitutions of any side in the league this season. And we usually ran out of gas in the last quarter of these games.

 

[Mr Meow]

I was actually amazed to see that DeKoning only missed 4 games. Felt like more.

Either way though, if you cross the line you're fit. And should be judged as such. Opposition players get zero sympathy for playing with niggles or injuries (as they should), same should go for us. If the depth is as strong as we're told it is, they should have rested Cameron and whoever else when they needed to, not once the season was blown.

This misses the point though. The fact that we were forced to field more injured players than usual, and couldn't manage the senior players like in 2022, is not necessarily an expected outcome for 2024. If we get even a little mean reversion on that and in-game injuries that's probably +2 wins on the scorecard just from that.

 

[bulletproof]

This misses the point though. The fact that we were forced to field more injured players than usual, and couldn't manage the senior players like in 2022, is not necessarily an expected outcome for 2024. If we get even a little mean reversion on that and in-game injuries that's probably +2 wins on the scorecard just from that.

The biggest issue I think for our season was our dismal preparation off the Premiership. Standards dropped.

A Premier often flys the gates with confidence and connection, but we were not ready.

Can they re-discover that hunger? Or is it gone, like Richmond or worse, West Coast.

I couldn’t say with any confidence.

 

[Rubberducky]

The major issue for our poor performance this year was being unfit and unmotivated. Yes, injuries contributed - losing C.Guthrie for pretty much the whole season particularly hurt with Joel's retirement - but it was pretty obvious that the fire in the belly wasn't there.

I don't think any player on our list fell off because they were less motivated- less optimistic, more nervous of injury or recurrence of injury, impacted by injury makes a lot more sense for professional athletes. There were games that certain players didn't look themselves and for most it was a case of carrying injury. As much as we'd love to throw all the kids in, this hinders their development when not ready or underdone.

SDK's development in the VFL, Bruhns fitness by the last 30% of the season, we have shown over and over just how good a club we are at developing talent. Atkins fitness development is another great example, Miers becoming a running machine. None of this happens if you just throw the kids in and rest the guns, and all of it becomes a lot tougher when forced to get games into players before they are ready. We don't see the behind the scenes impact to a young player that loses confidence or pulls up extra sore from the physical nature.

I felt all year the club did all it could to give us a chance if the list was fresh by seasons end. But never at the risk of hurting the development plans in place for our youth. Injury and continuity hurt us, not motivation.

 

[Lana]

Does the AFL have a demographic problem. With only 70 odd new players being drafted each year are we starting to see signs of with clubs rushing to lock in even mediocre talent.

 

[Mr Meow]

Partridge part one (note the ridiculous amount of in-game injuries - unbolded):

Round 1

-Kolo, J.Henry, Duncan, Bowes, Stewart (in-game), SDK (in-game), Stengle (in-game) - LOSS

Round 2

-Kolo, J.Henry, Duncan, Stewart, Stanley (in-game) - LOSS

Round 3

-Kolo, J.Henry, Duncan, Stanley, Rohan (sub-managed), SDK (in-game) - LOSS

Round 4

-SDK, J.Henry, Blicavs (in-game), Bews (concussion, in-game) - WIN

Round 5

-J.Henry, Rohan (suspension), Bews, Stengle (in-game) - WIN

Round 6

-J.Henry, Stanley, Stengle, Bews - WIN

Round 7

-C.Guthrie, Tuohy, J.Henry, Stanley, Stengle, Bowes (in-game), Rohan (in-game) - WIN

Round 8

-J.Henry, C.Guthrie, SDK, Bowes, Rohan, Stengle, Dangerfield (in-game) - WIN

Round 9

-Dangerfield, Close (suspension), J.Henry, Stengle, C.Guthrie, SDK, Bowes, Rohan - LOSS

Round 10

-Dangerfield, Duncan, O.Henry, C.Guthrie, SDK, Bowes, Rohan (Clark would've played too if not injured) - LOSS

Round 11

-Dangerfield, Duncan, Holmes, C.Guthrie, Bowes, Rohan, Ratugolea (in-game) - LOSS

Win/loss: 5-6

Many senior players looking jaded, lack of continuity on each line (forward, midfield, defence), VFL-level midfield with absentees, Cameron's decline in form hits.

