Opinion The 'Carlton related stuff that doesn't need it's own thread' thread

Arr0w

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When 1116SEN became what it is today in 2003, I was 14, and had a few things on my mind! Sounds like it could've been terrific, makes you wonder where it lost its way to the extent that it has.

Failing all else, I blame Kevin Bartlett.
You are a mere pup Gethelred, but you have nailed what the current media portrays
 

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Blue__Balls

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I'll listen to SEN post-match to get some "expert" opinions on how things played out.

Beyond that, it seems to be a bunch of morons getting paid to make shit up, and the occasional call from a drunken, rambling club supporter who just wants said "experts" to validate his theory on why De Goey is a better player than Clayton Oliver, or some such.

You know you're in trouble when the breakfast and drive hosts are basically jerking each other off on air, and the callers are inebriated or simple-minded fans with tunnel-vision who just want to be able to tell Barry at work that he's wrong and they're right.
 

jezzajay

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My biggest issue with commentary the way it has become is that we've legitimately lost the 'expert' commentator. We still have people who sit in that seat, whose resume reads that position, but these days it's ex players, ex coaches; people with names to make you sit up and listen, opinions to share, personalities to reckon with. You don't disagree with Malcolm Blight, or Leigh Matthews; you don't get into an argument with Jonathon Brown, Matthew Richardson, Luke Darcy, Bryan Taylor, Dermott Brereton. These roles used to be filled with people who knew the game like the back of their hand, who didn't need to reach to Gridiron or Basketball for a reference but could refer to something someone did in the VFA in the 40's or in the WAFL in the 60's to describe what was happening out there; they were not necessarily players, or commentators, but were lovers of the game, fascinated by it and privileged to call it. They were articulate fans, whose game knowledge could rival historians.

Those people have been shunted aside, for the people with the connections and the profile, and have instead either turned away or become the opinion merchants we so decry, because they're as determined as they ever were. You get muppets like this on the Roar, or in the Fairfax papers; their familiarity with the game is on the level as is their affection for it, but they've been subsumed by the industry they inhabit, so in their desire to be read/spoken about they join the ranks of the Healy's, the Robinson's, the Whateley's.

It is a shame that the best AFL journalist of the past 20 years is Caroline Wilson; not because she is unworthy of that appellation, but because she doesn't discuss the football!

There's a thing called the 'White-line Wireless' for cricket, where if there's an Australian game going on overseas that those of us without foxtel would like to follow, where those calling the game do not take themselves too seriously and have exceptional knowledge of the game. I wish that there was the equivalent to that for footy, provided it could bring the community feel of the game back to the sport. It's why Marngrook's the best footy show on air, makes it feel like it's entrenched in the community rather than an amorphous corporate blob whose best attribute is that it once resembled AFL.
Really could not have said it better :thumbsu:

What grinds my gears is when watching a station like Fox Footy...ads come on and all of a sudden you're watching a commercial aimed at hyping their commentators up... I honestly can't stand the majority of commentators we have to put up with and then you're watching these ad campaigns that simply strokes their egos. Does nothing for pushing the game but does what it can to push those that are behind the microphone or camera. Individuals that we have seen plenty of highlights from over the years in the game...and now have to watch ads glorifying what they are not good at - commentating.
I'm all for opinions...different views...etc...but I've had a gut full of who we are presented with.
And for the majority they are like sheep...they jump on someone like Rance and carry him through his career of the back of a couple of decent seasons to the point of brainwashing every nuffy into believing he's the best ever.
Commentators kill the game more for me more then the game itself!
 

BlueJet

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No I wouldn't - you are looking at 'numbers' - maybe I look at games differently - effectiveness. I'd be really happy if Murph halved his possessions and doubled his effectiveness - because he has been the playmaker and still considers himself to be - but the whole team needs to learn to spread the duties- especially with talented developing players like SPS/Fisher/Walsh on hand.

