Other MIchael Sam - Openly Gay and Drafted

[Exe Gesis]

Their choice of shoe brand and handshake.

It's a start.

 

[Sticks_Of_Fury]

Playing devils advocate. Like many of you have said he is probably not going to make it because of his play on the field not his sexuality. So why not try and cash in when he can. He is probably at the peak of his earning powers right now. Everyone in the country is interested in his story. When he gets cut by the Rams or hardly makes a play for the entire season that earning potential has greatly diminished. I say make the cash while the spotlights on!

 

[Woodson]

Playing devils advocate. Like many of you have said he is probably not going to make it because of his play on the field not his sexuality. So why not try and cash in when he can. He is probably at the peak of his earning powers right now. Everyone in the country is interested in his story. When he gets cut by the Rams or hardly makes a play for the entire season that earning potential has greatly diminished. I say make the cash while the spotlights on!

As much as this attempted 'media power play' is receiving all the attention.. the Rams have done the smart thing to splash water on the smoking story that will only put immense pressure on both team and player… to play the Devil's advocate from another angle.. let them do the Oprah doco but HOLD OFF from premiering it on TV for his full rookie season… if things work out, they have a compelling story… with highlights to show.. if he bombs.. just re-do it with excerpts of the initial feedback on a backdated review in a few years time… would still get the interest but also make the complete story for what it is.

The pressure is all on Sam to make the series on ongoing roster cuts. If you're one of his competitors fighting for a spot.. as an UDFA.. in training camp, would you play nasty (jibes) to keep him in line with his 'much celebrated self imposed status' or ignore his own hype and give it your best to beat him in getting a roster spot? He'll need to be tested for taunting because you know that it's gonna be cruel world when (if) it all comes crushing down.

 

[Woodson]

It's a start.

I can just see it now.. the sewing machine gift in his locker.

 

[PACatter]

Latest is that Sam has cancelled the docu to concentrate on making the team. Likely thanks to pressure from the media that was in line with many of the opinions on this thread - a lot of the top sports outlets had plenty to say when they found out about the show.

 

[Starburns_]

Playing devils advocate. Like many of you have said he is probably not going to make it because of his play on the field not his sexuality. So why not try and cash in when he can. He is probably at the peak of his earning powers right now. Everyone in the country is interested in his story. When he gets cut by the Rams or hardly makes a play for the entire season that earning potential has greatly diminished. I say make the cash while the spotlights on!

Hate to be a cynic, but you'd have to question how much he would care about having a football career if he's entering into something like this as a fringe talent. Regardless of when his career ends, he'll be able to cash in to some extent, he doesn't need to do so at the expense of what he's been drafted to do.

This latest move is a smart one (even if it is driven by the backlash), if he does fail, the money will still be there, he'll still have a story to tell.

 

[dart]

thing about michael sam is that before, when he wasn't gay, he was SEC defensive player of the year.

Since then he's turned gay and now he's not even good enough in most people's eyes to make it onto the ram's list.

there's a lesson in there somewhere.

 

[Starburns_]

thing about michael sam is that before, when he wasn't gay, he was SEC defensive player of the year.

Since then he's turned gay and now he's not even good enough in most people's eyes to make it onto the ram's list.

there's a lesson in there somewhere.

Manziel is a QB who won a Heismann, plenty of teams needed QBs, yet he fell to where he did.

It's about more than awards sometimes, if Sam had top 3 round talent, he'd have gone there.

 

[royals1922]

thing about michael sam is that before, when he wasn't gay, he was SEC defensive player of the year.

Since then he's turned gay and now he's not even good enough in most people's eyes to make it onto the ram's list.

there's a lesson in there somewhere.

Actually incorrect. Lindy's in their pre-draft special had Sam as a 3rd to 4th round prospect and noted the following negative aspects of his play:

"Sam's production is misleading. He had 6 (of his 10.5 sacks) against lesser competition"
"Failed to separate himself at the Senior Bowl and did not fare well in outside linebacker drills"
"Some scouts view him as too short for defensive end( he's 6 foot 2) and a project as a stand up outside linebacker, pushin the productive defender into third round conversation"
"Weaknesses- Not quite the sum of his parts due to size and flexibility limitations. Lacks the reach to separate from blockers and rarely recovers once engaged.Impressive burst upfield is mitigated by average core flexibility, limiting his ability to turn the corner in one fluid motion. Unseasoned and stiff changing direction on coverage:making a switch to outside linebacker a true projection"

Now Sam can disprove this stuff, but that does not mean the doubts as a football player were not there before the draft,

 

[Dixie Flatline]

Manziel is a QB who won a Heismann, plenty of teams needed QBs, yet he fell to where he did.