Miraculous win against the Bulldogs (Rohan in, Ratugolea out - otherwise the same injury list) but then post-bye Dangerfield breaks his ribs and it continues to be difficult.

 

[Sttew]

The biggest issue I think for our season was our dismal preparation off the Premiership. Standards dropped.

A Premier often flys the gates with confidence and connection, but we were not ready.

Can they re-discover that hunger? Or is it gone, like Richmond or worse, West Coast.

I couldn’t say with any confidence.

Isaac Smith is a client of the company where my daughter works and he told them in early March not to expect much from the Cats for the first part of the season because they had partied so hard and had such a delayed start to the preseason. It showed!

 

[Sttew]

Does the AFL have a demographic problem. With only 70 odd new players being drafted each year are we starting to see signs of with clubs rushing to lock in even mediocre talent.

Should Geelong try and convince Esava to stay?

 

[BigCat1]

I'd take that in a heartbeat.

What do we reckon? 7 + 28 to the draft? Nate Caddy + George Stevens would make for an exciting few years in the future.

Or do we trade for the Dogs 10 + 17 and take 10, 17 & 28 to the draft? Could be an injection of youth that really changes the landscape for us ala Port 2018.

Shadow89 this seems right up your alley, that future side could be looking pretty special in a month or so!!

Pick 28 aint pick 28 though is it.

That selection will be over 30 by the end of the weekend after free agency and on the draft night it will be in the mid to high 30s. Picks (for points) don’t start evaporation until after that point ( the sweet spot of value - late 30s & 40s) and there is still only 45-50 players taken.

 

[Mr Meow]

The biggest issue I think for our season was our dismal preparation off the Premiership. Standards dropped.

A Premier often flys the gates with confidence and connection, but we were not ready.

Can they re-discover that hunger? Or is it gone, like Richmond or worse, West Coast.

I couldn’t say with any confidence.

Likely a factor and yes it can be rectified. It would be more worrying if preparation was perfect and we performed as we did. Upside.

Richmond had too many players fall off a cliff, and their senior players didn't last the distance like ours have.

 

[No Quarter]

Isaac Smith is a client of the company where my daughter works and he told them in early March not to expect much from the Cats for the first part of the season because they had partied so hard and had such a delayed start to the preseason. It showed!

I think the absence of Selwood will linger for a while. I don't get a lot of vibes of the same leadership that we had 06-13, with Selwood continuing on from the culture that was bred by the likes of Scarlett, Milburn, Corey, Bartel, Enright, Chapman, Mooney etc. Dunno why I see it that way, but it was a generational team with a lot of strong leader type guys. Not sure we have it on that level at present.

 

[Tristan34]

We should hold firm on a 1st rounder for Rat. He is exactly what they need. He will restructure their defence and make it that much better... We should play hardball...

 

[No Quarter]

We should hold firm on a 1st rounder for Rat. He is exactly what they need. He will restructure their defence and make it that much better... We should play hardball...

Getting a pick in the 20s for a guy out of contract is not a terrible result.

I liken it to the Alan Christensen trade.. we thought that getting pick 21 was a bit average for him, but it netted us (premiership ruckman) Rhys Stanley. Christensen went on to achieve precisely what after playing in a flag with us?

Sometimes we're not looking at bigger pictures here.

 

[D BRIDGE]

What is the deadline date on contracting somebody like Sav?

It is after trade week yes?

We can play hardball with Port... If Port don't get the trade done then we can up our offer to Sav and keep him (assuming he signs of course) after not getting what we want from Port for him?

