The Perth Thread

[Scotland]

Why do you drive down Mounts Bay Rd instead of using Thomas St? Cos its more convenient. Same reason cyclists are using Mounts Bay Rd - its the most convenient route to where they are going. Not sure where these mythical cycle lanes are between UWA and the City.

You can dress up like Cadel Evans and ride in a group anywhere. There is no need to use MBR.

If you were a single cyclist riding from the GT to the city you'd just use the cycle path.

 

[kfc1]

Which roads would they be, pray tell?? Sometimes there is no other choice.

The freeway is a good start.

I often see cyclists riding down the 80kph Jandakot Rd, where there is almost no shoulder to speak of and certainly no bike path- and there are often aprons of loose gravel extending out from run off from driveways that lead down to Jandakot Rd. I must admit I get pissed off when the cyclists bunch up 3 across and cars can't get past because of double white lines.

If its double white lines and no shoulder you shouldn't be trying to squeeze past single file cyclists anyway - a lot of dumbarse drivers do so thats why cyclists ride defensively, including riding two abreast (never seen 3 across but a staggered formation might look like 3 across to an untrained eye) to discourage unsafe overtaking. If dumbarse davo in his ute screws up his overtake and has to take evasive action, its the cyclist that will be killed or seriously injured.

Other roads that can be too narrow include Burke Dr along the Swan River- which gets very busy on the weekends during footy and cricket season in particular, and The Esplanade in Mt Pleasant - and I suspect all other roads along the rivers have the same problem. There are far too many people out walking atm for these shared paths to work properly and it must frustrate cyclists to get stuck behind pedestrians as much as it frustrates drivers who get stuck behind cyclists on the way to and from work.

Burke Drive is a good example - its a very heavily used cycle route but every other road in the entire suburb is essentially devoid of cyclists. Plenty of alternatives if drivers don't want to share the roads.
And yes, cyclists trying to flog it on busy shared paths is dangerous so I'm quite happy the faster ones are on the road. Gotta ride and drive to the conditions.

 

[Scotland]

wut
do u get annoyed at sitting in traffic and rage at the other people who are not driving to/from work in the most direct route possible?

I get annoyed at people who make driving unnecessarily slower and/or more stressful than it needs to be.

 

[Kram]

Cyclists can get in the way a bit at time sure but I'd take that any day over the Johnny Office douchebags sitting in massive 4wds by themselves in peak hour city traffic.

 

[kfc1]

I get annoyed at people who make driving unnecessarily slower and/or more stressful than it needs to be.

Seems a bit pointless to me but most annoyances are.
Not sure I would enjoy driving while being annoyed that everyone else is using the road and they should all use another road so that I can drive unimpeded.

 

[kfc1]

You can dress up like Cadel Evans and ride in a group anywhere. There is no need to use MBR.

There's also no need for you to use MBR either - plenty of alternative routes around with various time penalties. Takes too long? Exactly why the cyclists use MBR.

If you were a single cyclist riding from the GT to the city you'd just use the cycle path.

Depends on your speed really. Uni students on upright bikes, yeah; lycra guys on roadbikes travelling at 30-50km/h, nah.

 

[Teriyakicat]

The freeway is a good start.



If its double white lines and no shoulder you shouldn't be trying to squeeze past single file cyclists anyway - a lot of dumbarse drivers do so thats why cyclists ride defensively, including riding two abreast (never seen 3 across but a staggered formation might look like 3 across to an untrained eye) to discourage unsafe overtaking. If dumbarse davo in his ute screws up his overtake and has to take evasive action, its the cyclist that will be killed or seriously injured.


Burke Drive is a good example - its a very heavily used cycle route but every other road in the entire suburb is essentially devoid of cyclists. Plenty of alternatives if drivers don't want to share the roads.
And yes, cyclists trying to flog it on busy shared paths is dangerous so I'm quite happy the faster ones are on the road. Gotta ride and drive to the conditions.

Ummm... the freeway only goes North South- or it did, the last time I looked

It isn't single file cyclists that are the problem on Jandakot Rd. There is enough room for them and a car to overtake safely- and you will find that many cars do slow down just in case. It's the 2 dozen cyclists who think they can ride fast, going at about 40kph 3 abreast, who are the pain. I have no problem slowing down to drive past them if they are single file- as I said, there is enough room if we are both careful. If it's a quiet day, there's no problem with them going 2 abreast if they could just pull in behind one another up the hills.

