Game Day Trade and draft period games (Machiavellian plots, palace intrigue, and tin foil hat theories)

[76woodenspooners]

Sam McClure insists that he was told by a reliable Essendon source that they made enquires about Mason Cox. Essendon denies it. Sam McClure is sticking by his story, appearing confused why Essendon would leak him something only to deny it.

But he points out that earlier in the year Essendon told him to walk back the Daniher-going-to-Sydney story because he was embarrassing himself ...

... only to end up being vindicated.

Us footy fans often bash jouno’s for making s**t up ...

... let’s not be so naive to think that our beloved footy clubs with their idolised footy players represented by their saintly managers engage in simple and fair and reasonable negotiations whilst the darstardly evil journo’s stir the pot.

There’s a lot at stake, and history has shown that clubs and player managers will do whatever they need to do to advance the interests of them or their clients - clandestine meetings, leaking to the media, not turning up to B&F nights, vigorously denying rumours that turn out to be true.

What are the games that are being played this trade period??

 

[Pragmatic Shill]

Cox's manager has confirmed this morning that Essendon and Collingwood did have conversations about Cox as well. The real game being played here is between media outlets, as Barrett spoke about this morning. Less than two hours after Gleeson and McClure run with their story, out comes Mark Stevens at Ch7 and Glenn Macfarlane at the Hun to run with the counter-story.

A lot of people seem really confused about the whole situation and have misinterpreted the original story. Gleeson/McClure said Essendon approached Collingwood about Mason Cox. Not once did they say that Cox's manager or Cox himself had been approached about a trade. Because that never happened. It was entirely a conversation between two clubs.

And reading between the lines of what Cox's manager said this morning, he said Collingwood never put Cox on the trade table. Which means Essendon approached us first. Now, we probably considered it as a salary dump, I totally buy that part.

 

[jimmy35]

Dominoes

 

[TradeDraft]

Trade Period been so Boring they are Trying to Make Things Up

 

[Pragmatic Shill]

Trade Period been so Boring they are Trying to Make Things Up

Except no one made anything up Dave, except Dodoro protesting too much about the story.

 

[Baltimore Jack]

Our TPP is so tight, we:
* Can't get any 'named' players in
* Won't be able to afford DeGoey, Moore and Grundy
* Will need to trade players out to elevate the tight cap

On each occasion this scenario is put the question is inevitably asked "If that is the case what is our TPP?"

On no occasion has that question been answered, so how are the three points above arrived at, what criterion is used?

 

[Quicky]

Do you think that maybe the Pies are leaking the salary cap issues themselves to help with negotiating contracts internally?

I reckon this post deserves a run in this thread. Ned Guy did come from the other side of the fence so might have kept a few of his player manager tricks up his sleeve...

 

[Alexander323bc]

I reckon this post deserves a run in this thread. Ned Guy did come from the other side of the fence so might have kept a few of his player manager tricks up his sleeve...

We were going after Lynch on a $1m per year. Just doesn’t add up to me. We also have lots of players that are close to retirement or fringe on more money than rookies when a rookie would offer better value. So I just dont believe that we are in such a dire position as the media would suggest. So what’s the alternative? Who wins from that narrative? Ned Guy that’s who. It gives him the narrative to go in negotiating a discount.

 

[Baltimore Jack]

We were going after Lynch on a $1m per year. Just doesn’t add up to me. We also have lots of players that are close to retirement or fringe on more money than rookies when a rookie would offer better value. So I just dont believe that we are in such a dire position as the media would suggest. So what’s the alternative? Who wins from that narrative? Ned Guy that’s who. It gives him the narrative to go in negotiating a discount.

And it was reported that as the decision by Lynch got close, we increased our offer to him (the Blairgowrie visit)

 

[76woodenspooners]

Reposted from another thread. Also relevant to this topic ...

(1) Trading isn’t just about value to you, it’s also about value to who you’re trading with. If you’re driving around a desert in a water truck and you come across a thirsty man, do you sell him water for the value that it has to you, or the value that it has to him? That’s also a question of ethics and survival, so let’s get back to the cut throat world of AFL trading ...

