Autopsy Round 14, 2020: Melbourne v St.Kilda

[gringo2011]

What about increasing it against the hawks.

I'd just be happy to beat them to be honest.

 

[bennymc7]

He has a history of being the one to step up and win us the game.

he just has an off night.

GC, Carlton spring to mind as games he was massive in when we were struggling.. same last week if we had have won he would have been why

 

[StCicatriz]

A sad sad state of affairs. No defending it.

You have to wonder what someone like Rath is thinking

He only came in at the end of last year. Id love to here his honest opinion of everything now that he's been there a while

Same with roughy

 

[plugger66]

I'd just be happy to beat them to be honest.

Well I’m happy beating them by a fair bit. Anyway I doubt our percentage comes into play except against the dees.

 

[plugger66]

You have to wonder what someone like Rath is thinking

He only came in at the end of last year. Id love to here his honest opinion of everything now that he's been there a while

Same with roughy

Well I reckon they would internally be very happy with our big improvement this year. I know it’s boring for you but not everything is a headline. We are still 6th Our percentage is 30% better than last year. That’s huge.

 

[gringo2011]

I think Clark will be a gun. He had a bad night and hasn't excelled as we would have hoped this year, but he's got the game to be a top level mid I think. I think he's not actually a natural half back. He isn't a dasher. He's a player who does his best work when he's moving through traffic. I don't know where Coffield ends up, but his game is so well suited to being an intercepting defender.

I think Marshall has done an exellelent job this season, considering the role he's played. The second ruck role he has is an unusual one and I think he's been pretty consistent in it. He hasn't had the games where he's stood out for us that he had last year, but I think that's largely a result of his role, rather than his form. He's formed a really important partnership with Ryder too, which has been a big factor in lots of our wins.

Agree on Battle. I feel like we are doing him a bit of a disservice with the role we're asking him to do. He'll have the odd game where it comes off, eg the Bombers game, but we're asking him to play the Richo/Roo role that they played late in their careers. It's a bloody tough role to play. Throwing him around constantly between different roles is really difficult for a young KPP. We need to find a more stable role for him. I still think he ends up being a terrific player, just not sure yet where it will be.

I hold all these guys to a very high standard. Hunter will be a gun, he's not a fast player and lacks closing speed for a back. In the mids you can lack a bit of top end speed and his composure and hands in traffic will make him a gun when he eventually moves in there. Marshall was unlucky to not win our B&F last year, this year he's a bit off that so I guess I kind of expected he'd be Brody Grundy this season. Coffield looks like Brandan Goddard.

 

[BrutThough]

EFA

The Brisbane game where he was unsighted for three quarters? He IS coasting this year.

Having a bad fortnight isnt coasting.

 

[George]

You have to wonder what someone like Rath is thinking

He only came in at the end of last year. Id love to here his honest opinion of everything now that he's been there a while

Same with roughy

Not too sure what to make of it all. 3 games now we really should have won and didn't. Had some good wins this year but we always find a way back to our default. Don't know what to say really. It was a pathetic performance.

 

[Stan_Darsh72]

Still rather be in this position than 14th like last year I suppose.

I’ve started to calm down a little and listen to considered posters like NarklesHelmet, lewdogs and even, dare I say it, plugger66

We have to know where we are and where we’ve come from. I know I probably overestimated where we were at in the excitement of the early season. Got so much further still to go, but we’ve improved heaps from last season both from organic growth of some of our young players and the additions to the team and that’s realistically all we can hope for right now. With the operative word being “realistic.”

We are still an inconsistent team but there are good signs.

We play attacking footy but do need more strings to our bow.

 

[Saint12]

The Melbourne loss is no where near as bad as the losses to North and Freo...that is why we will struggle to make the 8.

 

[Keg still on legs]

Just ran my own ladder predictor and I only put us down for the 1 win so I could show the "worst case scenario" (obviously zero wins is the worst but you get my point)

I had us finishing 9th, 1/2 a game behind the pies. Carlton to only win more and finish on 8 wins. So if the pies lose today my predictor would have us equal on 9 wins with the blues but currently 13% to the good of them

So ..... it's not impossible for us to sneak in with 9 wins as long as our %age doesn't take a hit. It's a shame it's come to this though when we had our destiny in our own hands.

