The 2017 Federal Govt Budget

[Run n Spread]

People have to move away from thinking about getting a job. Globalisation and technology means there has never been a greater opportunity to work for yourself.

Conversely, globalisation and technology means wages are now subject to global pressures meaning you are competing with an African or Indian on wages. Unemployment will continue to rise placing more and more downward pressure on lowering social security and wages.

People who don't change their thoughts on traditional education, traditional jobs and traditional living arrangements; will find life harder and harder unless they are born with a silver spoon. Those who change their thoughts and change their actions will enjoy a financial freedom unattainable by past generations.

With what skills thou? You need the foundation skills to be able to implement the new technologies available. All I currently hear is people banging on about SEO, Apps and Robotics. All great technology but the underlying skills and demand still need to be there.

What traditional living arrangements do you mean?

 

[WCE1987]

If I had a dollar for everytime shorten says 'top end of town'.

 

[Howard Littlejohn]

Never worse than the Qld JBP period of paper bags of money, Russ Hinze & the rest of the white shoe brigade.

Economies in SydMel are being driven by population growth. Immigration is a large part that. Regions dont get much benefit of that family reunion & ethnic grouping thing. That drives other jobs in those economies.

Tassie's problems go far deeper than low population. Low poulations can be enormously successful. At times in Aus, 2008-09 from memory, increased population has masked lower per capita GDP. Some of the growth is false. Tasmania's problems lie very, very deep. And with the educated fleeing, many are deeper. That's not to say some people can't make a go of things, but it will always (regardless of population trends)

The Gray and Lennon years at a minimum were definitely worse than Bjelke-Petersen, there was just no 4 Corners or Fitzgerald inquiry. The place needs to start with a Royal Commission into 40 years of governance, from parliamentarians to police to judges to local councils - and build a couple of new prisons to house the fallout. Incest is a label falsely applied to Tasmania (OK, Poatina and bits of the Huon), but incestuous doesn't start to cover the corridors of what passes for power in the state.

 

[DaRick]

I think the government does a lot. There is all those write-down options like the instant 20k one. There is quite a lot of grants https://www.business.gov.au/assistance/entrepreneurs-programme-summary
And I think there was changes recently to the laws around how you can claim bankruptcy with minimal impact, to encourage more start-ups and innovation.
https://www.innovation.gov.au/page/insolvency-laws-reform

Nice initiatives, but they don't actually put money in people's pockets. You would need to supplement these initiatives with a more generous welfare system to actually encourage people to spend money starting small businesses.

 

[WCE1987]

Nice initiatives, but they don't actually put money in people's pockets. You would need to supplement these initiatives with a more generous welfare system to actually encourage people to spend money starting small businesses.

Really?
I know people that have used them and have since expanded their business into 3 states, and have hired more people as a result.

There is a lot of incentive in starting a small business mainly for what it allows you to claim, as well as the benefits of depreciation. It's advantageous to start a small business at your house then you can claim portions of phone, car, computers and utilities etc.

I do see what you mean though about encouraging more people to become entrepreneurs to get off welfare through starting their own business as opposed to just job seeking.

 

[DaRick]

Spot on!

We have three choices of becoming
- a true capitalist nation with a race to the bottom. With loads of corruption like the US for big companies to prey on cheap labour.
- cling on and hold out with traditional socialist values and become a failed state like Venezuela or Argentina with loads of corruption.
- the third being an incredibly difficult balance seeking take take best best of socialists and capitalist values.

We have been successful in the past at achieving great outcomes but the challenge to adapt to modern pressures shouldn't be underestimated.

I think we should be borrowing a lot more from the Nordic states and Germany with regards to educational and economic policy than we actually do. Basically, they're all capitalist countries with many socialist trappings.

ATM our politicians are way too Anglo-centric and so they borrow some of the West's worst economic ideas (austerity, punitive measures towards unemployed people, broad-brush privatisation and deregulation) rather than the best.

 

[DaRick]

Really?
I know people that have used them and have since expanded their business into 3 states, and have hired more people as a result.

