News New jumpers for 2012

[Cory]

Is it just me or is Essendon's collar a lot rounder as compared to Collingwood's last night. Surely they'd be the same template.

Essendon are using the round collar while Collingwood is keeping the 2011 one

 

[Groupie_]

It is a subtle change but the Carlton guernsey for away games will have a slightly different look in 2012.
The front will remain the same on the navy guernsey with the CFC insignia the feature, front and centre. The Mars logo will be on the front of the Nike Carlton away guernsey similar to the last two years. It is the back of the guernsey that will have the subtle change.

In 2012 the Hyundai written across the back of the away guernsey will be white writing in a light blue box. It is subtle and in reality there is no change to the official Carlton guernsey. In previous years the Hyundai on the back of the Carlton away guernsey has been in white, directly on the navy guernsey.

 

[TheDoctor11]

Not a fan, the box is unnecessary.

 

[SJ]

Not a fan, the box is unnecessary.

I've heard this argument from FGDers a lot, but I'd like to be the devil's advocate and ask whether putting a box around a logo draws more attention to the sponsor? I'd hazard it does.

 

[Hank93]

Essendon are using the round collar while Collingwood is keeping the 2011 one

Ah OK. Cool.

 

[Franc de Borges]

I've heard this argument from FGDers a lot, but I'd like to be the devil's advocate and ask whether putting a box around a logo draws more attention to the sponsor? I'd hazard it does.

It definitely stands out more now with the royal blue box, but if that's the case I don't get why you'd do it on the back for away games but not the front for home games.

 

[Gibbsy]

I've heard this argument from FGDers a lot, but I'd like to be the devil's advocate and ask whether putting a box around a logo draws more attention to the sponsor? I'd hazard it does.

It does draw more attention to the sponsor. That's precisely the reason most on here don't like it!

 

[EBUS]

I actually like the look of it, the lighter blue looks pretty good on navy blue.

 

[Teen Wolf]

I've heard this argument from FGDers a lot, but I'd like to be the devil's advocate and ask whether putting a box around a logo draws more attention to the sponsor? I'd hazard it does.

Oh yeah, it certainly does. The problem is that overbearing advertisements from greedy corporations is kind of a turn off.

In this particular case, it's not too bad. But I think the compromise Carlton and Hyundai had for the 16(ish?) years prior was classier, and it made for a cleaner looking jumper.

 

[workhorse]

to me dark collingwood home is very modern, they should go back to what's right for the system to flow again. honestly doesn't the clash system feel like it revolves around collingwood? if they go back to white home all the traditional clashes work with the normal kits and other pointless changes with interstate clubs wont have to happen.

No, the clash system does not revolve around anyone. Just because Collingwood wear a dark jumper now, when we never used to up until 2001, doesn't mean we should revert back to a light jumper just because it will 'solve' all clash issues.

How about Fremantle or Carlton or Essendon or any other 'dark' jumpered team change to a light jumper? Will that solve everything?

Seriously, Collingwood should be able to wear any home jumper that we want as long as we provide an adequate and effective clash jumper. (Which we do. 2 infact!)

It's other clubs that don't follow these set rules that (ironically) should be in black and white - when your a dark team playing an away game against another dark team, you must wear a light jumper, simple!

I wouldn't complain, your clash jumper looks a million times better than your 'home' jumper.

Thats coming from a Geelong supporter. Many Collingwood fans like the 'home' jumper as you call it. And I'm sure that no matter what colour the jumper is, as long as it's black and white stripes, Pies fans will like it.

That is the reason and it's embarrassing that the AFL still thinks like that in 2012.

Ridiculous argument. I'd say more AFL supporters don't want to see one set of clash rules for one team and another set of rules for another team. Either there's a clash or there isn't.

I wouldn't say 'everyone' wants to see Carlton wear their Sturt strip in an away game against Collingwood, but the vast majority would like to see Carlton and Essendon follow the same rules as every other club in the competition. If Carlton is so embarrassed by their light blue, they shouldn't sell it.

How did traditional guernseys become traditional anyway? How come every club isn't wearing the same design as they had a hundred years ago? If Carlton kept their white away strip, or embraced their blue strip and wore it when they were obliged to, all of a sudden, it becomes part of their identity, without taking anything away from their association with the navy blue. Like West Coast's home guernsey. Like Fremantle and Port Adelaide's away guernseys. Like the Bulldogs' away guernsey.