 

[Plugger35]

I've decided to get on the sauce again today to drown the sorrows of us blowing another win and putting our finals spot in jeopardy.

Speaking of on the sauce, Nathan Jones is a bald headed flog.




A bit of light relief amongst all the doom and gloom in this thread.

 

[Saint12]

I've decided to get on the sauce again today to drown the sorrows of us blowing another win and putting our finals spot in jeopardy.

Speaking of on the sauce, Nathan Jones is a bald headed flog.




A bit of light relief amongst all the doom and gloom in this thread.

Gerard Roosy and Garry sounded pissed as but Jono Brown sounded his normal self....maybe he wasn't invited out for the piss up.

 

[NarklesHelmet]

You have to wonder what someone like Rath is thinking

He only came in at the end of last year. Id love to here his honest opinion of everything now that he's been there a while

Same with roughy

You’d reckon both Rath and Roughy would be really happy with where we are at.

I vividly remember watching us beat up on the Hawks back in 2005, similar to the way the Cats beat us up a few weeks back. Roughy will remember playing in a team at that stage of development as well (pretty sure he talks about it on AFL 360). I’m sure knows where we’re at at drawing on how long it took the Hawks with a young team to start getting results.

I think we are ahead of where we should be, especially when you look at how inexperienced our defense is minus Carlisle.

I’m bullish about us in 2-3 years when young blokes like Coff, Clark and King are in the 50-100 bracket.

This COVID year has been a blessing for us. Playing every game on the road, will build great resilience in the group and I’m sure you’ll see a better team on the road next year.

If we do actually play a finals game (I still think it can happen, plenty to play out yet), I’ll be absolutely over the moon, will be such a good experience for the group.

What we need to work on over the next 2 pre-seasons is understanding how to change tempo and gears within a match. Once that clicks with this group, and adding in a couple of players, look out, we’ll be right up there.

We as supporters just need to realize, it will still take a bit of time to get some of our key young blokes closer to 100 games. It should be an exciting ride though and hopefully that starts with a finals game this year.

 

[Plugger35]

Gerard Roosy and Garry sounded pissed as but Jono Brown sounded his normal self....maybe he wasn't invited out for the piss up.

Yeah Browny usually speaks like a bloke that has taken one too many head knocks, he doesn't need to get on the sauce to sound like that.

 

[kernelT]

can’t believe I still give a s**t after all these years.

 

[Hit The Boundary Saints]

I haven't been this furious after a game for a few years now, however I will give another perspective to my frustration.

I usually sit high on Level 3 at Docklands so I can see what is happening up the field, how the opposition is structured and what we have to look at when we go forward. I would much rather watch from high than ground level.
With the camera work this season, you get no perspective of whats ahead. The camera is usually fixed on where the ball is, and nothing outside 20 m of the contest. Consequently you see nothing of what is ahead, what options the players have. It was incredibly frustrating to see us stream forward and go to King 1 on 3, but not be able to see what other options there were, if any. I think the camera work this year has been crap though I am amazed that the commentators do a reasonable job if they are just seeing the same vision as we are.

On 3AW earlier they discussed how Melbourne set up their press much deeper, which we didnt cope with. They allowed us to get to the centre quite easily, but didnt allow us to penetrate deeper. I didnt get any sense of that off the TV, and the problem was the ground level commentator was Abby Holmes, and not Luke Hodge, who would have pointed out the structural challenge. The guys in the studio calling the game off the TV cant see any more than we can. We got none of that, just repeated vision of May outpointing King in a body strength contest. Why couldnt King get on a lead? Why couldnt he draw May wider and leave Membery / Marshall / Ryder / Battle one out against a lesser opponent. Where were Butler / Hind / Kent at the foot of these contests ? We only get a 2 dimensional view on the TV.

Last night we had way too many passesngers. Hind, Kent, King, Battle and even Clark all essentially non contributors. How does Battle only have 6 touches in 67% game time given his role. We have 5 guys with <=7 touches, Melbourne had 2. That, and the seemingly dumb way of entering 50, was the problem. We would like Max King to be a combination of Plugger and Stewie but at the moment he isnt beating good defenders in May and Lever by himself.

 

[Hit The Boundary Saints]

PS. did the ladder simulator. If we beat GWS we finish 6th, lose we finish 9th. Its that tight

 

[CaptainRisky]

He has a history of being the one to step up and win us the game.

he just has an off night.

