Frawley to Join Hawks. (Pick 3 to the Dees)

[GHardeman]

That isn't how restricted free agency works, their is no bidding war.

If the player is restricted the original club has the option of matching the offer, and then the player either stays or can opt to enter the draft or leave via a trade.

Y the feck would a club ever match an offer and potentially see a player walk for nothing instead of getting compensation?

You are assuming, and you might be right, that Frawley always wanted to go. But it might have been a decision based on money, prospects and length of contract and he might have considered staying. On that basis the RFA, UFA difference is important.
Because Melbourne might not be prepared to pay Frawley $700K, but they think $500k is value in their team and on that basis they want to keep him. But in this case they did not get the chance because, despite being only eight years in, the AFL retrospectively, ie after Frawley was contracted, decided that if a player was not in the top 25% on the final year of his contract, he was an UFA. So Melb get no option to match. If Hawthorn or Geelong think Melbourne can match, they will offer Frawley more and that helps the band level of compensation.

 

[PenAndPaper]

Inadvertently?
His disposal is s**t.

His disposal is nowhere near as bad as people are making it out to be. He averages just over 1 clanger a game which is minuscule

 

[doppleganger]

You are assuming, and you might be right, that Frawley always wanted to go. But it might have been a decision based on money, prospects and length of contract and he might have considered staying. On that basis the RFA, UFA difference is important.
Because Melbourne might not be prepared to pay Frawley $700K, but they think $500k is value in their team and on that basis they want to keep him. But in this case they did not get the chance because, despite being only eight years in, the AFL retrospectively, ie after Frawley was contracted, decided that if a player was in the top 25% on the final year of his contract, he was an UFA. So Melb get no option to match. If Hawthorn or Geelong think Melbourne can match, they will offer Frawley more and that helps the band level of compensation.

If it was about money he wouldn't be at Hawthorn! Think it through...he isn't leaving Melbourne to make money at Hawthorn, he is leaving for team success.

Hawthorn might only give him 400K, the point is he gets to play for a winning team.

If he wanted money he may as well just signed on again with Melbourne, they have to give their money to somebody.

Restricted or unrestricted makes no difference, if he wanted to be at Melbourne he would still be there.

 

[apollo_creed]

His disposal is nowhere near as bad as people are making it out to be. He averages just over 1 clanger a game which is minuscule

just because a disposal isn't a clanger it doesn't include underhitting a pass or overkicking a simple pass to an open teammate to make it a contest - things like that aren't captured within the 'clanger' stats.

 

[PenAndPaper]

just because a disposal isn't a clanger it doesn't include underhitting a pass or overkicking a simple pass to an open teammate to make it a contest - things like that aren't captured within the 'clanger' stats.

I know that but I watch a lot of Melbourne games since my brother goes for them, he's nowhere near as bad as people are saying.

 

[GHardeman]

If it was about money he wouldn't be at Hawthorn! Think it through...he isn't leaving Melbourne to make money at Hawthorn, he is leaving for team success.

Hawthorn might only give him 400K, the point is he gets to play for a winning team.

If he wanted money he may as well just signed on again with Melbourne, they have to give their money to somebody.

Restricted or unrestricted makes no difference, if he wanted to be at Melbourne he would still be there.

I agree with this. The money is linked to the compensation. If someone paid him overs Melbourne get pick 3. If they pay him unders it is pick 20. That is the difference. Melbourne could have forced someone to pay him overs if he was an RFA.
I know why he is going to Hawthorn. They are the envy of the AFL. But when you have the arse out of your pants (like Melbourne do) it is not great to have your pants taken away.

 

[apollo_creed]

I know that but I watch a lot of Melbourne games since my brother goes for them, he's nowhere near as bad as people are saying.

fair enough mate, hope he works out well for your mob and delivers.

 

[GHardeman]

just because a disposal isn't a clanger it doesn't include underhitting a pass or overkicking a simple pass to an open teammate to make it a contest - things like that aren't captured within the 'clanger' stats.