 

[cammania]

Here's the one I don't get:
Why do they make teams change shorts (or in some cases full kits) during their 20-minute turnaround between consecutive games? Surely it can be organised that the only team that needs to change is the team in games 1 and 3

Eg tonight at Subiaco:

Game 1 Eagles v Essendon
Eagles all Royal, Essendon Black with Red Shorts

Game 2 Essendon v Fremantle
Essendon Black with Red Shorts, Fremantle all White

Game 3 Fremantle v Eagles
Fremantle all White, Eagles all Royal.

There'd actually be no need for any changes.
Probably the Eagles and Freo wanted to show off both guernseys to their supporters to try and sell more.

I was predicting a jumper change. I figured with freo and essendon playing two games in a row, I thought we'd come out in the white clash jumper instead of the home.
So I echo the sentiments quoted just a small tweak in what was said

 

[cammania]

I like the box around Hyundai

 

[Mero]

That is the reason and it's embarrassing that the AFL still thinks like that in 2012.

Ridiculous argument. I'd say more AFL supporters don't want to see one set of clash rules for one team and another set of rules for another team. Either there's a clash or there isn't.

I wouldn't say 'everyone' wants to see Carlton wear their Sturt strip in an away game against Collingwood, but the vast majority would like to see Carlton and Essendon follow the same rules as every other club in the competition. If Carlton is so embarrassed by their light blue, they shouldn't sell it.

How did traditional guernseys become traditional anyway? How come every club isn't wearing the same design as they had a hundred years ago? If Carlton kept their white away strip, or embraced their blue strip and wore it when they were obliged to, all of a sudden, it becomes part of their identity, without taking anything away from their association with the navy blue. Like West Coast's home guernsey. Like Fremantle and Port Adelaide's away guernseys. Like the Bulldogs' away guernsey.

I saw research on this in 2007, the last time I've heard of the AFL doing polling on this.
It was something like 80% of football fans preferred the opposition club to wear their traditional jumpers if there was no clash.
I don't know if it was a Yes Minister type poll where they get the numbers they want, but I am certain it was something of that magnitude.

As far as clubs wearing what they wore in 1912, here is the breakdown:
Carlton basically do wear the same, Navy with White monogram
Collingwood do wear the same. Black with White stripes
Essendon wear the same, Black with Red sash
Fitzroy; now appearing as Brisbane; Dark Maroon with Blue yoke.. They've added a Paddle Pop lion and dragged the yoke lower.
Footscray; as of this year are now wearing what they wore in 1912
Geelong; Bluee & White hoops, so they're the same
Hawthorn; Gold with Blue yoke in the Ammos. They're different.
Melbourne have added a Red Yoke to their Navy jumper
North Until earlier tonight I would have told you they were wearing Blue & White stripes in 1912, but they may have been Blue with White yoke until about 1918, then the stripes.
Richmond Black with Yellow band is now a sash
StKilda 6 Red White and Black stripes are now three panels
South Melbourne nee Sydney, White with Red sash is now White with Red yoke and back

Why don't clubs wear what they wore one hundred years ago?
Most of them already do. Or something very similar.

 

[Mr Eagle]

I've heard this argument from FGDers a lot, but I'd like to be the devil's advocate and ask whether putting a box around a logo draws more attention to the sponsor? I'd hazard it does.

My question is: does that achieve anything? I'd be fascinated to see any research that suggested sponsors got more bang for their buck because they made their logo more intrusive.

 

[Hank93]

My question is: does that achieve anything? I'd be fascinated to see any research that suggested sponsors got more bang for their buck because they made their logo more intrusive.

I'd say it would.

However Hyundai probably paid slightly more to have the logo stand out more.

 

[E92_]

Did anyone see Freo's back sponsor yesterday? Looked horrible, the white box/outline is completely pointless.

 

[Silent Alarm]

I've heard this argument from FGDers a lot, but I'd like to be the devil's advocate and ask whether putting a box around a logo draws more attention to the sponsor? I'd hazard it does.

It does. But it perhaps makes it harder to read.

Think of Sydney and their QBE/Citi logos. Surely white on red is a great contrast, and enables the letters to be more readable than black on white in a squashed box.

 

[FXD_]

A lot of companies have brand books and guidelines these days and there are specific rules that govern how their logo is used.