We need to get him closer to the goals as all those other muppets we have tried up there are just not up to it

 

[Saintbloke]

I reckon Battle needs to be settled in a position, not thrown all over the ground- otherwise he wont take the next step up, and he has the potential to be a top player. Ratts didn't use him well last night. I think Marshall will still get even better in the next couple of seasons, and I expect Max will, but he has a lot to learn yet about using his body in contests.

Sadly one thing to guarantee a Saints loss, is to play in a "must win" game or a marquee game, though we wont be getting any more of those for a long time.

 

[Plugger35]

can’t believe I still give a sh*t after all these years.

Often wonder that myself.

Is it blind loyalty or Stockholm syndrome that keeps us supporting a club that brings us so much disappointment.

Probably half a dozen of one or six of the other.

 

[stfan]

PS. did the ladder simulator. If we beat GWS we finish 6th, lose we finish 9th. Its that tight

It depends on a lot of other teams and so is not that simple. % may be crucial for us and is currently a good advantage except for the Dees.. But if two teams pummel us that may push us down several places.

But yes how GWS goes is going to be crucial.

If we only beat the Hawks we could finish lower than 9th.

 

[austinnn]

Oh well. Time to get back on the horse and tune into Liverpool at 1.30. A side that doesn't constantly let me down

Another wasted year boys. Awards for the best excuses for this absolute shambles.

Oh.

Even Liverpool let us down today. I care a lot more about the Saints losing to a s**t pretender side in a pre-final final than a community cup loss to Arsenal, but even LFC can't give me joy on this shitty sporting weekend. A crap end to the summer holidays.

 

[Brains Trust66]

Bit harsh with people having a go at King saying he isn’t ready when only a couple of games ago he got the rising star nom. He is a young kid and young kids are always up and down .
I think some of us got ahead of ourselves about how far we have come this year . We are still in the eight at the moment and I will be very happy if we make the finals especially given how inexperienced most of our team are .
We lost by three points , just think how different this thread would be if that goal to Petracca was called a behind . Still it wasn’t to be . There is always next week .


On iPad using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[PostmanBish]

There is a good base about this team, but we still lack a few star mids and more maturity.

Marshall, Steele, Clark, Battle, Coffield, Paton, Wilkie, King, Butler, Gresh, Howard and Long are a good base.

We lost this game due to a lack of maturity and smarts but we can develop that, There is a premiership contender here but it might take time to get it right.

I'm thinking our lack of composure possibly in tight games comes from the fact we're almost always a young team under-fire from a much more experienced team. If I am reading it correctly, we were about 15 games, 10 months, and 3.5Kg lighter per player for this game.

In fact, from the 5 games decided by less than a goal, the only one where the difference in games played between the teams was under 50 games, is the one we won (Gold Coast - they had 48 games more experience running around) - the other 4 we were around 2-300 games short, and it largely sums up the difference.

I don't know too much about how we're training right now, but I'm betting it's nothing like a normal season, or normal training loads, so it's also not entirely a surprise that we're lacking some of the game-day plans we might have hoped to have.

Think of it a bit like an orchestra.

Geelong are like the Berlin Philharmonic ... even if you separate them for a month, and they can only do individual preparation, they're going to sit down on concert night (game day) and know exactly what they have to do - they have the experience, and maturity that the conductor waves his baton, and the performance is top notch.

Port, Richmond, Brisbane and a few other clubs are like the major Australian Orchestras ... they're really good, and have most of the attributes of the top-notch orchestras of the world, without necessarily having all the experience and polish, but generally turn up and put out a high quality performance.

St Kilda and Gold Coast, I would look at as being like a good University orchestra ... they've got some experience there in the players who are closer to graduation, but also a lot of kids in first year who don't really know how to match it with the big boys yet. Really need a lot of rehearsal (training) and input from the conductor (coach) and section leads (assistants) to get a quality product. If you take away 50% of the training, the quality of the performance suffers, and as a long performance season drags on, some of those younger performers find it harder to be consistent, and get a bit burned out. Also, a few of the leaders develop issues or fall ill, and force shuffling which puts younger players into positions where they lack the adequate support to do their best.

Then there are the basket cases ... but we know who they are ...