There is a lot of incentive in starting a small business mainly for what it allows you to claim, as well as the benefits of depreciation. It's advantageous to start a small business at your house then you can claim portions of phone, car, computers and utilities etc.

I do see what you mean though about encouraging more people to become entrepreneurs to get off welfare through starting their own business as opposed to just job seeking.

Oh I believe you don't worry; my brother uses his small business for this very thing.

It's just that IMO such initiatives by themselves don't encourage enough people to start small businesses.

Basically, I reckon we're on the same page but we're looking at this issue from different perspectives.

 

[Pessimistic]

If I had a dollar for everytime shorten says 'top end of town'.

...You'd be moving there in a week

 

[Pessimistic]

With what skills thou? You need the foundation skills to be able to implement the new technologies available. All I currently hear is people banging on about SEO, Apps and Robotics. All great technology but the underlying skills and demand still need to be there.

What traditional living arrangements do you mean?

I'm in IT and the admin effort by real people seems to go up with moores law. Everything magnitudes more complex but achieves very little more since the internet became popular

It's way more complex and 'labour' intensive than it needs to be. if robotics goes this way theyre'll be plenty of work

 

[madmug]

Tassie's problems go far deeper than low population. Low poulations can be enormously successful. At times in Aus, 2008-09 from memory, increased population has masked lower per capita GDP. Some of the growth is false. Tasmania's problems lie very, very deep. And with the educated fleeing, many are deeper. That's not to say some people can't make a go of things, but it will always (regardless of population trends)

The Gray and Lennon years at a minimum were definitely worse than Bjelke-Petersen, there was just no 4 Corners or Fitzgerald inquiry. The place needs to start with a Royal Commission into 40 years of governance, from parliamentarians to police to judges to local councils - and build a couple of new prisons to house the fallout. Incest is a label falsely applied to Tasmania (OK, Poatina and bits of the Huon), but incestuous doesn't start to cover the corridors of what passes for power in the state.

Very dark. Please offer more than just a dark storey. Maybe some sort of indication of evidence?

You'd most probably find dark incidences & many a dark story in every local Gument in every state, & every State gument & in their associated public services. At the Federal gument & its instrumentalities. In many unions, & in many businesses in every town & city in the nation. Certainly dark stories in most churches, in many families & other national & international organisations. In volunteer organisations. In health organisations. In the Judicial structures & associated organisations of the nation. In the many police forces & in other security organisations, in the Army, Navy & Airforces.
Christ, even in the jails are full of such dark stories, & thats not even the inmates!!!!!

Maybe you can start a thread & we'll outline a few of them, as they apply to all parts of this nation.

 

[WCE1987]

I'm in IT and the admin effort by real people seems to go up with moores law. Everything magnitudes more complex but achieves very little more since the internet became popular

It's way more complex and 'labour' intensive than it needs to be. if robotics goes this way theyre'll be plenty of work

To build and maintain those robots


Yeah I thought they were getting near moores law with processors based on what current chipsets are made off.

 

[Lebbo73]

What?
Sure, In boom times its when tax receipts rise. But spending should be contained & tax incomes should be saved for the inevitable downtimes, like the GEC of 10 years ago.
I thought that'd be economics 101?

In hindsight, they shouldn't have spent as much. Can't agree with you on lowering taxes though. Plus, the reckless GFC spending by Rudd started the deficit rot that the Liberals are only to happy to continue. It beggars belief that governments cannot pass spending cuts to rescue the budget. The Senate keeps forgetting that our children shouldn't be responsible for our debt.

 

[Pessimistic]

Costello and Howard did invest...,, in other countries infrastructure

'The future fund'

 

[madmug]

In hindsight, they shouldn't have spent as much. Can't agree with you on lowering taxes though. Plus, the reckless GFC spending by Rudd started the deficit rot that the Liberals are only to happy to continue. It beggars belief that governments cannot pass spending cuts to rescue the budget. The Senate keeps forgetting that our children shouldn't be responsible for our debt.

