Recommitted Paddy Dow [OOC 2023] explored his options, but stayed

[Simche]

Doesn't mean you shouldn't pay a late 2nd rounder for him though

Dow should get a look in soon as injuries are starting to mount up for us

Don't think anyone will be even vaguely tempted to give anything like a second for Dow. Likely a swap of thirds is about where he's at.

Likely needs to go somewhere where he can play inside the contest and isn't required to rotate out onto the flanks or the wing where his disposal gets exposed pretty badly.

While we're mentioned, I'm a bit interested in whether he may even compromise his brother's development given they both play pretty similar roles. We may be looking at him as a replacement for someone like Ross.

 

[Kreuuuzeurns]

Don't think anyone will be even vaguely tempted to give anything like a second for Dow. Likely a swap of thirds is about where he's at.

Likely needs to go somewhere where he can play inside the contest and isn't required to rotate out onto the flanks or the wing where his disposal gets exposed pretty badly.

While we're mentioned, I'm a bit interested in whether he may even compromise his brother's development given they both play pretty similar roles. We may be looking at him as a replacement for someone like Ross.

I doubt we let him go that cheaply unless we need to put his salary towards another player.

He is still a required player at Carlton.

 

[Simche]

I doubt we let him go that cheaply unless we need to put his salary towards another player.

He is still a required player at Carlton.

He's contracted and that is Carlton's prerogative to try and hold him to his deal.

I suspect Dow and his management will probably push for a trade if he continues his VFL form, there's interest and Carlton don't pick him in the seniors. In those circumstances I'm not sure that outside interest would be maintained at the price point above a third rounder.

At the end of the day, Dow is interesting to other clubs as a cheap player to try and bolster inside midfield stocks or potentially looked at as injury cover. I very much doubt any clubs out there reckon they can get his best case potential above a C+ 50 game depth player.

He's illustrated that he doesn't have a future in the inside role at Carlton, and if I were them I'd probably preference the cap relief over holding him to a deal given he could be a year away from being delisted at this stage.

 

[pressurepoint]

He’d be lucky to get another gig. His high draft stocks are irrelevant now. I do think there will be a club though that will give him another chance to see if a change in environment can help bring out his best. No club would trade for him, only as a DFA. I can see us being that team.

He’s contracted for another year. He will be held to his contract - why would Carlton discard him, pay him out, so he can go DFA?

Say he requests a trade. I think Carlton would facilitate that for a new start is probably best for the player and his football. But Carlton would need to be compensated fairly?

Otherwise they’ve committed to persisting with him and there’s merit to persisting with him. For all his shortcomings, there is a player there.

What’s fair compensation in this scenario? Not much overall. You would definitely take a pick in the 30s-40s. A first round pick upgrade with a bottom 5 team. A player swap to fill a void in the list.

Clubs willing to trade might just take the gamble that he will never come on at Carlton, wait another year, and think about getting him next year for nothing via DFA. The risk would be that he does come on in 2023, earns his spot in the 22, and re-signs.

 

[petrolium]

He’s contracted for another year. He will be held to his contract - why would Carlton discard him, pay him out, so he can go DFA?

Say he requests a trade. I think Carlton would facilitate that for a new start is probably best for the player and his football. But Carlton would need to be compensated fairly?

Otherwise they’ve committed to persisting with him and there’s merit to persisting with him. For all his shortcomings, there is a player there.

What’s fair compensation in this scenario? Not much overall. You would definitely take a pick in the 30s-40s. A first round pick upgrade with a bottom 5 team. A player swap to fill a void in the list.

Clubs willing to trade might just take the gamble that he will never come on at Carlton, wait another year, and think about getting him next year for nothing via DFA. The risk would be that he does come on in 2023, earns his spot in the 22, and re-signs.

My comment was made prior to finding out that he in fact had an additional year left on his current deal. Obviously that changes the situation re DFA status. If he doesn’t play much this year, he will ask for a trade as 1) there’s no guarantee that Carlton will extend his deal beyond 2023 so there’s not much security for him; there may be another club willing to offer greater security 2) more opportunity to play in the seniors
As all good clubs do - which Carlton is striving to become - they won’t get in the way of the player to seek better opportunities elsewhere and therefore won’t haggle when it comes to trading. Therefore I suspect that a R3 - possibly even token R4 pick gets the deal done.

