The Ultimate Hawthorn vs Richmond Poll

[Johnny_Segment]

It seems as though the whole site is just filled with Hawthorn and Richmond supporters arguing over who is the better side. We have seen countless threads regarding every facet of both clubs. In an attempt to settle this once and for all, I offer the following for your voting.

If you had to allign yourself with either Richmond or Hawthorn, who would it be? Imagine you are to be drafted and must choose between the two, or you have been offered the coaching job of either of them. I don't care how you do it, as long as it helps you to decide, use it. Consider the likes of:

• On field talent
• Chances of success
• Club history
• Club culture
• Facilities
• Chances of survival
• Coaching staff
• Leadership
• Club ideals
• How the club is perceived in the public eye
• Off field issues
• Future talent
• Treatment of fans
• etc. etc.

Basically, use whatever method or criteria you want to come to a conclusion on which club you would rather be a part of.

 

[KnockOut]

I really can't decide. I had hawthorn by a street until it came down to 'survival'. Much better playing list and a better chance of premiership success but a Tasmanian move in almost inevitable.

Undecided, someone enlighten me.

 

[Philhawk]

I really can't decide. I had hawthorn by a street until it came down to 'survival'. Much better playing list and a better chance of premiership success but a Tasmanian move in almost inevitable.

Undecided, someone enlighten me.

Chances of survival?

That's a funny one considering we've had the second most members of any club sign up since the beginning of the season.

 

[Hawkk]

I really can't decide. I had hawthorn by a street until it came down to 'survival'. Much better playing list and a better chance of premiership success but a Tasmanian move in almost inevitable.

Undecided, someone enlighten me.

Ignorance

Nothing in the decision to play games in Tasmania - we are contracted by Mirvac to stay at Waverley for at least the next 20 years - before we own it and realise its asset worth.

Its inevitable that Tasmania doesn’t have the infrastructure to support a professional side both now and certainly in 20 years time…

• On field talent

• 
  
  In terms of youngsters Hawthorn has the points, overall it'll be interesting to see if we have the legs to last up to round 15 when we play the Tigers.
  
  Richmond rely heavily on their senior players to win them games - Brown, Richo etc. while Hawthorn rely almost exclusively on a brigade of under 24's to win them games.
  
  The big test for Richmond will come when Richo retires AND Brown is out of the side. When this occurs we'll have a much better indication where Richmond sit on field talent wise without their war horse
  
  

  [*]Chances of success

  
  To early to tell yet, at this stage I'd say the Hawks are in front.
  
  Both clubs won't win any serious silverware for another 2-3 years at least...
  
  

  [*]Club history

  
  Richmond...
  
  

  [*]Club culture

  
  One club has been terrible for 15 years the other has been abysmal for 25 years...
  
  

  [*]Facilities

  
  Waverley Park >>>> Punt Road
  
  

  [*]Chances of survival

  
  I don’t think either clubs medium term survival is in any great threat.
  
  Hawthorn are in a much stronger position financially – and now alongside Collingwood have the largest football department out of the 10 Victorian clubs, while Richmond’s finances are improving after being on the skids during various stages over the past 20 years.
  
  Hawthorn has an excellent chance to continue growing its support and member base in both the East and SE of Melbourne and Tasmania, while Richmond already have a strong existing support base.
  
  

  [*]Coaching staff

  
  Coaching ability - Wallace probably has it over Clarkson, baring in mind he is also on probably on a salary 3 times the worth of Clarkson's
  
  I'm not sure who the RFC assistant coaches are, but the Hawks assistant coaching staff (on the whole) are very inexperienced
  
  

  [*]Leadership

  
  Kennett >>>> March
  
  

  [*]Off field issues

  
  Both face the same problems - there are too many clubs in Melbourne and thus are eating away at the corporate dollar.
  
  Both sides would benefit from a reduction in the number of Victorian based sides - both administrations would testify to that
  
  

  [*]Future talent

  
  ATM I'd say Hawthorn - albeit without knowing much about Richmond's stocks
  
  Purely on the provision that the vast majority of our '05 and '06 selections are untapped, taken with high picks and rated highly by drafting experts...

 

[NitWit]

Geelong > Hawthorn and Richmond combined

 

[Mitchell Madness]

Geelong > Hawthorn and Richmond combined

we heard that last year as well, and then you got flogged by both Hawthorn and Richmond!

