Glenn Archer nails it in one. The game is now jaut a soft run fest.

[bloodsports]

Please anyone who is over 12 years old, please tell me that you really think that the game is better to watch today than 6,7,8, or more years ago.

Bring back the biff to make the sprinting players afraid of running into some-one, then you will see the man on man games we all used to love.

http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/footy/common/story_page/0,8033,20222652%5E32422,00.html

Pace, tactics leave fans yearning for past
23 August 2006 Herald-Sun
DO YOU fear the speed of the game will shorten your career?

It's an intriguing question on the minds of AFL players.

I probably fear more for the state of the game but, in essence, it's the speed of the game affecting the state of the game that has players fearing for their future.

It's something the AFL must be concerned about when more than half its workforce -- the players -- admit thoughts about their long-term future cause them stress.

The state of, and speed of, the game are first cousins.

The state of the game with its chip, chip, often sideways, to release a player who, in turn, runs with the ball, is just one glaring example.

The kick-in from full-back means the game is played at break-neck speed.

Seemingly, it's get on the highway or get out of the game. The quick kick-in is made for receivers who can run.

Often, they are the guys who, when the ball goes in one side, head for the other.

All of them can run.

Their job, then, is to mark the ball, run and kick it. Some even find that too hard.

For me, who's 33, and my type, more a contested sort of player, the speed of the game has diminished the prevalence of the one-on-one contests.

And I'm not the only one in that shout, I tell you.

One day, we'll all look back and remember 2005 and 2006 as the years when the game changed.

The people who must take the blame are the coaches.

They're smart, no doubt. They connive and manipulate to achieve the best for their club. They have hours to study tapes of matches. They have accessed foreign strategies and tried to implement them. They devise zones and zoning off and manufacture fast breaks that open up the middle of the ground.

All their moves require speed to succeed.

It's what AFL has become and, as this latest players' survey suggests, it's not what a lot of players want.

I was interested to hear Michael Voss, the legendary Lion, express his opinion.

"My enjoyment for watching football has diminished quite significantly," Voss told ABC Radio.

I agree wholeheartedly and have been saying the same for several years.

At the weekend, I watched a suburban game of football. I had to catch up with my friend, Ron Joseph, who was with his best mate Keith Greig watching Keith's son, Matthew, playing for Vermont against East Burwood in the Eastern Football League.

I arrived midway through the second quarter and, because I enjoyed it so much, I stayed for the whole match.

What a pleasure it was to watch some good old-fashioned footy. It was a contest not poisoned by coaches seeking something extra.

There were no players dropping back filling holes, no play-on from a point, there were contests all over the ground, players fighting for the ball and forwards taking big pack marks.

I might be old-ish, and it may be a product of being old-ish, but I loved it.

That's not to say I don't love playing in the AFL. I do.

But I'm finding it increasingly harder to watch it. If that's the case, I assume a lot of other people do as well.

I'm all for win at all costs, but those in charge must address what that cost is.

Indeed, I fear it's going to get worse. On the weekend, we had Leigh Brown loose in the first half, chopping off leads and doing a superb job.

In the second, it turned around. Melbourne had two back, and we didn't have anyone back. I thought, we needed to have loose men as well just to compete. Somehow it's not footy to me.

The more I play, talk and watch the game, the more it is reinforced that we are pawns being moved in a game of speed chess.

 

[Jarka]

Is anyone surprised by the fact that Arch enjoyed footy alot more when the Ross were winning gf's?

 

[giantroo]

Is anyone surprised by the fact that Arch enjoyed footy alot more when the Ross were winning gf's?

Im not suprised. Arch wouldve loved the 90s, of course because back then we had majicians. Glenn Archer has always loved the 1 on 1 game. Why do you think his the most courageous player in the afl. He loves to put his body on the line. His always done it since his come to our club. and now with the speed of the game their is no more contested possesions for him to put his body on the line.

But who doesnt love when you see Bow and arrow just jump into a marking pack and put the body on the line. Thats the best about the old 1 on 1 style.