It's about more than awards sometimes, if Sam had top 3 round talent, he'd have gone there.

Tebow won the Heismann at Florida and is now out of the NFL. College football and professional football are often different beasts.

 

[royals1922]

Tebow won the Heismann at Florida and is now out of the NFL. College football and professional football are often different beasts.

I reckon as many people want Sam to succeed as they want Manziel to fail purely because of the publicity accorded to each and the different places each comes from.

That said, Michael Sam should have a chance to a make the roster based on precedent ( as long as he does not stuff it up):

SEC defensively players of the year:

2003 : Chad Lavalais - pick 142 - washout
2004: David Pollack - pick 17 wash out
2005: Demeco Ryans - pick 33
2006 Patrick Willis - pick 11
2007: Glenn Dorsey - pick 5
2008 : Eric Berry - pick 5
2009: Rolando McClain - pick 8 - wash out
2010: Nick Fairley - pick 13
2011: Morris Claiborne - pick 6
2012: Clowney - pick 1, Jarvis Jones - pick 17
2013: Sam, CJ Mosley - pick 17.

Interestingly the SEC offensive players of the year are less certain:

Jason Campbell, cutler, McFadden, Tebow, Newton, Richardson, Manziel and Mason.

 

[Exe Gesis]

String of defensive busts there

 

[royals1922]

String of defensive busts there

However his selection in the 7th round costs St Louis very little as against the other high signing bonus blokes.

 

[Starburns_]

Tebow won the Heismann at Florida and is now out of the NFL. College football and professional football are often different beasts.

That was my point, College doesn't always translate to pro, and if he's undersized as suggested, well that's often a big con when it comes to draft day.

 

[royals1922]

This from MSN today:

"Michael Sam is out of the TV spotlight and the St. Louis Rams are hopeful of avoiding being the subject of another high-profile show.
Coach Jeff Fisher told The Associated Press on Monday that it's ''probably unlikely'' the NFL will choose the Rams for HBO's ''Hard Knocks.''
The Rams are among teams eligible to get chosen for three reasons: They haven't appeared on the show for the past decade, haven't hired a new head coach and haven't reached the playoffs either of the past two seasons.
The Rams have never been picked and are coming off a pair of seven-win seasons in Fisher's first two years in the rugged NFC West.
Fisher said the announcement by the Oprah Winfrey network to film a documentary about Sam, the first openly gay player to be drafted by an NFL team, came as a surprise.
''I think the Oprah thing, it caught us off-guard,'' Fisher said. ''Whenever it takes place, I think it'll be a positive piece.''
Just not this summer.
''Not good for the locker room,'' the coach said. ''Nor Mike to get involved at this point.''
Sam was the SEC co-defensive player of the year at Missouri, but was drafted late in the seventh round after a poor combine performance combined with other franchises' concerns about taking a player who might be a distraction.
Just a few hours before the series was postponed Friday, a camera crew filmed a rookie workout, interviewed reporters and asked other media members to sign release waivers.
''We had a meeting and we got it resolved satisfactorily for everybody,'' Fisher said. ''The best thing for Mike right now is to just focus on football.''

Can just imagine how Fisher felt after waivers were asked to be signed.

It would have been a short conversation.

Fisher: You want to be cut right now.

 

[kaiserchief13]

What happens if somebody makes a homosexual remark to Sam? I'm sure players go around trash talking opposition calling them all sorts of things so why should it be different to Sam? But some might say it should be. Which is correct?

 

[Exe Gesis]

What happens if somebody makes a homosexual remark to Sam? I'm sure players go around trash talking opposition calling them all sorts of things so why should it be different to Sam? But some might say it should be. Which is correct?

I'm looking forward to when Manti T'eo and Michael Sam meet on special teams.

 

[royals1922]

What happens if somebody makes a homosexual remark to Sam? I'm sure players go around trash talking opposition calling them all sorts of things so why should it be different to Sam? But some might say it should be. Which is correct?

Further what happens if an anti homosexual comment is said in front of Sam ( eg we gotta stop playing like........)

That is the more likely drama coming up....

