Society/Culture Why I blame Islam for the fact it's raining today....

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More informed than yours.

They are not afraid to point out shitty kids or parents, but the idea that the next generation is dumber than yours is as old as time and not borne out in reality.
No-one said DUMBER, what we are saying is poorly educated in the basics of numeracy and literacy.
I challenge you to attend one of your five family members schools and ask five 15 yr old students the 9 times table.
 

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More informed than yours.

They are not afraid to point out shitty kids or parents, but the idea that the next generation is dumber than yours is as old as time and not borne out in reality.
The next generation isn’t necessarily dumber, just deficient in key skills after enormous investment in them through education.

If you spend 13 years in education and can’t spell basic words something has gone wrong. Parents (and taxpayers) aren’t getting bang for their buck.
 

Malifice

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The next generation isn’t necessarily dumber, just deficient in key skills after enormous investment in them through education.

If you spend 13 years in education and can’t spell basic words something has gone wrong. Parents (and taxpayers) aren’t getting bang for their buck.
How is teaching kids gender equality and tolerance getting in the way of math and spelling?

Any reason we cant do both?
 

JackOutback

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No-one said DUMBER, what we are saying is poorly educated in the basics of numeracy and literacy.
I challenge you to attend one of your five family members schools and ask five 15 yr old students the 9 times table.
My six-year-old does his 9 times tables. My brother's 15-year-old is in the advanced mathematics class (he's a maths teacher and some of his kids would confuse the shit out of you with what they know). Your anecdotes do not equal evidence. Yes, there are people that don't have university level maths or English, and at the risk of insulting your profession, would be more attracted to working on a farm. That doesn't equate to a whole generation being poorly educated.
 

Malifice

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Wut?

You're talking literally about a single unit (among dozens like language, PE, maths, science, art, technical skills like woodworking etc, home economics, geography, english, religion etc) that would take up all of a single 1 hour lesson per week for no more than a few semesters.

Safe Schools (for example) only ran coursework in years 7 and 8, and was literally one 45 minute lesson per week. Resource wise it got a fraction of the resources of the other faculties.

What do you think High schools do? Run gender diversity and 'how to be a decent person and not be a nasty piece of shit' courses for hours of each day over all of High School?

Is there a reason why we cant pump more funding into Maths and English, while also teaching our kids to be decent human beings?
 
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Your anecdotes do not equal evidence.
But yours obviously do.:drunk::drunk::drunk:
I'm a father of a 28, 21 and 18 yr old and have seen their individual skill levels over the years plummet dramatically. Plus have been employing, or been in the employment of, many, many youngsters over decades and can also see, quite clearly, the skill in basic math and literacy declining rapidly.
But hey, what would i know?
Thanks for the farm analogy that paints us all us uneducated hicks.
Very few of us under 40 have much less than a Bachelor degree. Most from 40-55 have at least a Diploma level.
 
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Yeah, but I feel like that's a seperate issue. Lets increase the funding for Maths and English, and fix the cirriculum.
I can live with that.
The current curriculum needs standardising across the nation first, because so many families move interstate, and a bigger focus on basic life skills. There is plenty of room for the rest.
 

Malifice

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I can live with that.
The current curriculum needs standardising across the nation first, because so many families move interstate, and a bigger focus on basic life skills. There is plenty of room for the rest.
Your issue then is with the Federal system.

It creates supid things like HSC/ VCE, different cirriculums, high school starting varying from year 7 to year 8 and so forth.

So many areas of law would be so much better off under Federal jurisdiction and not State jurisdiction.

Education and Health are the two main ones that spring to mind. Firearms and Criminal law also.
 

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Wut?

You're talking literally about a single unit (among dozens like language, PE, maths, science, art, technical skills like woodworking etc, home economics, geography, english, religion etc) that would take up all of a single 1 hour lesson per week for no more than a few semesters.

Safe Schools (for example) only ran coursework in years 7 and 8, and was literally one 45 minute lesson per week. Resource wise it got a fraction of the resources of the other faculties.

What do you think High schools do? Run gender diversity and 'how to be a decent person and not be a nasty piece of shit' courses for hours of each day over all of High School?

Is there a reason why we cant pump more funding into Maths and English, while also teaching our kids to be decent human beings?
Time and resources.

The whole "why can't we do both" applies to many things. There's an expectation that schools teach kids about consent, how to be a good person, gender and sexual diversity, indigenous history, indigenous language, say no to drugs, personal health and hygiene etc. All these in the name of "teaching our kids to be decent human beings".

At some point you're no longer doing both.
 

Malifice

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Time and resources.

The whole "why can't we do both" applies to many things. There's an expectation that schools teach kids about consent, how to be a good person, gender and sexual diversity, indigenous history, indigenous language, say no to drugs, personal health and hygiene etc. All these in the name of "teaching our kids to be decent human beings".

At some point you're no longer doing both.
And how much time in the curriculum is dedicated to doing that?

Find me a State in Oz that devotes more than say 1 hour a week towards those issues over a 6 year High school degree.

Bearing in mind English and Math are several hours a week over those 6 years.
 

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And how much time in the curriculum is dedicated to doing that?