 

[BigCat1]

Even a swap of their future 1st Rd pick for our future 2nd round pick is infinitely more valuable than any 2nd round pick post 30 that they can offer

 

[Warhorse]

Western bulldogs may have screwed their cap. Time to throw big money at Jamarra. I would offer R1 and F1 for him

 

[Tristan34]

Getting a pick in the 20s for a guy out of contract is not a terrible result.

I liken it to the Alan Christensen trade.. we thought that getting pick 21 was a bit average for him, but it netted us (premiership ruckman) Rhys Stanley. Christensen went on to achieve precisely what after playing in a flag with us?

Sometimes we're not looking at bigger pictures here.

Even if we have to give a pick( future r3) back i would still want their first. Rat is what they need and we hold the ticket to make their backline better structurally. Make them pay...

 

[D BRIDGE]

Western bulldogs may have screwed their cap. Time to throw big money at Jamarra. I would offer R1 and F1 for him

Yeah Naughton on big $$$, Bont surely on big $$$, English after next season will command big $$$, JUH after next season will command big $$$ and Smith after next season will also command big $$$.

Very hard to see them keeping them all.

Ahhh they should just trade JUH or Smith now and hook us up.

 

[Warhorse]

Yeah Naughton on big $$$, Bont surely on big $$$, English after next season will command big $$$, JUH after next season will command big $$$ and Smith after next season will also command big $$$.

Very hard to see them keeping them all.

Ahhh they should just trade JUH or Smith now and hook us up.

Both JUH and Smith have links to us as well. I personally would rather JUH. Could build a forwardline around him.

 

[Jumping Jack]

Likely a factor and yes it can be rectified. It would be more worrying if preparation was perfect and we performed as we did. Upside.

Richmond had too many players fall off a cliff, and their senior players didn't last the distance like ours have.

Let's see what Collingwood produce next year. Right now you'd have them as flag favourites for 2024 - as many did Geelong for 2023. Back to back is not easy as history shows.

Collingwood had the third oldest team on the park to have one a flag. All sound familiar?

My personal view is that on face value Geelong should have been right up there in contention for 2023. We turned our list over well, and brought some solid talent into the club. No one ever wants to use injuries as an excuse, but we were destroyed from early on with availability, or a lack of. So I don't think we'll hear the club publicly complain, but I think we're in a position where our 12th place finish can largely be put down to injuries.

I'm sure the club will take the positives and move on to 2024 - we got games into younger players - we got a look at a few kids ahead of time (Jyhe Clark - Ted Clohesy) - and we now have the benefit of a full pre-season and good preparation leading into next season. Sportsbet have us at $15 and 8th on the line of betting for the flag ..........definately worth a nibble if you're inclined to have a bet.

 

[BORIS332]

Pick 28 aint pick 28 though is it.

That selection will be over 30 by the end of the weekend after free agency and on the draft night it will be in the mid to high 30s. Picks (for points) don’t start evaporation until after that point ( the sweet spot of value - late 30s & 40s) and there is still only 45-50 players taken.

How do you figure that? If GC trade pick 4 for WBD's 10 & 17, then their picks will be 10, 17 & 29 which will all be swallowed up by academy bids for Walter, Read and Rogers. So pick 28 will go out three places, then come back in three places. Will McCabe might be bid on too, but at worst 28 becomes 29.

 

[Hinkley29]

Just my opinion but O Lord - but i think theres more upside - more to get excited about as a footballer than O Henry

Because Lord is lightning quick and he is 6ft 5inc

And when he kicked the 4 goals in that final - he did stuff that only really good players could do - and he has the physical attributes to do it - like a turn of foot

As others have said it is a very lack lustre - boring trade period for the Cats this off season - however Geel can turn that on their head - if O Lord is running around in the hoops next year

Personally i think Pt AAde would have to have rocks in their head to let him go/trade him out- but stranger things have happened

Respectfully have to disagree that lord is a more exciting prospect than O Henry. Henry has much better exposed form, and has a far greater upside.

I don’t dislike lord, but you are selling Henry very short.