They may stipulate that their logo has to be a certain colour on a certain background, so you can't just recolour the logo to fit in with the guernsey, they will need to have the logo look as it is used across all their branding so that may mean it goes in a box. From a marketing point of view this is obviously the right call as it means there is a consistency with how their brand is seen across the marketplace.

Sponsors don't really care about the aesthetics of a guernsey - they pay a large amount of money for a certain amount of space on a guernsey so they're (rightly) going to put whatever they want there.

EDIT: Just saw the back of the Fremantle guernsey. Yeah, no idea what they're thinking there.

 

[Hank93]

A lot of companies have brand books and guidelines these days and there are specific rules that govern how their logo is used.

They may stipulate that their logo has to be a certain colour on a certain background, so you can't just recolour the logo to fit in with the guernsey, they will need to have the logo look as it is used across all their branding so that may mean it goes in a box. From a marketing point of view this is obviously the right call as it means there is a consistency with how their brand is seen across the marketplace.

Sponsors don't really care about the aesthetics of a guernsey - they pay a large amount of money for a certain amount of space on a guernsey so they're (rightly) going to put whatever they want there.

EDIT: Just saw the back of the Fremantle guernsey. Yeah, no idea what they're thinking there.

+1

Sponsors put their logo on a respective jumper for one reason. Exposure of their brand. If they can find a way to enhance the logo on a jumper, then they will do this.

The more obvious a sponsors logo is on a jumper, the more $$$ they would bring in.

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

I saw research on this in 2007, the last time I've heard of the AFL doing polling on this.
It was something like 80% of football fans preferred the opposition club to wear their traditional jumpers if there was no clash.
I don't know if it was a Yes Minister type poll where they get the numbers they want, but I am certain it was something of that magnitude.

Of course. That's part of a bigger issue, when clubs wear a clash guernsey at home (or something similar) as a marketing venture. I'm the same. Every club should have a clash guernsey, but unless there are some exceptional circumstances, they should only wear something different to their regular guernsey when the necessity to avoid a clash is present.

As far as clubs wearing what they wore in 1912, here is the breakdown:
Carlton basically do wear the same, Navy with White monogram
Collingwood do wear the same. Black with White stripes
Essendon wear the same, Black with Red sash
Fitzroy; now appearing as Brisbane; Dark Maroon with Blue yoke.. They've added a Paddle Pop lion and dragged the yoke lower.
Footscray; as of this year are now wearing what they wore in 1912
Geelong; Bluee & White hoops, so they're the same
Hawthorn; Gold with Blue yoke in the Ammos. They're different.
Melbourne have added a Red Yoke to their Navy jumper
North Until earlier tonight I would have told you they were wearing Blue & White stripes in 1912, but they may have been Blue with White yoke until about 1918, then the stripes.
Richmond Black with Yellow band is now a sash
StKilda 6 Red White and Black stripes are now three panels
South Melbourne nee Sydney, White with Red sash is now White with Red yoke and back

Why don't clubs wear what they wore one hundred years ago?
Most of them already do. Or something very similar.

Ok, maybe a bad example. I'd still suggest that if clubs are, by-and-large, wearing the same thing that they wore a hundred years ago (or, better yet, when the club was founded) footyjumpers.com wouldn't be such an amazing resource. So the clash guernseys will, by nature, need to go through a more drastic change than the incremental ones that the standard guernsey has been through over the decades, but they're still changes. Every club could make a clash guernsey which stays true to its club colours and the longer that a few clubs bury their heads in the sand over it, the more amateur it makes the league look.

 

[krisholio14]

Thats coming from a Geelong supporter. Many Collingwood fans like the 'home' jumper as you call it. And I'm sure that no matter what colour the jumper is, as long as it's black and white stripes, Pies fans will like it.

Yeah but you've been wearing it for 5 minutes, and let's face it, the ony reason you changed was to pander to this BS modern design aesthetic that more black = more intimidating.

Your mob changed your jumper and created the clash. Why should Carlton have to change their jumper because you did? Why can't you wear what you wore against them for 100 years when there was no clash, without getting all precious about it?

 

[workhorse]

Yeah but you've been wearing it for 5 minutes, and let's face it, the ony reason you changed was to pander to this BS modern design aesthetic that more black = more intimidating.

Your mob changed your jumper and created the clash. Why should Carlton have to change their jumper because you did? Why can't you wear what you wore against them for 100 years when there was no clash, without getting all precious about it?