 

[jacko57]

No wonder he's p****d off, half the time if he sees a contest, Archer dives in to get the ball, some ****er hangs back then falls on top of Archer's back & gets rewarded for his 'tackle'.

 

[giantroo]

No wonder he's p****d off, half the time if he sees a contest, Archer dives in to get the ball, some ****er hangs back then falls on top of Archer's back & gets rewarded for his 'tackle'.

Thats whats so stupid about these new rules that this stupid afl has put through. Archer tries every thing to change the game back to what it was with his courageous jumps into packs,diving on the ball etc. Good on ya Arch. I hope the AFL learn the lesson. Theyll learn soon that the new rules are an absolute joke.

 

[JF_Bay_22_SCG]

I can't say I'm a big fan of Archer to be honest, because I have always considered him as a sort of thug. But I agree wholeheartedly about what he is saying.

You watch an SANFL game and compare it with the chip-chip crap you get from teams (especially bad ones) in the AFL. Ok, last Saturday night was mental, but I swear I have seen under 5 decent Swans games this season (both games vs Melbourne being definitely the better of them). I'm a fanatic & am saying this. How are we supposed to win over fans from other sports when footy is becoming such a terrible spectacle to watch. I watch mainly Swans matches & little more these days; I know I'm not the only one doing this as well.

I NEVER thought I could be in a Premiership-defending season yet still be a bit disillusioned with footy. But I am. Still with teams like the Bulldogs & Melbourne to play against, I'm at least assured of some good attacking running footy before the end of the season.

JF

 

[DanA]

I honestly like footy better now.

I am amazed at how the players are now able to create and then exploit small advantages. As someone who plays I am also amazed at how quickly players get up and get to th next contest. In my eyes that it what tough footy is about. Getting hit hard and shaking it off and making the next contest at full tilt. would hazard a guess that there have been more concussions and broken bones this year than any other in the history of the game.

Watch guys like Jarad Rooke play, you can still be a hard player. Did you see West coast vs Sydney. Daniel Chick turned the game. Was great to watch.

What about the dogs 3rd quarter against Collingwood was damn exciting. This years final series has ben amazing footy.

The game is not soft and it is damn exciting. Stuff Archer looking back on his "Glory days" as the pinnacle. THe game is better now than EVER.

 

[Corpuscles]

BS... we have found something to agree on!

The quick kick in rule is just plain stupid... and the AFL admin obsession with making a fast game FASTER is also obviously deliberate and detracts from the game.

Need more contested marks, more tollerance of heavy (legal) bumps.

Read a good article by D Rhy-Jones... he reackons limit the number of times that interchanges can occur in a 1/4... to something like 4... to reduce the run amongst other suggestions.

Dunno what can be done, definitely agree with archer that lower level footy is often more interesting and exciting in some ways

BUT.... we can't kick our teams or their coaches NOW if they are forced to find a way to win in the way the sport is regulated!

 

[gadj1976]

Personally, I'm caught between liking fragments of the new game and fragments of the old.

In the new, I love watching the Bulldogs. Free running, quick, highly skilled. I really don't like the rule changes. Waste of time.

Just two weeks ago, we had all games (bar 1) in which the winning side kicked 20 or more goals. Up until that time, people were calling for rule changes to stop the chipping sideways style of play, and to attempt to stop flooding.

In the old, the one on one contests. Remember the build up for a Carey/Jakovich final contest, you knew it was one on one, you knew Carey would take contested marks and you knew at the end of it they'd have mutual admiration for each others ability, even if they did try and clobber the daylights out of each other.

 

[bloodsports]

Need more contested marks, more tollerance of heavy (legal) bumps.

More tollerance by the umpires would go a long way to letting the other nuance's of the game come to the fore, not just running, but the hardness and intimidation that used to be so much a part of the game.

When skill is displayed in the face of intimidation, it becomes more then the some of it's parts. It becomes a spectacle by the inclusion of the ingredient of courage.

But of course there is no insentive for the umpires to show more tollerance, becuase it would mean that they would have to take themselves out of the game more. Umpires like all of us are egoists.

Also the AFL does not disipline them for over umpiring, even letting them off when they make attrocious calls.