 

[Simche]

He’s contracted for another year. He will be held to his contract - why would Carlton discard him, pay him out, so he can go DFA?

Say he requests a trade. I think Carlton would facilitate that for a new start is probably best for the player and his football. But Carlton would need to be compensated fairly?

Otherwise they’ve committed to persisting with him and there’s merit to persisting with him. For all his shortcomings, there is a player there.

What’s fair compensation in this scenario? Not much overall. You would definitely take a pick in the 30s-40s. A first round pick upgrade with a bottom 5 team. A player swap to fill a void in the list.

Clubs willing to trade might just take the gamble that he will never come on at Carlton, wait another year, and think about getting him next year for nothing via DFA. The risk would be that he does come on in 2023, earns his spot in the 22, and re-signs.

Don't think Dow is worth a first rounder upgrade to anyone, let alone a team in the bottom 5.

No one is dropping potentially 10 spots at the pointy end for him even if he is contracted.

 

[pressurepoint]

I think that's right - there might be a club that sees upside in such a deal but very unlikely.
I hope Carlton hold on to him

 

[bluebaggerjuls]

I dont see how we let him go. Whats the point in trading him for a late pick. Unless we get a second rounder which is unlikely becuase it doesnt look like hes going to play any senior footy at this rate and has showed next to nothing over the past 4 years.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

I dont see how we let him go. Whats the point in trading him for a late pick. Unless we get a second rounder which is unlikely becuase it doesnt look like hes going to play any senior footy at this rate and has showed next to nothing over the past 4 years.

Contradictory post.
Has shown nothing, can’t get a game, but you can’t see why you’d let him go.

Maybe he will say “trade me please” and the club won’t stand in his way?

 

[Foxman98]

I dont see how we let him go. Whats the point in trading him for a late pick. Unless we get a second rounder which is unlikely becuase it doesnt look like hes going to play any senior footy at this rate and has showed next to nothing over the past 4 years.

If he wasn't drafted at pick 3 and was a rookie selection would you still say 2nd rounder? Judge him on his output not where he was picked

 

[Gratees]

If he wasn't drafted at pick 3 and was a rookie selection would you still say 2nd rounder? Judge him on his output not where he was picked

If he was a rookie im not sure he would be on a list by now

 

[marcmurphy3]

If he wasn't drafted at pick 3 and was a rookie selection would you still say 2nd rounder? Judge him on his output not where he was picked

I agree with you but luckily due to him being contracted we dont have to give him away for a token pick. If we dont get anything for him we are better off keeping him.

Also, its not like he is playing poorly. He is probably winning the Liston Trophy count at this stage. We just happen to have arguably the best cohort of inside mids in the comp atm and Voss is hesitent to play players out of position.

 

[The Kings Ransom]

I agree with you but luckily due to him being contracted we dont have to give him away for a token pick. If we dont get anything for him we are better off keeping him.

Also, its not like he is playing poorly. He is probably winning the Liston Trophy count at this stage. We just happen to have arguably the best cohort of inside mids in the comp atm and Voss is hesitent to play players out of position.

What do you think about Jacob Dawsons season so far?

 

[Foxman98]

I agree with you but luckily due to him being contracted we dont have to give him away for a token pick. If we dont get anything for him we are better off keeping him.

Also, its not like he is playing poorly. He is probably winning the Liston Trophy count at this stage. We just happen to have arguably the best cohort of inside mids in the comp atm and Voss is hesitent to play players out of position.

VFL form is irrelevant. Michael Gibbons won it twice and was a preseason top up and since delisted , Anthony Miles was traded for a 3rd round pick swap (Since "retired") and Tom Gribble isnt on a list. Having an extra year on his contract and playing well in the VFL doesn't shoot his value up that much at all he is still worth a late pick like SPS went for last year

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

We and Hawthorn have had a good trading relationship over the past 5 or so years, wouldn't surprise me if we traded Dow to them rather cheaply/for mates rates.

 

[Foxman98]

We and Hawthorn have had a good trading relationship over the past 5 or so years, wouldn't surprise me if we traded Dow to them rather cheaply/for mates rates.