(2) The AFL is a closed market of 18 competitive entities. When a team trades they are striving to make themselves better than the opposition which they can do by either (a) trading to make themselves stronger or (b) trading to make the opposition weaker or (c) a combination of a and b. Wells made the point over the recent Kelly trade ... why would Geelong willingly let Kelly go to a fellow Premiership contender? Geelong’s hefty compensation for Kelly wasn’t just about making Geelong stronger, but it was also about making WCE weaker. Alex Ferguson in principle didn’t like trading with other clubs at the top of the EPL.

 

[Snake_Baker]

This one didn't even last a day.

October 10: North have offered De Goey a 7 year contract - Tony Sheahan
October 11: North have not even approached me regarding De Goey - De Goey's manager


Spare a thought for North, we have to deal with this crap half a dozen times every trade period.

 

[ExcitementMachine]

Reposted from another thread. Also relevant to this topic ...

(1) Trading isn’t just about value to you, it’s also about value to who you’re trading with. If you’re driving around a desert in a water truck and you come across a thirsty man, do you sell him water for the value that it has to you, or the value that it has to him? That’s also a question of ethics and survival, so let’s get back to the cut throat world of AFL trading ...

(2) The AFL is a closed market of 18 competitive entities. When a team trades they are striving to make themselves better than the opposition which they can do by either (a) trading to make themselves stronger or (b) trading to make the opposition weaker or (c) a combination of a and b. Wells made the point over the recent Kelly trade ... why would Geelong willingly let Kelly go to a fellow Premiership contender? Geelong’s hefty compensation for Kelly wasn’t just about making Geelong stronger, but it was also about making WCE weaker. Alex Ferguson in principle didn’t like trading with other clubs at the top of the EPL.

That's a well thought out post, who's the author?

 

[76woodenspooners]

That's a well thought out post, who's the author?

Opinion - Trading Scott Pendlebury - the case for and against?

Ah yes, thanks, that’s another one. Geelong’s Premiership chances in 2011 weren’t harmed by GAJ going to Suns. GAJ went to Suns as a 26 year old highly talented marquee player. Sure, he could and would have reasonably been a healthy role model, and maybe on a scale of Dane Swan to Scott...

www.bigfooty.com

 

[The hyphon]

Rumour is that Charlie Dixon has toured the Holden Centre
A fit Charllie Dixon is exactely what we need but needs to overcome his injuries.May be out of favour at Port

maybe that's why we are tryng to trade into the first round.If we have no luck we alwys can trade off next year;s first round.Heard next years crop doesnt bat that deep...Can anyone confirm the rumour ?

 

[left at home]

Rumour is that Charlie Dixon has toured the Holden Centre
A fit Charllie Dixon is exactely what we need but needs to overcome his injuries.May be out of favour at Port

maybe that's why we are tryng to trade into the first round.If we have no luck we alwys can trade off next year;s first round.Heard next years crop doesnt bat that deep...Can anyone confirm the rumour ?

The contract he would be on and what port would want in return, won’t happen if true, which l seriously doubt it

 

[jackcass]

Sam McClure insists that he was told by a reliable Essendon source that they made enquires about Mason Cox. Essendon denies it. Sam McClure is sticking by his story, appearing confused why Essendon would leak him something only to deny it.

But he points out that earlier in the year Essendon told him to walk back the Daniher-going-to-Sydney story because he was embarrassing himself ...

... only to end up being vindicated.

Us footy fans often bash jouno’s for making s**t up ...

... let’s not be so naive to think that our beloved footy clubs with their idolised footy players represented by their saintly managers engage in simple and fair and reasonable negotiations whilst the darstardly evil journo’s stir the pot.

There’s a lot at stake, and history has shown that clubs and player managers will do whatever they need to do to advance the interests of them or their clients - clandestine meetings, leaking to the media, not turning up to B&F nights, vigorously denying rumours that turn out to be true.

What are the games that are being played this trade period??

