Religion So, How do Atheists explain miracles?

[KevinCat07]

http://www.abc.net.au/pm/content/2010/s2789958.htm

How do Atheists explain Miracles?

How was the woman who was diagnosed with inoperable cancer saved, even leaving doctors stumped?http://www.abc.net.au/pm/content/2010/s2789958.htm

Do they acknowledge the power of prayer, that science can't explain everything?

I've heard of other cases where people's illnesses have just dissapeared: cancer, HIV, athritis.

Are there any Atheists that believe in miracles? Or do you simply put it all down to random chance like you always do?

 

[Niximus]

http://www.abc.net.au/pm/content/2010/s2789958.htm

How do Atheists explain Miracles?

How was the woman who was diagnosed with inoperable cancer saved, even leaving doctors stumped?

Do they acknowledge the power of prayer, that science can't explain everything?

I've heard of other cases where people's illnesses have just dissapeared: cancer, HIV, athritis.

Are there any Atheists that believe in miracles? Or do you simply put it all down to random chance like you always do?

I did it. I'm magic.

 

[The Sultan]

in simple terms. Shit Happens.

 

[Sportman1987]

We acknowledge that science doesn't have all the answers as of yet. But just saying "God did it" whenever there is something we don't understand is fruitless. I could just as easily say "aliens did it" or "King Neptune did it" or "I did it by praying to Satan"

Science is however trying to account for the gaps in our knowledge by being dynamic & always trying new things. Religion on the other hand insists that the gaps adhere to an estabished viewpoint which never changes. The problem for you guys is that the gaps keep getting filled by science, with much more reasonable answers than you can provide. Eventually there won't be that many gaps left for you to cling to.

 

[The Sultan]

We acknowledge that science doesn't have all the answers as of yet. But just saying "God did it" whenever there is something we don't understand is fruitless. I could just as easily say "aliens did it" or "King Neptune did it" or "I did it by praying to Satan"

Science is however trying to account for the gaps in our knowledge by being dynamic & always trying new things. Religion on the other hand insists that the gaps adhere to an estabished viewpoint which never changes. The problem for you guys is that the gaps keep getting filled by science, with much more reasonable answers than you can provide. Eventually there won't be that many gaps left for you to cling to.

so basically i was right, sometimes shit happens

 

[HarryTiger]

I would ask you where is your control group, the non-prayers with their 100 % mortality rate?

 

[KevinCat07]

From the current answers I can conclude:

We can't explain it.

Thank you. That's all I needed to know.

 

[Niximus]

From the current answers I can conclude:

We can't explain it.

Thank you. That's all I needed to know.

So if we can't explain your vague description of an alleged miracle you win?

OK if you wan't an an explaination please provide the following details.

The woman's age
type of cancer
location of cancer
her height, weight and level of fitness
details of her diet
the age and experience of the doctor who made the diagnosis

There's more that we willneed to know but here is a start for you.

 

[bit_pattern]

I would ask you where is your control group, the non-prayers with their 100 % mortality rate?

This

Two words for you KC... Confirmation. Bias.

 

[J_Moore]

KevinCat07, your childish response (From the current answers I can conclude: We can't explain it.) perfectly encapsulates the differences between religion and the scientific method.

For science, not being able to immediately explain something simply isn't an issue, whereas, for the religious, it's an enormous problem solved by attributing it to a god.

 

[_JC_]

From the current answers I can conclude:

We can't explain it.

Thank you. That's all I needed to know.

How do you explain God exists?.

You can't.

Thank you. Thats all i needed to know

 

[WCEforeverman]

This

Two words for you KC... Confirmation. Bias.

Everyone is guilty of confirmation bias to some extent on most issues.

But I agree KC take it to the extreme.

 

[likka]

From the current answers I can conclude:

We can't explain it.

Thank you. That's all I needed to know.

How does the body fight any disease... the immune system.

The odds were obviously long that her body would beat the disease, but it is hardly the miracle you claim.

There are many stories of people beating cancer using non conventional eastern medicinal practices... are they to be considered miracles too?

With that sort of logic is it any wonder you gullible clowns actually believe the fairy tale scriptures are fact.

How do you explain God exists?.

You can't.

Thank you. Thats all I needed to know

Don't you know that unexplained stuff is all the proof you need.

 

[skilts]

Would she have died had she been a Muslim, rather than catholic? Had that occured, would that have been her right whack for endorsing the wrong religion?

How does Kevin Pussy explain the fact that the first resort to clowns such as him is to endorse the immutability of miracles. Tell me KevinPussy, how many other possible causes did you explore in that mush you call a mind?

 

[bunsen burner]

From the current answers I can conclude:

We can't explain it.

Thank you. That's all I needed to know.

This statement says more than the obvious stuff you have just been owned over. It suggests that you need an explanation for everything. others don't need an explanation. That is why pussy boys like you need religion and others can function perfectly without it.

God fearers like you always try to insist that non-believers are mad atheists who are as wrapped up in not belief as much as you are in beleif. The simple truth is most others are nauseating by ****wits like yourself who assume a moral high ground and communicate they are morally superior. Many people just think theist are plain old ****wits and need to be told so.

 

[GeorgeGrljusich]

We should all be jubilant that the upcoming beatification of the old girl will enrich all of our souls and make Australia the proud Christian nation that exists in kC07's tiny, deluded little mind.

 

[Waspy79]

So how do you explain disasters, catastrophes, the 2007 Grand Final?

 

[Roylion]

http://www.abc.net.au/pm/content/2010/s2789958.htm

How do Atheists explain Miracles?