Can't see the hawks wanting him really they have Worpel in and out of the team don't see how Dow would be any different

 

[theiaofseed]

Can't see the hawks wanting him really they have Worpel in and out of the team don't see how Dow would be any different

Dow has speed which is something we lack, could very well be the point of difference the make up of our midfield needs. If he's delisted after two years no harm done because he was cheap

 

[marcmurphy3]

VFL form is irrelevant. Michael Gibbons won it twice and was a preseason top up and since delisted , Anthony Miles was traded for a 3rd round pick swap (Since "retired") and Tom Gribble isnt on a list. Having an extra year on his contract and playing well in the VFL doesn't shoot his value up that much at all he is still worth a late pick like SPS went for last year

Im not saying another club will offer a heap more then a token pick for him. Im saying because he is contracted and worth more to us then that we dont have to accept said token pick. It is up to the club who wants him to satisfy us. Why would we just give him away for nothing? Im sure we will try do the right thing by him if he isnt getting opportunitty but we will still need to get something we can use.

A month ago when I thought he was uncontracted I was preparing myself for chips.

Also most those VFL players you mentioned have physical attributes that limit their impact at AFL level or make them very vanilla. Dow is not exactly in the same catergory.

 

[Foxman98]

Im not saying another club will offer a heap more then a token pick for him. Im saying because he is contracted and worth more to us then that we dont have to accept said token pick. It is up to the club who wants him to satisfy us. Why would we just give him away for nothing? Im sure we will try do the right thing by him if he isnt getting opportunitty but we will still need to get something we can use.

A month ago when I thought he was uncontracted I was preparing myself for chips.

Also most those VFL players you mentioned have physical attributes that limit their impact at AFL level or make them very vanilla. Dow is not exactly in the same catergory.

Paddy doesn't impact at AFL level so he mustn't have them either. (I know he is quick but that doesn't make you valuable if you don't get the ball and impact games) He will go for chips if he wants out.

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

Paddy doesn't impact at AFL level so he mustn't have them either. (I know he is quick but that doesn't make you valuable if you don't get the ball and impact games) He will go for chips if he wants out.

Agreed, and we certainly won't let stand in his way if he wants to go

Our list depth and chemistry has now reached a point where he probably is surplus to requirements, still think he would be a great fit for Hawthorn.

 

[Foxman98]

Agreed, and we certainly won't let stand in his way if he wants to go

Our list depth and chemistry has now reached a point where he probably is surplus to requirements, still think he would be a great fit for Hawthorn.

I just personally now don't see him ever really making it at the level. He has had every opportunity to stake a claim in what has been a poor Carlton team in previous years and was unable to do so and the rapid improvement in the team with the likes of Hewett coming in have shown how far off he was

 

[Jeremias]

It's a fallacy that he wasn't able to cement a spot or stake a claim in a poor Carlton side.

Missed a handful of games in his first two seasons of senior football and was developing nicely until Teague took over the role of head coach and moved our younger players (including Paddy) out of the midfield rotations.

 

[Foxman98]

It's a fallacy that he wasn't able to cement a spot or stake a claim in a poor Carlton side.

Missed a handful of games in his first two seasons of senior football and was developing nicely until Teague took over the role of head coach and moved our younger players (including Paddy) out of the midfield rotations.

How is that not him being able to cement a spot? Was gifted time to develop in his first 2 years was deemed not good enough and had been on the outer since

 

[Jeremias]

How is that not him being able to cement a spot? Was gifted time to develop in his first 2 years was deemed not good enough and had been on the outer since

You're choosing to side with semantics rather than assess the situation with even the slightest bit of logic.

Each to their own I guess, but claiming he hadn't cemented a spot because he's now out of the side years down the track is nonsense.

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

It's a fallacy that he wasn't able to cement a spot or stake a claim in a poor Carlton side.

Missed a handful of games in his first two seasons of senior football and was developing nicely until Teague took over the role of head coach and moved our younger players (including Paddy) out of the midfield rotations.

I don't think it's fair to blame Teague for all of Dow's issues.
Wasn't sure he was developing all that nicely either before Teague was appointed.

Sometimes players are just drafted to the wrong club, at the wrong time, as clearly is the case with Dow.