 

[lids2004roar]

Garry Lyon's article didn't help public perception. Hawthorn are clearly the favourites atm.

Look at this from the article.

Roughead gets dropped and kicks 8 in the reserves and gets called a "very good player for the future".

Cleve Hughes is claimed to be a dud after 1 year in the system.

Cleve Hughes today kicks 5 goals and in the best at VFL seniors (a level up from reserves).

Jay Schulz doesn't get a mention despite being 21yo (Roughead 20) and going by VFL games (which Garry likes to do) last year Schulz kicked 6 goals 3 weeks in a row at VFL senior level.

This is just one of many examples where Garry Lyon is shown to be a biased man-bear-pig. He thinks Hawthorn's talent is vastly superior to Richmond's "lacklustre" youngsters when in REALITY it is very close between the two clubs.

Richmond and Hawthorn are relatively even talent wise in my eyes and to anyone else who seriously looks at the lists for themselves and the turnover of talent.

 

[raskolnikov]

I hate Hawthorn with a passion but....

Hawthorn>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Richmond

 

[A Living God]

A grand total of 2 non richmond supporters have voted richmond

 

[TigerGlory]

Yeah we are getting killed.

But its purely based on the performances this year, and not on a proper look at our talent i'd bet

 

[Jonathan]

Richmond and Hawthorn are relatively even talent wise in my eyes and to anyone else who seriously looks at the lists for themselves and the turnover of talent.

You've gotta be kidding if you think Richmond has as much talent as Hawthorn. You guys might have a couple of good young players but Hawthorn would have the deepest young talent in the AFL. Richmonds going nowhere buddy, Hawthorn>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Shitmond.

 

[lids2004roar]

You've gotta be kidding if you think Richmond has as much talent as Hawthorn. You guys might have a couple of good young players but Hawthorn would have the deepest young talent in the AFL. Richmonds going nowhere buddy, Hawthorn>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Shitmond.

Okay now, wipe the froth from your mouth. There we go

We have both turned over the same number of players in the last 3 years, it comes down to a little bit of luck now as to which players turn out the best.

Oh woops, that's too rational.

HawFoRn!!1!one!!! RulZZZZZZZ!!!! MAN!

 

[OneEyedHawk]

Look at this from the article.

Roughead gets dropped and kicks 8 in the reserves and gets called a "very good player for the future".

Cleve Hughes is claimed to be a dud after 1 year in the system.

Cleve Hughes today kicks 5 goals and in the best at VFL seniors (a level up from reserves).

Misleading. As always. Hughes was never called a dud, stop making sh** up.
He said Tiger fans want to know if he'll hold down a KP spot in the future, never even queried his ability.

Jay Schulz doesn't get a mention despite being 21yo (Roughead 20) and going by VFL games (which Garry likes to do) last year Schulz kicked 6 goals 3 weeks in a row at VFL senior level. .

Roughead turned 20 four weeks ago, Schulz is 22.

This is just one of many examples where Garry Lyon is shown to be a biased man-bear-pig. He thinks Hawthorn's talent is vastly superior to Richmond's "lacklustre" youngsters when in REALITY it is very close between the two clubs.

Richmond and Hawthorn are relatively even talent wise in my eyes and to anyone else who seriously looks at the lists for themselves and the turnover of talent.

Please never, ever call anyone else biased.

 

[HBK619]

You've gotta be kidding if you think Richmond has as much talent as Hawthorn. You guys might have a couple of good young players but Hawthorn would have the deepest young talent in the AFL. Richmonds going nowhere buddy, Hawthorn>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Shitmond.

Easy to get young talent when you tank to get good draft picks, unlike your team the last two years Richmond have been trying to win games, thus the reason we have finished higher than Hawthorn in the past 2 years.

 

[tazhawk]

Geelong > Hawthorn and Richmond combined

I guess that is why your nickname is .......................NitWit.

 

[keefriffhard]

Easy to get young talent when you tank to get good draft picks, unlike your team the last two years Richmond have been trying to win games, thus the reason we have finished higher than Hawthorn in the past 2 years.

Utterly commendable.....

This is why we will see ranting on all forms of media when Richmond again finish ninth this year.