So what!? We are allowed to wear whatever we want as a home jumper. It's not precious to say that if we wear a dark jumper at home, the opposition wears a light jumper when they play us. That should be common logic?

Never mentioned Carlton changing their jumper mate You seem to be bending my words.

I'll mention again, they should wear a clash jumper against us when they are the away team. (or against any other dark team for that matter) Why is that hard to understand?

People need to deal with the fact that this is 2012, not the 1970's. Collingwood wear a black jumper at home. Sorry if you don't like it but your going to have to suck it up and....

 

[krisholio14]

So what!? We are allowed to wear whatever we want as a home jumper. It's not precious to say that if we wear a dark jumper at home, the opposition wears a light jumper when they play us. That should be common logic?

Never mentioned Carlton changing their jumper mate You seem to be bending my words.

I'll mention again, they should wear a clash jumper against us when they are the away team. (or against any other dark team for that matter) Why is that hard to understand?

People need to deal with the fact that this is 2012, not the 1970's. Collingwood wear a black jumper at home. Sorry if you don't like it but your going to have to suck it up and....

No you are missing the point.

Carlton do not want to wear a clash jumper. They do it because the AFL 'force' them to.

Now I don't recall there being any clash between Collingwood and Carlton until your team decided you wanted to wear mainly black instead of mainly white.

So on that basis, if your team created a clash by changing your main color, then if Carlton wish to wear their traditional guernsey instead of their pale blue monstrosity, they should be allowed to do so.

You've played each other over 200 times, and i'd say you've worn your 'clash' colors in 99% of them. What's the problem with keeping it that way?

 

[workhorse]

No you are missing the point.

Carlton do not want to wear a clash jumper. They do it because the AFL 'force' them to.

Now I don't recall there being any clash between Collingwood and Carlton until your team decided you wanted to wear mainly black instead of mainly white.

So on that basis, if your team created a clash by changing your main color, then if Carlton wish to wear their traditional guernsey instead of their pale blue monstrosity, they should be allowed to do so.

You've played each other over 200 times, and i'd say you've worn your 'clash' colors in 99% of them. What's the problem with keeping it that way?

I see what your saying, thats cool.

The main issue I have is that Carlton (along with every other AFL club) should be forced to wear a jumper that avoids a clash with the opposition. At the moment, we have 80% of teams that do and 20% that don't.

Now the fact that Melbourne were made to were that silver abomination a few years ago to avoid a clash with Essendon but in contrary, Carlton don't have to wear a clash jumper against Collingwood because they 'don't want to' and then we get a match with two dark jumpered teams makes zero sense and is an absolute joke that the rules can be that skewed.

Now in terms of the Collingwood/Carlton matches, I don't really care what jumpers Collingwood wear. If by preventing a clash Collingwood want to wear their white strip than thats fine. If the clubs come to an agreement that sees Collingwood wear the white strip at home games well, even though the rules are still ridiculous, it helps the viewers and thats the main thing.

 

[krisholio14]

I see what your saying, thats cool.

The main issue I have is that Carlton (along with every other AFL club) should be forced to wear a jumper that avoids a clash with the opposition. At the moment, we have 80% of teams that do and 20% that don't.

Now the fact that Melbourne were made to were that silver abomination a few years ago to avoid a clash with Essendon but in contrary, Carlton don't have to wear a clash jumper against Collingwood because they 'don't want to' and then we get a match with two dark jumpered teams makes zero sense and is an absolute joke that the rules can be that skewed.

Now in terms of the Collingwood/Carlton matches, I don't really care what jumpers Collingwood wear. If by preventing a clash Collingwood want to wear their white strip than thats fine. If the clubs come to an agreement that sees Collingwood wear the white strip at home games well, even though the rules are still ridiculous, it helps the viewers and thats the main thing.

I agree.

I think the problem is that 'clash' jumpers aren't really designed to help Joe Public like you and I see the game better (or help the players), they are purely a money spinner.

Basically they are there to have more merch to sell us, and so that they can get more money out of apparel sponsors.

There have been situations in the A League this year where the Victory have used their fluro yellow clash strip when they didn't need to (and actually created a clash in the process), simply because they have an agreement with adidas to wear it in x amount of games.

It truly annoys me that these things have become a cash cow in pretty much every competition in the world, rather than do what they are designed to do.