Who has the better list?

[rancidpants13]

Pies/Carlton/Essendon supporters all have a preety rounded hatred for each other


I agree the pies have a better list. They almost shook Geelong out of it. Awesome game I was lucky to be at. Collingwood have another couple years of being 'up there' in my opinion.


Perhaps. I think they will grow to finish just outside the finals. Perhaps 8-12. I think they'll miss out on bottom 4.


Who was coming back from a major injury last year, yet still kicked 50+ goals with another key forward kicking a similar amount in his space.


Who didn't have a pre-season last year due to injury. This dramatically affected his entire season and fitness.


Perhaps sometimes. Is preety solid though in my opinion. Has some opponents which do beat him though which is probably where you get 'missing' from. He doesn't go missing, he just gets beaten at times. Who doesn't?


Now you're just making yourself look silly. How can one of the most underrated players in the league be one of the most overrated players in the league? Lucas is a GUN.

in my opinion, he's over-rated AND still tends to be selfish, and lloyd is not the player he was, and injury does play a part in that, but he's not as mobile as he was
michael is also a lot slower

someone listed those four players as essendon stars, yet with those four AND the mighty james hird, the side fell away badly last year (and yes, lloyd was injured, but a lot of clubs had injuries and finished above the bombers)
the original post was about two club lists, i just think c'wood's is stronger, and i envy the club in some ways
although i admit to being surprised at the number of talented kids essendon has had on display in the preseason
reimers is a gun and courtney dempsey (not new, i know) is set for a break-out season, he looks heaps bigger and stronger than i remember (and he's fast)

 

[Ari]

in my opinion, he's over-rated AND still tends to be selfish, and lloyd is not the player he was, and injury does play a part in that, but he's not as mobile as he was
michael is also a lot slower

That's your opinion and you're entitled to it. I'm not going to argue it. I've given you my thoughts.

someone listed those four players as essendon stars, yet with those four AND the mighty james hird, the side fell away badly last year (and yes, lloyd was injured, but a lot of clubs had injuries and finished above the bombers)

Note however that Essendon were inline to play finals last year. When did it all end? When Sheedy got the axe. After that I think Essendon won one of their game from 6? Speculation perhaps... but they're the facts. Check the ladder and timelines.

the original post was about two club lists, i just think c'wood's is stronger, and i envy the club in some ways

I agree the Pies are stronger... much stronger. I hate to admit it, but I too am preety impressed with thier line up of kids. They're doing some good things down that way!

although i admit to being surprised at the number of talented kids essendon has had on display in the preseason
reimers is a gun and courtney dempsey (not new, i know) is set for a break-out season, he looks heaps bigger and stronger than i remember (and he's fast)

I agree that the Essendon kids have shown a lot in pre-season. That said, that's all it is. Pre-season. Good of them to get some runs but most of them won't be strong footballers for a couple years to come. But that's all a part of the cycle. Perhaps in years to come there will be a thread questioning whether Collingwood can be considered as good as the up and coming Essendon! Who knows....

 

[rancidpants13]

That's your opinion and you're entitled to it. I'm not going to argue it. I've given you my thoughts.


Note however that Essendon were inline to play finals last year. When did it all end? When Sheedy got the axe. After that I think Essendon won one of their game from 6? Speculation perhaps... but they're the facts. Check the ladder and timelines.


I agree the Pies are stronger... much stronger. I hate to admit it, but I too am preety impressed with thier line up of kids. They're doing some good things down that way!


I agree that the Essendon kids have shown a lot in pre-season. That said, that's all it is. Pre-season. Good of them to get some runs but most of them won't be strong footballers for a couple years to come. But that's all a part of the cycle. Perhaps in years to come there will be a thread questioning whether Collingwood can be considered as good as the up and coming Essendon! Who knows....

two more things while we're chatting
i agree about sheedy, couldn't believe - and still can't - that the club's hierarchy thought it wise to inform sheedy and the players that it was the coach's last season when they were, from memory, half a game outside the eight
surely one of the worst decisions in terms of club morale in the game's recent history
second, i hope for your club's and the player's own sake that jason laycock can stay fit
from a swans point of view, to see how stephen doyle's career just dwindled away was a cruel shame, laycock seems to have more skills than big doyle and i just hope he can see out a whole season, fit and healthy and playing seniors
he could be a real x factor for you blokes
i wanna put him in my supercoach team but i'm waiting to see that a) he's fit and b) he gets into the senior 22 for round 1
i really like laycock, great aerialist for a big bloke too

 

[Consumed]

I think Collingwood has a better list at the moment. I also think that Collingwood has consistently got more from their list than most other teams. This is one area I am impressed with by the Pies, they achieve more than what would be expected with their list.