It goes back to a school yard mentality. It is easy for teachers to discipline the kids and feel like they are resloving some kind of behaviour by repressing it.

I am sure the upires think they are doing the right thing, but all that is happening is the suppression of the various nuances within the game.

Only coaches get to fully express themselves in the modern game, were as the players follow instructions.

Of course all this is an honest reflection of modern society where CEO's get to live their rock star lives, while the workers get paid less for doing more and are all expendable.

Until the umpires are either 1. prepared to be more tollerant, or 2. forced to be more tollerant, then the game will become more and more like Gealic/soccer every year, and a lot of people will slowly lose interest.

But of course the people in the growth states will keep watching, becuase they don't know any better, and footy is still a couple of lengths ahead of the other codes, even without the ingredients which used to make it truly great !

 

[Jarka]

Ask Kosi if he thinks the game is soft....

 

[Kickin_Goals]

Don't you mean anyone else threatened by change?
12 year old's would likely write a more mature lead in.
Old slow players complaining about the pace of the game?
What exactly is this word biff other then a media buzz word to inspire you to think this way.
You see now, those wizards, just have to beat 2 or 3 players and on occasion they are quite up to it and when that happens it's quite more impressive.
The one on ones that do go on, the defensive minded player pretty much infringes the umpire calls it or he doesn't in any case both players want a free kick.
These players are on the field who is directing them to do that?
Or the one on ones don't take place and a player gets an uncontested mark as his opponent is slow and/or unaccountable.
Yes this happens with a super flood like scenario it happens in many a flooding scenario the end of the day the chipping stops you from scoring as the opposition get more and more players back, not scoring doesn't win you a game you shoot yourself in the foot with hesitation. It's not the coaches being smart in many of these occasions it's the teams not adapting and countering. Eventually they will get smarter and there will be a one on one press for chipping scenarios and things like that.

An actaul trouble I find with contests is the paying of marks, a player takes the mark a clean grasp and half a second later a player taps it out of his hands no mark paid, when the player was in no way going to drop it this makes a huge difference really and is so incredibly cheap.
Im quite sure this didn't use to take place a punch needed to clean knock the ball or be spontaneous with the marking players hands.

The players on the field dictate how the game is played as much as anyone affiliated coaches communicate with players in both directions, if they are incapable of countering a certain strategy complaining is becoming the new attempt.
If you would like we could just get media personalities to decide the winner of games how about that? Teams be dictated to by your likes or dislikes?
Capital idea no?

The actual facts of players still taking damage from contesting seems lost on some people, that players are still hitting the packs hard.
Often have players losing there kidney attempting to get the ball in a season? Isn't there a grumpier old men show for this BS? Get together and have a circle jerk with them.
No matter what the umpires call the players will do what they do and what works, high contact has been a free kick a while now.
You go to the tribunal for a high hip and shoulder spin the wheel miss some matches or come back, I'm pretty sure everyone thinks things were harder in my day they had to walk 10 miles to get there in rain blistering heat hail or snow etc etc etc.

The word blame appears in this article once again placed solely in one place, what a joke.
From speed chess pawn to media pawn one wonders if he will become a board room queen....
Over the years there has been some fluctuation in points scored for and against but there isnt any great difference atm from the period mentioned.

 

[sput1956]

Great article and I agree 100% with it. The coaches are ruining the game as a spectacle, and I have enjoyed watching the VFL and suburban footy much more than the AFL this year.

Appoint Glen Archer as chairman of the rules commitee.

Be interesting to see what the percentage of Crows and Swans respondents is that bag his article.

 

[sput1956]

I honestly like footy better now.

I am amazed at how the players are now able to create and then exploit small advantages. As someone who plays I am also amazed at how quickly players get up and get to th next contest. In my eyes that it what tough footy is about. Getting hit hard and shaking it off and making the next contest at full tilt. would hazard a guess that there have been more concussions and broken bones this year than any other in the history of the game.

Watch guys like Jarad Rooke play, you can still be a hard player. Did you see West coast vs Sydney. Daniel Chick turned the game. Was great to watch.

What about the dogs 3rd quarter against Collingwood was damn exciting. This years final series has ben amazing footy.