Hawthorn's tough decision of taking medium term pain for us supporters by trading older players and playing our kids has seen us have a great run at the selection table. Which undoubtably is the best way to rebuild a poor list these days. Unless you have a list you think can take you all the way within a couple of years there is no point in finishing mid-table and drafting recycled senior players. And I can't see the Tigers challenging West Coast in September any earlier than the 2011 date thrown up by your coach this year.

Looking at the group of youngsters we still have yet to break into the side is very exciting. Great few years ahead at Waverley.

Can you honestly say the Tigers are in the same situation? The reason that it will always be a harder proposition for any Richmond coach to consistantly play his youngsters and not be afraid to finish near the bottom of the ladder to get some good drafts is the feral attitude of some Tiger supporters who would publicly tear up memberships and call for his head. Even a proud club such as Carlton has realised that the only way to rebuild a team from the ground up causes a lot of anguish, but ultimately a greater reward. The Wooden Spoon no longer holds the same stigma as it once did. The reverse side is picking up players like Bryce Gibbs.

 

[lids2004roar]

He said Tiger fans want to know if he'll hold down a KP spot in the future, never even queried his ability.

...and Hawk fans DON'T want to know if Rug-head can hold a KP spot down in the future?

There's no doubt all the Hawk kids will be guns, I forgot. Richmond will be lucky to get more than just Deledio (who has been overtaken by the brilliant rookie Young, apparently )

If you don't think this article is flattering to the Hawks then you're thinking with your emotions which all supporters can do, but don't come on here and tell us why it is perfectly true than all your kids are blue chip talent and Richmond's have doubts.

 

[Jonathan]

Easy to get young talent when you tank to get good draft picks, unlike your team the last two years Richmond have been trying to win games, thus the reason we have finished higher than Hawthorn in the past 2 years.

You won't finish higher than us this year though will you.

 

[Roddy]

We've already won more games than the Tiges are likely to win this year....

 

[lids2004roar]

We've already won more games than the Tiges are likely to win this year....

The same thing happened last year

I hate Hawthorn as much as any club, if they finish above us this year then yes I will be disappointed. It is looking likely atm, but neither team will win the flag for a while so what does it matter?

 

[Phil McCreviss]

The same thing happened last year

I hate Hawthorn as much as any club, if they finish above us this year then yes I will be disappointed. It is looking likely atm, but neither team will win the flag for a while so what does it matter?

Yeah but the same thing has been happening at your club since Kevin Bartlett had hair. Its been 27 years. Dont you get it? In that time we have won 5 premierships. Loser culture breeds loser players breeds loser coaches (enter Wallet).

Anyway here is a stat for you. 0-4 v 3-1.

End of thread.

 

[lids2004roar]

Yeah but the same thing has been happening at your club since Kevin Bartlett had hair. Its been 27 years. Dont you get it? In that time we have won 5 premierships. Loser culture breeds loser players breeds loser coaches (enter Wallet).

Anyway here is a stat for you. 0-4 v 3-1.

End of thread.

So you breed a winning culture..... yet Wallace has a losing culture

lol idiot, you bred him!

 

[ShanBoi]

why is a move to tassie inevitable??

Hello.... we are the second richest victorian club if you take assets into account. I would be more worried if i were the doggies or kangas. Just because we play 4/22 games a year in launceston... Idiots!

 

[Phil McCreviss]

So you breed a winning culture..... yet Wallace has a losing culture

lol idiot, you bred him!

And you hired him!

Wallace was never a gun player at Hawthorn. He was just lucky to have played with one of the all time great teams. Right place right time.

But who really cares? At the end of the day look at the ladder. We are playing schoolkids and they are cr**ping all over your rabble. Keep paying the big bucks to your coach....another superior managerial decision by the Richmond board.

 

[Roddy]

And you hired him!

Wallace was never a gun player at Hawthorn. He was just lucky to have played with one of the all time great teams. Right place right time.

But who really cares? At the end of the day look at the ladder. We are playing schoolkids and they are cr**ping all over your rabble. Keep paying the big bucks to your coach....another superior managerial decision by the Richmond board.

Disagree. He was our most prolific possession winner right through the early to mid 80s. Definitely a gun.

As a coach, on the other hand.....