However, I think Knights may be able to match that type of behaviour with his team this year.

 

[tigers_of_old_08]

Collingwood - they are so far ahead there was never any need for this thread.

 

[daics cousin]

The clubs to really reign over the next few years as far as their lists go will be collingwood,hawthorn,essendon,west coast,brisbane,carlton (providing they get some decent backmen).

 

[Verbeek]

Essendon look like they will be better long term but at the moment I think they are both pretty average.

What? Long term? The pies have terrific youngsters coming through who I'd take over most teams youngsters, let alone Essendons. Cloke, Shaw, Thomas and Pendelbury are better than any Essendon youngster. Maybe even Marty Clarke.

What about Essendon long term when Lloyd, Lucas, Fletcher, Michael are gone?

Collingwood by a fair margin at this stage.

 

[hellfire]

What? Long term? The pies have terrific youngsters coming through who I'd take over most teams youngsters, let alone Essendons. Cloke, Shaw, Thomas and Pendelbury are better than any Essendon youngster. Maybe even Marty Clarke.

What about Essendon long term when Lloyd, Lucas, Fletcher, Michael are gone?

Collingwood by a fair margin at this stage.

That's what I was thinking. How can someone say Essendon will be better long term, when our youngsters rival or better those of any club?

 

[fraser25]

I totally agree with what you guys said our list is extremely even across the board, I think that serves us pretty well. We may not have an abundance of dream team guns or brownlow favourites but it's the four points that always count.

 

[MarkT]

When they say long term I think they mean with the addition of early draft picks over the next few years….

 

[cs61]

Collingwood have a much better balance.

They look like they could seriously do some damage in the coming years.

Essendon I think are OK, and better than the bottom 4 sides, but couldn't compete against the competition's elite, which Collingwood can already.

 

[Merv]

The question was who has the better LIST.

A LIST comprises of 40 players.

No one could dispute Collingwood have the better starting 22 as their past years performances have proved but do they have the better 40 players?

FWIW, I'm not saying they don't or do, as they have a few players i haven't seen play at any level yet.

What i do know is i am very happy with our list and the direction we are heading.

These questions are merely a way for the OP to pump up Collingwoods tyres as i'm sure there are many if not all people who have not seen ALL 40 Essendon or Collingwood players yet, so how can you make an informed decision?

 

[hellfire]

The question was who has the better LIST.

A LIST comprises of 40 players.

No one could dispute Collingwood have the better starting 22 as their past years performances have proved but do they have the better 40 players?

FWIW, I'm not saying they don't or do, as they have a few players i haven't seen play at any level yet.

What i do know is i am very happy with our list and the direction we are heading.

Both teams have 10 players who haven't played a game. Essendon has another 10 who have played less than 10 games, Collingwood has another 6 who have played less than 10 games. So there is a lot of inexperience on both lists at the bottom end. I personally think our bottom end is still better, but that's totally subjective so there is no way of proving it.

 

[mango]

well Anzac Day aint that far away, so we'll get some idea, should be a cracker this year

have to say collingwood has the better list at the moment, & so they should have after essendon's recent turmoils

however wont stay that way for long, will be very evenly matched within a couple of seasons

 

[Lance Uppercut]

When they say long term I think they mean with the addition of early draft picks over the next few years….

a crap cheap shot from a normally balanced poster Guess you're no different to anyone here.

If one team finished just outside the bottom four, and the other finished in a preliminary final, you'd have to have rocks in your head to suggest that the lower team has a better list.

So I'll concede that point to Collingwood right now, but I don't think there's much in it, personally. Essendon's pre-seeason this year has been very promising, whilst Collingwood's has been dismal. I remember not winning a game pre-season - it was the lead in to the 06 season, and we all know how that panned out (though I'm not suggesting Collingwood will fall that far!).