The spending during the GEC saved a lot of jobs, businesses & family homes. Thats what Guments are for. Getting involved when needed, monitor the economy & health of citizens, otherwise keep out of the way.

 

[Lebbo73]

The spending during the GEC saved a lot of jobs, businesses & family homes. Thats what Guments are for. Getting involved when needed, monitor the economy & health of citizens, otherwise keep out of the way.

That is bs. China saved us. If you really believe it did, then you aren't worth responding to. The only thing Krudd's stimulus did was delay the inevitable.
Family homes haven't been saved. They have only stalled the disaster that is coming. A director on a board of one of the banks has told me that Australians are too highly loaded with debt. It is only a matter of time.

 

[madmug]

That is bs. China saved us. If you really believe it did, then you aren't worth responding to. The only thing Krudd's stimulus did was delay the inevitable.
Family homes haven't been saved. They have only stalled the disaster that is coming. A director on a board of one of the banks has told me that Australians are too highly loaded with debt. It is only a matter of time.

Whats the 2017 price of houses in Syd/Mel got to do with Rudd?

The China effect pushed up the $A which damaged all export industries except mining at that time.

The China effect enabled Rudd to spend & keep the rest of the country going & not collapsing into a depression like in places like Spain.

 

[DaRick]

Whats the 2017 price of houses in Syd/Mel got to do with Rudd?

The China effect pushed up the $A which damaged all export industries except mining at that time.

The China effect enabled Rudd to spend & keep the rest of the country going & not collapsing into a depression like in places like Spain.

Having control over one's monetary policy and being able to print one's own sovereign currency when needed helps too.

 

[Generalissimo]

I didn't agree with everything in Shorten's budget reply, but it was refreshing to see a Labor leader just unload like that. Normally Labor just tries to be Liberal Lite and doesn't raise a murmur against even the worst of the Liberals' excesses of amoral bullshit. Good on him for drawing a line.

ScoMo's original budget was pretty poor though. Nothing original; all the bad stuff was stolen from One Nation, and all the good stuff was stolen from Labor. It's like he knows the next election is already lost, and he and his band of millionaire kleptocrats just want to take as much as they can while they still have a chance. Probably need to give Turnbull a pat-down as he exits the Lodge to make sure he hasn't pocketed the silverware.

 

[madmug]

I didn't agree with everything in Shorten's budget reply, but it was refreshing to see a Labor leader just unload like that. Normally Labor just tries to be Liberal Lite and doesn't raise a murmur against even the worst of the Liberals' excesses of amoral bullshit. Good on him for drawing a line.

ScoMo's original budget was pretty poor though. Nothing original; all the bad stuff was stolen from One Nation, and all the good stuff was stolen from Labor. It's like he knows the next election is already lost, and he and his band of millionaire kleptocrats just want to take as much as they can while they still have a chance. Probably need to give Turnbull a pat-down as he exits the Lodge to make sure he hasn't pocketed the silverware.

No need for a pat down. Turnbull has made his money . In the banking system where its all about ripping investors off. Its nicely tucked away overseas now. So he's ok.

 

[Pessimistic]

Nice episode with coalition beeches bein beeechy about Mrs Shortens necklace

Really how low do they go?

 

[Ice-Wolf]

No need for a pat down. Turnbull has made his money . In the banking system where its all about ripping investors off. Its nicely tucked away overseas now. So he's ok.

Guys like Turnbull can never have enough money.

 

[Generalissimo]

Guys like Turnbull can never have enough money.

...of other people's money.

 

[Ice-Wolf]

...of other people's money.

That's how you get rich, using "other people's money" see: negative gearing.

 

[WCE1987]

http://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2017-...en-the-medicare-levy-increase-is-fair/8527338

Disability groups tell Bill Shorten the Medicare levy increase is fair


http://www.abc.net.au/news/story-st...levy-doesnt-go-far-enough/8525620?pfmredir=ms

Federal budget 2017: Why Scott Morrison's bank levy doesn't go far enough

 

[GreyCrow]

Imagine if Labor introduced a Mining Levy. The might still be in surplus and power