He averages 1.7 goals per game against him in a side that lost to Geelong by 186pts and Essendon by 149 and who conceded over 20 goals for per game two seasons in 2012/3. He played in teams where the ball was permanently in his half and ended up with a goals against average not much less than the AA guys. He is not a dud.

 

[PenAndPaper]

fair enough mate, hope he works out well for your mob and delivers.

I hope so too. Exactly the player we need, in the age bracket which we love. Hopefully we have actually got him though. Not getting too excited just yet

 

[doppleganger]

I agree with this. The money is linked to the compensation. If someone paid him overs Melbourne get pick 3. If they pay him unders it is pick 20. That is the difference. Melbourne could have forced someone to pay him overs if he was an RFA.
I know why he is going to Hawthorn. They are the envy of the AFL. But when you have the arse out of your pants (like Melbourne do) it is not great to have your pants taken away.

The forcing to pay overs line is simply factually incorrect.

Frawley decides he wants out

Freo offer 700k for 5 seasons
Cats offer 550k for 5 seasons
Hawks offer 400k for 3 seasons

Frawley decides to go to Hawthorn.

Sucks to be Melbourne as they might get less compo now, but being able to match Hawthorn's offer doesn't help them at all.

 

[GHardeman]

The forcing to pay overs line is simply factually incorrect.

Frawley decides he wants out

Freo offer 700k for 5 seasons
Cats offer 550k for 5 seasons
Hawks offer 400k for 3 seasons

Frawley decides to go to Hawthorn.

Sucks to be Melbourne as they might get less compo now, but being able to match Hawthorn's offer doesn't help them at all.

If he wants out wouldn't he take the Freo offer if he thought Melbourne might match?

 

[AstonSouffle]

Wtf are you talking about?

Kids don't get a choice where they end up. Juss is saying that he thinks that maybe players in bottom teams shouldn't be able to use free agency and leave for greener pastures.

In what world should employees have no say in where they go to work?

Alright I got bit to excited there apologies.

Hawthorn don't need Frawley, if you do there's plenty of other clubs that need him more. It's a damn shame that of this sort of thing is allowed to continue. Our competition will die, it will truly become a pathetic soulless pile of whatever if the same teams are always able to leech off the bottom. Won premierships will become devalued. (Much like everyone was ready to pin Sydney for).

But, I'm well aware we need another playing generation of this before we know if that's the case. Maybe the hangover of overtopping on free agents could be immense? Maybe it's just making player movement that was always going to happen easier?

Clubs should rightfully fall, if they're staying up top because they're leeching off other clubs good work then it's a huge problem and the AFLPA will have been the architects of the downfall of competitiveness within the competition

 

[GHardeman]

In what world should employees have no say in where they go to work?

In the AFL for the first eight years of your working life.

 

[doppleganger]

If he wants out wouldn't he take the Freo offer if he thought Melbourne might match?

What the feck does Melbourne matching have to do with anything?

He most likely had 3 offers to consider - Geel, Freo and Haw - he picked Hawthorn, which most likely was the lowest $$$.

He left Melbourne to play in a good team.

 

[GHardeman]

What the feck does Melbourne matching have to do with anything?

He most likely had 3 offers to consider - Geel, Freo and Haw - he picked Hawthorn, which most likely was the lowest $$$.

He left Melbourne to play in a good team.

Clearly you don't see my point. I happily see yours. 'Night.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Alright I got bit to excited there apologies.

Hawthorn don't need Frawley, if you do there's plenty of other clubs that need him more. It's a damn shame that of this sort of thing is allowed to continue. Our competition will die, it will truly become a pathetic soulless pile of whatever if the same teams are always able to leech off the bottom. Won premierships will become devalued. (Much like everyone was ready to pin Sydney for).

But, I'm well aware we need another playing generation of this before we know if that's the case. Maybe the hangover of overtopping on free agents could be immense? Maybe it's just making player movement that was always going to happen easier?