 

[bomberman500]

For a guy who wants to be known as just a footballer he's definately trying to keep his 'profile' up with the tv show on the Oprah Winfrey Network...
Was an average at best draft prospect who had a shite combine who came out in the hope it would increase his draft stock...
Full credit to him if he can turn into a decent role player but he is an over-rated hack for mine.

The Tim Tebow effect will strike again, and when its finnished spitting Sam out (phrasing) it will go after Johnny Cleveland

 

[Woodson]

For a guy who wants to be known as just a footballer he's definately trying to keep his 'profile' up with the tv show on the Oprah Winfrey Network...
Was an average at best draft prospect who had a shite combine who came out in the hope it would increase his draft stock...
Full credit to him if he can turn into a decent role player but he is an over-rated hack for mine.

The Tim Tebow effect will strike again, and when its finnished spitting Sam out (phrasing) it will go after Johnny Cleveland

I still think Tebow got MORE than MOST out of his 'limitations'.. (READ: made an IMPACT!!) so placing a QB in the same pigeon hole as a late round DB isn't quite the same 'strike again effect'. But I do agree that attention seeking for all the 'indifferent reasons' is quite bizarre indeed.

 

[bomberman500]

I still think Tebow got MORE than MOST out of his 'limitations'.. (READ: made an IMPACT!!) so placing a QB in the same pigeon hole as a late round DB isn't quite the same 'strike again effect'. But I do agree that attention seeking for all the 'indifferent reasons' is quite bizarre indeed.

I'm more describing the 'media' effect on certain players. In 2011 he was the most talked about player of any sport on ESPN, by a country mile no less. Personnally I think Tebow was a complete bust (HB with a decent arm), same as Manziel will be imo.
There is nothing about Sam that screams "watch this space" either. Yes 1st round QB and 7th round DB are 2 very different things but im just talking media coverage v skill set/output

 

[Exe Gesis]

Agree but...

Tebow: yep is only a RB.
Manziel: penchant for running around is bad, but is the best pure passer of his entire draft class.
Sam: very mediocre talent, but similar talent has made 53 man rosters before and eked out a decent career.

So its the media who creates these tsunami stories yes, but these players as people carried all these fans of them before the media. Their personalities larger than life already before, hero's of their region, they prodded the medias attention to become national personalities.

The media can't just grab some talentless player and fabricate a national interest in them. There has to be a big interest and following first. Has to be a story trending first. That is then sent into national and international orbit.

 

[royals1922]

Agree but...

Tebow: yep is only a RB.
Manziel: penchant for running around is bad, but is the best pure passer of his entire draft class.
Sam: very mediocre talent, but similar talent has made 53 man rosters before and eked out a decent career.

So its the media who creates these tsunami stories yes, but these players as people carried all these fans of them before the media. Their personalities larger than life already before, hero's of their region, they prodded the medias attention to become national personalities.

The media can't just grab some talentless player and fabricate a national interest in them. There has to be a big interest and following first. Has to be a story trending first. That is then sent into national and international orbit.

But from a football point of view, most of these players have a "jumping of the shark" moment when they become less the football person and more the media darling at which point football franchises start getting concerned.

 

[Exe Gesis]

But from a football point of view, most of these players have a "jumping of the shark" moment when they become less the football person and more the media darling at which point football franchises start getting concerned.

For sure. If they can play like champions then clubs put up with them more. Tho plenty of players in history the clubs get rid of those stars still who upset the apple cart, or cause locker room probs.

 

[TheGreatBarryB]

Agree but...

Tebow: yep is only a RB.
Manziel: penchant for running around is bad, but is the best pure passer of his entire draft class.
Sam: very mediocre talent, but similar talent has made 53 man rosters before and eked out a decent career.

So its the media who creates these tsunami stories yes, but these players as people carried all these fans of them before the media. Their personalities larger than life already before, hero's of their region, they prodded the medias attention to become national personalities.

The media can't just grab some talentless player and fabricate a national interest in them. There has to be a big interest and following first. Has to be a story trending first. That is then sent into national and international orbit.

Isn't it more about the symbolism of a gay player being drafted in a very macho league? It's a small but significant step.
In February CBS had Sam ranked 90 overall for the draft , the day after his announcement he dropped to 160. Around the same time NFLDraftScout had him ranked around 110. Yet he was drafted at pick 250+.

He was SEC defensive player of the year. I read somewhere that since that award started only one player was drafted past pick 30(?)ish, some guy in the 5th round. Interesting.