Find me a State in Oz that devotes more than say 1 hour a week towards those issues over a 6 year High school degree.

Bearing in mind English and Math are several hours a week over those 6 years.
We're not talking about high school, we're talking about primary school, where English and Math [sic] are falling behind in international comparisons.
 

JackOutback

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But yours obviously do.:drunk::drunk::drunk:
I'm a father of a 28, 21 and 18 yr old and have seen their individual skill levels over the years plummet dramatically. Plus have been employing, or been in the employment of, many, many youngsters over decades and can also see, quite clearly, the skill in basic math and literacy declining rapidly.
But hey, what would i know?
Thanks for the farm analogy that paints us all us uneducated hicks.
Very few of us under 40 have much less than a Bachelor degree. Most from 40-55 have at least a Diploma level.
Except I'm not the one in this thread making broad, sweeping generalisations about an entire generation.
 
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Your issue then is with the Federal system.

It creates supid things like HSC/ VCE, different cirriculums, high school starting varying from year 7 to year 8 and so forth.

So many areas of law would be so much better off under Federal jurisdiction and not State jurisdiction.

Education and Health are the two main ones that spring to mind. Firearms and Criminal law also.
I'd happily take it further and abolish the State Gov't system altogether.
One huge layer of completely unnecessary bureaucracy gone in a swipe and give councils an actual purpose instead of being grant and allocation spenders with little accountability.
Anyway, that is highly unlikely to happen, ever, under our current system.
 
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Except I'm not the one in this thread making broad, sweeping generalisations about an entire generation.
You like building strawmen don't you.
I have never mentioned an entire generation(s), however I was talking about the majority.
Have you been down to one of those schools and questioned them on their times tables or asked them to write a legible few paragraphs yet?
 

Number37

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I'd happily take it further and abolish the State Gov't system altogether.
One huge layer of completely unnecessary bureaucracy gone in a swipe and give councils an actual purpose instead of being grant and allocation spenders with little accountability.
Anyway, that is highly unlikely to happen, ever, under our current system.
By highly unlikely you must mean constitutionally impossible.
 

Malifice

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I'd happily take it further and abolish the State Gov't system altogether.
I largely agree with you.

The system does provide an extra set of checks and balances against Federal government tyranny, but at what cost.

If I could replace the Federal system with something similar but different (a different form of devolved independent State governments answering to a Federal Government, but otherwise unified legally) I would.
 

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My six-year-old does his 9 times tables. My brother's 15-year-old is in the advanced mathematics class (he's a maths teacher and some of his kids would confuse the shit out of you with what they know). Your anecdotes do not equal evidence. Yes, there are people that don't have university level maths or English, and at the risk of insulting your profession, would be more attracted to working on a farm. That doesn't equate to a whole generation being poorly educated.
https://www.smh.com.au/education/au...ading-and-science-report-20180225-p4z1mx.html

"The proportion of Australian 15-year-olds who are reaching international baseline levels in maths, reading and science has fallen significantly over a decade, and federal Education Minister Simon Birmingham says parents need to start doing more to stem the country's declining performance."

Most of the elite performing kids are Asian imports, which makes the decline even worse than it looks.

https://www.theguardian.com/comment...the-ethnic-imbalance-in-our-selective-schools

"Almost all selective high schools in Sydney are dominated by students from a language background other than English (LBOTE). According to the MySchool website, at James Ruse, 97% of students were from a LBOTE in 2015. Across Sydney, LBOTE students regularly make up 80 or 90% of enrolments in selective schools. Most of these students are children of migrants from various Asian countries, especially China, Korea, other east and south-east Asian countries, and increasingly, India and south Asia. "

We're a bit off-topic here though.
 

medusala

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How is teaching kids gender equality and tolerance getting in the way of math and spelling?

Any reason we cant do both?
On what possible basis can you argue its the states duty to teach such things as "gender equality" and "tolerance"?

If I could replace the Federal system with something similar but different (a different form of devolved independent State governments answering to a Federal Government, but otherwise unified legally) I would.
Countries with a federal system tend to work better for a few reasons. More democratic (do you think anyone would pay any attention to Tasmania whatsoever if there were no states, tax competition and cost competition)

The UK is a good example of this. ie it makes no sense to pay public sector employees the same across the country. You either massively overpay up north and cripple private enterprise or pay so little in London that they cant survive.

NB not sure this has much to do with the topic at hand.
 

Balls In

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I dont want my kids being taught a program designed by a marxist that implies homosexuality is no different to hetrosexuality. Stupidest thing I ever heard of. In fact this whole celebration of alternate sexual orientation has gone too far the other way.
 

JackOutback

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I dont want my kids being taught a program designed by a marxist that implies homosexuality is no different to hetrosexuality. Stupidest thing I ever heard of. In fact this whole celebration of alternate sexual orientation has gone too far the other way.
If you don’t like homosexuality, then that rules out biology and history for you too (hint: the Romans and Greeks celebrated it a fair bit). Your lack of engagement with education may explain some of your posts though.
 

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If you don’t like homosexuality, then that rules out biology and history for you too (hint: the Romans and Greeks celebrated it a fair bit). Your lack of engagement with education may explain some of your posts though.
Ironic username to post content too.
 
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