Clubs should rightfully fall, if they're staying up top because they're leeching off other clubs good work then it's a huge problem and the AFLPA will have been the architects of the downfall of competitiveness within the competition

You make it sound like Hawthorn or other top teams are not going to lose players via agency.

Franklin and Young have already moved. Then there's the clubs lining up to poach our depth like Lowden, Cheney, Hallahan which will always be an issue for strong clubs with a 22 that's hard to squeeze into.

Did you feel the same way about Free Agency when Freo landed Sylvia?

 

[GHardeman]

You make it sound like Hawthorn or other top teams are not going to lose players via agency.

Franklin and Young have already moved. Then there's the clubs lining up to poach our depth like Lowden, Cheney, Hallahan which will always be an issue for strong clubs with a 22 that's hard to squeeze into.

Did you feel the same way about Free Agency when Freo landed Sylvia?

Franklin is a good example of the problem we all fear, the good players being attracted away. The other guys are depth players in a strong team. Melbourne have lost Rivers, Moloney, Frawley and Sylvia (and Clark through a strange anomaly). None of these guys would be in Hawthorn's best 10 players but they are all in Melbourne's best 10 and they have lost the lot. Hawthorn and Geelong have, and will, win without them. Melbourne could not even win with them.
You would have to acknowledge that FA is a boon to those teams who are successful because they can top up without drafting, so the teams who are successful when it begins will benefit the most early. In 10 years who knows what will happen.

 

[AstonSouffle]

You make it sound like Hawthorn or other top teams are not going to lose players via agency.

Franklin and Young have already moved. Then there's the clubs lining up to poach our depth like Lowden, Cheney, Hallahan which will always be an issue for strong clubs with a 22 that's hard to squeeze into.

Did you feel the same way about Free Agency when Freo landed Sylvia?

Well that's a bit of funny question, I didn't feel bad because I didn't feel Melbourne were losing anyone special. Since that's proven to be absolutely the case... seriously he's nothing special. I get what you mean when you ask that, so fair enough.

Look you're right, maybe it's just too early say free agency is unfair.

 

[GHardeman]

Well that's a bit of funny question, I didn't feel bad because I didn't feel Melbourne were losing anyone special. Since that's proven to be absolutely the case... seriously he's nothing special. I get what you mean when you ask that, so fair enough.

Look you're right, maybe it's just too early say free agency is unfair.

I would have been interested in what Roos could do with Sylvia.

 

[dipper86]

S

Inadvertently?
His disposal is s**t.

So is Lakes....hasn't affected our back line.
Why because he gives it off at every opportunity. As long as Frawley doesnt get creative with ball in hand....he'll be fine.

 

[Matt Stevic]

Free agency will only work properly if the Fitzroy rule is removed.

 

[gab213]

The Hawk$ have now signed two key defenders - Brian Lake after 2012 and now Frawley after their premiership LOL!

You got Tippet at the end of 2012, Franklin at the end of 2013.

How do you think their combined wages for a year would stack up against what Hawthorn would pay Lake and Frawley in a year?

You really aren't comparing apples with apples. Lake and Frawley left lower ranked clubs for a shot at premiership glory, Tippet transferred from a club that had finished 3rd and Franklin from a Premiership team for the dollars on offer.

 

[ptrg]

At the end of the day, the yard stick of whether Frawley has made it to hawthorn due to FT exclusively is to ask yourself this: would the hawks have got him under the old rules where a trade must be done OR he went into the PSD? Zero chance. (Unless the hawks were made to offer up something very enticing for Melbourne's only All Australian player in past 6 years).

Instead Melbourne's compo is dictated by his new payments (clearly unders when taking I to consideration the interest by multiple clubs for him), and hawks have to give nothing up directly.

Not sure how anyone could disagree with the above?

 

[Superduperouzel]

Hate to say it but the way Hawthorn mould good players into very good players is no fluke. He´ll be a star for them.
They don´t fail the Hawks when they land big fish.

 

[BEEG]

People talking about Frawley and his disposal he doesn't have to use it in the Hawks team that's what blokes like Gibson, Burgoyne, Suckling, and Burchall are used for