To the mutants who think Essendon have no talent after Lloyd Lucas Fletcher and Michael, I am really going to enjoy watching you eat your words over the next few years

 

[hellfire]

well Anzac Day aint that far away, so we'll get some idea, should be a cracker this year

have to say collingwood has the better list at the moment, & so they should have after essendon's recent turmoils

however wont stay that way for long, will be very evenly matched within a couple of seasons

I wouldn't say ANZAC day shows anything to be honest. Our teams always seem to be competitive, regardless of the ladder. It's the same with us and Carlton. Overall success throughout the season shows a lot more. We can judge at the end of the year.

 

[Ealesy]

That and the only thing the ANZAC Day match will prove is who has the best starting 22 at that point in time, not which club has the best list.

 

[Bourky23]

collingwood... easily

 

[Ari]

What? Long term? The pies have terrific youngsters coming through who I'd take over most teams youngsters, let alone Essendons. Cloke, Shaw, Thomas and Pendelbury are better than any Essendon youngster. Maybe even Marty Clarke.

What about Essendon long term when Lloyd, Lucas, Fletcher, Michael are gone?

Collingwood by a fair margin at this stage.

You're right! What will Essendon do when those blokes retire in 3-4 years from now!

Excepting Gumby, Ryder, Neagle, Daniher, Hooker, Myers, Pears, Dempsey, Chartres, Lee, Nash Essendon have absolutely no KPP prospects coming through.

 

[Verbeek]

a crap cheap shot from a normally balanced poster Guess you're no different to anyone here.

If one team finished just outside the bottom four, and the other finished in a preliminary final, you'd have to have rocks in your head to suggest that the lower team has a better list.

So I'll concede that point to Collingwood right now, but I don't think there's much in it, personally. Essendon's pre-seeason this year has been very promising, whilst Collingwood's has been dismal. I remember not winning a game pre-season - it was the lead in to the 06 season, and we all know how that panned out (though I'm not suggesting Collingwood will fall that far!).

To the mutants who think Essendon have no talent after Lloyd Lucas Fletcher and Michael, I am really going to enjoy watching you eat your words over the next few years

Good points Lance BUT dont forget that Carlton has also had some cracker pre-seasons over the last few years

Unfortynately it means SFA.

 

[Peacock]

I dont think Collingwood have enough talented kids. Pendlebury, Cloke, Thomas, Heath Shaw,Clarke, Goldsack, Egan, O'Brien, Rusling, Reid, Dawes and Brown dont look they are up to it.

Oh yes, who could forget about Collingwood's amazingly talented kids that were just too good to trade for Judd.

 

[Lance Uppercut]

Good points Lance BUT dont forget that Carlton has also had some cracker pre-seasons over the last few years

Unfortynately it means SFA.

agreed.

Although I'd make the point that IMO Carlton went all out to win the pre-season cup (selections, training etc) - whereas I don't think any team has really done that this year

 

[Ari]

Good points Lance BUT dont forget that Carlton has also had some cracker pre-seasons over the last few years

Unfortynately it means SFA.

True..........but there's one big BUT.

Who played in Carltons recent 'cracker pre-seasons'? Did they play and kids and Rookies with an angle on the future? Or did they play their senior squad with an angle on winning the NAB Cup and gaining memberships?

 

[hellfire]

You're right! What will Essendon do when those blokes retire in 3-4 years from now!

Excepting Gumby, Ryder, Neagle, Daniher, Hooker, Myers, Pears, Dempsey, Chartres, Lee, Nash Essendon have absolutely no KPP prospects coming through.

Is Nash going to play KP? Thought he was a mid.

 

[Verbeek]

You're right! What will Essendon do when those blokes retire in 3-4 years from now!

Excepting Gumby, Ryder, Neagle, Daniher, Hooker, Myers, Pears, Dempsey, Chartres, Lee, Nash Essendon have absolutely no KPP prospects coming through.

Prospects being the key word here. Other than Ryder the others havent exactly shown that they'll make it (yet).

What about midfielders coming through? Any luck there?

Bottom line: Collngwood has a better list than Essendon. No?