The more senior the player the higher the benchmark expectations for their role. No opposition player/coach has been fooled or worried about Murphy for years - they like him having possessions for good reason and players absolutely love running through him. Pretty obvious Marc is playing with bung shoulders....good on him for carrying on and helping the Club and its kids same accolades for Thomas and Simpson. Their collective contribution shouldn't be over stated though.
Or overlooked because some young players have shown some promise. ;)
 

james Dean

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Murphy gets a lot of disposals because players have been conditioned to give it to him and most of the time his execution has become a turnover. I dont like seeing it - but that is what I have been seeing - his disposal stats are not a positive for the team these days I am sorry to say.
So harsh on Murphy. He set the bar to an incredibly high standard in 2011 when he was arguably the best player in the league. He hasn't hit those same levels since but he is still consistent and a quality ball user. To say Walsh, who hasn't even debuted yet is already ahead of him is extremely disrespectful.
 

JustaBattler

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So harsh on Murphy. He set the bar to an incredibly high standard in 2011 when he was arguably the best player in the league. He hasn't hit those same levels since but he is still consistent and a quality ball user. To say Walsh, who hasn't even debuted yet is already ahead of him is extremely disrespectful.
No Murphy is and has been for quite a long time - a very ordinary ball user by hand often selling hospital passes to team mates and increasingly a very poor user by foot. Age gets everyone - he is just a lot slower than he used to be - and it shows because he can't find a way out of congestion like he used to. It is an age thing. No disrespect - I am just amazed at how well Walsh plays - better than any player drafted at Carlton in midfield i've seen in the last 20 years - so far.
 

Jabba73

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Murphy needs to get rid of the 20 metre kicks to a contest and look further upfield. He can accurately kick a ball 45+ but insists on trying to steer it instead, usually ends up floating to where the defender can impact the contest. The flat hard kicks over distance are so much better for his team mates.

The quick handball to a covered team mate to avoid being a target for the oncoming opponent are unworthy of a senior player who considers himself a leader. Take the hit or be more creative and look further afield for someone free. The kids shouldn’t be getting smashed to protect him or his disposal efficiency.

Fix those two things and most of the criticism will stop. Most understand he will never tackle with intent as his shoulders are beyond it, the rest of it is fixable.
 

bmaurizio

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Problem with Murphy is that his shoulders are cooked and he's probably a good hit away from retirement, and he knows it.

It's a shame as him at his best would be a massive bonus for us.

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Yup he was slammed into the ground by a Lions player much more matured bigger bodied Lions snipper .
It was a cowardly act to do on a young upcoming star of the AFL,
Murphy courageously continued the game. The Lions were pissed off Marc chose the Baggers as his future home. Has had reoccurring problems since that incident
 

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Arr0w

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Yup he was slammed into the ground by a Lions player much more matured bigger bodied Lions snipper .
It was a cowardly act to do on a young upcoming star of the AFL,
Murphy courageously continued the game. The Lions were pissed off Marc chose the Baggers as his future home. Has had reoccurring problems since that incident
Copeland
 

JustaBattler

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They were a nasty mob in their glory days they could also play football- even when they declined as a football power the nasty stayed - led by Brown. They made a point of giving to Murph every time we played them - little off ball punches, bumps as often as possible - Murphy has cooped more than a fair share of bashing over the years on top of his serious injuries. It all adds up and takes a toll. Always felt that Judd and Murph got very little chop out from team mates over the years.
 

Stamos

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The quick handball to a covered team mate to avoid being a target for the oncoming opponent are unworthy of a senior player who considers himself a leader. Take the hit or be more creative and look further afield for someone free. The kids shouldn’t be getting smashed to protect him or his disposal efficiency.
You do realise that handballing to a player who will be immediately tackled will result in a ball up due to no prior opportunity, rather than a free kick against if the player with the ball takes the hit, though right?

This is a team tactic to avoid a turnover, not Murphy being soft.

People just see the negatives that they want to see.
 

Jabba73

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You do realise that handballing to a player who will be immediately tackled will result in a ball up due to no prior opportunity, rather than a free kick against if the player with the ball takes the hit, though right?

This is a team tactic to avoid a turnover, not Murphy being soft.

People just see the negatives that they want to see.
If it was a team tactic then everyone would be doing it, can’t think of another player that does on a regular basis.
 

SkyhorseTamer

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If it was a team tactic then everyone would be doing it, can’t think of another player that does on a regular basis.
Just a counter point I feel worth raising, whether it has merit or not is probably up for debate, I think there's a distinct possibility Murphy plays with full trust in his teammates. The follow on effect of that is if he hears someone call for the ball they get it. We've got a lot of young guys who are still calling for the ball when they shouldn't, have their shoulders facing the wrong way and run into each other. I'm sure his skills have declined but I wouldn't be surprised if he's being made to look worse because he's simply responding to a call for the ball.