The game is not soft and it is damn exciting. Stuff Archer looking back on his "Glory days" as the pinnacle. THe game is better now than EVER.

If you honestly believe that watching Geelong now is a better spectacle than watching Geelong in the 90's then I will have to assume that you are very young.

 

[footy4eva]

Is anyone surprised by the fact that Arch enjoyed footy alot more when the Ross were winning gf's?

same goes 4 that w@nker voss!

 

[likka]

Thoroughly agree with Arch, to the point that I now watch suburban footy myself instead of AFL. I actually watch the same league that Arch was at (EDFL in Victoria). Vermont finished second on the ladder and play great footy.

The skills are pretty good and I find it far more entertaining than AFL. Not just the contests that Arch wrote about, but it is refreshing to see people kicking to packs. A couple of weeks ago I saw 3 spectacular pack marks at the one game.

Entry is free, VB cans are only $3, and BBQ burger is only $2.50... cannot lose!

 

[likka]

Is anyone surprised by the fact that Arch enjoyed footy alot more when the Ross were winning gf's?

Have you read the article? Uncontested footy is boring... he has a valid point.

 

[bloodsports]

If you honestly believe that watching Geelong now is a better spectacle than watching Geelong in the 90's then I will have to assume that you are very young.

I specified anyone over 12.

Anyone that thinks the team that Garry Ablett was in is less entertaining than the one his sons are in has obvioulsy not been on the face of the earth long enough to know wtf they are talking about.

 

[bloodsports]

Ask Kosi if he thinks the game is soft....

Kosi is soft.

There are always accidents were players get accidentially hurt, even in soccer. That does not mean however that the game is a hard one, nor even that it is neccessarialy a contact sport.

Next insipid argument ??

 

[Slacker]

I kind of agree but also think he has rose coloured glasses for the past.

I still blame the bench, too many players on it and the coaches are given too much freedom in their use. Want to slow the game down then limit the interchange.

 

[Hawkers]

I kind of agree but also think he has rose coloured glasses for the past.

I still blame the bench, too many players on it and the coaches are given too much freedom in their use. Want to slow the game down then limit the interchange.

I agree. I say go back to two on the bench and two umpires

 

[Kickin_Goals]

I specified anyone over 12.

Anyone that thinks the team that Garry Ablett was in is less entertaining than the one his sons are in has obvioulsy not been on the face of the earth long enough to know wtf they are talking about.

Ablett hardly counts I mean he is Ablett, you can base your entire argument pretty much on that Ablett no longer plays so football is less entertaining.
Which is hardly fair

I don't associate the word slow with entertaining
Snail races must be some peoples thing
It's not about pace it's about contest and it's complete crap really, you want a contest you make one you don't you don't.
When you don't you have standoffs chips and flooding, man up your forced to contest kick to a contest players are forced to contest.

 

[Hap Hapablap]

i loved the 80's and 90's gamestyle where the biff was allowed and one on one was played out throughout the league. that sort of gameplay is the actual way sport should be played. with balls. flooding is a no no. tempo footy makes me sick. only good thing i like about this era is the run. other than that i would much rather watch carltons, wce, adelaide and nths melb (inc their losses) gf matches rather than last years gf or qf.

 

[Vtech]

I agree. I say go back to two on the bench and two umpires

I totally agree with your post. I would also like to see the end of the runner. I think if the coach wants a player off the field he should have to signal for the player to come off, a la soccer style. The coach could then only convey any messages at the breaks and this will allow all these so called smart footballers to really stand out and use there footy smarts to gain the advantage for their team. It would also encourage the leadership group to take much more responsible for their teams performance. It would also see the runner not being able to sit in the hole or be constantly on the field coaching. I would also remove the water carriers from the playing surface, if the players want a drink they should go to the boundry line and get one. I believe we should remove all club officials from the field unless there is an injured player that requires medical attention.

 

[likka]

I agree. I say go back to two on the bench and two umpires

Disagree, this will simply burn players out quicker. The game may slow down a little, but only because players will be completely knackered.

Would make preseason even more gut busting than it is now.