I can see both sides of the argument here- there are idiots on both sides and good drivers/cyclists on both sides. Hopefully, with the increased number of cyclists on the roads these days, the councils will be working harder to modify the roads to suit both modes of transport.

 

[Scotland]

There's also no need for you to use MBR either - plenty of alternative routes around with various time penalties. Takes too long? Exactly why the cyclists use MBR.

Cyclists use MBR because it's pretty flat and looks pretty. I use it to get from point A to point B. I could conceivably get off the Freeway at Hay St and take Thomas St and get back on to Stirling Hwy to get to where I need to get to in Nedlands but that would just add minutes to that journey so why would I bother? I don't do that drive for fun.

Depends on your speed really. Uni students on upright bikes, yeah; lycra guys on roadbikes travelling at 30-50km/h, nah.

Here's a thought. If the path is congested with pedestrians, slow down and go around them. You know, like cars have to when you decide to clog up the road doing 30 km/h.

 

[Scotland]

I can see both sides of the argument here- there are idiots on both sides and good drivers/cyclists on both sides. Hopefully, with the increased number of cyclists on the roads these days, the councils will be working harder to modify the roads to suit both modes of transport.

What, like putting in cycle paths adjacent to roads for cyclists to use on the off chance they don't feel like using the road that day?

You can modify the roads until the cows come home, but it's a lot harder to modify ingrained behaviours - and that applies to all road users.

 

[kfc1]

Cyclists use MBR because it's pretty flat and looks pretty. I use it to get from point A to point B. I could conceivably get off the Freeway at Hay St and take Thomas St and get back on to Stirling Hwy to get to where I need to get to in Nedlands but that would just add minutes to that journey so why would I bother? I don't do that drive for fun.

Cyclists aren't doing laps of MBR, they are using it to get from A to B as well. Trip purpose is irrelevant.

Here's a thought. If the path is congested with pedestrians, slow down and go around them. You know, like cars have to when you decide to clog up the road doing 30 km/h.

Or use a more convenient route which doesn't have that issue, which they do.

 

[kfc1]

What, like putting in cycle paths adjacent to roads for cyclists to use on the off chance they don't feel like using the road that day?
You can modify the roads until the cows come home, but it's a lot harder to modify ingrained behaviours - and that applies to all road users.

Shared paths are not suitable for the type of rider that you are whinging about so they are not going to be used. Good quality cycle lanes will be used.

 

[Scotland]

Cyclists aren't doing laps of MBR, they are using it to get from A to B as well. Trip purpose is irrelevant.

So groups of dickheads in lycra all riding at once along MBR can't possibly ride anywhere else? They all have a pressing engagement somewhere between Nedlands and the city? Please.

Shared paths are not suitable for the type of rider that you are whinging about so they are not going to be used. Good quality cycle lanes will be used.

And what is a "proper" cycle lane? A few metres across so you can ride 5 abreast?

 

[kfc1]

So groups of dickheads in lycra all riding at once along MBR can't possibly ride anywhere else? They all have a pressing engagement somewhere between Nedlands and the city? Please.

Trip purpose is irrelevant. The quickest and shortest route from the Narrows/CBD to Nedlands is via MBR, that's why you use it and that's why they use it.

And what is a "proper" cycle lane? A few metres across so you can ride 5 abreast?

On-road, minimum 1.5m wide (wider in higher speed zones), priority across intersections as general traffic lanes do, actually continuous and not disappearing at conflict points, doesn't have parked cars in it and isn't covered in debris. Pretty much what a general traffic lane is like, just not as wide.

 

[Teriyakicat]

What, like putting in cycle paths adjacent to roads for cyclists to use on the off chance they don't feel like using the road that day?

You can modify the roads until the cows come home, but it's a lot harder to modify ingrained behaviours - and that applies to all road users.

There are a fair few cycle paths being marked in on existing wider roads, narrowing those roads -I can think of a few offhand in the Leeming-Winthrop area. There's a pretty good network of cycle paths around, it's just that it's difficult to match them in with existing busy roads like MBR, which is why the road planning mobs opted to use a shared cycle/walking path, I'd think.