How was the woman who was diagnosed with inoperable cancer saved, even leaving doctors stumped?http://www.abc.net.au/pm/content/2010/s2789958.htm

Do they acknowledge the power of prayer, that science can't explain everything?

I've heard of other cases where people's illnesses have just dissapeared: cancer, HIV, athritis.

Are there any Atheists that believe in miracles? Or do you simply put it all down to random chance like you always do?

I particularly like these quotes about miracles,

"A miracle is an event described by those to whom it was told, by people who did not see it. "Elbert Hubbard,

"In those parts of the world where learning and science have prevailed, miracles have ceased; but in those parts of it as are barbarous and ignorant, miracles are still in vogue." Ethan Allen, American Revolutionary War patriot.

Peter Cochrane's recent article in the Sydney Morning Herald here pretty much sums up my thoughts on miracles and Mary Mckillop.

The "spontaneous regression" or "spontaneous remission" he refers to was defined by T. C. Everson and W.H. Cole in their 1966 book Cole WH, Everson TC: Spontaneous Regression of Cancer. WB Saunders, Philadelphia, PA. 1966 (Buch) [1] and was as follows: "The partial or complete disappearance of a malignant tumour in the absence of all treatment, or in the presence of therapy which is considered inadequate to exert significant influence on neoplastic disease."

That we may not quite know what causes "spontaneous regression" does not necessarily make such an occurence of "spontaneous regression" a miracle.

Some other studies that have been conducted on spontaneous regression (and their numbers) are below.

It was concluded in a study of breast-cancer by Per-Henrik Zahl; Jan Mæhlen; H. Gilbert Welch titled The Natural History of Invasive Breast Cancers Detected by Screening Mammography, Arch. Intern Med., Vol 168 (NO. 21), Nov 24, 2008, that 22% of all breast cancer cases underwent spontaneous regression

Rohdenburg's study Fluctuations in the growth energy of tumors in man, with especial reference to spontaneous recession. J Cancer Res 1918;3:193-225, summarized 185 spontaneous regressions

J. Fauvet: Spontaneous cancer cures and regressions. Rev Prat. 1964 Jun 11;14:2177–2180 reported 202 cases between 1960–1964

W. H. Cole Spontaneous regression of cancer and the importance of finding its cause. Natl Cancer Inst Monogr. 1976 Nov;44:5–9 PMID 799760 described 176 cases between 1900–1960 ,

W. Boyd: The spontaneous regression of cancer. Charles Thomas, Publ., Springfield Ill. 1966 (Buch) reported 98 cases in 1966

G.B. Challis, H. J. Stam: (1990) The spontaneous regression of cancer. A review of cases from 1900 - 1987 Acta Oncol 29(5): 545-550 summarized 489 cases 1900–1987

All miracles? I personally doubt it, but no doubt further medical research will determine whether those who believe in 'miracles' are correct.

 

[GoesBangFrom50]

http://www.abc.net.au/pm/content/2010/s2789958.htm

How do Atheists explain Miracles?

How was the woman who was diagnosed with inoperable cancer saved, even leaving doctors stumped?

Do they acknowledge the power of prayer, that science can't explain everything?

I've heard of other cases where people's illnesses have just dissapeared: cancer, HIV, athritis.

Are there any Atheists that believe in miracles? Or do you simply put it all down to random chance like you always do?

Did she pray before she got the Cancer? How do you explain how she got it?

 

[HarryTiger]

Did she pray before she got the Cancer? How do you explain how she got it?

That's a "God works in mysterious ways" one.

 

[WCEforeverman]

Did she pray before she got the Cancer? How do you explain how she got it?

It was sent to test her faith...or something like that.

 

[Dont be a lemon]

blah blah blah

You're an idiot.

 

[linga_is_no1]

Firstly, just to clarify this in order for a miracle to be declared within the Catholic Church it has to go through for some very serious testing. The reason it took so long for Mary to become a saint, is testament to how hard the system is as opposed to her lack of intervention. There are literally records of 1000's miracles attributed to Mary, but only 2 have been proved. Read all about the process here , for this miracle attributed to Mary MacKillop at least 2 doctors invovled with the case would have to have admitted it was a miracle and had no scientific explaination.

The argument 'well how come some people weren't cured' shows a lack of understanding of Christian and Catholic doctrine more than anything else. We don't understand God, if we did he wouldn't be God. No one can say why someone survives and someone does not. What would be a fair statement to say that if someone touches a piece of Mary's old clothing against a dying person, and that person miraculously recovers and defies science, then everyone would have to admit something is going on around here.

Miracles at Lourdes are the most interesting as there have been so many, and they go through even more rigorous testing than usual miracles. The most famous miracles are The Miracle of Sun, of which no credible scientific study has ever contested. No one has ever explained why the sun suddenly plummeted towards the earth (inconsistent with weather patterns), why peoples clothes which were soaking wet dried in seconds , why the miracle occurred at the exact same time it was predicted. The Miracle of the Sun also occurred in front of 100,000 people, many of whom were atheists, and obviously went back home a whole lot less comfortable with themselves that night.

Lanciano where the eucharist turned into real flesh and blood is also scientifically credible having been tested by the UN's health wing.

Sorry if that was disjointed

Miracles do happen, but some people really do need a torch to see the sun.

 

[GeorgeGrljusich]

blah, blah, indoctrinated, blah

Miracles do happen, but some people really do need a torch to see the sun.

My batteries are flat.
Thank god.

 

[evo]

How do Atheists explain Miracles?

as a breakdown in clear thinking.