We try to coach don't call for it if you're covered, create a block or create space for someone else instead.
 

mediumsizered

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Have been watching the footy with the sound down for years...will only turn it up if there's an injury report...with all due respect to commentators I've been around footy for longer than most of them and know enough to make my own judgement....when they stopped adding value to the broadcast that was it for me..I can see what's going on, I can read stats etc etc.... don't need inane comments and calling the wrong players...don't need a commentator if I go to the ground why do we need them to watch the same thing on TV.....only time I listen to a commentator is if I can't watch and have to listen....that's my whinge for the day:)
I also do not have the volume on when watching our games on TV. The commentators only call what we can see with our own eyes anyway & their opinions are clouded by what is PC in the eyes of the AFL & the respective broadcasters.

I still can't get out of my mind a certain Fox Footy 'expert' doing the half time review of one of our games last season & putting up a graphic showing Plowman his opponent too much space. That would have been all good if Plowman was actually the player in the picture, or more importantly, was actually playing that day. It is this sort of ignorance of who the players are which is really annoying. These commentators are well paid for their efforts so therefore should be expected to actually know what they are talking about. Instead they are all competing to be the commentator who comes up with the best one-liner.
 

skadoosh

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You do realise that handballing to a player who will be immediately tackled will result in a ball up due to no prior opportunity, rather than a free kick against if the player with the ball takes the hit, though right?

This is a team tactic to avoid a turnover, not Murphy being soft.

People just see the negatives that they want to see.
You know how ridiculous this sounds?
 

Stamos

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If it was a team tactic then everyone would be doing it, can’t think of another player that does on a regular basis.
Then you’re not watching very closely. Happens in every game, by every team. For example Paul Roos has repeatedly called for them to change the prior opportunity rule to a ‘team prior opportunity’ to stop the tactic.
 

Jabba73

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My biggest issue with commentary the way it has become is that we've legitimately lost the 'expert' commentator. We still have people who sit in that seat, whose resume reads that position, but these days it's ex players, ex coaches; people with names to make you sit up and listen, opinions to share, personalities to reckon with. You don't disagree with Malcolm Blight, or Leigh Matthews; you don't get into an argument with Jonathon Brown, Matthew Richardson, Luke Darcy, Bryan Taylor, Dermott Brereton. These roles used to be filled with people who knew the game like the back of their hand, who didn't need to reach to Gridiron or Basketball for a reference but could refer to something someone did in the VFA in the 40's or in the WAFL in the 60's to describe what was happening out there; they were not necessarily players, or commentators, but were lovers of the game, fascinated by it and privileged to call it. They were articulate fans, whose game knowledge could rival historians.

Those people have been shunted aside, for the people with the connections and the profile, and have instead either turned away or become the opinion merchants we so decry, because they're as determined as they ever were. You get muppets like this on the Roar, or in the Fairfax papers; their familiarity with the game is on the level as is their affection for it, but they've been subsumed by the industry they inhabit, so in their desire to be read/spoken about they join the ranks of the Healy's, the Robinson's, the Whateley's.

It is a shame that the best AFL journalist of the past 20 years is Caroline Wilson; not because she is unworthy of that appellation, but because she doesn't discuss the football!

There's a thing called the 'White-line Wireless' for cricket, where if there's an Australian game going on overseas that those of us without foxtel would like to follow, where those calling the game do not take themselves too seriously and have exceptional knowledge of the game. I wish that there was the equivalent to that for footy, provided it could bring the community feel of the game back to the sport. It's why Marngrook's the best footy show on air, makes it feel like it's entrenched in the community rather than an amorphous corporate blob whose best attribute is that it once resembled AFL.
Thought it was the Blues style of play that was to blame for the drop in Friday night ratings last season?

Channel 7 certainly made a case for it so they didn’t have to look at their AGrade line up of BT, JB, Darce and Lingy with Duck on the special comments as a possible cause for people tuning out.

Scroll through the game day threads from last season and I have added #commentatorcalls to quotes of some of the most ridiculous things said during the coverage. There is plenty of material to work with.
 
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