Maybe a site like footywire could run a journo's sub-page and monitor their hot tip accuracy % so we'd know how to weight their offerings.

 

[TKiL]

(1) Trading isn’t just about value to you, it’s also about value to who you’re trading with. If you’re driving around a desert in a water truck and you come across a thirsty man, do you sell him water for the value that it has to you, or the value that it has to him? That’s also a question of ethics and survival, so let’s get back to the cut throat world of AFL trading ...

nice - did you study comparative and absolute advantage by any chance?

 

[TKiL]

Rumour is that Charlie Dixon has toured the Holden Centre

Lots of rumours about who's toured where...

The AFL has a tour bus which players / managers can charter for a small fee.

It's designed to provide anonymity and protect all parties' interests during what's often referred to as "trade period", but is better referred to as "another timeslot the AFL uses to stamp its footprint all over everything".

 

[76woodenspooners]

nice - did you study comparative and absolute advantage by any chance?

No. But thanks for the search terms!

 

[sr36]

I reckon this post deserves a run in this thread. Ned Guy did come from the other side of the fence so might have kept a few of his player manager tricks up his sleeve...

I hope that the theory of us leaking cap issues to help with negotiations has no truth to it. It'd be a stupidly high risk strategy. If players and managers were to learn about it, it would backfire horribly. The club would lose internal credibility and be disadvantaged in future negotiations.

 

[TKiL]

No. But thanks for the search terms!

you're welcome - I'm here to help

 

[Alexander323bc]

I hope that the theory of us leaking cap issues to help with negotiations has no truth to it. It'd be a stupidly high risk strategy. If players and managers were to learn about it, it would backfire horribly. The club would lose internal credibility and be disadvantaged in future negotiations.

You are assuming that they are also lying internally which they may not be. It could simply be a tactic to force players who are overpaid to consider looking elsewhere so that they approach the club to be traded rather than the club tapping players on the shoulder and asking them to look elsewhere.
Hey we have a salary cap pressure and we are not sure we can offer you the same amount of money come your next contract. We would love you to stay but we see you here $300k not here $500k. Player chooses to leave. Nothing untoward in that. Part of doing business. It helps when the media also confirms that we can’t offer players same money.

 

[sr36]

You are assuming that they are also lying internally which they may not be. It could simply be a tactic to force players who are overpaid to consider looking elsewhere so that they approach the club to be traded rather than the club tapping players on the shoulder and asking them to look elsewhere.
Hey we have a salary cap pressure and we are not sure we can offer you the same amount of money come your next contract. We would love you to stay but we see you here $300k not here $500k. Player chooses to leave. Nothing untoward in that. Part of doing business. It helps when the media also confirms that we can’t offer players same money.

True. Losing one or two this year so those getting greedy see and feel the consequences to their mates could also be a part of the strategy, I suppose
Its an ugly game though. Would piss me off.

 

[Alexander323bc]

True. Losing one or two this year so those getting greedy see and feel the consequences to their mates could also be a part of the strategy, I suppose
Its an ugly game though. Would piss me off.

It’s cut throat actually. But at the same time it doesn’t have to be. I tell my team that the moment they get bored or they don’t feel challenged to tell me and I’ll help them get the next job. We could be doing the same with Aish. It could be a stint to prolong his career in the afl.

 

[Robroy22]

Lewis Taylor surplus to needs @ Brisbane....media...nothing said except he'll be traded to Sydney
Sam Frost no longer necessary @ Melbourne.....media...nothing said except he'll be traded to Hawthorn (aren't Hawthorn Great?)
Sam Menegola offered up by Geelong....media.....would be a good pick up for Freo, great trading by Stephen Wells!
Ellis / Butler/ Menadue (et al) all moved on by the Tiges.....media.....nothing to see here!
Patton dumped by the AFL's own side GWS.....media.....Hawthorn strikes again!!! (They are super great those Hawks)

Aish / Wills / Shaz encouraged to look elsewhere by the Pies.....media....MELTDOWN "Pies in CAP explosion"

am I only seeing this thing from a one sided perspective?????