 

[Teriyakicat]

So groups of dickheads in lycra all riding at once along MBR can't possibly ride anywhere else? They all have a pressing engagement somewhere between Nedlands and the city? Please.

And what is a "proper" cycle lane? A few metres across so you can ride 5 abreast?

Don't worry- the way things are going, pretty soon the whole city will be blocked off to cars and the cyclists will have a free reign

 

[kfc1]

There are a fair few cycle paths being marked in on existing wider roads, narrowing those roads -I can think of a few offhand in the Leeming-Winthrop area.

Most of which are half-assed jobs, done for the purpose of traffic calming, not providing a useable cycling facility. I have ridden down Farrington Road before and it is a joke - that's a good example of a road which was 'traffic calmed' after Roe Hwy opened and the cycling facilities are an after-thought.

 

[kfc1]

Scotland, seeing as you have plenty of time on your hands, keep a record of how many seconds you are delayed by cyclists over the next week and report back. Also keep a record of how many seconds you are delayed by another motorised vehicle over the next week for comparison.

 

[Teriyakicat]

Most of which are half-assed jobs, done for the purpose of traffic calming, not providing a useable cycling facility. I have ridden down Farrington Road before and it is a joke - that's a good example of a road which was 'traffic calmed' after Roe Hwy opened and the cycling facilities are an after-thought.

They pinch out now and then and sometimes go up on a footpath. Farrington Rd was better as a 2 lane 60kph road, IMO. It's a pain in the butt now.

 

[kfc1]

They pinch out now and then and sometimes go up on a footpath. Farrington Rd was better as a 2 lane 60kph road, IMO. It's a pain in the butt now.

Yep in the 1.5km between the freeway and Karel Ave, cyclists are forced 4 times either into the traffic lane or up onto a footpath they can't legally cycle on to then give way to all vehicles. Ridiculous.

 

[Teriyakicat]

Yep in the 1.5km between the freeway and Karel Ave, cyclists are forced 4 times either into the traffic lane or up onto a footpath they can't legally cycle on to then give way to all vehicles. Ridiculous.

If it had been left as 2 lanes, the cyclists could've easily ridden in the left lane and the cars swap lanes around them.
One of the problems in that area, though, was the amount of cars that sped down the street. When we first moved to Perth, a cop came knocking on my door to borrow my phone (pre-mobile days) one afternoon, just before school was about to be let out. Some dickhead had been roaring down the road at 140kpm and the cop, who happened to be off duty but driving past, managed to get him to pull over and they ended up outside my place, in the street behind Farrington Rd. The cop was livid and wanted to call for the bloke to be picked up but they both calmed down and he ended up letting the bloke drive his car home.
Couldn't do that these days. He'd have had his car impounded. Idiot! Having the roundabouts as well, helps slow the hoons down a bit.

 

[kfc1]

If it had been left as 2 lanes, the cyclists could've easily ridden in the left lane and the cars swap lanes around them.

Unless you're Scotland

 

[Teriyakicat]

Unless you're Scotland

nasty!!

I'm sure he'd be happy with that. Unless he prefers playing skittles

 

[kfc1]

nasty!!

I'm sure he'd be happy with that. Unless he prefers playing skittles

nah Scotland isn't that bad, I'm assuming he doesn't go "punishment passing" cyclists or road raging etc., he just likes a vent on a forum like most of us. The real issue is the morons who think not liking cyclists gives them the right to attempt to injure or kill another road user, or the morons who are so blissfully unaware of their incompetence or the dangers of driving that they cause crashes.

 

[Teriyakicat]

nah Scotland isn't that bad, I'm assuming he doesn't go "punishment passing" cyclists or road raging etc., he just likes a vent on a forum like most of us. The real issue is the morons who think not liking cyclists gives them the right to attempt to injure or kill another road user, or the morons who are so blissfully unaware of their incompetence or the dangers of driving that they cause crashes.

You mean like the bloke in the news recently?? Was that you, Scotland ??

Don't get me started on motorbikes...

 

[Stronzo]

Lets all lay off Scotland, he makes some valid points and is probably a fair reflection on most driver's attitude towards cyclists.

The point we can all agree on is most of the cycle paths around perth are inadequate and this causes frustration with all road users.